Prolonging the Hunger Strike: The Derailing of the ICJP

In addition to last week’s expanded timeline, two interesting articles originally in the Washington Post in 1981 have been added to the new hunger strike archive: Break Seen In Ulster Jail Crisis and 5th IRA Hunger Striker Dies Before Settlement Reached. They are very detailed about the ICJP offer and, put together with what we know today about the Adams negotiations with the British over the Mountain Climber offer, paint a very stark picture of how needlessly the hunger strike was prolonged. It has been said by some who subscribe to the Morrison narrative of events that the Brits wanted the Provos to ‘call off the strike’ before they would move on any deal. Such language however is without nuance and negates the reality of what was happening. The FOI documents obtained by the Sunday Times illuminate this.

“The statement has now been read and we await provo reactions (we would be willing to allow them a sight of the document just before it is given to the prisoners and released to the press). It has been made clear (as the draft itself states) that it is not a basis for negotiation.” – Extract from a Telegram from the Northern Ireland Office to the Cabinet Office

Lest there be any doubt of their intentions, it should be clear that this is an internal directive of what they were going to do. The Brits were looking assurance that their offer would be accepted. Once Adams said yes it would be, the choreography would be the Brits sending in the NIO with the statement to be read to the prisoners, who would ‘accept’ it and then the end of the hunger strike would be announced and the statement be released to the press.

So reducing it to language such as ‘calling off the strike’ makes it seem as if for nothing – as we saw from the 81 report, the ICJP had the essence of the M/C offer, the Brits had offered the ECHR as guarantors; to any rational eye it does not make sense why that was torpedoed. Reading the 81 reports you see the lay of the land as it was without knowledge of the M/C offer. Knowing what we know now, it seems likely the reason the NIO official did not go in was because the Brits were directly negotiating with the Adams committee; and in the meantime, the Adams committee were intent on getting the ICJP offside – to the point that McFarlane, following orders to shut the ICJP out, turned his back on them when they were so close to getting the deal done. What we see from the historical record is that the Brits, the ICJP, even the prisoners were prepared to end the strike. Evidence is all over the place of this – but no record exists of the Adams committee doing anything but what they could to prolong the strike. Just a week or so later, during the last weeks of July, they were stalling acceptance of the British offer over nailing down details of exactly what could be put into parcels. They had already won the concession of letters and parcels, yet they allowed men to die over fighting about what could be put in the parcels. That is the sort of detail you fight over, if you have to, after the strike is settled – not at the expense of people’s lives. Like George Mitchell said of them during the Good Friday negotiations, they were addicted to over-negotiating.

There were 2 offers on the table from the Brits in early July – the ICJP and M/C offer. Contrary to what we’ve been led to believe, the two offers did not differ in substance. They were much the same and contained enough to settle the protest. Rather than show British duplicity this shows that the British were serious about ending the hunger strike. It shows they were desperate to, actually. With the ICJP offer, you had the backing of the Irish government, and no shortage of mediators to stand as guarantors. As mentioned the Brits suggested the ECHR. That’s the Brits putting forward a guarantor! (Not much later they would send in the Red Cross in the hopes that they would fulfil the same remit – have the ability to secure a deal and act as guarantors to satisfy the prisoners and the international community that the Brits were honouring their end; they too were rejected by Adams and co.) The ICJP had the backing of the prisoners, who told them if they got someone from the NIO in to stand over the deal, they’d accept it. (In addition, the prison leadership, O’Rawe and McFarlane, also accepted the M/C version of the offer, with McFarlane describing it as ‘amazing’ and as a ‘huge opportunity’ and ‘a potential here to end this’; that they accepted the offer is no longer under question now that the conversation has been corroborated.) That was all the Brits were waiting for, an assurance that if they went in, the prisoners were going to say yes. As far as everyone connected with the ICJP initiative were concerned, everything was good to go. The NIO would go in, the prisoners would say yes, and Joe McDonnell had a chance.

