Informers behind the wire.

The Newsletter is reporting that

THE Government had IRA informers inside the Maze and had prior warning of republicans going “on the blanket” and the dirty protests.
And the republican sources said they had been threatened by the IRA Army Council with “being shot”, if they did not participate in the campaign.

  • DC

    Oh right…well then that’s rather authoritarian isn’t it but here tell us all something we dont know.

    Something different like the IRA and its Army Council was concerned for members and their families and asked the prisoners to seek their loved ones’ views before going on hunger or self-suicide ergo purposely losing themselves to their own loved ones. That would be a tear jerker, oh the self sacrifice backed by the family and the IRA sobbing in the background in a heap begging them to put people first not abstract entities. Abstract thoughts like that west Belfast boy Adams and his own imagined mythical might of republican historical right to rule everything in sight on this beloved fair isle o’Ireland. Oh what a construct.

    As I type this I am waving up to just-call-me-Martin up on the hill the good chap he is.

    What a nice bunch. I am sure too they are best placed up there to help us fight a globalised downturn what with the new image NI has as a hive of industry, with co-operative and industrious politicians alike, working together constantly for our common good.

  • Grassy Noel

    Rip up all the books and the personal testimonies fo everyone concerned with this episode.

    Yous are all wrong – right!

    My source: republican informers quoted in the News Letter.

    Now, I must take my tablets and lie.

    NURSE! THE SCREENS!!

  • cynic

    Informers in the IRA? ….never.

    And the Army council threatening members to make them go on hunger strike? Why, next you will expect us to believe that they even withheld details of a deal from the Hunger Strikers so that they would gain political advantage allowing more to die needlessly.

    Unbelievable!! They were all Saints you know.

  • cynic

    Grassy

    Do you mean the ‘authorised’ testimonials that were cleared by the leadership so as to comply with the official history?

    As more and more papers are revealed over the years there may be a few red faces.

  • IRIA

    Republicans hold the “dirty protest” and “hunger strikers” on a higher level of reverence. I’m guessing the powers that be are simply trying to tarnish that to the best of their ability.

    Odds are there were informers in prison. We know that already. Have there been previous reports of the threats from survivors/other prisoners? If not, why? I think we know…

  • Earnan

    Not all IRA members went on the blanket, not even close. I don’t believe this shit at all

  • cut the bull

    Other home office files which will be released in the future will tell every one that the Birmingham Six and the Guildford four were mass murderers. Every body now knows that this aint true even Ken Magennis.
    Just because you read something in a home office report does’nt mean its fact,it would more than likely point to the need for reading carefully between the lines and investating the issue yourself.

  • cut the bull

    sorry Investigating

  • JJ

    Touts everywhere

  • NCM

    Maybe touts sometimes exaggerate or lie?

  • cut the bull

    more important is the fact that governments and govt intelligence agencies regularly lie

  • blinding

    posted by NCM

    “Maybe touts sometimes exaggerate or lie?”

    Hard for some people to believe but you just can’t rely on a tout

  • The use of touts was the method by which the British effectively got the republican movement to do what it ultimately wanted them to do, according to Gunsmoke and Mirrors author Henry McDonald.

    They merely groomed Gerry Adams because for some reason they knew that he was their Achilles Heel. But this led to their defeat as militarists and their birth as trainee democrats. But the truth is that they were humiliated by the British and went down the default road of advocating SDLP policy as of necessitating and without really having any roots in the ways of democracy or of persuading others of the merits of their policies.

    The outworkings of the this approach have yet to be realised but the unfurling of a deeply delusional Gerry Adams will soon become evident.

    We’ll see then that flags are not enough.

  • JJ

    Ofcourse a lot of men together will talk. The brits must have heard something it is understandable. Depends on wether or not the govt gave anything for the information.

  • Father Ted Crilly

    “We Priests had nothing to do with it and the Pope didn’t really know what he was doing when he blessed those bad bad men in the maze, isn’t that right Dougal?”

    “Oh Aye Ted, [wink, wink]….where’s those hunger strike posters Bishop Len Brennan gave you?”

  • DC

    “But the truth is that they were humiliated by the British”

    But also in the present circumstances, just to add as an after thought, I think a return to republican war as per previous IRA failures is more unlikely. The British military is continually facing more severe terrorist threats in Iraq and Afghanistan that hones and hardens their skills. Making any potential return to NI something like a tea party, unless republicans take to getting their children to blow themselves up and such likes.

