Mr Paisley goes to Dublin Town…

Ian Paisley is to meet the Taoiseach in Dublin today (don’t expect any snowballs to be thrown), in what is being billed (sound file) as a significant consolidation of the ‘new dispensation’.

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  • smcgiff

    http://www.rte.ie/news/2007/0404/northpolitics.html

    Jaysus, sounds like he just stopped short of a peck on the cheek.

    I suppose if you’re going to do something you’ve previously been reticent about, it’s best to do it with gusto.

    Still, good to see.

  • Yokel

    The new Bertie & Ian Stop SF Show.

    Well, actually the DUP probably don’t care so much about SF in the South right now so I assume there must be money at stake.

  • jerryp

    IP will be throwing in the ball at the Ulster final next at this rate !

  • Bemused

    Just hear the press conference – reasonably positive, but must say that I found it pretty pettily offensive that Paisley couldn’t bring himself to address Bertie by his official title – even his own Prime Minister (Blair) manages it without difficulty. Then again, common courtesy was never the old blusterers strong point…….

  • Greenflag

    Ho Hum . Paisley won’t need any tips from Bertie on how to achieve ‘power’ but he might want to listen to our ‘Machiavelli’ if he wants to stay in ‘power’.

    I would not be surprised if we see Paisley addressing a joint session of Dail and Senate in the not too distant future .

    BTW whatever happened to Queenie’s visit ?

  • Would Big Ian be interested in Stan’s job….?

  • smcgiff

    Macswiney, did you leave an “a” out just before the “t”. 😉

    Only joking – Big Ian has moved on and so should we.

  • Dinger

    …and a news report I’ve just heard said that the Big Man said he was “proud of his Irish heritage” or suchlike…is this correct?? And if so, are there a few True Blue DUP-ers burning their membership cards and/or having a nervous breakdown as we speak??

    Seriously though, hallelujah and praise the lord, things are moving on! Any bets on Bertie, Big Ian and Gerry cheering on Norn Iron at Windsor for the next home match??!

  • Aldamir

    Don’t be surprised if Rome is the next stop on IP’s agenda…

  • smcgiff

    ‘“proud of his Irish heritage” or suchlike…is this correct??’

    *Drops off chair* I’ve my doubts – even in his most jovial of moods the best I’ve ever heard him discribe himself was, ‘Scots-Irish’.

  • The Dubliner

    That’s quite encouraging; it’s good to see the leaders of unionism engaging with the south free from their customary stunt n’ gesture manner of yore.

    I’m not so sure that it was worth £400 million of Irish taxpayers’ money, however. At that rate of expenditure, it’ll cost us a couple of billion for a kiss on the cheek.

  • Token Dissent

    Big Ian – for all his faults – has always acknowledged the importance of Irishness in his identity.

    Quotes from the 1980s:

    “I was born on the island of Ireland. I have Irish traits in me…and I am an Irishman because you can’t be an Ulsterman without being an Irishman.”

    I would argue that Ian and his loyal deputy Marty both share another common trait: anti-Englishness.

  • interested

    He expressed his Irishness in similar terms to Carson’s – mentioning his father joined the UVF of Carson, who’s aim was after all to deliver all of Ireland within the Union.

    Now that NI is secure in the Union maybe that should be the next stop – persuading all the deluded people in the South to re-join us British!!!

  • Aldamir

    IP at one time was one of the few unionist politicians who used the phrase “North of Ireland”.

  • Inspector Clouseau

    Ian Paisley is sowing seeds that will eventually lead to a regional assembly within a New Ireland where the descendents of the plantation have a say over their own affairs.

  • The Dubliner

    Interested, why would the Irish want to join an economy that is substantially inferior to ours, and where its citizens are substantially worse off? Improve yourselves and return with an acceptable offer, kid.

  • Charlie

    Inspector Clouseau – by ‘descendents of the plantation’ I take it you mean those with lowland Scots surnames such as Morrison and Adams??

  • Gréagóir O’ Frainclín

    Just a note, but I believe the Reverend Paisley has an Ancient Order of Hibernians sash in his collection. What we are seeing is the greening of the Unionists, and long overdue it is too.

  • Token Dissent

    We have more importantly seen nationalism turn towards a nice pale shade of green. Replacing the vulgar old shade of choice.

    Dubliner, the substantial joining up of economies has already occurred. Irish success has came about by rejecting the cul de sac of nationalistic economics and embracing the European Union – where British money was of welcome assistance.

    Plus I am not entirely sure that all citizens of the Republic feel better of than those of the Black North. Welfare and Health provision? Social inequality? Crime? Job security?

  • Two Nations

    Gréagóir O’ Frainclín

    I honestly believe it is the complete opposite – it’s the oranging of the South.

    Paisley will seduce the Southerners. In a couple of years he will be Granda Ian – the luvlee big muhn. He will steal the thunder from Gerry. The Shinners will demand something and the response in the ROI will be – What Would Ian Want? There’ll even be WWIW wristbands.

