#RuthPatterson: Would I shed a tear, No.

At one level, social media and politicians don’t mix. At another it merely allows them to share their innermost thoughts with us, with the unfortunate effect of making us all stupider by having read them.

Yesterday, Ruth Patterson responded to a post from Brian Ulsterman on Facebook as below.

Ruth Patterson

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[I’ve updated this with the full text and image, I’d originally included this version and the full screen grab with other comments can be seen here; h/ts to between the bridges, Ciarán, @PaulTyredeagh81 and @LADFLEG]

The following are the provisions of the UK’s Terrorism Act 2006:

1     Encouragement of terrorism

(1) This section applies to a statement that is likely to be understood by some or all of the members of the public to whom it is published as a direct or indirect encouragement or other inducement to them to the commission, preparation or instigation of acts of terrorism or Convention offences.

(2) A person commits an offence if — (a)he publishes a statement to which this section applies or causes another to publish such a statement; and (b)at the time he publishes it or causes it to be published, he— (i)intends members of the public to be directly or indirectly encouraged or otherwise induced by the statement to commit, prepare or instigate acts of terrorism or Convention offences; or (ii)is reckless as to whether members of the public will be directly or indirectly encouraged or otherwise induced by the statement to commit, prepare or instigate such acts or offences.

(3) For the purposes of this section, the statements that are likely to be understood by members of the public as indirectly encouraging the commission or preparation of acts of terrorism or Convention offences include every statement which— (a)glorifies the commission or preparation (whether in the past, in the future or generally) of such acts or offences; and (b)is a statement from which those members of the public could reasonably be expected to infer that what is being glorified is being glorified as conduct that should be emulated by them in existing circumstances.

(4) For the purposes of this section the questions how a statement is likely to be understood and what members of the public could reasonably be expected to infer from it must be determined having regard both — (a)to the contents of the statement as a whole; and (b)to the circumstances and manner of its publication. 

(5) It is irrelevant for the purposes of subsections (1) to (3) — (a)whether anything mentioned in those subsections relates to the commission, preparation or instigation of one or more particular acts of terrorism or Convention offences, of acts of terrorism or Convention offences of a particular description or of acts of terrorism or Convention offences generally; and, (b)whether any person is in fact encouraged or induced by the statement to commit, prepare or instigate any such act or offence.

(6) In proceedings for an offence under this section against a person in whose case it is not proved that he intended the statement directly or indirectly to encourage or otherwise induce the commission, preparation or instigation of acts of terrorism or Convention offences, it is a defence for him to show—

(a) that the statement neither expressed his views nor had his endorsement (whether by virtue of section 3 or otherwise); and

(b) that it was clear, in all the circumstances of the statement’s publication, that it did not express his views and (apart from the possibility of his having been given and failed to comply with a notice under subsection (3) of that section) did not have his endorsement.

(7) A person guilty of an offence under this section shall be liable—

(a) on conviction on indictment, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 7 years or to a fine, or to both;

(c) on summary conviction in Scotland or Northern Ireland, to imprisonment for a term not exceeding 6 months or to a fine not exceeding the statutory maximum, or to both.

 

Ruth has issued a statement this afternoon in which she apologies for her lapse in judgement:

I unreservedly apologise for this lapse of judgement. I completely withdraw this flawed Facebook comment. Murder and terrorism can never be justified in any circumstances. To descend to such a level would be to repeat the actions of those we stood against during the dark days of Northern Ireland’s troubles.

If the law is applied and she is indicted and found guilty under Section 7, she wouldn’t be able to work as a Special Advisor. Previously, Marion Price was arraigned on similar charges relating to an Easter Rising rally in Derry.

By the way, Loyalists Against Democracy have been highlighting similar sentiments all summer (and repeatedly getting grief for it).

 

UPDATE 2.8.13 BBC are reporting that Ruth Patterson has been arrested by the PSNI for the comments.

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  • FDM

    @DC,

    What was that about keeping this on topic?

