More on the Tube shooting…

The Daily Mail has a fuller report on the shooting of an Asian man in Stockwell Tube station. It’s worth reading their comments facility too.

  • DavidS

    What is so depressing is how quickly people are prepared to pass judgement on the rights and wrongs of the shooting – even though few hard facts have yet emerged…

  • Jo

    David,
    I agree, but this is a symptom of a craving for revenge bloodletting which is base and basically lets us all down.
    We are better than those who would kill us by killing themselves and that sort of death-worship does not become us, or the memory of the victims.

  • bertie

    Jo

    I think that there is also an element of – if someone is dead, I’d prefer that they were a bad someone.

  • Jo

    Bertie
    That is fair enough – I am not, as maybe some might perceive, someone who whinges “why couldnt they arrest him”? I do live in the real world.

  • raff

    As usual in times like this the propaganda wing of the British government, (British media), swings into full speculative mode. A young ‘Asian type’ is gunned down and automatically they are a suicide bomber. An few questions;
    1) If the security forces were working on intelligence from its usual sources surely they could have arrested this man instead of murdering him?
    2) Would a captured ‘terrorist’ not be of more use to them than a corpse?
    3) Could this be a typical knee-jerk reaction to a security situation from the British police, one which the likes of the Birmingham 6, etc would be well aware of?
    4) Are they justifying murder in London the same way they have in the past with Republicans?

  • Mick

    Certainly there were unsubstantiated rumours in the immeidate wake of the incident. But, from what I understand, the Met press conference this afternoon only said the guy hadn’t stopped when called to.

    This is one to follow. But possibly premature to make solid judgements on rumour only.

  • Ringo

    propaganda wing of the British government

    Raff – pity to think that you have to see everything – no matter how utterly remote -through your own jaundiced parish pump political squabble.

    I’ve heard News Corp and Rupert Murdoch being referrer to as many things – but to declare that he is a tool of Tony Blair and the wicked British Government, now that is a first. Don’t all the sheepy lefties claim that it is the other way around?

    It is hard to take your questions seriously after that.

  • fair_deal

    Raff

    1. Some eyewitness evidence.
    “Another passenger on the train, Anthony Larkin, told BBC News the man had been wearing a “bomb belt with wires coming out”.
    “I’ve seen these police officers shouting, ‘Get down, get down!’, and I’ve seen this guy who appears to have a bomb belt and wires coming out.”
    If this person’s testimony is true then this person represented a clear threat to life.
    2. Yes a live terrorist possesses useful information, if they are willing to give it. However one dead terrorist is better than three dead police officers and the occupants of the train.
    3. Time will tell.
    4. Under the European Convention of Human Rights the state is allowed to take live in certain circumstances. If he was carrying a bomb 2 (a) covers it.
    “ARTICLE 2
    Everyone’s right to life shall be protected by law. No one shall be deprived of his life intentionally save in the execution of a sentence of a court following his conviction of a crime for which this penalty is provided by law.
    Deprivation of life shall not be regarded as inflicted in contravention of this article when it results from the use of force which is no more than absolutely necessary:
    (a) in defence of any person from unlawful violence;
    (b) in order to effect a lawful arrest or to prevent escape of a person lawfully detained;
    (c) in action lawfully taken for the purpose of quelling a riot or insurrection. “

  • Young Fogey

    There will be an enquiry.

    If this dude had a bomb (and remember he was under surveillance and did not stop when hailed) then the cops did right, I’m afraid.

  • Young Fogey

    His description does sound rather like the dude with the New York top.

  • raff

    Well Ringo the fact that Mr Murdoch has had extensive links to successive British governments must have slipped your mind. Also I did not claim that Mr Murdock was a tool of Mr Blair’s, but thank you for pointing out that they are linked through mutual support. Regarding not taking my questions seriously, why? Regardless of whether or not you agree of my analysis of the media the questions are still valid.

    The news reports, if they are to be believed, reported that the police had been following this gentleman after gaining information on him, well surely they would have been aware if he had been strapped with explosives earlier and would have prevented him entering a populated area?

    These attacks on London have been likened, gain by media commentators, to the PIRA campaign during the 70’s and 80’s so to accuse me of ‘jaundiced parish pump political squabble’ seems a bit unfair!

  • Young Fogey

    But apparently, he wasn’t one of yesterday’s bombers.