But the Brits, desperate to get the guarantee the prisoners would say yes, opened the channel directly to the Provos. And this is where the mistake lay. Once the Provos got on the line, the ICJP was rendered redundant. Sure, they could stand as guarantors of the implementation of the deal, but as far as guaranteeing the assurances the British needed in order to go into the jail with the offer, Adams was the real deal in their eyes. And Adams had to have seen the ability to have direct negotiations with the British as an opportunity that couldn’t be passed up. He didn’t share this activity with the rest of the A/C – this was kept tight between his small group. We know now that he was on the phone with the British himself, bypassing Duddy, during the negotiations; the conversation described in Before the Dawn has been verified and Duddy was at a loss to explain it, as it was outside his scope. We also know that Duddy was never informed that the prisoner leadership – O’Rawe and McFarlane – had accepted the offer; instead he was told it was rejected on the basis that ‘more was needed’. At this point, it must be remembered, the push for a political agenda was already well on the table; the Sands bill had just gone through, and it was known that Sands’ seat would be contestable (this would have been known from his death).

So while the ICJP were waiting for the NIO to come in and give their deal to the prisoners, Adams was dealing directly with the British. The British put the ICJP on hold, but gave no indication of why – because they couldn’t! From their position, and they made this clear to Adams who promptly broke their confidence by telling the ICJP, the negotiations they were having with Adams were secret – it would compromise the British Government fatally to be seen to be negotiating directly with the PIRA. So the ICJP was kept in the dark by the British, not because they were playing games and wanted to see as many hunger strikers die as possible, but because of the secret nature of what they were doing with Adams. The ICJP were not the only ones kept in the dark; Michael Alison could only tell the Friends of Ireland in Washington DC that there had been “drafting problems”, and that resolving them could not happen until “after the prisoners had gone to bed”. He had to maintain the British hard-line façade. This is why many of the papers relating to this time period are still classified; the repercussions that Thatcher would have felt had the extent of her direct contact with the PIRA been known would have brought her down, especially if her overtures were snubbed. Over a decade later, when it was revealed that John Major had had a back channel with the PIRA the ructions were serious.

What has always been missing from the established narrative is the reason why the Brits did not send the NIO in with the ICJP offer when they were supposed to. Now we know why – they were getting what they believed was the real deal directly from the horse’s mouth. And Adams was telling them, ‘more was needed’, and then, when the Brits appeared to pull back from their very extended limb, it was ‘tone, not content’ – which they then wasted time negotiating over, right up until the moment Joe McDonnell died. It was a waste of time because as we see when the British came back after the funeral of Martin Hurson, they were negotiating over items of little importance, and as ultimately, when the hunger strike ended months later in October, the prisoners got what was on offer in July.

So the question of who was really prolonging the strike, the British or Adams, falls on Adams. He kept secret the fact of his negotiations from others on the Army Council; he withheld details of the negotiations from the prisoners; he kept the offer and negotiations secret from the IRSP and INLA, who also had men dying on hunger strike; all of this history has been buried until O’Rawe came forward writing of his and McFarlane’s acceptance of the M/C offer. Because of that and the information that has come out since then, the picture of what happened during the hunger strike is much clearer. He scuttled the ICJP settlement, and later would have the Red Cross chased, and used the prisoners, who were not informed of the details of what he was doing, as cover to prolong the hunger strike to the election of Owen Carron.

Earlier on Slugger:

Updated Timeline and Upcoming Discussion Brian Rowan and Brendan Duddy to speak at Feile

Gulladuff: More Heat Than Light Gerry Adams meets with some of the families of some of the hunger strikers.

Gerry Adams to meet Hunger Strikers Families; Inquiry Sought Families of the hunger strikers call for a public inquiry; Adams arranges meeting

“This is a huge opportunity and I feel there’s a potential here to end this” Bik McFarlane miraculously recovers his memory and completely backtracks on every denial he had made previously, while also making up new, contradictory details never before mentioned

“I will not be attending and will not send a representative” Gerry Adams refuses to attend public meeting about the hunger strikes; extremely revealing discussion in the comments section

1981 Hunger Strike Truth Commission Includes text of British document of July offer and transcript of Willie Gallagher’s speech at the Derry meeting

The Truth is a Heartbreaking Thing Initial summary of Derry meeting

Upcoming Debate: “What is the Truth Behind the Hunger Strike?” Announcement of public meeting and note of Radio Foyle debate between Raymond McCartney and Richard O’Rawe (also discussed on The Pensive Quill: A Shifting Narrative)

When in a hole… Contrasts between Danny Morrison’s position and previously published accounts of the time

What were the hunger strikers told? Questions emerge that cast doubt on what the hunger strikers knew when about what negotiations were being conducted on their behalf by the Adams subcommittee.