    How is the PSNI’s now defunct recruiting policy related to Ruth stating that the murder of a substantial number of our government ministers and senior politicians would be good for NI and the world?

    Is this is same problem we faced with you on the infamous Naomi Long night? And boy did you make that a long night.

    Ruth must answer for her conduct. Let justice be done upon her.

  • odd_number

    FDM
    You left out that the IRA got it’s biggest influx of recruits, ever. Context being important.

  • DC

    Let’s look at the PSNI today and the Union Flag.

    Use of flags by the Police Service of Northern Ireland is governed by the Police Emblems and Flags Regulations (Northern Ireland) 2002, which provides that no flag shall be used by the Service other than its own flag.

    The PSNI has been shaped by Chris Patten the guy that fcked over the BBC, what kind of police service is this?

    Q: Is the PSNI irreplaceable?

    A: As the lovely Beyoncé would say-

    …don’t you ever for a second get to thinkin you’re irreplaceable!

  • odd_number

    DC
    The Psni is clearly not the ruc, get over it.

  • DC

    The PSNI or any police service that can’t bring itself to fly the union flag on designated days is not a service that should be in northern ireland, pack your bags PSNI!

  • Tir Chonaill Gael

    Man was made to look like an absolute fool by LAD.

    Man is now obsessed with LAD.

    Man still looks like a ranting fool.

  • FDM

    Feck, he is back to the flegs AGAIN.

  • DC

    Sorry i do realise that i must operate using only satire and using McFleggyweggyy McFleg Marty McFleggy Waggy McTaig pseudonyms to get along with you guys.

  • FDM
  • As for me, I invariably stop alcohol consumption by midnight, no matter what the occasion.

  • mac tire

    DC – I have to say, this LAD and Flag stuff does seem to have you perplexed.

    But, while I disagree with most things you post, I can say that I like you as a poster. Better than “Two Thirds of Ulster Press Center”.

    I have spoken to the lads/girls who run LAD on quite a few occasions. Is there anything you wish to pass on. I can be a “Mountain Climber”, if you will.

    You have posted a few names you say are fake. I’m sure they are. But if you look at the posts many of them have made you will find that they are anti-sectarian, anti-bigot and pro peace.

    Look at the message, not the name.

  • DC

    I don’t dislike anyone in fact it is this sense of underhandedness that is making me feel uneasy re LAD, you say that LAD isn’t a republican page but answer me this genuinely – are you an Irish Republican?

  • Tir Chonaill Gael

    I’m a constitutional republican. You’re just taking the pi*s, baby.

  • mac tire

    DC you seem very interested in my politics. Is there a reason – genuinely?

  • DC

    Yes i want to know if this would-be ‘mountain climber’ is an Irish Republican? So are you – yes / no?

  • At least Joe is still with the plot here. Meanwhile over my blog…..

  • DC

    We are getting down to the brass tacks here bdub what is off topic?

  • DC, blatant plug regarding the topic in hand, rather than silly point scoring going on. The point of discussion is to challenge and perhaps change opinions, not reinforce preconceptions but perhaps that’s just a middle class thing?

  • DC

    I am challenging, the LAD site which i believe you are on record for supporting as side splitting actually does a hell of a lot of reinforcing!!!!

    but don’t let that get in the way of your objective bloggerism!

  • DC

    or objective blogging or whatever the hell you want to call it!

  • DC,
    I think you addressed that to me so yes, I do think the Lad site is great! It exposes what is there. Simples. What’s the problem with that?
    If there is something with an alternative view, point me that way. Lad is only exposing loyalism for, eh, for what it is? Am I wrong?

  • DC

    i was yes and hell no i don’t agree with it (LAD) for the reasons set out above and in previous comments and am challenging mac tire as to whether he is an irish republican in relation to lad not being operated by irish republicans!