  • Jo

    I have great scepticism about eyewitnesses ever since I saw that evil woman on TV claiming that she had seen Holly and Jessica alive several miles away from where they disappeared – at a time when they were already dead. I hope she got jail.

  • Brendan

    Eyewitness reports that I have read had him falling to the ground and being held down whilst 5 shots were pumped into him. I also heard that the policeman with the gun had his foot on the “terrorist’s” back to keep him down. I

  • raff

    According to SKY news the alleged ‘terrorist’ was NOT involved in any previous explosions in London!
    So if he was not a bomber and the British security forces had intelligence on him why weren’t he and his associates arrested?
    It would not be too unreasonable to assume that this mans murder was unjustified, but with the British public whipped into a hate/fear filled frenzy by the media this death, like so many before will be justified as the actions of over cautious police.

  • raff

    According to SKY news the alleged ‘terrorist’ was NOT involved in any previous explosions in London!
    So if he was not a bomber and the British security forces had intelligence on him why weren’t he and his associates arrested?
    It would not be too unreasonable to assume that this mans murder was unjustified, but with the British public whipped into a hate/fear filled frenzy by the media this death, like so many before will be justified as the actions of over cautious police.

  • Comrade Stalin

    What is it they say in Andytown ? “he must have done something to deserve it”.

  • raff

    So you support murder then Comrade Stalin, it is a pity that a human life means so little to you

  • VICTOR1

    If you want to continue to comment, Victor, try to keep it coherent. This is a yellow card. – ed. Mod

  • Young Fogey

    What is it they say in Andytown ? “he must have done something to deserve it”.

    Don’t be stupid, Stalin. That’s only true when the Ra do something. When the Brits do something, it’s completely different.

    Tut!

  • Juan

    I wonder if all those who’ve so staunchly backed the police if it was their brother, son, father that had been shot? An innocent man was shot for what? Jumping a bar, wearing a thick jacket and looking suspicious(darker skin they call it)? Any one of us could have done the same had we been accosted by plain-clothed men in a foreign country! Wake up!! Since when did this mandate the death sentence?

  • Oilbhéar Chromaill

    If one were to read some of the posts on here, the only difference between an atrocity and a tragedy is that an atrocity is an attack on Britain whereas it’s a tragedy when Britain goes on a murderous attack.

  • Baluba

    This was an absolutely scandalous disgrace – nothing more, nothing less!

    More to come too listening to Police in Britain.

    Bad time to have a tan in London.

    Shameful.

  • Keith M

    It now turns out that the guy was working on an expired student visa and that may be why he tried to evade the police. Given the situation in London, anyone who tries to evade the police at the moment, deserves to be shot for sheer stupidy.

  • Denny Boy

    Hmm. In London when your visa expires the police shoot you dead.

    In Garnaville when you terrorize a community the police do, er, nothing.

    Isn’t there a middle way?

  • Baluba

    ‘Given the situation in London, anyone who tries to evade the police at the moment, deserves to be shot for sheer stupidy[sic].’

    Incredibly callous, insensitive, disgraceful thing to say.

    Shame on you.

  • Jo

    I think that sort of comment will reflect poorly on further postings: the rush to condemn this innocent victim and exult this killing – in total ignorance of and in anticipation of facts – marks something of a watershed in perceptions of this conflict.

  • Oilbhéar Chromaill

    for sheer stupidy{sic} Keith M’s comment takes some beating. Having an expired student visa is no grounds for shooting someone dead. It’s typical of rightwingers to be so gung ho in favour of state violence (especially British and American state violence0 that they will dream up any excuse to cheer on their ‘heroes’ no matter how reprehensibile their actions.
    Keith M’s post indicates nothing except a willingness to countenance murder on the flimsiest of pretexts.

  • Jo

    “It’s typical of rightwingers to be so gung ho”

    I am aware of this but have been shocked by the bestial ferocity – ahead of all facts – that has been associated with this incident.

    The revelation that the man may – or may not – have been working illegally is now being trotted out as a pseudo-justification: “he shouldnt have been here in the first place.”

    Purely visceral and with no engagement whatsoever of higher intellect. Cleverer than the terrorists? I think not.

  • bertie

    “It now turns out that the guy was working on an expired student visa and that may be why he tried to evade the police. Given the situation in London, anyone who tries to evade the police at the moment, deserves to be shot for sheer stupidy.”