    You can all quote me on this – when he dies the Tricolour will fly at half-mast from Leinster House.

  • Dissenter

    Hear hear! The most ill-judged stance of Northern Protestants has been that of “we’re not Irish, we’re inherently British!”, which, with any exploration of history (ie. the 1798 rebellion and the antagonism between Ulster Presbyterian settlers and the British establishment in America) can be proven to be built on shaky ground…if Unionists proudly described themselves as ‘Irish Unionists’ (as they did in Carson’s era), their politics would be better understood and they would attract a lot more sympathy for their position around the world…the staunch, Union Jack-waving Prod stereotype only appeals to BNP supporters and plays right into the hands of ultra-Nationalists who love to see Unionism looking so unappealing to neutral observers…

  • Henry94

    I don’t think anyone could have asked more of Dr Paisley than what he did today. He is a class act.

  • jaffa

    Bertie made a good first move with the Somme commemorations last year. Serious heart melter. I think that sort of thing matters to Dr Paisley. The Boyne thing’s a similarily good move.

  • willowfield

    Dr Paisley must look back on his life with some pride. He must be proud that he hounded O’Neill out of office for daring to meet with the Southern PM.

    Maybe he objected to O’Neill’s meeting because there were no cross-border bodies? Now that the South is able to interfere in NI’s affairs, Dr Paisley deems it acceptable for the NI First Minister to meet the Southern PM?

    Or maybe it’s OK now because he’s the top dog?

  • jg

    “rejecting cul de sac economics” when will NI do the same?

  • Henry94

    willowfield

    while it is arguable that things should have happened 30 years ago it could just as easily have taken another 30 years. Here we are and let’s do our best with it.

  • GavBelfast

    Or maybe it’s OK now because he’s the top dog?

    Posted by willowfield on Apr 04, 2007 @ 06:45 PM

    Of course he did – own church, own loyal order (more or less), own party, own-ership of Unionism (as he liked to emphasise today alongside Bertie).

    All of the deaths and destruction seem even more pointless, tragic and avoidable now, but I still hope (and it is a hope) that this works inan enduring way FOR EVERYONE in Northern Ireland, in all of Ireland and all of the UK.

  • The Dubliner

    “Dubliner, the substantial joining up of economies has already occurred. Irish success has came about by rejecting the cul de sac of nationalistic economics and embracing the European Union – where British money was of welcome assistance.” – Token Dissent

    I’m not sure what point(s) you are making, if any. All members states can be said to have rejected “the cul de sac of nationalistic economics” by joining the EU. Everybody welcomes free money – except fools, hippies, or lunatics. All member states receive contributions for social infrastructure, including the UK, so it can be equally said that Irish money was of “welcome assistance” to the UK. Don’t overestimate the importance of that rebates that were a fraction of Irish tax revenue. CAP payments may have made a few farmers very rich, but those pig-fuckers never reinvest a penny into the economy. They certainly had no part to play in making Sean Quinn a multi-billionaire or any of the other self-made Irish billionaires. Brilliance and entrepreneurial flair did that – the same qualities that create success and wealth anywhere in the world.

    “All of the deaths and destruction seem even more pointless, tragic and avoidable now, but I still hope (and it is a hope) that this works inan enduring way FOR EVERYONE in Northern Ireland, in all of Ireland and all of the UK.” – GavBelfast

    I wouldn’t read too much into Paisley’s improved demeanour. As First Minister, there are decorum and protocols to be observed. He didn’t disgrace the office he now represents – and we’re all pleased for him. It may have taken him 80 years to reach maturity, but it’s better late than never.

    On the optimistic side, this may be a sign of the ‘normalising’ of political relationships between different traditions… and a sign of good faith on Paisley’s part to do his best to make the assembly work. If so, bring it on…

  • Emmet

    ” was born on the island of Ireland. I have Irish traits in me…and I am an Irishman because you can’t be an Ulsterman without being an Irishman.”

    that’s something that will never escape David Vance’s lips!

  • Comrade Stalin

    I agree with Henry94, the Paisley appearance and events today were wonderful.

    Whatever your point of view is, the events of the past week or so have been nothing short of utterly historic, and you can’t fail but to be encouraged by Paisley’s newfound constructive approach.

    UUP supporters trying to win the advantage by pouring very cold water over these things are doing themselves serious harm. I’d advise you guys to back off for a while until the honeymoon passes.

  • smcgiff

    ‘You can all quote me on this – when he dies the Tricolour will fly at half-mast from Leinster House.’

    Of course it will. It’d be fair strange for the tricolour to be flying at half mast over Stormont, and not Leinster house! 🙂

  • smcgiff

    CS is correct – now is not the time for the UUP to throw a hissy fit. It might be some consolatation to know tat on some level all unionists know that Paisley somewhat put self interest over what was best for the people of Northern Ireland by his actions over these past years.