“significant evidence the UDA are involved in extortion”

Det Supt Esmond Adair of the PSNI’s anti-extortion team has confirmed what the government are well aware of – “significant evidence the UDA are involved in extortion”. Not to worry though, the Secretary of State for Wales, etc. has previously stated that it is “wilfully mischievous” to suggest “that the Government would ‘buy off’ paramilitaries”… and Processing™ onwards..

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  • Dread Cthulhu

    Oh, shock and dismay!

    Do you mean to tell me that this group of thugs is acting like a common… well, group of thugs??

    I was told that this was the start of a “new way” and “brighter dawn” for Northern Ireland — the start of something brilliant.

    Instead, all we see is that the UDA is the same old collection of tattooed louts as ever, with perhaps the small difference that they are trying to extort the government in addition to the local shops and residents.

    Is it any wonder the UPRG has a minimal political footprint?

  • Pete Baker

    Dread

    “Is it any wonder the UPRG has a minimal political footprint?”

    Well, if this goes the way it’s apparently planned that political footprint can be expected to grow.. which is the other element to the financial incentive.

  • Crataegus

    There really is only one way to deal with this and that is lock the bastards up. But of course that is difficult for various reasons not least of which is collusion.

    There are times when a bit of honesty is the easiest option but politicians really do make a meal of it.

    You cannot trust these people and you will never buy them off, they will just come back for more. Eventually you have to face them down.

  • Dread Cthulhu

    Pete Baker: “Well, if this goes the way it’s apparently planned that political footprint can be expected to grow.. which is the other element to the financial incentive. ”

    Somehow, I’d like to believe that the people who actually had their neighborhoods run down by these hoods were smart enough — hell, they don’t even need smarts, just a memory that reaches back past Tuesday last — not to elect the same collection of hoods who created the problem that the guv’mint, in their infinite wisdow, are now paying to correct the problems they created. It’s akin to paying the KKK to provide diversity training.

  • observer

    Somehow, I’d like to believe that the people who actually had their neighborhoods run down by these hoods were smart enough—

    It didnt stop Sinn Fein

  • circles

    No because SF didn’t run neighbourhoods down. You see the problem with facile comparisons such as observers is that they are complete nonsense.
    SF is not the republican version of the UDA (Nor indeed was the IRA) by any wild stretch of the imagination.
    The UDA are nipple piercing (now be honest – Martin McGuinness with his nipples pierced? I don’t think so), powder snortin, back-stabbing, lackies that did a considerable amount of leg work for the (in)security forces, thus guaranteeing a continuation of that way of life for them.

    I’m wondering though if that 1 million quid wasn’t just a crude sting operation to provide this “significant evidence that the UDA are involved in extortion”

  • Dread Cthulhu

    observer: “It didnt stop Sinn Fein ”

    Apples and Oranges, observer.

    1) SF / PIRA always had a political track — they had seperate identities, if not wholly seperate memberships. The UDA is seeking to graft on a political wing, after yielding that field Unionism and the British, who “suddenly” have little use for the UDA anymore. Also, UPRG comes off looking like a sock-puppet — a thin facade — a bit of cover-up make-up to hide bad tattoos.

    2) The RUC, et. al., were gracious enough to cast themselves as the Catholic communities enemies, giving support to SF’s political agenda and PIRA’s proclaimed role as their defenders.

    3) As a result of some forty odd years of less-than-benign neglect and discrimination in employment, the Catholics communities were pretty broken from the start of the conflict.

    If the UDA had been an actual neighborhood watch / defense association, rather than a drug-dealing criminal enterprise, and had had an interest in looking after the political well-being of their neighbors, rather than trying to make a quick buck selling them nose-candy and “protection,” it might be different.

  • observer

    so whos running drugs in republican areas, the UDA? get real

  • northsider

    so whos running drugs in republican areas, the UDA? get real

    The UDA – supply. Crims and dissidents – distribution. I live in those areas so I know more than you.

    Go back to the Daily Star. This is a political site.

