8 of the 9 charged after Raytheon protest get bail

Press Association reports that 8 of the nine men, including Eamonn McCann, arrested after forcing their way into the Raytheon offices in Derry and destroying computer equipment and documents have been granted bail with conditions on their movements and association. One of the nine did not apply for bail. Also worth noting, according to the Irish News report[subs req], three of the nine “refused to acknowledge the court” when they were initially charged.The charges are detailed in the PA report..

Miss Naomh Lavery, for the Crown, told the court: “The protesters carrying placards identifying themselves as the Derry Anti-War Coalition staged a protest outside the Raytheon offices. Members of the crowd confronted two security guards who were punched and kicked.”

She said: “They smashed through doors with a crowbar they had brought with them and made their way to a first floor office occupied by Raytheon.

“Three members of staff in the office were ordered to leave and the group barricaded themselves inside.”

She said during an eight hour stand-off, office equipment and computers were damaged or thrown out of the windows. A mainframe computer suffered £150,000 of damage and the total damage was in the region of £350,000.

She said after being arrested by police, all nine people read out a statement at the start of their interviews in which, she said, they attempted to justify their actions.

Those charged included veteran socialist and journalist Eamon McCann, 63.

The others, who like Mr McCann live in Derry, were James Kelly, 45, Colm Bryce, 40, Kieran Gallagher, 45, Micheal Gallagher, 27, Patrick McDaid, 36, Gary Donnelly, 36 and Sean Heaton, 34.

The ninth man Eamon O`Donnell, who was charged alongside them, did not seek bail.

The bail conditions are to be reviewed on 29th August.

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  • Cahal

    Do any of these tossers have jobs?

  • Frustrated Democrat

    More importantly do they want any one else to have jobs… this type of violence has no place in a democratic society. They should have all their assets seized, if they have any, and should be given lengthy sentences as a deterent especially Mcann who sets himself up as a pacifist.

  • Garibaldy

    I don’t think Mc Cann has ever said he was a pacifist. he does, however, have several jobs

  • Dread Cthulhu

    Garibaldy: “I don’t think Mc Cann has ever said he was a pacifist. he does, however, have several jobs ”

    Assault and battery doesn’t count as “civil disobedience,” either.

  • JONE

    I take it Gary Donnelly didn’t recognise the court. He’s a prominent 32CSM bloke who last year chaired a public meeting at the Corn Beef Tin in the Creggan where he cheerfully adavanced the proposition that anti-social behaviour could be tackled through punishment beating.

    See his manifesto here.

    http://www.phoblacht.net/gdem1904052g.html

  • Garibaldy

    Dread,

    I agree. Working people shouldn’t be assaulted doing their jobs. If the assault took place.

  • Dread Cthulhu

    Garibaldy: “I agree. Working people shouldn’t be assaulted doing their jobs. If the assault took place. ”

    What gives you doubts, pray tell? The uncompromising nature of their attitude or the fella in there number who thinks that punishment beatings are good for civil society?

  • Pete Baker

    Dread

    The allegation by Jone is simply that – despite the uncompromising nature of the manifesto – but Gary Donnelly is not one of the three named by the Irish News as refusing to recognise the court.

    They were, Kelly, Michael Gallagher and McDaid.

  • Bill

    So McCann has several jobs. Does he actually work?

  • Dread Cthulhu

    Pete: “The allegation by Jone is simply that – despite the uncompromising nature of the manifesto – but Gary Donnelly is not one of the three named by the Irish News as refusing to recognise the court. ”

    I hardly believe they were let in on a kind word and a “pretty please,” Pete… and these don’t strike me as the sort to slip a bribe.

    Pardon my cynicism.

  • micheal

    Those who profit from and perpetuate the slaughter in the middle east have no place in a truely democratic society. Congratulations to all involved in the decommissioning of Raytheon. The anti-war movement is rightly proud.

  • Pete Baker

    Dread

    I think you may be confused over the allegation I was referring to.