    Not only do I hope but it feels like it is end game here in NI to all of that stuff, save a few silly buggers messing around in part with bits and bobs of left over IRA materiel and inconsistent usage of what was, as you hint at John, a largely botched ‘war’ strategy.

  • latcheeco

    Nonsense DC,
    Many of those who served in the North in the early ’70s had served in other colonial hotspots previously. Your thesis works both ways. From what I can tell the chaps aren’t doing too well in the aforementioned theatres. Indeed their incompetence might even encourage “silly buggers” as the fuddyduddies seem to be using familiar methods successfully against them.

  • William

    It is obvious that the ordinary guys who went on the blanket / dirty protest were coerced into doing so….one has only to read ‘The Blanketmen’ by Richard O’Rawe to see that the Leadership of the IRA used the prisoners and a number of them died that didn’t have to.

    The IRA leadership [including McGuinness and Adams] don’t care about anyone….the still have their feet on the neck of the local population through the numerous Community groups they control in Nationalist / Republican areas….usually with a Sinn Fein / IRA person as chair and as the paid Officer, e.g. Drummie Crumley [IRA prisoner], Gerry McLouglin and Maeve McLouglin in Londonderry and Scranner Rice in the Lower Ormeau. ‘Sadly’ they have lost McKenna in Portadown, now within Eirgi with his terror pal Duffy. Birds of a feather!!

  • Ulsters my homeland

    “[i]The British military is continually facing more severe terrorist threats in Iraq and Afghanistan that hones and hardens their skills.”[/i]

    I’m not so sure honing or hardening skills will help any future situation in N.Ireland if it occurred. I’d say what we need is more use of technology and it’s implementation in a court of law.

    Honing and hardening skills only serves one purpose and that’s to defeat the enemy. However in built up areas in N.Ireland, after the enemy was taken out, civilians have been known to remove the enemy’s weaponry, thus rendering the enemy a civilian, which results in a propaganda war of victim hood. Therefore, honing and hardening soldier skills is only one part of the plan when dealing with the likes of N.Ireland. The use of video/audio technology and it’s implementation in a court of law is what is needed. The technology can record exactly what the soldier sees and hears at the specific time an incident occurs.

  • NCM

    So then how many volunteers didn’t go on the blanket and were subsequently shot for it?

  • Ulsters my homeland

    “[/i]So then how many volunteers didn’t go on the blanket and were subsequently shot for it?”[/i]

    That’s not what the Newsletter has stated. The Newsletter states that the republican sources (touts) said ‘they had been threatened by the IRA Army Council with “being shot”, if they did not participate in the campaign.’, not every IRA member.

    Obviously, the IRA selected certain people to participate in the hungerstrike and if you refused, the IRA would shoot you. Sounds logical if victim hood was the game being played.

  • It was Sammy Mc Nally what done it

    It is difficult for Unionists to accept the (eventual) British government view that the IRA were not criminals but politically inspired insurgents deserving of government and the Hunger strike/strikers is a key battleground for Unionists in their battle of denial. When the boby bowl saga (Long Kesh) starts up again we can expect more of the same.

  • Ulsters my homeland

    “[i]It is difficult for Unionists to accept the (eventual) British government view that the IRA were not criminals but politically inspired insurgents deserving…………..”[/i]

    There’s nothing difficult at all for Unionists to accept the fact their government buckled under religious and world wide pressure. Unionists will always be stronger when republicans highlight out weakness.

    Facts are Facts, a bunch of criminals and murderers decide they wanted to wear their own clothes and be freed of their crimes while in prison.

    So they starved themselves to death to get these demands. I hope heaven is as pleasant as the Priest said it would be.

  • Earnan

    So you admit that the hungerstrikers did so of their own free will? Surprising. Cheers

  • Ulsters my homeland

    “[i]So you admit that the hungerstrikers did so of their own free will? Surprising. Cheers”[/i]

    Free-will is something no hunger striker or Catholic has.

  • Ulsters my homeland

    Earnan, if the hungerstrikers did so of their own free-will, wouldn’t it be safe to say they not Catholic?

  • IRIA

    “Free-will is something no hunger striker or Catholic has.”