  • This is the most boring fucking thing we have ever read. Just for the record ‘DC’ – WE ARE NOT REPUBLICANS! Is that clear enough? We just popped by to say that in addition to our loyal loyalist Facebook page: http://www.facebook.com/loyalistsagainstdamacracy & Twitter feed @LADFLEG, we now have a terriby entertaining and informative blog – http://loyalistsagainstdemocracy.blogspot.co.uk/ – You’re welcome. No surrender. WE are the people.

  • mac tire

    DC – you seem to miss the wood for the trees concerning LAD.

    I’ll give your most recent example.

    DC – you said about a post made on LAD:
    “Some religious freak seems to have an opinion on Ruth’s arrest… Let’s all watch and laugh our begs off.

    That is from LAD.”

    OK – I personally think that header to the post is a little silly. But that is what LAD does.

    OK, now let’s post the link to the video (of which you seemed so offended by) and let Slugger’s posters make up their own minds. That’s fair?

    https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=154677404726529&set=vb.579775668711870&type=2&theater

    OK – listen to what this person says, DC.

    Do you agree with what he says?
    Is this what Loyalism really thinks?
    Can you not see the contradictions?

    Thanks in advance.

  • ayeYerMa

    Keversterino, “dealing with the Irish (sic)” is the very influence responsible for catalysing recent British corruption with regards to Ulster policy.

  • DC,
    Calm yerself, Lad reproduces and satirises what is produced by the PUL community.Who cares who produces it? It is very funny. If you want to know who is behind it I suggest you go find out but they are not actually producing the material. They are just showing the rest of of us, that is the point.

  • mac tire

    @ DC “i … am challenging mac tire as to whether he is an irish republican in relation to lad not being operated by irish republicans!

    I DO NOT speak for LAD. I did say I have spoke to LAD.
    I suggest you do also – you will find LAD is quite different to what you expect unless you are a bigot, sectarian or Ruth Patterson. 🙂

  • Tir Chonaill Gael

    “recent British corruption with regards to Ulster [sic] policy.”

    what exactly is British policy in regard to Cavan, Monaghan and Donegal?

  • DC

    mac tire

    are you an irish republican – please?

  • mac tire

    DC – would it make any difference? What if I were a Unionist? Would that make a difference? Just a Human Being?

    “Do you agree with what he says?
    Is this what Loyalism really thinks?
    Can you not see the contradictions?”

    What about those since that was the template you used?

    When you truthfully answer a question (and according to your posts I accept you do, in the main, truthfully answer) then I will.

  • Hi DC. You seem to be a little bit obsessed with us so in answer to the question ‘is LAD operated by Irish republicans’, the answer is – definitively NO. Happy? We are Loyalists Against Democracy and WE are the people.

  • between the bridges

    Mac tire cheers for the link, I have seen LAD copied onto other forums but never had the privilege of reading the comments, going from that example there is more than one side making fools of themselves… There are off course other ‘parody’ pages on FB/interweb select google type in a four letter word beginning with F and ending with uck add on ‘the 12th’, ‘OO’ ‘Huns’ etc and knock one off at the funny comments…

  • DC

    ideology mac tire that’s why!

    why do you have to lock me in to answering first in relation to my question as to whether you are indeed an irish republican?

  • mac tire

    No problem BRB – and when taigbook take down this loyal of loyalist page you can always hook up to:

    http://loyalistsagainstdemocracy.blogspot.co.uk/

    I’m sure you can post your views/findings there. It’ll give you a break from that usual haunt.

  • mac tire

    DC – ideology – I guess what you want to find out there is that you are what I am not.

    C’mon DC enough of the contested conceptualization. Shit after that I feel as if I’m a Sluggerite.

    DC lighten up. We are not all out to get you.

  • I hadn’t looked at LAD until a few minutes ago. Brilliantly funny.

  • mac tire

    See, Mister Joe, that is the question.

    Why do some find LAD unfunny? I suggest you go right through. I think you’ll find some absolute gems in there, MJ. Pity you had not been signed up all along.