    The detail given in court refers to the assault on the security guards as well as using a crowbar to smash through the doors before ordering the workers in the office to leave.

  • Fanny

    I wonder how a court in Tehran would have sentenced them had they attacked a company supplying Hizbollah.

    Would they have been hoisted by the neck by a crane, or do the Iranians reserve that particular punishment for 17-year-old girls defending themselves against gang-rape?

  • Brendan, Belfast

    the decommissioning of raytheon? the anti war movement is proud?

    give my head peace. what was achieved through this vandalism? bombs still land on lebanon. terrorists still fire missiles into Israel.

    these guys are like schoolkids. “what wheeze will we get up to next?”

    pathetic,

  • Proud

    Well said Brendan.

  • TAFKABO

    The anti war movement (whatever that is exactly) may be proud, but they oughn’t let their pride blind them from realising how these actions cause the majority of people to dismiss every and any legitimate points they may have to make.

    I can’t but help think these types of protests are more about striking a pose to satiate the egos of those participating, rather than actually trying to achieve something meaningful.

    Wolfie McCann certainly lived up to his public personna as a joke revolutionary.

  • rapunsel

    Funny how the courts and PSNI seem to intervene more in the interests of big business and peace processing than of public. You can be a prominent UDA leader , known to co-ordinate murder, extortion , intimidation and get bail. Or you can be refused bail if you were involved in , admittedly a non violent protest that got out of hand against a corporation that is happy to profit from the deaths of hundreds of innocent people– — well actually profit from their deaths at the same time as profiting form their defence if as stated Raytheon supply radar technology to Lebanon.

    Members of my family have ben trying to get PSNI to the some action in respect of ongoing vandalism at a community project for the past 8 weeks. Not only have the PSNI never responded but they also failed to log the fact that complaints were made and action requested

  • Garibaldy

    Rapunsel,

    At the end of the day, we live in a class-ridden society, and the state and its forces represent the interests of the dominant class.

  • rapunsel

    Of course they do — they can do no other

  • Pete Baker

    Garibaldy

    No offense, but the idea that the NIO’s, and others’, approach to dealing with UDA criminals is class-based is frankly laughable..

    It’s political, certainly, as is the approach to ‘good’ PIRA members, but it isn’t class warfare.

  • rapunsel

    Pete

    I don’t know too many working class senior civil servants and any member of the ahem UPRg that i’ve met so far hasn’t been living in a semi detached at the top of the Ormeau Road. I don’t think garibaldy was suggesting class warfare and I took the post in the sprit that elits have power and that power will always be used so not to caue damage to the intrests of thse that have it.

  • rapunsel

    Apologies for the terrible spelling there — overexcited fingers and a brain numbed with wine.

  • Pete Baker

    Apology accepted, rapunsel [am very familiar with the condition ;o) ]

    But if Garibaldy didn’t mean class-warfare he shouldn’t have said – “we live in a class-ridden society, and the state and its forces represent the interests of the dominant class.”

    Now should he?

    As I pointed out, and have done here for some time, political decisions drive the UDA/PIRA charges brought in all areas of influence on this island…

    On the Raytheon case, it’s fairly clear-cut – we have the video evidence of the trashing of the offices for a start. It’s not class-based bias to point to the thuggery involved.

  • Garibaldy

    My post was to offer some explanation of why rapunsel’s complaints were ignored while those of rayethon were rapidly dealt with. The state serves the interests of those with power. In terms of the UDA, it’s in the state’s (two states’?) interest at this point and time to have a quiet life, and so the pressure is off.

    Not all of life is class conflict. And more’s the pity, otherwise NI wouldn’t be the divided sectarian society that we all know and love.

  • Brendan, Belfast

    what if Raytheon had been supplying arms to Syria and therefore Hizbollah? would Citizen McCann have taken similiar action??

