UUP conference

Just a quick note that a live blog of the UUP 2009 Conference is on Three Thousand Versts courtsey of Chekov.

  • Itwas SammyMcNally whatdoneit

    The key question at the UUP conference, leaving aside their comedic internal tribulations with Sylv and the revolt of the hardline Prods in South Belfast, is whether the Tories will signal an attempt to play some type of Orangey Card via the UUP on the shape of fecking up the transfer of police.

    It would be some black comedy if Tory influence which ridiculously claimed to be trying to end tribal politics in Norn Irom whilst simultaneously linking up with the deeply sectarian and tribal UUP were to help plunge Norn Iron into a fresh political crisis.

  • andrew white

    i see hauge wants to stop double jobbing, how many jobs has he and other tories got?

  • Drumlins Rock

    hey what a surprise Sammy has to be the first to get his knife in, his obcession with the UUP Tory link is bordering on fanatical, up there with rusty nails and JoCs favourite subjects.
    By what I saw seemed to be a pretty good conference for a party that many said was finished a couple of years ago, the selections is probably the biggest issue and where tensions will come to the fore, if they can pull that off then they will be a New force (sorry that is a bit corny I know)

  • quizzical

    “the revolt of the hardline Prods in South Belfast”

    hardline prods, what Roy Garland, Jeff Dudgeon? yeah hardcore

  • fin

    might be pee-ing in the wind here, but interested to hear (sensible) comments on P&J. Reggie appears to have come up with a small shopping list in return for UUP support. But I note he called for a proper 4 party executive, if the UUP support the Alliance for the Justice post it would be a 5 party executive. My thinking is connected to Ritchies and Empys letter from yesterday. Is it possible that the UUP would support the SDLPs arguement regarding their claim to the Justice role.
    Would it be a clever move to embarass the DUP? Would it collect nationalist votes for UCUNF or even the UUP?

    afterall there is a sunset clause involved so in a few years the SDLP or SF could have the role anyway. What if the UUP skipped selecting Justice after an Assembly election and it was snaffled by SF or the SDLP, would it allow the DUP to accuse them. Why not gift it to the SDLP now, and blame the DUP for it, the DUP then have to fight the next election as the unionists who handed the role to a nationalist. Would the UUP rank and file buy into this?

    Its a serious senario for me, I think it would be a very clever move by Reggie, however I’m not a unionist, so what do I know

  • Comrade Stalin

    hey what a surprise Sammy has to be the first to get his knife in, his obcession with the UUP Tory link is bordering on fanatical, up there with rusty nails and JoCs favourite subjects.

    I don’t get it. UCUNF bang on all day about how the linkup is going to revolutionize Northern Ireland politics, and yet you guys complain every time someone else mentions it.

    I’ll bet there are some in the UUP who are quite sore that Cameron indicated that he would not oppose the policing and justice deal.

  • andrew white

    Is it possible that the UUP would support the SDLPs arguement regarding their claim to the Justice role…

    it wasnt that long ago wee reg said no non pro-union (read nationalist/catholic) could hold the post. Are you suggesting he flipped on this? and what about the McNarrys 5 years delay of devolving policing and justice?

  • fair_deal

    Robinson already offered a new approach to the operation of the Executive in his speech in September so not much of a ‘demand’.

  • interested

    Does any know if Lady Hermon was there?

  • Itwas SammyMcNally whatdoneit

    Drumlin’s Rock,

    I am trying to take your well intentioned remarks on board – and if and when Wee Reggie signs up to Police and Justice I will probably relax a ibt more and quietly watch a quite small party, that is the UUP, get quite a bit smaller.

    But you must admit, that as Andrew White pointed out above, it is but a few months since the UUP were trying to stall the transfer of police (or at least the finance bit) for 5 years. At a crucial time in the negotiations and with the DUP suffering from attack from the TUV, this was a fairly irresponsible position to adopt and to all but the most naieve was cleary an attempt to make like difficult for the DUP. As CS points out the somewhat neutral postion of the PoshBoyDC must have been something of a disappointment to those trying to use the issue to their advantage.

    Do you not accept any of that?

    quizzical,

    re. Hard line Prods.