“Let’s have the whole truth” – Danny Morrison and Richard O’Rawe statements

Did Thatcher Kill All 10 or Only 4? – contains statements and interview excerpts

  • the joxer

    Yawn…..The same re-cycled baseless conjectures and vanishing hitch-hiker stories from the cowardly and anonymous Blogger,’Rusty Nail.’
    Put up or Shut up!, including your real identity which no doubt would reveal your true motivation.
    The families have already dismissed these baseless stories and have asked for closure on this matter. Still never mind their feelings, Rusty, eh?. Keep on keeping on…….

    This is my one and only comment on this week’s Rusty Nail Exclusive Hunger Strike Expose-until next week’s Exclusive Hunger Strike Expose that is.
    Groundhog Day, or what?….

  • sj1

    It’s true there is a lot of filing in the blanks there, but it simply cannot be dismissed out of hand either. The amount of evidence being unearthed against the Sinn Fein official narrative of this is disturbing. I agree that the families must feel this but even if only one member of one family wants to look at this further then that is enough to continue putting the evidence together. It would be nice to know the identity of the blogger involved, because without that, we don’t know who is constructing the hunger strike web site, and that is important. O’Rawe didn’t publish his book anonymously, he stood over it, and that took backbone. An unknown element constructing and now in the lead of this debate, should stand over what he or she is doing, for the purposes of authenticity. If the person in the lead position cannot defend what they say and believe in public, why would any of the rest of us?

  • joeCanuck

    Joxer, couldn’t agree more (yawn and Groundhog Day). I believe that Rusty is flogging a dead horse here.

  • Paul

    The way Pete and Rusty flog him Adams the dead horse is undoubtedly the most important political figure in nIreland history.

    I knew he was a big player but who would have guessed the total of nIreland politics rotates around him like the planets rotate around the sun

  • Dixie

    Whats good for the Brownie is good for the Rusty Nail…

    Why should Rusty put his or her name to what is some well researched work?

    I don’t see Rusty’s detractor’s putting their names out there!

  • dunreavynomore

    Joxer,
    you can cry ‘anonymous ‘ but while you are anonymous yourself, as I am, your complaint has no validity..

    Rusty nail is dealing with an issue of great importance which goes beyond even the deaths of the remaining hunger strikers; If they were sacrificed to aid the development of Sinn Féin then all Sinn Féin and IRA politics since were built on lies. This is a difficult issue for the families of the hunger strikers we can all recognise that, but it goes much further and deeper and I for one thank rusty nail for the ongoing info. When we have all the facts, all the documentation then we can make up our own minds and we should not be expected to believe something just because a different scenario would be hard on the families and particularily not because a different scenario looks terrible for Adams and the whole leadership.
    We should never fear the truth even if it turns out to be nightmarish.

  • Dixie

    I put my name out there in letters to the Derry Journal etc and some clampet going by the name Bigtomtom with an ip address in Derry put holiday photos of my teenage daughter from her Bebo in a Hunger Strike thread in Politics ie.
    Oh I know she shouldn’t have left her Bebo public because you don’t know what perverts are out there but this is what you have to expect when you go public.

  • Anonymous (I value my legs)

    Dixie, how did you ascertain that the IP address was Derry-based? One of your friends lied through his teeth when, several weeks ago on the excellent The Pensive Quill website, he made very similar allegations with regard to the IP addresses of a number of people.

    The search for truth is vital and I commend the efforts being made to expose Adams’ role during this period. However, I’m revolted at the thought of one particular individual being lauded for his association with his search.

  • Dixie

    Anonymous (I value my legs)…

    I didn’t ascertain it others did for me. However how else would would someone know who my daughter is unless they were from Derry?

    Your post while claiming to be supportive is riddled with smear mate and that is obvious to anyone reading it.

  • Anonymous (I value my legs)

    [i]I didn’t ascertain it others did for me.[/i]

    That doesn’t sound very legal to me. Either you or “others” have friends within the communications industry or the British intelligence services.