  • Patrique

    “Do any of them have jobs”? I don’t believe that. What you are in effect saying here is that if the SDLP and others had been in power in Derry in the 1930s’ they could have got the contract for supplying gas to Hitler and the Battle of Bogside would never have happened.Jobs? Making weapons of mass destruction? The Yanks should invade Derry.

    If the Yanks didn’t arm Israel and Syria and Iran didn’t arm the Hezbullah, there would be no war. This factory in Derry is one of the causes of the war.

    And if Tony Blair sent a simple e-mail to whoever runs the USA saying that we respected muslims and all people, there would be no threat to Britain.

    “Do these people have jobs?”. Hitler could have found plenty to work in the concentration camps on this website.

  • Brendan, Belfast

    Patrique – if there was an arms factory in Derry supplying Hezbullah, should it be occupied and vandalised? i would like to know the answer.

  • Dualta

    At least one of those on that protest is far from being anti-war when it comes to Ireland.

    If Raytheon were to phone him up and offer him some of there wares he’d soon change his tune.

  • Harry Flashman

    Am I wrong in believing that the 32 County Sovereignty group believes in war against the British? Am I correct that Eamonn McCann supports the concept of class war?

    How are they “Anti-War” then? What are they Quakers?

  • Dualta

    Raytheon is a legitmate target for peace activists. Such actions raise awareness of the arms industry and provides a media opportunity to highlight how this vast industry, with it massive political power, uses that power in its own interests and not those of human society.

    However, when people realise that there are those involved in such actions who are not in fact anti-violence, but anti-imperialist violence then these actions lose their power to influence wider society. Hypocrisy impresses no-one.

    What anti-war activists in Ireland need to think about is how they can have a direct impact on the philosophies underpinning the justification of violence by focussing their activities towards violent groups and bodies here, including state, pro-state and anti-state organisations.

  • Patrique

    Brendan can’t read, except for what he wants to see.ALL ARMS factories should be raised to the ground.I already said that.

    The world is full of terrorists. I just pick on the Yanks because they are the biggest.

  • Dread Cthulhu

    Patrique: “If the Yanks didn’t arm Israel and Syria and Iran didn’t arm the Hezbullah, there would be no war. This factory in Derry is one of the causes of the war. ”

    Bollocks. The factory in Derry builds air-traffic control radars, not missiles.

    Rule one: Weapons do not cause war. People cause war.

    Rule two: There is no such thing as a dangerous weapon, there are only dangerous people.

    This war was caused because Hizbollah, unable to read the writing on the wall (i.e. Hamas pulled the same stunt and received both barrels for their trouble). Now, the civilian casualties are the result of deliberate Hizbollah doctrine — military assests are parked next to civilians as cover — if it works, they get to fire their weapons. If the Israelis attack their launchers, civilians die and gives them a propaganda victory.

  • Brendan, Belfast

    Patrique

    you just pick on the yanks because its “right on”.

  • Paul

    Blaming arms manufacturers for wars really is schoolyard stuff. Their weapons are marketed as “defence” and can be used as such. If I was an Israeli citizen I would expect my government to have procurred weapons to defend the state and the lives of it’s citizens. It is quite clear that the lives of those citizens are under threat. Also, a number of posts have said Raytheon “supply” Israel, they don’t, Israel buys weapons off them as do numerous other countries. Raytheon are a legitimate business acting entirely within the law.
    I live in Derry and it has been a notable fact that Wolfie and his small band of toytown revolutionaries have criticised virtually every new employer coming to Derry over the past ten years, usually on the grounds that they are “Macjobs”, “they are anti-union” and are only here to exploit the workforce etc, etc, ad naseum. Meanwhile thousands of people applied for the jobs, thousands of peoples are now at work, in a town previously blighted by unemployment,and the city has enjoyed something of an economic renaissance.