    If they are not such hard line types why would they be trying to stop such a moderate SDLP type from geting elected?

  • cynicorwhat

    Andrew White
    it wasnt that long ago wee reg said no non pro-union (read nationalist/catholic) could hold the post.

    Actually, it was specifically in response to the idea of an Alliance Minister, in the context that Alliance was said to be neutral on the border. Not exactly a state secret that Alliance thinks a shared future is more important than the ancient quarrel, but wee reg threw a fit.

    Then in the Assembly, Basil McCrea said it should be an SDLP Minister. Not exactly joined uup thinking, as pointed out at the time by Naomi Long, David Ford and (interestingly) William McCrea.

  • elvis parker

    Re: Lady Hermon – I’ve been going to UUP conference for about 10 years and I think she has attended twice

    Andrew White re Hague’s double jobbing. Hague has outside interests which he declares. Like all other Shadow Cabinet he is committed to giving this up at the end of the year to prepare for govt.

    Contrast this to the will-he-wont indecision of FM Peter MP MLA the patriach of the Swiss family who was standing down from Westminster and now he’s not LOL

    So I guess he will have to stand down from the Assembly now following the Conservatives pledge to end double jobbing?

    Mind you this will suit him as it will save him from having to become DFM under the stupid rule he pushed for at St Andrews for party advantage.

  • granni trixie

    Andrew: The SDLP might claim ‘justice’ is theirs but surely Alliance can equally claim this heritage|? eg Bob Cooper (rel/pol discrimination),Mary Clark Glass (Wm Rights) or Oliver Napier,David Cook and Brice Dickson (policing and Human Rights). And Alliance have proved in many other significent roles that they can punch above their numberical strength.

    Whatever, if David Ford is offered and accepts the Justice portfolio it is quite a risk for Alliance. But I’m sure they’re up to it!

  • andrew white

    Hague has outside interests which he declares. Like all other Shadow Cabinet he is committed to giving this up at the end of the year to prepare for govt.

    outside interests , dont you mean other jobs? and what about other tory members? hypocrisy pure hypocrisy

    So I guess he will have to stand down from the Assembly now following the Conservatives pledge to end double jobbing?….

    bet this wont happen as there will be such a fuss over the tories keeping their other jobs

  • Hipo Crite

    Andrew

    So you are saying that double jobbing is wrong?

    Could you tell your party colleagues this as they seem to have missed the memo.

    Or are you saying it’s ok to take all th emoney you can from the tax payer whilst doing very little for it?

    Which is it?

  • andrew white

    Andrew

    So you are saying that double jobbing is wrong?……….

    im saying its hypocrisy of the tories to say they will ban doubel jobbing when they are up to their necks in it themselves

    Or are you saying it’s ok to take all th emoney you can from the tax payer whilst doing very little for it?………..

    tell me this, who is it that voted these people into their various posistions..oh yes, the taxpayer!

  • frustrated democrat

    CS

    Why do you have to be economical with the truth when you really do know the real facts.

    The Conservatives have ONLY said they are broadly happy with the financial settlement and they are happy for the 4 parties here to decide on the rest.

    It seems to me Reg’s price for P&J is a settlement on education to show the executive is working.

    So SF have a decision on what is more important to them P&J or education, as both are not on offer any longer now Robinson has effectively passed control of P&J to Reg.

    Sammy – which one do you think they will go for?

  • Hipo Crite

    Andrew

    Share your thoughts with the tax payers – I am sure they see it’s all their fault.

  • andrew white

    Share your thoughts with the tax payers – I am sure they see it’s all their fault. ………

    why is it a fault? are you saying the taxpayers are stupid for voting one person to more than one position? is that UUP policy now?

  • Hipo Crite

    Andrew

    Why is it a fault….‘ In that one question you show just how detatched the DUP have become from the electorate.

    Is tomorrows quote from you ‘let them eat cake‘?

    I guess that’s what you get from believing your own hype.

  • andrew white

    Why is it a fault….’ In that one question you show just how detatched the DUP have become from the electorate….

    the electorate vote people into multiple jobs. THe tories have no difficulty indoing 3 , 4 or more jobs – why should anyone else

  • Hipo Crite

    Let’s see how many multiple jobs the electorate vote the DUP into over the next few years.