  • circles

    ’tis true what northsider says (in my experience).
    Welcome to the real world observer – now you see that the big pease wall wasn’t a mirror after all! Things ARE actually different on either side

  • Cromwell

    Thats right Circles, the Bon Jovis never did nuffink, any money they got from their own areas was from “voluntary donations”!

  • nmc

    I can only agree with circles and northsider. Never bought dope from a chuck, and I’ve bought plenty…

  • circles

    Now Cromwell – how did you get your ludicrous statement from what I wrote?
    Read the posts and respond accordingly willya? Rather than simply making up what you think someone may have posted.

  • Cromwell

    You said the SF, & by that i will assume you also mean the IRA, is not a republican version of the UDA.
    So are you telling me the Bon Jovis/SF dont engage in extorsion? Dont oppress their “own” people in order to gain funds?

  • Dread Cthulhu

    circles: “Now Cromwell – how did you get your ludicrous statement from what I wrote?
    Read the posts and respond accordingly willya? Rather than simply making up what you think someone may have posted. ”

    I wouldn’t hold your breath… the would appear to be a dearth of literate, eloquent Loyalists.

    It is worth a note that, in broad general terms, that PIRA, whilst funding their operations with criminal activities, had a couple of “political” advantages. First, there is the small matter of common cause — the police had allowed themselves to be cast as an enemy of the Catholic community. Second, much of their criminality had a tangible or intangible benefit — smuggled / converted petrol is cheaper, stolen goods cost less and both deny “the man” the taxes, which can be presented as political — no tax = no money for the RUC/UDR etc. Even protection payments, thanks to the excesses of the Protestant mobs and B-Specials in the early days of the Troubles, enjoyed a certain lustre, as it appeared at Catholics really did need protecting.

  • circles

    Cromwell – I still stand by my statement that SF (and the IRA) are in no way some kind of republican mirror image of Johnny Adair and the pierced tit brigades. The organisations do not have a similar history, a similar outlook, a similar membership, a similar ethos….
    The only thing in common was that both the IRA and the UDA killed people, and both were involved in other extra-legal activites. How these were viewed and handled by the (in)security forces was however completely different.
    Its a facile comparison as I said – but false.

  • Dread Cthulhu

    Cromwell: “So are you telling me the Bon Jovis/SF dont engage in extorsion?”

    ex-: prefix, meaning out of or away from;

    torsion: noun, meaning the act of twisting or turning or the condition of being twisted or turned.

    Thusly, “extorsion” would mean, roughly “formerly being twisted”

    Now, presumably, you meant “extortion.” And, yes, PIRA did fund themselves partly through that mechanism. However, given the behavior of the B-Specials and other parties allegedly there to preserve order, mayhap the Catholic community had a different opinion as to the necessity of “protection.”

    Cromwell: “Dont (sic) oppress their “own” people in order to gain funds? ”

    Presumably, as you expressed this as a question, you meant “didn’t they oppress their own to gain funds?”

    If the choice is oppression from one of your own or “the other,” most will choose one of their own. Additionally, as noted above, there were reasons that, in the beginning, would make such payments attractive or at least seemingly less onerous.

  • Shore Road Resident

    Ridiculous no-but themmuns posturing on this thread. Callers to the Nolan show made it quite clear that this is and remains a problem across the board, especially in the construction sector.

    PS: I’ve bought pills off the Ogra. I’ve grown up since. Have they?

  • chris

    Sure everyone knows that the loyalist paramilitaries / UDA are up to their necks in racketeering even the dogs that live in republican areas know this. How do you take the paramilitary out of any terrorist? This was easy money for the UDA, But will they be round on Saturday collecting for loyalist prisoner welfare or is every one afraid to tell them that these gangsters are back on the street except for Haddock. This money would have been more useful to the innocent victims of loyalists.

  • Cromwell

    Dread,
    Yawn.
    I can do without the pedantry, but since you like making a fool of yourself maybe you should learn to spell “behaviour”!
    Frankly, I don’t have time to engage the spellcheck or swallow a dictionary every time I post.
    You should think about growing up.
    Have, in your opinion, SF/IRA ever done anything wrong?