    Huh?

    UMH: #19 above was enlightening and pretty spot on and you follow it up with drivel.

    NCM is right-how many, if any, prisoners were eventually shot for not participating?

  • NCM

    “Obviously, the IRA selected certain people to participate in the hungerstrike and if you refused, the IRA would shoot you. Sounds logical if victim hood was the game being played.”

    So then how many volunteers were shot for refusing to take part in the dirty protest/hunger strikes? If the answer is zero, then that is evidence that this whole story is bogus.

  • Ulsters my homeland

    “[i]NCM is right-how many, if any, prisoners were eventually shot for not participating?”[/i]

    IRIA, That’s not what the Newsletter stated. I read that column as saying those volunteers (touts) who took part in the hunger-strike, had stated they were forced in taking part.

    What NCM says is hypothetical.

  • Ulsters my homeland

    Free-will is something no hunger striker or Catholic has.

    You’re surely not suggesting that free will is something available only to Ulster’s finest Protestants? Surely only atheists and the like have free will (and only in a delusional sense).

  • Ulsters my homeland

    God yin John, lol. I would say Protestantism in it’s true form, without all the bells and whistles, is as free as you’ll get.

    The sacramental Presbyterian baptismal rituals, are nothing more than the hocus pocus of Roman Catholicism, but labeled under different names and subject to different rules.

  • UMH

    would say Protestantism in it’s true form, without all the bells and whistles, is as free as you’ll get.

    You wouldn’t be delusional in this, UMH. I mean, surely the only thing that Ulster’s traditional Protestants are tied to in a meaningful sense is the Old Testament. Well, lets say that throughout their history on this island, the only things that they’ve honoured are the values of the Old Testament.

    Freedom is not found in the Old Testament, but in the New where Christ advocates such things as loving your enemies, not persistently believing that you’re superior to them.

    The only freedom conferred by the Old Testament is the freedom to do evil, beginning with the law, an eye for an eye.

  • Ulsters my homeland

    John O’Connell, forget about the Free-P church.

    The Reformed church is a really good church in N.Ireland for you to learn your gospel.

  • Ulsters my homeland

    “[i]You wouldn’t be delusional in this, UMH. I mean, surely the only thing that Ulster’s traditional Protestants are tied to in a meaningful sense is the Old Testament. Well, lets say that throughout their history on this island, the only things that they’ve honoured are the values of the Old Testament.[/i]

    hi dipstick, what’s this crap about Ulster’s traditional Prods being tied to the Old Testament?

    Ever read the New Testament, you dumb ass piece of crap?

  • Earnan

    So, UMH, tell me

    Do I have free will?

    My dads parents were good protestants from Ballynihinch and my mom was a RC born in Tralee.

    I was raised Catholic, even was an altar boy, but no longer believe any of the hocus pocus, let alone in Christianity in general. Do I have free will?? Or does my RC blood preclude that

  • Ulsters my homeland

    “[i]So, UMH, tell me

    Do I have free will?

    My dads parents were good protestants from Ballynihinch and my mom was a RC born in Tralee.

    I was raised Catholic, even was an altar boy, but no longer believe any of the hocus pocus, let alone in Christianity in general. Do I have free will?? Or does my RC blood preclude that “[/i]

    Earnan, were you baptised or christened Catholic? If you were you would have to ask the Roman Catholic church if you can be freed from this.

  • NCM

    Wow, this thread has degenerated into pure nonsense.

  • Rory Carr

    The concept of man having been imbued by God with free will is a central tenet of Catholic faith and dogma. Indeed it would not be possible for man to sin against God where he did not have the choice to exercise such free will in the first place.

    It would appear indeed that Ulsters My Homeland is as ignorant of basic Catholic beliefs as he is about the inner workings of Republicanism. But at least he seems equally bigoted against both organisations and equally ready to listen to and to spread any ridiculous nonsense that any other malicious fool comes up with. His rants on these matters may be safely ignored.

  • Ulsters my homeland

    “[i]Or does my RC blood preclude that “[/i]

    how the fuck is your blood RC blood, Earnan?

  • Ulster my homeland

    “[i]I was raised Catholic, even was an altar boy, but no longer believe any of the hocus pocus, let alone in Christianity in general. Do I have free will?? Or does my RC blood preclude that “[/i]

    Posted by Earnan

    what does your local dioceses say?