  • Toireasa

    Why is there only seems to be Islamic Extremists are Israeli’s always the innocent victims that can do no wrong.
    The Lebanese people (or Hizbollah)are fighting a war against invaders. Why are they always the extremists?
    Do they not have the right to defend and free their land?
    Well done to the Derry 9 at least they got up off their backsides to highlight what is going on under our noses

  • Reader

    Toireasa: The Lebanese people (or Hizbollah)are fighting a war against invaders.
    Never mind Hizbollah. What do you think the actual Lebanese army should do, in the best interests of the people of Lebanon? Lebanon was free and not occupied for 6 years up until a month ago – what went wrong? What was Hizbollah there for – all that time?

  • Fanny

    That’s my concern too, Reader. According to reports, Hizbollah appear to have a fearsome arsenal. Were they stockpiling this in secret for six years? It’s a scary thought that their assault on Israel was that long in the planning.

  • Garibaldy

    maybe they had the weapons lest there be another invasion on top of the constant Israeli border incursions, or another civil war

  • Garibaldy

    oh wait, there was another invasion

  • Fanny

    What, long-range missiles as counter-invasion weapons?

    I must have dozed off during that module of my military training.

  • Dualta

    Reader said: “[i]Lebanon was free and not occupied for 6 years up until a month ago [/i]

    That doesn’t seem to be the case. There is an area called the Shabaa Farms, which Isreal claims to be Syrian territory and which Lebanon and Hizbollah claim to be Lebanese territory. The Farms currently lies in the area known as the Golan Heights, which Israel took from Syria and continues to occupy.

    It seems that the Lebonese claim is correct, however, following the finding of French documents by an Israeli academic Dr. Asher Kauf of Hebrew University of Jerusalem in 2002, which show that French officials in the 1930s mistakenly marked the Farms as Syrian (wiki entry).

    So Hizbollah’s claim that Israel continues to occupy a part of Lebanon seems to stand up.

  • Garibaldy

    Fanny,

    Yes they do. Both to strike at military targets from a distance, and to retaliate against attacks on your civilians. That’s why lots of countries have them as deterrents.

  • Garibaldy

    And I meant to add that the Katyushas and so forth that Hezbollah have don’t count as long range missiles in most military terms anyway. Short and medium at best

  • Fanny

    Garibaldy, you must have slept through more than one module.

    However, I think you’ll find that you used the operative word: deterrent. This still means something like discouragement, doesn’t it, something to be used before not after the event? Are you by any chance trying to rewrite recent history? Have you got some kind of grudge againt Israel?

  • Garibaldy

    Fanny,

    I’m not trying to rewrite history, nor military strategy. I am trying to look at the situation in the round. Somebody posted a link to an Israeli newspaper which spoke of daily incursions into Lebanonese territory either earlier on this or another thread. Let’s not forget the butchery carried out by Israel in Lebanon, by people who are now in senior positions. In terms of deterrent, the point is that you demonstrate the willingness to use them if you’re attacked otherwise they’re worthless. As I said already, they are also for retaliation.

    Do I have a grudge against Israel? No. I believe in its right to exist, and to be secure in agreed borders. What I don’t accept is that it has a right to oppress the people of Palestine, to grab their land with a racist wall, to deny their right to a viable state, to strike at and carry out operations in other countries whenever it feels like, much less invade them, or to terrorise and massacre large numbers of civilians. A perfectly reasonable position as I see it. Entirely consistent with justice and international law to boot.

  • Fanny

    Garibaldy, glad you don’t hold a grudge, and I agree with you about Israel’s past sins. Shatila and Shabra anyone?

    Yet you seem to forget that the Lebanese in the guise of Hizbollah attacked Israel this time round, and that they do have long-range missiles that can reach Tel Aviv. I don’t see how this is consistent with thwarting an invasion or striking at military targets from a distance. Hizbollah seem to be striking indiscriminately at civilian targets.

    I’m minded to believe that this operation was years in preparation and that Hiz, Syria and Iran took the opportunity when it arose.