    I can’t believe you are telling me that an MP can be a MLA and give their electorate a quality service – if this is your party line you are heading for a much bigger fall than predicted.

  • DW

    Cameron and the Conservative,s may be doing the five SF MPs/MLA’s Gerry Adams , Pat Doherty , Michelle Gildernew ,Martin Mc Guinness , & Conor Murphy a favour by making it illegal to hold seats both at Westminister & the Stormont Assembly at the same time. The SF MP’s don’t take their seats at Westminister anyway, so they can sit back in amusement and watch how many DUP & SDLP MP’s are prepared to forefit their assembly seat to stand for Westminster in May 2010.

    The UUP’s only MP never served on the Assembly so Lady Hermon can stand again as an Unionist Independant without any bother in the next election. The recent news is all Alliance voters in North Down will vote for her against Ian Parsley (deflector to Conservatives) if he is chosen as the UCUNF candidate.

  • andrew white

    I can’t believe you are telling me that an MP can be a MLA and give their electorate a quality service -………..

    reg is a minister , mla and councillor, he must be shit at all 3 then

    hauge works for a number of companies and is shadow foreign minister…he seems to think its ok, not to mention the rest of the tory party.

  • DW

    Its holding political seats in different governments namely the EU, Devolved Government & House of Commons all at the same time that is going to be made illegal by the new Conservative government. Not non government positions.

  • DC

    ANTHONY SELDON

    Tony Blair could be really outstanding. People have him wrong: they think he spent his premiership fixated on Clinton and Bush, but in fact he gave considerable and increasing time to Europe once he had worked out what he wanted to do. His plan to enter the euro was ill-considered, and when Brown defeated it the second time in 2003, he cared little. His defining moment came in Brussels in June 2005, when he set the tone for a more liberal, less bureaucratic and enlarged Europe. Britain needs a voice to match China, India and the US and a Blair is best placed to provide exactly that

    Vote Labour and Blair for El President 😀

  • DC

    But Brown, after a 5th 1/4 of recession, is extremely ‘under pressure’:

    (Still, don’t ever vote Tory!)

  • bob wilson

    ‘The recent news is all Alliance voters in North Down will vote for her against Ian Parsley’

    DW well down for talking directly to all Alliance voters – I know there arent a huge number but that’s quite an achievement nonetheless.

    However you are definitely wrong. I will sure IJP will vote for himself!

  • Comrade Stalin

    Are the Tories going to apply this double jobbing thing in the Scottish Parliament ? Look at how many jobs Alex Salmond has. No, the only reason why they are bringing it up here is not on principle, but because it is a stick with which to beat the DUP.

    It is up to the electorate to decide whether or not they want to endorse double jobbers. They certainly won’t take lectures from the Conservatives, whose senior members have directorships and consultancies all over the place.

  • Comrade Stalin

    And incidentally, if double jobbing is so bad, then why exactly was almost every single UUP candidate in the last Westminster election already an MLA ?

  • BonarLaw

    Comrade Stalin

    The ban on multiple mandates will be UK wide. Cameron made that clear at the last Scottish Tory conference when he had a dig at Salmond (although he will stand down from Westminster at the next election)

    Generally, there has been much more than the usual bullshit about the desire of South Belfast unionists to be represented by a unionist. As someone who campaigned in West Tyrone in 1997 (which the “moderate” SDLP described as “Stalingrad”) I didn’t detect a willingness from nationalists to be represented by a unionist. Indeed, in the follow-up of 2002 the intra nationalist debate could be summed up as a “who can beat the prod” contest involving everyone from the GAA down. But, of course, only unionists are sectarian in their politics…

  • DW

    bob wilson @ 05:51 PM: ‘ I will sure IJP will vote for himself!’

    Of course he will, but he is conservative now, not Alliance.

    Likewise over 1000 plus Alliance voters voted for SDLP in S Belfast in the 2005 Westminster election to keep a Unionist from winning the seat. The same 1000 plus only came back to Vote for Anna Lo in the 2007 Assembly election.

    The little three monkey’s neutral Lib/Dem party members can play the tactical card whenever it suits them in whatever constituency they happen to live in.