    God this is a hell of a price to pay. I would not go as far as to say death is a just punishment for stupidity, and indeed I can understand his actions (without condoning working illegally) – the bombs would most likely not have been his primary concern as he fled. I think that given this tragedy more people will have to think twice before running from the police, epecially around public trasport. Drunks beware! I fear that there will be more of this before we are done or that the next time the police will hold back too long and it will have been a bomber.

    I would not like to be a police officer and having to make these life and death decisions.

    Jo it would appear that the dead someone this time was not a bad someone as I hoped.

  • Jo

    Bertie:
    Tragically, that is the case.

    Had the victim in fact been a British Muslim, the consequences would have been even more politically significant. I am quite disgusted at those who firmly believed that he was not innocent – irrespective of the confusion over the circumstances – and who would subsequently seek to justify or excuse the killing on the known circumstances of the victim’s status.

  • bertie

    Jo

    I agree that some of the, shall we say, speculation, doesn’t help but I think that people are nervous and wanted/needed to beleive that we had been saved from another bomb and that the police are so on the ball that we can feel that bit safer, I know I did. For those living in London and indeed other major cities, we need to keep a cool head and a sense of perspective and that may not always be easy

  • Jo

    Berie:

    I certainly did not intend to include you in the group I was thinking of: it is a group which is prejudiced against the immigrant population and which lusts for revenge against that community or against any Muslim – for crimes such as the London bombings.

  • George

    It really raises the fear factor when the cops start killing people indiscriminately too. I for one wouldn’t be too quick to run for a train in the current climate if I was late for work and listening to my MP3 player.

    Shoot that man, I see wires!

  • bertie

    Jo

    No problem Jo I didn’t for a moment consider think you were getting at me.

  • Blackadder

    “It really raises the fear factor when the cops start killing people indiscriminately too. I for one wouldn’t be too quick to run for a train in the current climate if I was late for work and listening to my MP3 player.

    Shoot that man, I see wires!”

    If you are listening to that Crazy Frog tune you are a legitimate target 😉

  • Keith M

    I cannot believe some of the hyserical reactions to my earlier post. I hope that no one here is ever in a position where they have to make a life or death decision in a split second. By the time they’ve weighed up all the supposed rights and wrongs of the situation they (and anyone nearby) will be in the queue for angel wings.

    The only mistake the police made here is not telling everyone of their (quite sensible given the circumstances) decision on shoot to kill in a situation where lives at at risk until after they had implemented it.

  • George

    Keithm,
    civilised societies hand the power over life and death decisions to qualified and trained people who work within a code of ethics. Doctors and police for example.

    Gross negligence is gross negligence and if the death of an innocent person ensues then it undermines the respect others have for the people they supposedly trust.

    You may be happy to excuse gross incompetence because it isn’t your innocent son with five bullets in him but don’t expect others to sympathise with your point.

  • bertie

    Are we in a position to know that it was gross incompetence or is this just an assumption because he wasn’t actually a bomber.

  • Millie

    It wasn’t soo much gross negligence as gross incompetence on the police’s part.

    1. They were tailing the wrong man.

    2. Despite tailing him from his home they somehow managed to contrive a situation where the man ended up not only entering a tube station but getting on a train.

    3. They executed him.

    That’s THREE amazing cock-ups, not just the one. What was their so-called intelligence pertaining to the man they shot? Did they even know who they were looking for or did they simply decide to follow the first non-white person they saw emerge from the flats where Mr de Menezes lived?

    Apparently plain clothes officers followed him onto a bus before he entered Stockwell tube, so why hasn’t he approached or apprehended before then given the fact that two devices had previously been left on London buses.

    Then how in God’s name did they allow him to alight the bus and enter Stockwell tube? Not only did Mr de Menezes do so but he made it onto a train, the very last place you would want to corner a suspected suicide bomber.

    The police in Britain have never needed much of an excuse to kill a black person and now it would seem they have the opportunity to do so with impunity. If these plain clothes officers represent the cream of British undercover and intelligence work then God help us all.

  • Denny Boy

    I suppose none of us here can sit in judgement, not being in possession of the facts yet.

    It seems he was shot not 5 but 8 times, which to me is a little excessive when someone is lying supine with arms spread wide.

    Plus I’m wondering why he was allowed to enter a busy tube station while possibly carrying a bomb or bombs. Couldn’t the police have stopped him outside his home, which seems to have been relatively secluded?

    I don’t like it when police forces become trigger happy. There’s enough of that elsewhere.

  • Denny Boy

    Millie, I paused to make coffee before hitting the “send” button. I agree with almost everything you’ve written there.