  • Yer Woman

    Paul wrote:
    “I live in Derry and it has been a notable fact that Wolfie and his small band of toytown revolutionaries have criticised virtually every new employer coming to Derry over the past ten years, usually on the grounds that they are “Macjobs”, “they are anti-union” and are only here to exploit the workforce etc, etc, ad naseum. Meanwhile thousands of people applied for the jobs, thousands of peoples are now at work, in a town previously blighted by unemployment,and the city has enjoyed something of an economic renaissance.”

    Although I’m loathe to support McCann’s recent actions in Derry, he’s spot on when condemning these new employers to Derry – particularly the ones who’ve arrived over the past ten years. The council/John Hume et al create great fanfare when these employers choose to set up camp in the city, but no-one, apart from McCann, draws attention to the fact that they’re tempted here in the first place by promises of a workforce that will happily slave away for barely the minmum wage with little union interference or scope for promotion. There are precious little graduate opportunities within these companies, and some of them have the cheek to employ people on a 51 week contract so they can deny them the full rights and pay of a permanent member of staff. Ironically, one of the best paid jobs you can get in Derry is WITH Raytheon!

    Yes, it’s still bringing jobs to the city, but with house prices rising at the rate they are, particularly when this isn’t complemented by a hike in salary paid out by these companies, this means precious little when many many people in Derry are slowly slipping under the poverty line.

    I know this sounds mercenary and please forgive for saying this, but McCann would do well to focus his efforts towards what these companies are doing to the locals, rather than on what they may or might not be inflicting on countries thousands of miles away.

  • Garibaldy

    Fanny,

    Hizbollah and Israel have been engaged in a low-level conflict since 2000. One of the reasons being the prisoners issue from the last invasion. This was all kicked off by an attack on and capture of soldiers. I haven’t heard anything about them for a while, as Israel widened its aims when it met without criticism from the US and its allies for its violation of Lebanonese soveriegnty.

    Both sides clearly had plans in place, as does every army in the world for possible conflicts. As for the missiles, remember that Israel is likely to be able to push Hezbollah further north, at which point those missiles would be aimed at militaru targets. And the distances involved are not actually that great. 70-odd kilometres I think were being mentioned. The failure to negotiate outstanding issues being one reason why the build up of arms was maintained.

    Yerwoman,

    Mc Cann (and yourself) is right to point out that a lot of the inward investment does not provide the quality jobs with development potential necessary for real and sustained economic and industrial growth in Derry and its hinterland.
    Those complaining about this are just taking cheap shots, and tying up different issues.

    However, part of the reason that Mc Cann et al focus on issues like these is because their ideology does not allow them to indulge in the long, slow hard slog to build on local issues, rather they seek to jump on one bandwagon after another. Although in fairness, Mc Cann has been at it for years, and at least one of the other people has been in the SWP for over a decade. Most people in it spend around 6 months, so they are the few with the ability to stick at it to some extent.

  • Paul

    Yer Woman, the reason house prices are rising in Derry is as a result of increased wealth in the city. If you cannot see the evidence of greater wealth in this town as a result of jobs then you are blind. Incidentally, Stream, and other companies employ mostly graduates. Anyway, are you saying Derry should reject non-graduate jobs?
    If you and Wolfie have problems with the jobs coming to this town maybe you should provide a few yourselves. Forget about the “community sector”, SF have that sown up.

  • Yer Woman

    I have absolutely no probelms with jobs coming to this Town Paul, but I object to the wage levels that are allowed to exist in Derry and not in say Belfast.

    I don’t dispute that Stream take on graduates, indeed I worked there myself whilst at University. But the probelm is that call centre jobs at £5 an hour is all that’s available in Derry for graduates (or anyone else for that matter) hence so many of them work there. Very few companies in Derry recruit graduate’s to utilise their quailifications on a wage fitting for their qualification. As i’ve already said, I don’t agree with Eamon’s actions over the past week, but I do agree on some things he stands for.