    [i] However how else would would someone know who my daughter is unless they were from Derry? [/i]

    Absolutely. But why lie about knowing the person’s IP address, as your friend also did on The Pensive Quill? I doesn’t make you look very big or clever.

    [i]Your post while claiming to be supportive is riddled with smear mate and that is obvious to anyone reading it. [/i]

    I don’t give a f*ck, ‘mate’. Pot. Kettle. Black. I have no idea what your background is, but good luck to you and guys like O’Rawe. As for one of the other individuals – while Adams obviously lied through his teeth to him, the dogs on the street know the truth.

  • Comrade Stalin

    Given an IP address it’s usually possible to take a rough guess at where (geographically) it resides. A lookup on my IP address would allow someone to guess the name of the main road near where I live. That narrows it down to within a few hundred houses. Safe enough, given that it’s not that easy to guess.

    However it’s not possible to go any further than that without having inside knowledge within the telecoms company/ISP. It’s extremely trivial to trace a given IP address back to a customer account, but I not every employee will have the ability to do this. Running such a lookup without the proper cause or authorization would run the risk of dismissal and/or prosecution.

    I’ll hazard a guess that those who claim to have obtained personal details from IP addresses are flying a kite. It might suit you guys to believe that British intelligence have you under surveillance, but I doubt they’re that stupid to feed information to people to let them mouth off on the internet.

  • Anonymous (I value my legs)

    Comrade – the poster that I referred to earlier, a close ally of Dixie Elliot, claimed on [i]The Pensive Quill[/i] some weeks back that he had evidence that a number of posters on Slugger who were claiming to be from Strabane instead had IP addresses based in Derry. Furthermire, Elliott has now claimed that he had “others” trace back the IP address of an individual writing on Politics.ie.

    Therefore, one can draw one of a number of conclusions:

    1. They have friends working in the intelligence services able to ascertain this information.

    2. They have somehow gained access to private information related to both this website and Politics.ie which they have subsequently passed on to someone in the communications sector with the ability to trace IP addresses to specific locations.

    3. They are lying through their teeth.

  • hodgie

    the long road to truth can be tedious for some but for others the research and documentation by Rusty Nail is vital in out efforts to understand.

    the adams narrative has shifted too many times and inconsistencies coupled with an aversion to facing his detractors in public make it look like there is a case to be answered.

    for some of us this is important. fair play to Rusty Nail for continuing to piece together the web of intrigue which is 1981.

    it could all be ended in a dignified and conclusive way quite rapidly: adams could face his accusers in public in an open and honest forum where one side could be either vindicated or exposed.

  • Dixie

    Anonymous (I value my legs)

    Ah see what I mean just a wee poke and the true you comes out I knew what your agenda was. By the way the only thing the dogs in the street know about is pissing on lamp posts and barking.

  • The-geek-from-inside-your-computer

    I.P tracing is not a great big secret intelligence tool…unlike the tools who lack the intelligence on how the magic computer works.
    Have to laugh as it sounds like bloody witchcraft.
    If hackers break into highly restricted computers, then without a doubt it would be “WEE BUNS” to pin point and I.P.

    For more information please contact me at
    Paranoid@busted.come on wise up.
    Why yap about some idiot in Derry pulling a stunt then getting nailed…paranoia…no such thing as privacy in computer-land…check your firewall I think your brains gave been locked out.

  • Dixie

    Anonymous (I value my legs)

    You’re one to be accusing others of lying through their teeth when you originally posted claiming to be in some way in agreement while throwing in the odd smear…Now you go as far to claim that we are working with British Intelligence…Brilliant!

    Why would the Brits want to go to these lengths to damage PSF when they could merely pull the plug on funding their community groups?

  • Anonymous

    [i]You’re one to be accusing others of lying through their teeth when you originally posted claiming to be in some way in agreement while throwing in the odd smea[/i]

    I’m in total agreement with the search for truth. Good luck to (all but one of) you. The truth will out, that is certain.

    [i]Now you go as far to claim that we are working with British Intelligence…Brilliant![/i]

    No, I simply didn’t claim this. Seriously, you need to calm down, ‘mate’. I noted that this was one of a number of possibilities. It’s obviously an absurd suggestion, but was outlined in order to highlight the fact that your friend has made basless claims about his detractors.