  • Comrade Stalin

    BonarLaw, accepted on the multiple jobs thing.

    Although I don’t think you’re going to get far with that thing about nationalists all trying to beat the prods. Unionism has a history of maintaining electoral pacts, nationalists, for all their faults, do not.

    DW:

    Likewise over 1000 plus Alliance voters voted for SDLP in S Belfast in the 2005 Westminster election to keep a Unionist from winning the seat.

    No problem. I’d take the SDLP over the UUP any day of the week. I don’t care that much for them but at least they operate, for example, voluntary powersharing arrangements, which unionists still refuse to do (case in point : Newtownabbey). I find it a bit ridiculous hearing the unionists saying “those nasty sectarian nationalists refusing to vote for us” given that unionists come up with nothing except reasons for nationalists to vote against them.

  • BonarLaw

    Comrade

    I think you are forgetting the infamous SDLP decision not to fight the Provos in Fermanagh and South Tyrone in 1981 and their earlier refusal to stand against Frank Maguire in 1979.

    As I said, only unionists are sectarian in their politics eh?

  • Comrade Stalin

    I think you are forgetting the infamous SDLP decision not to fight the Provos in Fermanagh and South Tyrone in 1981 and their earlier refusal to stand against Frank Maguire in 1979.

    Er, could that possibly be because the Provos were going around kneecapping and burning out people who stood against them ?

    I admire people who would stand up to such threats (one Alliance man did in West Belfast and was kneecapped for his trouble), but realistically, these are people with lives and families that they can’t necessarily put on the line. That comparison is not fair.

    Unionists on the other hand have operated such electoral strategies for decades. They did so again during the European election and they are still doing it, re. South Belfast.

    And I didn’t say only unionists are sectarian in their politics. I mean, the SDLP had Brian Feeney for christ’s sake. But, like I said, the Stoops have operated voluntary powersharing, for example in Derry. When’s the last time the unionists shared power on a council where they had overall control ?

  • BonarLaw

    Comrade

    or was it just a sign of community solidarity? A name on a ballot, any name, would have sufficed. No canvassing required, no local put in harms way.

    BTW what about ’79? You’re not suggesting the previous incumbant was a knee breaker are you?

  • question mark question mark

    Are the Tories going to apply this double jobbing thing in the Scottish Parliament ? Look at how many jobs Alex Salmond has. No, the only reason why they are bringing it up here is not on principle, but because it is a stick with which to beat the DUP.

    Comerade stalin looks like a right dick after that. If you’re going to use facts, try to make sure tey’re accurate, or at least not so easy to disprove.

    The tories love bitching about Salmond’s multiple mandates!

  • since you’re asking

    When’s the last time the unionists shared power on a council where they had overall control ?

    Larne.

  • Comrade Stalin

    A name on a ballot, any name, would have sufficed. No canvassing required, no local put in harms way.

    The Provos were not merely “local” and putting yourself up for election requires a name and address.

    BTW what about ‘79? You’re not suggesting the previous incumbant was a knee breaker are you?

    I am suggesting nothing other than that unionists have a history of tribal pacts, and nationalists generally do not, and a series of isolated cases 30 years ago doesn’t provide compelling evidence to the contrary.

    question mark :

    Comerade stalin looks like a right dick after that. If you’re going to use facts, try to make sure tey’re accurate, or at least not so easy to disprove.

    I already conceded the correction on the point about Conservative policy. But I think the fact remains that UCUNF would not be pursuing the double jobbing thing had they not been a failed political party and had they actually won any of the Westminister seats they had been running for, the candidates for most of which were sitting MLAs. The poor representation of the Conservatives in the devolved parliaments makes it an easy policy for them to adopt as well.

  • Comrade Stalin

    Larne.

    Correction noted. Still doesn’t stop the unionists from squealing like a stuck pig whenever anyone brings up the idea in other places though.

  • Comrade Stalin

    BonarLaw,

    A bit from my earlier reply got chopped. I was pointing out that SDLP politicians were getting burnt out of their houses, and hate campaigns were organized against them to ostracize them from the communities they’d been representing for decades. And yet you are suggesting that they felt the need to show solidarity with the Provos. That makes no sense at all.