  • 6countyprod

    After the initial horror of July 7 had subsided, blame for the bombings was quickly shifted from those who had deliberately murdered scores of people, to Tony Blair, and western foreign policy over the last hundred years.

    The sad death of the Brazilian man, apparently due to incompetent police action, also, rightly, horrified many of us. But when are we going to acknowledge that this man’s death is not the fault of the police, but comes as a direct result of the Islamic extremists’ violent campaign in our country?

  • Denny Boy

    Er, “direct” result???!

  • Robert Keogh

    6countyprod,

    But when are we going to acknowledge that this man’s death is not the fault of the police,

    You are an apologist for state murder.

    You are in precisely the same company as those you lambast for excusing nationalist/unionist terrorism.

  • 6countyprod

    Denny Boy

    lying supine with arms spread wide – is that not how one of the recent unsucessful bombers lay before getting up and running away when his bomb didn’t explode?

    That’s right, direct, as in: obvious, plain, explicit; result, as in: consequence, outcome, corollary …of Islamic violence! Cause and effect.

    Robert

    The man’s death was obviously a case of mistaken identity, not murder. I think a lot of people are a little tired of those who disregard and excuse deliberate and calculated mass murder, who then, in the next breath, condemn and denounce those involved in trying to defend our freedoms. What a warped and ott PC world we live in.

  • Valenciano

    KeithM, I think that the comment that caused outrage was your implication that he deserved to be shot for stupidity. Kinda gives a whole new meaning to the word “draconian” that.

    He comes from a fairly violent country and presumably panicked when confronted with
    stranger(s) waving guns at him. Not an odd reaction in the circumstances. The fact that he was on an expired visa is utterly irrelevant unless shooting illegal immigrants is your thang, something that not even the BNP or NF currently propose…

  • Robert Keogh

    6countyprod,

    The man’s death was obviously a case of mistaken identity, not murder.

    The man’s death IS murder, your inability to recognise that makes you an apologist for murder.

  • 6countyprod

    Robert,

    I had been thinking about your ‘apologist’ jibe, (before I read your second comment) and you’re right. I shouldn’t have said ‘ this man’s death is not the fault of the police’. Obviously there were disastrous and devastating procedures and systems failures in communication and interpretation in the whole episode. The police were at fault.

    If the Mr de Menezes had been a bomber, and had been stopped by the police officers from detonating his bomb, would you still have called that murder? Maybe not. We’ll never know exactly what was going through the minds of the policemen involved in this terrible mistake, but I would like to give the officers the benefit of the doubt.

    Hindsight is always twenty-twenty, and is an exact science. Making a life or death decision, affecting your own life, the life of your colleagues, and the general public, in a split second, is not.

    I abhor murder, no matter who does it.

  • Denny Boy

    6countyprod: “lying supine with arms spread wide – is that not how one of the recent unsucessful bombers lay before getting up and running away when his bomb didn’t explode?”

    So we heard from “eyewitnesses”. Clearly we didn’t have armed cops standing over him ready to put at least 6 unnecessary bullets into his head, so we have no official confirmation.

    “That’s right, direct, as in: obvious, plain, explicit; result, as in: consequence, outcome, corollary …of Islamic violence! Cause and effect.”

    I don’t believe I’m being pedantic when I insist that “direct” has a different meaning, as in “88 people died in Egypt as a direct result of terrorist bombs.”

    Face it: the London police overreacted with disproportionate firepower.

  • Biffo

    Keith M

    “The only mistake the police made here is not telling everyone of their (quite sensible given the circumstances) decision on shoot to kill in a situation where lives at at risk until after they had implemented it.”

    So what you’re saying is that, for the benefit of would be suicide bombers and the general public, the met should have released a statement last week saying…

    “Due to current circumstances, anybody acting suspiciously will be shot”.

    It’s a bit late for the Brazilian lad, but maybe they should have asked him what he was up to instead of putting him under surveillance.

    It sounds to me that he paid with his life because someone has pointed the finger at him because they considered him a suspicious foreigner.

    It’s not the first it’s happened in London.

  • Denny Boy

    Did the cops not find his address in one of Thursday’s unexploded rucksacks? Or was that all one’s eye?

    Hard to know what to believe in all this….

  • Keith M

    Biffo “Due to current circumstances, anybody acting suspiciously will be shot”. No the statement should be that “anyone resisting arrest is leaving themselves open to being shot, if the police believe that they could be a suicide bomber”.