    That is LAD3 since the bigots congregated to get rid of ! and 2.

    But Facebook can get rid of the most loyalist Loyalist page ever – but not the more loyal Loyalists who are more loyal than those wans in Britain.

    Just in case Jelly Kelly and his PSNIRA attack our Loyalist pages then we are smarter than him.

    http://loyalistsagainstdemocracy.blogspot.co.uk/

  • ayeYerMa

    Tirconnel, clearly you don’t see the irony in that the only definition of Ulster (one of many) which you view as valid is that as defined by the military planners of the Tudor conquest.

  • Tir Chonaill Gael

    You’re way off the mark old boy. Back to the history textbooks for you.
    Anyway, what of British policy towards the aforementioned three counties: does it even exist?

  • Comrade Stalin

    DISGRASE

  • DC

    we really did go round the houses last night – mac tire are you an irish republican? 😉

  • Am Ghobsmacht

    Mac Tire

    “Why do some find LAD unfunny?”

    Aside from humour differences I’d say that it just exposes an ugly truth.

    Harder to laugh at the track suit wearing, vodka drinking, Union fleg adorned, kaflick hating, elephant in the room. So to speak.

    Think ‘I never met a nice South African’ with Ulster Flegs.

    The way ‘our lot’ deals with such things is very digital, if it is an attack on any element of unionism, no matter how unsavory that aspect is, then is simply an attack on Unionism full stop.
    Ergo, not funny.

    We can’t address those unsavory aspects because quite frankly that’s what themuns want us to do i.e. “a surrender!”

    For the record, I think L.A.D picks up where the Portadown news left off.

    I tip my hat to them.

  • derrydave

    The thread has really descended into pretty boring backwards and forwards nonsense about LAD – the only good to come out of it I suppose is that it has acted as a free advertisement for the LAD pages – I had never seen them until DC’s obsession on this thread intrigued me enough to go have a look – cheers DC, it is actually very funny ! You really should try to be less of an uptight oul bore.

  • Fleggy McFleggerson

    Hi there,
    First time blogger long time hater of eejits!
    DC you don’t need a silly Fleggy name to be funny, cool or to fit in!
    All yah need is to voice an opinion!
    Sure a lot of times people don’t care for it but hey thats life.
    I cant speak for LAD, or anyone posting in it but here is my view.
    LAD exposes idiots that seem to think the internet is a vessel for the ugly thoughts that run around in your head.
    Most decent, civilised human beings have the capacity to filter through these thoughts and articulate them without looking or sounding like an arsehole, a fuckwit or a bigot!
    They use satire to mock these people, most of the contributors and commentators have no political opinions what so ever!
    But i think we all share a few things in common.
    We hate bigots
    We hate fuckwits
    We all enjoy embarrassing them!
    Now here us lesson number 1
    A republican is not defined by the fact that they dont agree with you!
    Further lessons will follow as needed
    Ive been Fleggy
    Tx for listening

  • michael-mcivor

    UDR= Unionist Does Remand-

  • Rory Carr

    Nice of Fleggy McFleggerson to explain to us all the rules governing satire on the L.A.D. Facebook page which he encapsulates neatly as,

    LAD exposes idiots that seem to think the internet is a vessel for the ugly thoughts that run around in your head.

    Unfortunately, having started with the best of intentions and having given us all many a chuckle, the followers of the L.A.D. page have now themselves (with a few notable exceptions), increasingly chosen to vent the more atavistic side of their nature. This at least has the advantage of demonstrating a common human frailty that they share with those that L.A.D. seeks to expose through satire.

    This is perhaps best seen below in the responses to a video of a Loyalist preacher’s defense of Cllr Patterson:

    https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=154677404726529&set=vb.579775668711870&type=2&theater

    While the response to a picture of “a million” protestors outside Musgrave Park police station is mostly funny and in keeping with the ethos of the Facebook page, one response fantasises a Death Race 2000 scenario with a less-than-satirical serious tone that is disturbing, indeed almost on a par with the offensive statement that Patterson had cause to withdraw and offer and apology. Unless L.A.D. can weed out or prevent such responses (and I do not think that is possible) then they are only going to end up as a parody of their very own intent.