    I don’t really care about what you claim in relation to that cowardly idiot on politics.ie. My point is that your friend simply could not have ascertained the IP addresses of those contributing to Slugger last month without something a bit ‘dodgy’ going on.

    [i]Why would the Brits want to go to these lengths to damage PSF when they could merely pull the plug on funding their community groups? [/i]

    Exactly. So either scenario 2 or 3, from my previous post, is applicable.

  • Dixie

    Anonymous [what happened to the legs part?]

    Could you give us a link to these claims on the Pensive Quill?

    If you dig that hole any deeper it might collapse in on you. Who for one minute now believes what your agenda is anything other than smear?

    After you’ve smeared crap on your cell walls for a few years the wee bit that often comes your way in later life no longer stinks as much as you soon get used to it!

  • Anonymous

    [i][what happened to the legs part?][/i]

    I wised up a bit.

    [i]Could you give us a link to these claims on the Pensive Quill?[/i]

    https://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=4807238897188927967&postID=6362947500390234992

    [i]Who for one minute now believes what your agenda is anything other than smear? [/i]

    It’s perfectly possibly to quietly support the cause while being critical of the role that one of its most prominent members has, in recent years, played in his community.

    A person’s involvement in a genuinely courageous and necessary search for truth does not mean that they are automatically exempt from criticism, nor (as you seem to believe) do those criticisms have to be viewed as an attempt to smear that search. You can repeat that assertion as many times as you like, but all you’re doing is exercising the very smear tactics which you’re so scathing about.

    [i]After you’ve smeared crap on your cell walls for a few years the wee bit that often comes your way in later life no longer stinks as much as you soon get used to it! [/i]

    You’ll not believe this and/or won’t give a damn, but I have nothing but respect and admiration for you given what you, and many others, bravely endured. However, I’m not going to extend that deep respect to others who have brought shame on the socialist Irish republican cause.

  • Dixie

    Anonymous [who hasn’t a leg to stand on]

    I see what you mean, you are referring to this…

    “This can be evidenced as recently as the demonisation of myself(and by extension the O Hara and Devine families) on Slugger yesterday from posters claiming to be from Strabane but with IP addresses from Derry. They claimed that my sole motivation representing the two families is solely anti-SF and that I am some sort of “Mr. Big” who is “very, very rich.” And that my home is the epicenter of a crime-wave in the North-West. Nothing has changed in the PSF criminalisation policy-Thatcher taught them well.”

    It so happens this person was a former Blanket Man as well, but whats a bit of divide and conquer, sure it worked for the Brits.

  • Anonymous

    [i]It so happens this person was a former Blanket Man as well, but whats a bit of divide and conquer, sure it worked for the Brits. [/i]

    Yes, I know. I refer you once more to my sentiments expressed in the last sentence of post 19. It’s a pity that didn’t stick to the principles and convictions which he must have had in order to join the struggle and endure the cells e.g. “good luck to them”

    “Divide and conquer”? What a load of paranoid nonsense. You know who he is and, unless you’re extremely naive, how he’s perceived in his home town. Therefore, there’s nothing anyone could say that could possibly “divide” the both of you.

    My point is that this IP address nonsense, whether or not it’s true (and I very much doubt it), further demonstrates the depth to which he has now sunk.

    críochnaithe.

  • Dixie

    Anonymous [who keeps shooting his/herself in the foot]

    You can’t very well talk about people sticking to their principles while hiding behind anonymity and slagging off people who have the guts to go public thus leaving themselves open to the likes of yourself…

    Oh that’s right you’re worried about your legs! Me I have trouble with the old gout myself!