    I’ve just been watching an interesting piece on Newsnight which shows how the country that has been the greatest victim of suicide bombers has reacted and it is obvious that the British police could learn a lot from their Israeli counterparts.

    Millie “The police in Britain have never needed much of an excuse to kill a black person and now it would seem they have the opportunity to do so with impunity.” Actually the guy who was shot wasn’t black, but when have you ever bothered letting the facts get in the way of a rant?

  • Biffo

    Keith M

    “anyone resisting arrest is leaving themselves open to being shot, if the police believe that they could be a suicide bomber”

    In other words – what I originally said.

  • George

    I thought capital punishment was illegal in the European Union Keithm.

    Also if Tony Blair is sincerely apologising for the death, surely that means the government thinks it was a terrible mistake.

    Why are you continuing to condone it?

  • kevser

    Questions, questions:
    First bombing:
    No cctv moving footage, just one very bad still from Luton!
    (Its harder to fake a video).
    No pics from Kings-X station of our “4 muslim bombers”. Why?

    Who is this brazilian and what jobs was he working on recently? (he seemed pretty scared)
    Who executed him and why? (They were following him for hours..)

  • Jo

    6co:

    “Hindsight is always twenty-twenty”
    Yes, indeed, but the problem was that some had this poor unfortunate man hailed in “GOTCHA” terms as revenge for what he had allegedly “done” well ahead of any facts.

    On reflection, the man who was searched in Whitehall the previous day and who was pictured hands on his head on the front page of some tabloids (another totally innocent person) got off pretty lightly…

    The best perspective is that of the law of the land – “innocent until proven guilty.”

  • Jo

    “Millie “The police in Britain have never needed much of an excuse to kill a black person and now it would seem they have the opportunity to do so with impunity.”

    I think Millie was speculating on future circumstances, Keith…

  • DCB

    It’s still more than a little unfair. As if there are hoards of BNP supporting, gun totting police who can’t wait to shoot a black man.

    Also the officiers who shot the Brazalian are potentially facing criminal charges.

  • Jo

    “it is obvious that the British police could learn a lot from their Israeli counterparts.”

    Since Jan 2002, Israeli security forces have killed 2744 Palestinians.

  • 6countyprod

    Jo

    So, where did you find your ‘2744’ figure? I reckon either your date is wrong, or your figure for that time frame is wrong.

    In Dec ’03, reports said: ‘The latest deaths brought to 3,666 the number of people killed since the start of the Palestinian uprising, or intifada, at the end of September 2000, including 2,744 Palestinians and 856 Israelis’.

    Notice who initiated the violence.

  • 6countyprod

    Casualty figures:

    Pro-Palestinian report

    Pro-Israeli report

    Interesting how the Israeli site includes all those who have suffered in the conflict, as opposed to the Palestinian site, which only lists the Palestinian casualties.

  • Jo

    6Co:
    I dont want to get into a statistical argument, but the figures are from the Red Crescent database.

    The point I am making is that the killings are on a completely different scale from our own conflict – and whatever the source, there are far more Palestinian casualties than there are Israelis.

  • Keith M

    Jo “Since Jan 2002, Israeli security forces have killed 2744 Palestinians.”. I specifically mentioned the Israeli police (who tend to operate inside the internationally recognised borders of Israel) and not the army (which also operates in the disputed territories, so that number is irrelevant.

    6county prod “Interesting how the Israeli site includes all those who have suffered in the conflict, as opposed to the Palestinian site, which only lists the Palestinian casualties.” You should know by now that Palestinians run NI Nationalists close in the mopery stakes.

  • 6countyprod

    Jo

    I take your point. I agree with your sentiments on the personal abuse thread.

  • Tommy

    Just off the AP Wire. Read the rest at yahoo.com news

    ‘Shoot-To-Kill’ Old Debate for U.K. Forces By SHAWN POGATCHNIK, Associated Press Writer
    Tue Jul 26, 8:42 AM ET

    BELFAST, Northern Ireland – When London police killed an innocent Brazilian in a hunt for suicide bombers, they reopened a “shoot-to-kill” debate that for decades haunted British efforts to combat the Irish Republican Army.
    Throughout the 1980s, undercover police and soldiers repeatedly ambushed IRA units — and killed both unarmed IRA members and civilians in the process. Those events inspired decades of legal action and international criticism, particularly from Irish Americans, who argued that deadly force was not justified.