    And that’s not funny.

    p.s. I see that Cllr Patterson has been charged with the lesser offence of publishing “a grossly offensive” statement.

    Well, damn it, we are all guilty of that every now and then and while it might be thought that her offence was much more serious than that (and I certainly think that it was), on the charge itself it would be in all our best interests if we were to defend Cllr Patterson against that charge, lest we all find ourselves up before the beak next week, or the week after.

  • I think thats a long standing problem with Humour.
    For nearly twenty years the dominant impressionist onTV was Mike Yarwood. I believe he is on record as saying that he would not do an impression of someone he did not like.
    I would have preferred Yarwood to Bernard Manning or Mike Reid…or Jim Davidson, who seemed to have no affection for the subjects of their humour.
    Alas …Alternative Comedy has come and gone. Those guys and few women are now in their 50s but there has been a swing back to personal cruelty by a younger generation. The Mock the Week people or indeed Clarkson….on left or right there seems no affection for subjects.
    It is of course “funny” and nothing wrong with the professionalism….but 1970s cruelty has been fuelled by Internet anonymity…the last refuge of the racist and sexist.

    And therein lies the dilemna …that pouring humourous vitriol on nasty people is more acceptable than pouring humourous vitriol on very nice people.
    Making a law that differentiates….seems hard.

  • Rory Carr

    It’s not just that, FJH. I can best exemplify what I mean by saying that to call someone with whom one is at odds, “a baldy cunt” or “a fat fucker,” does nothing other than to demonstrate the speaker’s fear of himself becoming bald or fat or indeed his shame at already being bald or fat and takes not a jot away from the strength of what has been said and with which he disagrees.

  • Fleggy McFleggerson

    Atavistic? Eh Rory me thinks your trying to impress your dictionary skills upon someone that doesn’t care for your self indulgent sarcasm.
    Like i said i don’t speak for LAD, its contributors or commentators.
    But rejoice in your own opinion fella cause you seem pretty attatched to it.

  • DC

    But rejoice in your own opinion fella cause you seem pretty attatched to it.

    That’s a bit rich coming from you Fleggy.

  • Fleggy McFleggerson

    Lol DC thats all it is an opinion!

  • Rory Carr

    I employed no sarcasm, Fleggy but I did point out some of the difficulties that L.A.D. inevitably suffers. Not everyone opposed to the more outlandish reaches of gross loyalist bigotry are able or willing to rest in the refined subtlety of smooth satire.

    Just sayin’ like. Alliteration – did you see what I did there ?

    And I do appreciate that you do not speak on behalf of the L.A.D. Facebook page – as no doubt, do they.

  • Fleggy McFleggerson

    Oki Rory cool

  • goalsboyce

    DC you love your flags heres one for ya https://www.facebook.com/TricolourAtCityHall

  • babyface finlayson

    Carl Marks
    Each to their own I suppose, but to me LAD seems to be going for a fairly easy target. It’s a bit too close to mocking the afflicted for my liking. Not my cup of tea.

  • babyface finlayson

    Sorry I meant Rory Carr of course,not Carl Marks. (Though we all know they are one and the same.)

  • Neil

    Each to their own I suppose, but to me LAD seems to be going for a fairly easy target.

    Maybe, but hypothetically let’s say piss baby didn’t get automatically challenged and turned from an Olympic grade MOPE into a humiliating embarrassment for whatever individual created it. How would that have helped the situation? A bunch of morons staggering about Belfast thinking that piss baby was real would have been a bad thing.

    Instead the whole episode – clearly designed to additionally inflame an already tense situation – was over before it began. In summary some individual saw Unionists going ballistic and thought ‘how can I make Unionists even more angry’ and set about trying to up tensions. LAD pissed all over that fire before it got started. Piss baby was not a stand alone attempt to up tensions by telling lies, nor was it alone in being derailed by the folks at LAD.

