Mapping the Irish budget on Debategraph…

The live blog continues until late this evening… But I thought setting up a Debategraph might a particularly useful way of unpacking a complex budget… I’ve got things started here by stealking from the main themes in the Minister’s speech, but to really map the tensions and complications we need to get a few more people involved… You need to register at debate graph and then you can start shaping the contours of arguments around the budget:

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  • Different Drummer

    The Budget Mick Kind Admin Turns on A Sixpence

    Ok Mick thanks for the hutzba but no thanks – the debatograph is like what you just done there:

    Reduced the content of the a debate into its form – it still is politically useless…

    A debate on the lines of is Kirenan Allen’s book Ireland’s Economic Crash: A Radical Agenda for Change’, useful or useless..?

    would be useful – he’s been touting it round the studios in the south – and was featured on Vincent brown program.

    Or is is that this is only reply you give me to my discourse…
    if it is that would be a shame..

  • martin


  • Different Drummer

    Yes Martin let’s have no more solutions offered by Furhers – -**North or South:

  • Michael

    This debategraph thing, is Stewart Pearson making money from it?

    The number of iFrames and external js files on this site make it load slower than a speccy at times.

  • Different Drummer

    Yes Michael it is a useless toy – like the Tamagcohi the Japanese produced some years back all it did was demand that you pretend to feed it…time to bin it..

  • Michael

    Tamagochi, I like that comparison. 🙂

    I think the site just needs a garish background image that doesn’t lend itself to tiling, to take that last step to myspace hell.

  • Mick Fealty

    Michael, the new faster and more connected Slugger will be ready in the new year.


    I’m not sure I understand any of that.

  • Different Drummer

    Yes MICK your right you don’t understand

    Especially what a RADICAL agenda for change on the island would look like..

  • Mick Fealty


    Then why not explain it? Better still, why not take it out on the debategraph?

    There’s a lot of fury and anger about Lenihan’s budget online. But there are also a few calmer heads who quietly point out that he had little choice but to do some of these things.

    But that’s not why I think this is worth doing. I think it is worth doing because it puts the focus back on the complex policy picture and gives us a *possible* avenue for bringing it back to ground.

    It’s an experiment. It’s supposed to be fun. But not in the classical ‘distraction’ sort of way you’re alluding to. Quite the opposite.

  • Different Drummer

    Mick as you said this has become (against your wishes) a thread about the quality of debate on Slugger and why the debatograph will not improve that quality – one iota

    If you don’t like the way things are done here then it’s you who has to do something other than what you are doing the debatograph is not the way to do that…

  • Greenflag

    Not sure whether it’s a toy or an experiment or both . In it’s favour it shows the ‘complex’ and many stranded process that goes into any budget formulation along with the competing political interests . For the single agenda folk it’s a reminder that no man or interest group or political party is an island unto himself or themselves . Will it help the quality of debate on slugger ? Can’t do any harm anyway .

    My only criticism is that it seems to apportion (unintended of course )almost equal importance to all the political party players . Perhaps a ‘box size ‘ commensurate with each party’s percentage share of the vote in the last election might show where the ‘responsibility’ for the current mess lies and who will bear the major responsibility for it’s reversal .

    In the real world -Cowan and Lenihan just like Brown and Darling will have to wait for Washington DC/Wall St and Berlin /Frankfurt to say ‘game on’ again . In the meantime live horse and eat grass 😉

  • Mick Fealty


    That last is just a function of it being an underinvested graph. The more people interact with it the richer it becomes, which in turn gives us the the opportunity we might have of simplifying it by identifying major nodes in the network.

  • Jaker

    What’s about the thing at the top, I thought they were directions on how to get on to the road to “Hell”. For even there would be better than even more divided rich/poor little “Eire” that’s run really by the Greens & the 4/5 Independent’s. Now wait for the rioting on the street’s in the “New Year”.

    So I written words to a new Christmas songs if anyone can write a tune to it they can have it, if they’ll just give me a bit of credit

    “Mean Two Santa’s”.
    I wish Santa Lenihan would bring this Government back down to Earth
    Or if not wave a big magic wand & make them forever disappear for our mirth
    And Santa Lenihan, if with your greedy pardner’ Cowen, dares to pass over my chimney
    I’ll be on the look-out to shoot you both down so that you won’t look so healthy.
    Just like the most of us,
    Who are dying on our feet?
    (Our Health doesn’t seem to matter)
    Our illnesses seem to repeat

    Oh we’re taxed off the street!
    We can’t even buy a little sustenance
    We are looking to our futures
    That is turning into no futures or “Worse”
    All because of Santa’s Cowen & Santa Lenihan
    Who between them have stolen Xmas in one big greedy “Swoop?”
    So, forget Merry Xmas everybody & forget Happy New Year!
    Santa’s Lenihan & Cowen, made sure of that this year….. (HIC)!
    © Christmas2009. Jaker.