  • Morton

    Hopefully we can move past our history. Recent happenings open up old wounds, but hopefully we can continue to heal. As heated as slugger gets at times, at least we are able to talk to each other about our opinions and hot topics. Back in the 80s this was impossible.
    Thanks Mick, et al. for all your hard work on this site and for trying to get posters to play within the rules…something which should extend to greater society.
    Peace.

  • bertie

    Morton

    I can understand your sentiments but not everyone is healing and some of those wounds never closed. Part of the problem we have now is that this is ignored. This goes beyond the conflict in NI. Apartantly some people in Dunblane think that the parents are “holding Dunblane back”. It would appear that the parents emotional baggage is considered a burden to some. The novelty of empathy seems to have worn off.

  • Morton

    Bertie

    I agree with you. For some, wounds have never been bandaged and are still wide open. Empathy is indeed a key ingredient to a better society…and it not for use only over a short term.

  • bertie

    I just wondered how those living and working in London have “adapted” to the times that’s in it.

    I had an unnerving experience today. I have been off sick since before the London bombs (which is why I have had so much time to spend posting on Slugger recently) and had not been travelling on public transport. It was my first time at work today and I started my journey by bus. I bumped into a neighbour at the bus stop and we went down to the back of the bus. Shortly afterwards a young man got on with a holdall sat down beside us and beamed around at us. I smiled back, I don’t know that he was much worse than I was when I first moved to London and before I had learned to ignore other travellers. My neighbour started to look very uncomfortable and her body language and facial expressions showed alarm. I was not sure what was the matter with her and even wondered if she had a problem with black people. She got more agitated when he started rummaging through his holdall and she was looking at me as if she was trying to communicate something. He took out what had the look of a holy book, but I don’t think it was a bible. He did seem to be a bit strange but I was still thinking nothing more serious than I was going to be on the receiving end of a sermon. At this my neighbour got up said “see you later” and got off the bus. I caught the eye of another passenger and we gave each other what I thought were “oh well we’ve got the nutter” glances. It still took a while for the the penny to drop, that my neighbour suspected that he was a suicide bomber. My first thought was “oh sh*t!”, my second thought was also “Oh sh*t”. After several similar thoughts I considered my options. If I make a fuss and its innocent I make a fool of myself. If I make a fuss and he is what I am worried he is, he may set the thing off and I have the lives of the other passengers on my concious (although I would be past feeling guilt). I pressed the “bus stopping” thingy, avoided looking at the guy and got of the bus, followed by the other passenger. I didn’t know what to do about the other passangers without alarming the guy but I got back on to have a word with the driver and re-alighted. I then phoned the police. For a while I felt satisfied that I had done the right thing, (and I still do), but then I started imagining another tragedy like the other day and a string of events leading up to this young man getting shot because he smiled at me in the bus and took a book out of his holdall. In my dark fantasy, this of course leads to an eruption of violence and continued violence on the streets of London.

    I don’t know whether to be glad that my (perhaps dangerous) naivety is gone or depressed that I am going to be suspicious of everyone with a holdall.

    Are other London travellers having similar experiences or was I just unlucky my first time out? I’m hoping that after a few days I will have regained my equilibrium.

    Sorry for such a long post and God bless you for working your way through it.

  • Lafcadio

    bertie – I hop on the tube every day to and from work, at rush hour, between Waterloo and Canary Wharf. For a few days after the bombs didn’t really think much about it, but now, I must say I heave a sigh of relief when I get back out into open air, and walk out much quicker than I walk in..

    I don’t know if this makes me a coward, and I’d hate to be over-reacting, given the millions upon millions of people who live their daily lives in much more dangerous and unfortunate situations than I do, but still..

    In Waterloo yesterday, I saw two cops had stopped a guy, and were quizzing him, taking notes – probably predictably, he was Asian, and on the ground was a big holdall that he had been carrying. To be fair, everything was good-natured, and they were all smiling, but I found it heart-breaking, because the guy, reeking of ordinariness, maybe 45 years old, in front of his wife and kid, reminded me immediately of my dad – except with brown skin.

  • bertie

    Lafcadio

    Unless you have a death wish, being concerned about your safety is not cowardice.

    I’ve had a few uneventful journeys since my first, but I’m still pleased when I arrive at my destination.

    I think we need to keep on doing what we would have been doing anyway as far as we can.

    Keep safe and that goes for all London posters (and everywhere else).