    As to the sectarian comments below the line, they reflect on the people making them. Often they get the piss took out of them too for being sectarian. And there are a number of examples of bright Nationalist types who have taken LAD as a for real ‘protest page’ and emailed sectarian abuse to the LAD lads, who have in response wound them up mercilessly and published the whole lot for us all to laugh at. Sectarian ‘taigs’ and ‘huns’ will be laughed at, and I for one think it’s great.

  • FDM

    I think FJH’s position on this is effete.

    If loyalists and extreme unionists want to make a fool of themselves on communications media then I am going to laugh at it.

    If the girls and boys at LAD can put a humourous spin on a lie or an untenable position then I may well laugh at that as well.

    If the loyalist or whomever was more fond of bypassing school for a day at the snooker hall then a) that was their choice and b) they have no-one to blame but themselves for their educational/life underachievement.

    “He is a poor unprivileged peaceful rioter” is the tale told by many of their apologists.

    Well tell that to someone who is listening.

  • stewart1

    One of the funniest LAD pieces was an Irish guy living in Australia having a go at him on Facebook for being a loyalist. Some brilliant responses from LAD about the queen still owning the whole island etc….. Comedy gold. #disgrase

  • Reader

    Rory Carr: Not everyone opposed to the more outlandish reaches of gross loyalist bigotry are able or willing to rest in the refined subtlety of smooth satire.
    Indeed. Of course, the possibility that LAD might expose both sides to ridicule, instead of just one is “a good thing” / “a bad thing” (delete whichever does not apply).
    I suppose it depends what LAD is for.

  • John Ó Néill

    Interesting that everyone seems to assume that LAD are not from Protestant/loyalist/unionist background.

  • Am Ghobsmacht

    John

    Do you really think that’s what people here think?

    I only assume that they are Protestant for the most feeble of reasons: a ‘hunch’

    It seems like a very Protestant perspective to me, at least one I can relate to quite well, the sheer frustration of watching Unionism’s withdrawal into the stone age, so I’d be surprised if they/he/she weren’t from a Unionist back ground.

    But I think I’d rather not know.

  • Neil

    Here’s another sensible contribution from a DUPe in response to a Loyalist ‘protest’ where 9 cops were injured today:

    http://www.u.tv/News/Police-shield-SF-mayor-from-protestors/181c132c-2a09-488f-9269-89019b54d405

    DUP North Belfast MLA William Humphrey said that the protest was a response to Mr Ó Muilleoir’s part in Sinn Féin supporting the restricting of the Union flag at Belfast City Hall back in November.

    “For the Lord Mayor to think he can come here and carry out an opening, when he and his party have been involved in a campaign against the culture of the unionist community – particularly the Orange culture – is simply not real.”

  • Kevsterino

    Neil, do you have access to any more detail regarding bold Nelson’s foray to the park in by the Falls Road?

  • Neil
  • DC

    The SF Mayor said there will be no ‘no go’ areas in Belfast, errr ya wanna think again mate because I can think of one!

  • FDM

    DC 6 August 2013 at 6:23 pm

    The SF Mayor said there will be no ‘no go’ areas in Belfast, errr ya wanna think again mate because I can think of one!
    —————————-

    Really DC? I can’t think of single place on this entire island that the threats direct or implied by you or anyone else will keep the democrats in this society from moving forward.

    Lets just hope these thugs are identified, arrested, prosecuted and jailed. An assault on our democratically elected representatives is an assault on democracy.

    These thugs cannot be allowed to win. Does the last person out of the extreme unionist/loyalist community not to have a criminal record win some sort of prize? All you are doing is condemning yourselves to the fringes of society. No power, no jobs, little education, no hope and ultimately no future. All for a rag hanging from a lamppost. I hope they eat well. Bon appetit.

