Trimble pronounces against nationalism in Scotland

Glad to see milord Trimble pronouncing confidently on how to handle devolution – in Scotland, and against Alex Salmond

Alex is the Artful Dodger of politics and he will have a charmed existence for some time, but he can’t actually deliver a solution to the real problems. Lord Trimble said he was confident the Tories would win the next UK election – and make gains in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland.

On suggestions that only English MPs should vote on English matters, he said: “There is only one sovereign parliament in the UK, end of story. Power devolved is power retained. If you start trying to restructure the sovereign parliament because of devolution you are actually doing huge damage.”

See here the latest Devolution Monitoring Report for Scotland

compiled for the Constitution Unit last month. Since the Glenrothes by election won by Labour it shows SNP and Labour fighting it out in time to see-sawing opinion over handling the recession. Alex Samond was still streets ahead as the most convincing Scottish leader, 10 points up on Gordon Brown according to an October YouGov poll.

In November – does the current financial crisis make you more or less likely to support independence
for Scotland?
%
More likely 24
Less likely 42
Unsure 34

.. and lot’s more for either party and cause to spin in its favour. The report gives a valuable account of the full course of Scottish devolution over the year, not just the opinion polls.

  • Jer

    why is it that so many people propagate this artful dodgy, cunning scot nonsense about Salmond.

    Why not just say he is a good politician.

  • Catholic Observer

    Salmond should be praying for a Tory victory in the next General Election. Nothing would alienate Scots more from Westminster rule more than a Conservative government. It is ironic that the Tories are the most strenously opposed to Scottish independence when they would benefit the most from it. At the last election the Tories took more seats in England than Labour did.

    It is inexplicable that Irish nationalists have not already formed an alliance with Scottish, Welsh and English ones. Time for Sinn Fein to take its seats at Westminster. Sinn Fein, Plaid Cymru, SNP, and the SDLP would be a very potent alliance and doubtlessly hasten the decline of this archaic political union.

  • gadgie

    the scots are all wind and water. if they had been told a scottish parliament would have to be paid for by extra taxes in scotland they would have voted no at the referendum in 1997.

  • blinding

    Catholic Observer

    “It is ironic that the Tories are the most strenously opposed to Scottish independence when they would benefit the most from it.”

    There are suggestions that the Tories would be delighted if the SNP ousted labour MPs in Scotland and that there little incursion in NI is just a figleaf to protect them from accusations that they might not be so pro-union as in former times.We will have to observe and learn on that one.

  • Paul Kielty

    Just what Scotland needs!! An ageing sectarian, orange order bigot, from the Mugabe-styled, fifty years unbroken, un-democratic unionist regime, with the audacious cheek to try and lecture the Scots on their democratic failings as he sees them!
    This is a cynical attempt to play on the base elements of the small minority of extreme british nationalist opinion in scotland.
    The artful dodger slur is very childish and totally in keeping with this over indulged pensioned, at tax-payers expense, member of the extreme right; And he got the nobel prize!!! Totally devalues that particular award.
    Scotland does not need nor cares for your extreme right-wing intervention Mr Trimble.
    Please, please, please, go away!!

  • William

    How does Paul Kielty, a resident of the Republic of Ireland, a foreign country know what Scotland, part of Her Majesty’s United Kingdom, wants….I would suggest that David Trimble knows a lot more than he Paul knows about the politics of nationalism and its evils.

    Once again, we have libellous remarks against a Unionist. Where are you Mick or Pete when you’re needed? Does ‘Ball not Man’ not apply on a Saturday…First ‘USA’ mentioned Gregory Campbell, not this Free Stater churns out his nastiness against David Trimble. It is time you guys put a stop to it !!!

  • Catholic Observer

    William,

    Where are the ‘libellous remarks’?

  • William,

    Firstly, do you know me personally? Or, are you just assuming that I live in the republic or Ireland??

    Secondly, I lived, studied, worked, in Scotland for 10 years. I am also married to a scottish lady. I have voted in numerous scottish elections so I feel I have some understanding of scottish politics!!!

    Thirdly, David trimble was(probably still is!) a member of an extreme right wing, sectarian grouping known as the orange order. That is a very obvious fact. My description of that group would be the wildly held view of most ‘decent’ people within britain.

    I would advise you william, quite sincerely, to leave your ‘little country’, and venture over the water to Britain. It may come as a surprise to find that you will receive a warm welcome because you are Irish! Just don’t mention the fact that your are a unionist ‘sponger’, your reception may be different.Not unless of course you wish to spend time with the BNP.

    Off out for a pint william, i’ll raise a glass to your health!!

  • PaddyReilly

    It is an oft repeated misconception that England without Scotland (and Wales) would be a permanent Tory walkover. What would actually happen is that the Labour Party would be forced to merge with or go into coalition with the Liberals, and power would alternate between Liberal and Tory, as was the case in the 19th Century.

    Similarly, it was thought that Independent Scotland and Wales would be permanently under Labour dominion. But the Welsh Assembly and Scottish Parliament have shown that this is not the case.

  • “Alex is the Artful Dodger of politics and he will have a charmed existence for some time, but he can’t actually deliver a solution to the real problems. ”

    A nifty piece of ball playing me thinks, remind me who are these politician that deliver solutions to real problems; and what makes Mr Salmond so different from them that he deserves to be labeled an Artful Dodger and failure.