  • MCM

    Wow, this thread has degenerated into pure nonsense.

    We have to establish a basis for our communication or else the remainder of the thread is just fraudulent.

    UMH

    Ever read the New Testament, you dumb ass piece of crap?

    You contradict yourself in a sentence. If, per slight chance, you had once read the New Testament, you reveal that you never understood it. Ever seeing but never perceiving; ever hearing but never understanding.

  • Ulsters my homeland

    John O’Connell, master of shit..how do you do?

  • Feeling a bit Satanic at the moment, UMH? I suppose you’re just feeling the atmosphere in the Old Testament world, your part of the homeland.

  • RepublicanStones

    UMH give it up.

  • doctor

    This story is really a non-issue but anything with the tag “IRA informers” is guaranteed to give a cheap thrill to the News Letter staff and readership. The network of touts, if one actually reads the article, was one prisoner in the Maze and one prisoner in Britain. It apparently consisted of a couple of interviews between prison staff and the prisoners in question. Not sure what benefit this information actually gave to the British. The whole bit about the army council threat to shoot non-participants just sounds silly in retrospect. Wouldn’t the British have been broadcasting this claim every chance they got, both during the actual protest and ever since, if they took this claim seriously? At best, the prisoner in question may have been threatened by another prisoner who tried invoking the army council to put try and put some weight behind his words.

  • Dan’s Breen Revolver

    My RC blood? Because my Mother, and her whole family, are/were hardcore Catholic. As for my diocese, I haven’t given them a dime since I grew up, so to them I don’t exist. Plus I live in America these days anyways.

    The only people who believe this story are those who want to believe anything/everything negative about the IRA.

    They would probably believe “They drank each others blood to get into the Army Council” or some such BS.

  • Lucy

    I love it when the Unionists talk trash about the Republican prisoners. The Unionists had the English Army to do their dirty work while they sat on their asses in their homes.

    This isn’t about religion..it’s about the Unionists and the English wanting to decimate the Northern Irish people. Their way or the highway.

    None of you know what those prisoners went thru and I doubt Unionist prisoners suffered the same treatment. How can you possibly “KNOW” why the prisoners did what they did. Who are you to judge anyone’s actions when yours were so dispicable ..hiding behind SAS troops with the order to kill on sight.

    Bah! Peace in Northern Ireland?? Never as long as you continue to treat the Northern Irish like yesterday’s trash, and teach your children the same. Have you ever seen small children play together? They have fun and they don’t mistreat their playmates. Adults teach them all the hate and vindictiveness, and your young people today only act out as their parents encourage them to do.

    You all should be ashamed for pushing the
    religious bull shite.

    And why is this an issue for the papers at all? Everyone has heard all of this before. There isn’t one new item that hasn’t bee bashed about for years. Much ado about nothing.

  • Mick Fealty

    UMH,

    That’s a yellow. I think you are on one already, but it’s a long time since I handed it to you.

    Red to follow if you don’t pull your horns in.

  • DC

    “You all should be ashamed for pushing the
    religious bull shite.”

    Why didn’t we think of that throughout all of Ireland north and south over the last 100 years here.

    A welcome admission and better late than never I suppose.

  • Prionsa Eoghan

    Thanks for the giggle UMH, your fascination with the intricacies, minor rules and minutiae of the Church never fails to amaze me, nor not bore me silly for that matter.

    Bet those silly Taig high heid yins never knew what they were missing when they knocked you back for the priest-hood eh?

    Or perhaps they did.

    >>And the republican sources said they had been threatened by the IRA Army Council with “being shot”, if they did not participate in the campaign.<< Dearie dearie me!

  • Reader

    Lucy: The Unionists had the English Army to do their dirty work while they sat on their asses in their homes.
    Well done Lucy. You would be surprised at the number of nationalists around the place who would suggest that unionists are, in general, active, violent, aggressive, brutal and thuggish. But our secret is that we are really meek, peaceful and endlessly inclined to non-violence, reason and basket-weaving. We were on the verge of extinction before the British Army was deployed on the streets at the beginning of the troubles.
    Just on your original point, though – what *should* we have been doing instead?

  • blinding

    Shock horror people that are getting paid to talk to other people tell the paymasters what they want to hear.

    It really is not rocket science.