  • odd_number

    Loyalists against democracy.
    Let them eat fleg.

  • SK

    “The SF Mayor said there will be no ‘no go’ areas in Belfast, errr ya wanna think again mate because I can think of one!”

    _____

    Poor, repugnant, Loyalists. They never turn down an opportunity to make a show of themselves.

  • DC

    @FDM

    The Lord Mayor got the Tony Blair treatment and OK morally it mightn’t be right to jostle him in that way but entirely predictable given the way a small number feel out there in that area. it was only a small crowd so let’s not pretend this is reflective of unionism or in fact loyalism in general.

    Thinking my day couldn’t get any better after learning LAD 2 or 3 or 4 now? has been struck off facebook – again – boom, along comes news of Conall McDevitt paying his wife money via her company out of his expenses. Come on Yesssssssssssssssss you walt head!

    Politicians in relation to their expenses and money really are incorrigible.

  • Mc Slaggart

    DC

    “morally it mightn’t be right to jostle him in that way but entirely predictable given the way a small number feel out there in that area. it was only a small crowd so let’s not pretend this is reflective of unionism or in fact loyalism in general.”

    I think the lack of response from the DUP is the most damaging thing for unionism. I wonder what the people taking part in this think of the event?

    “First Minister Meets World Police & Fire Games Athletes”

  • DC

    oh yeah, plus there’s this: http://i42.tinypic.com/2prtpag.jpg

    That man is gold dust!

    an exciting day has been had by all!?

  • FDM

    @DC

    “entirely predictable given the way a small number feel out there”

    “let’s not pretend this is reflective of unionism or in fact loyalism in general.”

    ——————————-

    If they were not out rioting, injuring police, intimidating people, blocking-roads and generally destroying the place every week, at the drop of a bowler hat, then you would have a point.

    Loyalism and extreme unionism is an evolutionary dead-end. They have degenerated into a mass of seething mindless zombies who wreak havoc, whilst making senseless whining and groaning sounds. Their concentrations vary from place to place but the pestilent effect they have upon the land is the same.

  • Submariner

    ” so let’s not pretend this is reflective of unionism or in fact loyalism in general.”

    Wrong it is reflective of Loyalism in general. Loyalism is all about sectarian hatred it has nothing else to offer.The Lord Mayor was assaulted and subjected to vile sectarian abuse by a bunch of dole sponging knuckle dragging bigots who also assaulted nine police officers, then we had the spectacle of elected Unionist politicians defending and refusing to condemn the assaults. Contrast the treatment meted out to the Lord Mayor and PSNI officers at Woodvale with the treatment of DUP politicians at Dunville. That my friend says it all about the different attitudes within the respective communities.

  • Comrade Stalin

    LAD are most certainly not nationalists, but they’re not really unionists either. I imagine the Alliance Party led by Sid Vicious.

  • Comrade Stalin

    The attacks on our Lord Mayor and our police officers today were a disgrace, and even more disgraceful (but sadly unsurprising to the extent that it is becoming boring) was the DUP’s justification of this hooliganism.

  • DC

    I guess that’s just the way certain people protest about things in that area some of it isn’t pleasant looking; but, it is interesting that it is hostility to SF that actually shifts people off the sofa and brings them out of the house and into public view. when in view, i don’t think these protesters are any different in style to those people pissed off about stuff in certain nationalist areas, or in England for that matter. think supporters of the EDL etc.

    clearly middle class type folks don’t like reactionary behaviour as an end in itself, they are content to look the other way if it’s a by-product of idealism. such would-be voters are content with scuffles and head banging on the sidelines if it can get some sort of new politics through or noble cause off the ground or a cause that looks as if it will ‘lift all boats’ but theirs in particular.