    Actually Trimble has found his true home alongside the rest of the unelected pompous humbugs, who have such low self esteem, they feel the need to put some daft title in front of their names, in the hope it might give them the status they crave.

    It just shows what a paucity of talent there is in the Tory party for Cameron to seriously to consider giving this Elvis impersonator a job.

  • joeCanuck

    Just what Scotland needs!! An ageing sectarian, orange order bigot, from the Mugabe-styled, fifty years unbroken, un-democratic unionist regime, with the audacious cheek to try and lecture the Scots on their democratic failings as he sees them!

    But he’s totally British and a decent person to boot.

  • Catholic Observer

    “There are suggestions that the Tories would be delighted if the SNP ousted labour MPs”

    There was an article in the English Catholic magazine The Tablet a few weeks ago about the growing support for the SNP among the Irish Catholic working class in the west of Scotland. Traditionally they were Labour’s most loyal constituency, but according to this article they have been alienated and are deserting at a rapid rate. The Tories may get their secret wish.

  • As a southerner, methinks that the Scots are less inclined to break away from the UK than we were down here. As a Protestant country, they don’t have a memory of Penal laws imposed by Westminster, or of an economic blockade or land-dispossession (except for Highland Scots and most of them left in the 18th and 19th century).There was clearly a strong demand for devolution, however, as proven in the referendum all those years ago. This topic raises interesting parallels, in particular calling into question the claims made by Northern Unionists at the time that All-Ireland Home Rule would have led to the breakup of the Union. Well Scotland has Home Rule and it hasn’t left the Union and polls suggest it won’t – the SNP is a minority govt. While opposed to partition and in favour of unity by consent, I think that in a weird kind of way, we have the Unionists to thank for the fact that we are a fully independent state. Had they not resisted Home Rule, we might still be in the UK and subject to a tax-policy set according to the interests of England, rather than Ireland. Perhaps the people of Scotland, likewise, will not reach their full potential while remaining in the UK, notably given the North Sea oil revenues are being spent primarily in England.

  • Harry Flashman

    “Traditionally they were Labour’s most loyal constituency”

    Yes, it is amusing to note that the biggest bulwark against Scottish independence has long been the support given to the Unionist Labour Party by the dyed in the wool Catholics of western Scotland, most of whom were directly descended from Ulster Catholics, whereas the core vote of the SNP was centred around disaffected Scottish Tory voters and other assorted blue noses.

  • joeCanuck

    Harry,

    I wonder did our paths ever cross; St.Columb’s 1959 – 1965.

  • Catholic Observer

    Brian Boru,

    In fairness no penal laws were ever imposed on Irish Catholics by Westminster. It was the (exclusively Protestant) Irish Parliament that was responsible for them. The Patriot Party in Grattan’s Parliament did however manage to relieve some of the more egregious ones. It was precisely the offer of Catholic Emancipation in a united parliament by Lord Castlereagh and William Pitt that proved so tantalizing to the Catholic hierarchy and much of the Catholic class. Daniel O’Connell was one of the very few prominent Catholics who opposed the Act of Union. Unattracted by the lure of Emancipation he said he would rather loose all his religious rights than be ruled from London.

  • Henry94

    Support for freedom is at 38% with the union at 40% according to this latest poll in the Sunday Hearld.

    So suggestions that New labours economic incompetence might save the union appear wide of the mark.

  • Henry94
  • dub

    William,

    Don’t see any libel. Some of us remember Trimble’s vile and disgusting reaction to the sectarian murder of Ciaran Cummings in Antrim in 2001. By the way that’s not libellous either.

  • Harry Flashman

    “I wonder did our paths ever cross; St.Columb’s 1959 – 1965.”

    God Joe, you’re an old codger aren’t you?

  • Catholic Observer

    On his blog he signs himself as “The Rt Hon The Lord Trimble”. His Most Respectable Highness sure has a vanity problem!!!

  • blinding

    Does modern Scotland realy need advice from one of yesterdays men.
    Has the penney dropped with David that he is one of yesterdays men.

  • joeCanuck

    Indeed, Harry. A mellow oul geezer.
    I thought you might be up there too.

  • sunnysoutheast

    It is interesting when it comes to scottish independence the chief argument against it is taxes. Why should the english taxpayer pay for scots, irish and welsh in their eyes are acting ungrateful. The celt unionists forget if the uk breaks up. England gains the most have a look at the web site english democrats see how an increasing amount of english are tired of being scapegoats tired of england being sacrificed for the idea of britain. Why should england pay 50 billion a year without fail. The key to independence for scotland and wales is to be so expensive england goes it alone. Harry Flashman says it is ironic scotish catholics labours bedrock of unionism turning towardsv the snp. If you look at the english democrats website most of them seem as they were former tories. The break up of the uk is getting nearer if it leads to a united ireland is another question. But unionists in ireland insist they are british when britain implodes who are they. A problem that will not go away interesting times ahead.

  • Harry Flashman

    Not quite I’m a decade or two behind you but given how my bones and muscles are feeling this morning after a couple of hours gardening yesterday I’m certainly no spring chicken.

    Was Bunkum teaching in your day (he was in the final years of his presidency when I was there)? And what about the legendary Nipper, or Father Fla? You must have been taught by them.

  • Lindsay Roy

    Would this mythical English taxpayer also like to get rid of the drain of resources that is London?