    Increased wealth in Derry? It’s all on shakey foundations and you’d be a fool not to realise that! It’s concentrated in the hands of the few I’m afraid.

  • Paul

    Yer Woman, unfortunately we can’t force Microsoft to relocate to Derry. Nobody owes us a living. I wouldn’t hold my breath waiting for an company to arrive that meets all the left’s requirements of a good employer.

  • Yer Woman

    I totally agree with you Paul, nobody owes us a living at all. Indeed, i left Derry and found myself a job instead of settling for whats on offer at home. But it’s nice to know, surely, that the likes of McCann is standing up and pointing this problem out?

    I’m all too aware that it will be yeeeaaars until Derry and , indeed, the whole of Norn Iron, turns into the bustling productive metropolis of yer Londons and Dublins.

  • Paul

    Yer Woman, agreed, but you have to start somewhere.

  • Garibaldy

    Saw this on Marc Mulholland’s blog, and thought it was interesting:

    The TLS has an enthusiastic review of Michael
    Gove’s Celsius 7/7 by Walter Laqueur. I was
    rather distressed by the whole thing really, but
    in particular this bit:

    “… Britain is more fortunate than some other
    regions of Europe in which Muslims will
    constitute a majority in certain age groups
    within one generation or even less; it could well
    be that appeasement has become the only feasible
    policy in these parts.”

    How does this sentence sound if you replace the
    word ‘Muslims’ with ‘Catholics’, or ‘Hundus’,
    or ‘athesists’, or ‘Jews’?

  • Fanny

    “How does this sentence sound if you replace the
    word ‘Muslims’ with ‘Catholics’, or ‘Hundus’,
    or ‘athesists’, or ‘Jews’?”

    Er, it actually sounds pretty illiterate, Garibaldy – or do I mean inarticulate?

    It could also be construed as hasty typing, I suppose 😉

  • Garibaldy

    You’d have to address that to Mulholland

  • lib2016

    Garibaldy,

    That sentence sounds just fine if one views it as an interesting demographic fact. After all I’m getting to the age where one worries about who is going to pay for my pension and all the new arrivals are going to do that since the younger generation of all Western European countries don’t appear to be up to the task of replacing themselves (sniffs in dispair!).

    Let’s not join in with the idiots who don’t appear to have any realisation of what globilisation is going to mean. There are relatively large Muslim populations already in the North of England and it will inevitably happen here. The fior gael is in for just as big a surprise as the thickest loyalist. King Canute comes to mind.

  • Garibaldy

    Lib,

    To be clear, this is Mulholland commenting on Laquer. Mulholland is suggesting, rightly I believe, that talk of appeasement of sections of populations is disgusting.

    I agree with what you’re saying – we are the last people in the world who should be complaining about migration

  • Fanny

    “You’d have to address that to Mulholland”

    It was, Garibaldy! Maybe you should use the old “[sic]” convention when you quote misspelling verbatim.

    I share your concern BTW. That’s one slippery slope you highlighted.

  • Elle

    The security guards were not assaulted or hurt in any way. In fact, the glass pane was broken because one of the security guards had linked his arms through the door handles and would have been hurt had the doors been forced open. Thus, care was actually taken to keep the protest non-violent. And no, property damage is not violence, unless it is intended to convey threats of harm to people or animals.

    The untruthfulness of the allegations that the protesters hurt the security guards will come out in the trial. Watch this space.

  • nmc

    I put in for a job in Raytheon, they wouldn’t have me. They don’t make bombs in there, just software.

    It was funny, on the news there was a woman standing with a CMM booklet saying “this is proof they manufacture weapons here”. All a CMM proves is whatever they’re doing, they’re trying to do well.

    I can’t comment on the wages in Derry, but jobs are better than no jobs. It’s necessary to have both good and bad jobs everywhere, some people don’t have degrees, HNDs etc. and won’t get a job paying 25k plus benefits.