    Crude reactionary stuff like this is just a mega turn off to the modern middle class, consumer type, would-be voter, person out there.

    the lesson is, make sure to package your reactionary stuff up in idealism or if you are very very clever (or deceptive?) package it up as idealism! like those in ardoyne make sure to do when they wreck the place in their apparent quest to end discrimination in ireland and to create a new ireland in the process, whenever in reality all SF and the residents groups have achieved is the closure of part of a public road in NI that is used by others, their neighbours in particular which has caused great upset and offence esp to the POA.

    alliance should take heed of the above, in future if you’re going to mess around with flags at least have one of your own to go up in the place of the one coming down, give the people of the city something new to believe in.

    rather than looking like being forced to react not to a civic minded proposal but to a bitter, ethnically motivated, pan-nationalist charge at full removal of the union flag. Even to have put the council flag up 365 would have been something for people to go on than a bare flagpole!

  • Tir Chonaill Gael

    pic.twitter.com/l7gngCitru

    political loyalism is imploding. Dangerous times ahead.

  • Tir Chonaill Gael

    direct link for the above (hopefully)…

    http://pic.twitter.com/l7gngCitru

  • Kevsterino

    Rather than issue condemnation of the attack on the Lord Mayor of Belfast, I read one report quoting a DUP man as saying the violence was preventable, if, wait for it, the Mayor had not shown up at the opening.

    So I guess, to the DUP, it is all the mayor’s fault for, like, breathing protestant air or something.

  • Zig70

    So if Humphrey had written his threat in social media, to the Lord Mayor that there would be trouble if he turned up, then he would have broken the law. Is this not worse than Ruth’s expression of hate?

  • Comrade Stalin

    DC, if you want your opinion about flags to be heeded you need to explain why the unionist majority in places like Craigavon, Lisburn (and a few other places too, I believe) are happy with designated days.

    Kevsterino, that’s right. Fairly typical. There were riots near a graveyard in Newtownabbey about 10-15 years ago, on the O’Neill Road. One of the local unionist councillors excused the violence by saying it was provoked by the Catholic priest officiating at a grave blessing ceremony allegedly blessing some of the Protestant graves.

  • Comrade Stalin

    Zig70, yeah I wondered about that too.

  • JR

    I noticed Nelson McCausland the sly dog stand shoulder to shoulder with Mairtín at the Falls but shuffel straight over to the protesters at the Shankill.

  • DC

    ‘DC, if you want your opinion about flags to be heeded you need to explain why the unionist majority in places like Craigavon, Lisburn (and a few other places too, I believe) are happy with designated days’

    One proposal was civic-minded the other ethnic?

  • MonkDeWallyDeHonk

    DC

    Lets save time – what you are saying is that it’s all the fault of SF, the SDLP and Alliance that there has been rioting, assault and bills running into hundreds of thousands of pounds. If only BCC reverse their decision and give the “Loyalists” inc the UVF and UDA what they want, it will all stop.

    Effectively, every time they don’t get what they want, they’ll come out on the streets.

    What decade do you live in? It’s not the 70s any more and the British govt will not back down to “Loyalist” terrorists and thugs.

    This was a democratic decision and if some people don’t like it – that’s tough. It’s part of living in a democracy, there are decisions I don’t like but I don’t go out vandalising things or assaulting people.

    The so called “Loyalist” flag protestors are pathetic – they claim to be so proud of being British. My Dads family are all English and I lived in London for almost 20 years. I’m here to tell you that the flag protesting “Loyalists” display none of the tolerance, humour and friendliness that I associate with real British people.

    The vast majority of genuine British people wouldn’t want to be associated with the fleg protestors. Whether you like it or not, there is little interest or support for NI Unionists in Britain and given the behaviour of the “Loyalist” mobs – that’s hardly a surprise.

  • Comrade Stalin

    DC, if you’re going to use that argument you have to explain why unionists chose to be civic-minded everywhere except in Belfast.

  • Barnshee

    “This was a democratic decision and if some people don’t like it – that’s tough. It’s part of living in a democracy, there are decisions I don’t like but I don’t go out vandalising things or assaulting people.”

    Ah ye olde democracy -that old majority thing -but only when it suits