  • nmc

    no-but themmuns

    No shit. A thread on the UDA money, and we have four posts on the UDA and 16 posts about the IRA, (who decomissioned btw).

    Have, in your opinion, SF/IRA ever done anything wrong?

    Would need a definition of wrong, (incorrect, illegeal?) but in all likelihood the answer’s yes.

    In your opinion is the IRA the only answer to any issue in any thread? What do you have to say about the UDA, other than nothing?

  • mchinadog

    the Secretary of State for Wales, etc. has previously stated that it is “wilfully mischievous” to suggest “that the Government would ‘buy off’ paramilitaries”.

    Whom does the S O S think he is kidding. British Governments have been buying of both sets of paramilitaries for years, first it was the IRA and latterly the UDA. They are both scum. The UDA have destroyed their communities for years and now the S O S has rewarded them. What should have happened if there was any money going into any community it should have been channeled through legitimate sources in the community, not though hoods, extortionists and gangsters (confirmed today by the police). No matter how many checks and balances have been set in place the UDA will find a way to syphon of hundreds of pounds for their own nefarious activities. Sham on you S O S what about the law-abiding communities with no paramilitary connections, where their reward for being good citizens?

  • Cromwell

    nmc,
    you are right,
    to qualify,

    The UDA are right up there on my list of scumbags, joint top with the Provos, but edging slightly ahead in the steriod enhanced moron column.
    Enjoy your weekend, its about time I went home.

  • Dread Cthulhu

    cromwell: “I can do without the pedantry, but since you like making a fool of yourself maybe you should learn to spell “behaviour”! ”

    Ah, but I do… the difference is, however, a matter of local mileage… 😉

    cromwell: “Frankly, I don’t have time to engage the spellcheck or swallow a dictionary every time I post. You should think about growing up. ”

    Coming from a poster who is unwilling (or unable) to engage in a discussion of the issues rooted in fact, I find your criticism less than impressive.

    Cromwell: “Have, in your opinion, SF/IRA ever done anything wrong? ”

    Certainly they have done wrong. As a matter of fact, at no point in this discussion have I denied they have done wrong. If you must know, I am ecumenical on the matter of criminality — hoods is hoods. Likewise, my politics, on a day-to-day basis, are hardly in-line with Sinn Fein. However, they, the IRA, were not the issue at hand in this thread, or hadn’t you noticed?

    Cromwell: “The UDA are right up there on my list of scumbags, joint top with the Provos, but edging slightly ahead in the steriod enhanced moron column. ”

    Well, it would appear that we agree on at least one thing.

  • picador

    An absolute bloody disgrace.

    Still no mention of decommissioning whatsoever.

    Then again MI5 would probably object.

  • sean1

    Given the Branch run the UDA, does this mean they have just given themselves a £1 million pay 0ff / increase?

  • Wilde Rover

    As loathsome as many of them are, the occasional attack dogs of unionism offer a comfort blanket to the majority.

    Perhaps it’s the job of the bigger men within the United Irelander wing of slugger to convince unionism that this unsavory element is unnecessary.

    As for this (former United Irelander) Mexican, he’s still banging on about that Two Votes Good One Vote Bad Party bollix, and NI having a star on the EU flag and all of that.

    I invite any of the many articulate United Irelanders to convince me how having one vote within the EU for the island is better than two independent votes (with NI as a sort of EU Special Zone, with special tax and gambling laws, or whatever it takes).

    I also invite their unionist counterparts to convince me how an EU-supported independent and stable NI wouldn’t be better than the current wandering mess.

  • Pablo

    Will Mo Courtney still get his share now that he’s seen the error of his ways and pleaded guilty; no doubt in return for a weak slap on the wrists with a damp copy of ‘Combat’?

    These boys are all on the payroll anyway, so why get upset if occasionally one or two of us have to pay a little bit more than we’re already paying for their services. Ladies and gentlemen welcome to the mother of all democracies!

  • Dread Cthulhu

    Wilde Rover: “As loathsome as many of them are, the occasional attack dogs of unionism offer a comfort blanket to the majority. ”

    One should find no comfort in diseased ticks. There is no irony in paying these lice to regenerate the areas they’ve destroyed, only farce.

  • Pete Baker

    Short memories in evidence for some.

    A couple of archived links for deeper background to this announcement.

    And a more pertitent objection than those proffered so far.

  • observer

    The shite that emanates from republicans is quite amazing. The UDA are now controlling Republican areas through drugs , what a load of bollox

    the provos are up to their neck in it and extortion. as well as bank robberies, stealing details of prison officers, gun running, and lets not forget the issue of those who were expelled from catholic areas who are still not allowed to return.,

    These issues need to be sorted before republicans are allowed back into power

  • circles

    Wilde Rover – but why would the 6 counties even get a vote? Its a province of a corner off the coast of europe. Surely you’re not basing you’re argumentation on wishful thinking? Would the north not have to be an independent country for that? And that being the case I invite you to convince me that that would ever be possible.

  • Pablo

    Understand this Observer (with his eyes closed).

    Republicans do not require you or anyone else to ‘allow’ them into power, their mandate puts them there.

    Being the largest party in unionism will amount to nothing under the alternative of joint sovereignty. Welcome to the 21st century. Now observe how SF will be in direct government of this rotten statelet or failing that indirectly through the alternative scenario.

  • observer

    Pablo, i think youll find that republicans DO need us. We have a veto and were not afraid to use in

    and in the south you need FF

  • James

    oh joy, 2 of my favourite Pete-isms in one thread. not a day goes by i don’t wish for the cliched, tired, and slightly embarrassing use of the peter hain title and the trademark sign in a post.

    …..what, you mean that’s not the ball??

  • Pete Baker

    “…..what, you mean that’s not the ball??”

    Oh, in the way that you ignore the actual topic in order to attack the messenger – something along those lines I’d guess.

    Meanwhile.. back to the actual topic – the ongoing Processâ„¢.

  • UFB

    “Pablo, i think youll find that republicans DO need us. We have a veto and were not afraid to use in. And in the south you need FF”

    Wishfull, deluded thinking

  • picador

    Have the DUP issued a statement condemning this appeasement of terrorists yet?

  • observer

    “Pablo, i think youll find that republicans DO need us. We have a veto and were not afraid to use in. And in the south you need FF”

    Wishfull, deluded thinking
    Posted by UFB on Mar 24, 2007 @ 01:22 AM

    well go ahead a form a government on monday without us then and see how far that gets you

  • Observer

    Never seen so much tripe since the last time I looked at Slugger.
    To equate the largest nationalist party with a bunch of sectarian serial killers without a vote between them is ludicrous.
    The same tired old allegations trotted out time after time, without a shred of evidence to back them up just won’t cut it anymore.
    If republicans were leeching on the nationalist community the way the UDA leeches on the unionists, they would be given the same bums rush these clowns have every time people got the chance to leave a blank beside their representative’s name on the ballot paper.
    The Brit’s created the UDA and now they are responsible for the redundancy payments.

    “Pablo, i think youll find that republicans DO need us. We have a veto and were not afraid to use in”

    Go for it. Collapsing the Assembly will place unionists in the position of self neutered rabbits, trapped in the headlights of the Sinn Fein juggernaut gradually increasing in strength in the south.

  • Observer

    the Sinn Fein juggernaut gradually increasing in strength in the south.

    delusions of the grandeur

  • Pat Mc Larnon

    ‘the provos are up to their neck in it and extortion. as well as bank robberies, stealing details of prison officers, gun running, and lets not forget the issue of those who were expelled from catholic areas who are still not allowed to return.,’

    A catalogue of lies that indicates the depths some unionists will retreat to in order to convince themselves that democracy should not be allowed to work.
    While pitiable, nonetheless, the layers of bigotry should be continually peeled away to leave the neanderthals with absolutely nothing. It is time consuming in the short term but beneficial in the long term for the people concerned.