  • Anonymous

    [i]You can’t very well talk about people sticking to their principles while hiding behind anonymity and slagging off people who have the guts to go public thus leaving themselves open to the likes of yourself…[/i]

    Indeed he has the guts to go public, safe in the knowledge that he has the support of others that the rest of us in the community find somewhat intimidating. So you’ll have to excuse me while I, without the backing of a political party nor an affiliated armed wing behind me, highlight sanctimonious hypocrisy and downrights lies. If you want to talk about guts then how about standing for election before the community that one purports to represent?

    críochnaithe this time

  • Dixie

    Anonymous [who is on their last legs]

    Ah the old election thingy previously used by John Hume/Gerry Fitt when Gerry Adams was saying while hiding behind the Brownie thingy….I love this one…

    “The weakness of the IRA of that period was that instead of pursuing the war to it’s bitter end come what may, they allowed unscrupulous politicians and so called “Peacemakers” to gain the upper hand. The result was the betrayal of the Fight for Freedom followed by a vicious and brutal Civil War and of course partition. It is to be hoped that the lesson of that period will not be lost on today’s leaders. There is only one time to talk of peace and that is when the war has been won not while it is raging. The time to talk of peace is when the British have left Ireland, otherwise they will find some excuse to remain.”
    Brownie, Republican News , May 8, 1976.

    Always look on the bright side of life, Anon.

  • yaya

    I think that was is a very well put together piece but again we can see the messenger being attacked rather than the message.

    Let’s not get too hung up on ip addresses (which can be traced quite easily to a general location) and concentrate more on the facts at hand.

  • Anonymous

    Your use of that little excerpt is utterly bizarre. And you have the chutzpah to accuse me of not having a leg to stand on? Still, if you and your friends have the power to trace people using their IP addresses then you can rest soundly in your bed tonight knowing exactly who I am.

  • Dixie

    Anonymous [with an artifical leg]

    You talked about standing for elections and I remembered how it was…However who knows who anyone is, just as we want to know the truth.

    I was never in the IRA…I left the IRA in 1974…I didn’t know about the Mountain Climber initiative until after the Hunger Strikes….

  • Planning To Write

    This is one of the most persuasive cases yet made. I had long thought there was something that might absolve the Sinn Fein leadership of any wrongdoing. Not any longer. Their prize asset – the assertion that the British would not send an offical in to explain the offer – was a case clincher. No more. Rusty Nail should write a book on this. It is badly needed.

  • Willy Wonka

    Dixie, despite for all your past glories you come across as a right sanctimonious pr*ck on this site. Sort it out, there’s no need to be so defensive when people start picking on wee willie. Not everyone’s out to get you, you know

  • Dixie

    Willy Wonka

    Personally I couldn’t give a monkeys who’s out to get me nor could I give another monkeys what you or any of the other names you post under thinks.

  • Dave

    Not much rebuttal this time from Shinner posters – just a couple of low-rent trolls shooting the messenger and name-calling.

    Once the Shinners solicited a “Please me silent” letter from the relatives, that gave them the pretext they needed to close the debate – hence there are no ‘official’ SF spinners this time around.

    Meanwhile, of course, the case keeps on building.

  • Anonymous

    Dave, how do you know when Adams is lying? His lips are moving. It’s clear that he’s a pathological liar and it’s also blatantly obvious that he has not come clean about his real role in this tragic state of affairs.

    However, with respect you are entirely ignorant of life in Strabane. If you had any inkling of the situation in the town it would turn your stomach to hear a particular individual lauded as a prophet of truth and to watch him claim, on another forum, that he was able to access the IP addresses of individuals using this very site and subsequently ascertain their location.

    He has manipulated his role in this search for truth to his own advantage and now claims that any criticism which is directed at him are, by extension, a despicable attack upon the families of the ten dead men.

    Before you decide you sling a bit of mud in future, how about doing a little bit of research?

  • np

    Anon your problem with others on this site is woefully misplaced and you can hardly fault anyone for thinking you are smearing others in order to distract from the substance of the topic at hand as you have spent all your time here attacking someone not central to the issue and none of it on the topic itself. So you can hardly cry foul when others question your agenda – or see your contributions to this discusion in less than positive light.

    Before you start another stream of posts attempting to demonstrate that the person of your ire is central to the debate, he was not part of the events of 1981 under examination and therefore his role today in seeking the truth of things is peripheral and not worthy of the amount of time being devoted to him – unless of course, distraction is what is desired. Which of course you have achieved handily.

    In other words, in the context of this debate, no one really gives a flying fk about the person you seem fixated on. The only ones who mention him in the manner you do are those who prefer to hide their own misdeeds.

  • Prof Teapot

    “Given an IP address it’s usually possible to take a rough guess at where (geographically) it resides. A lookup on my IP address would allow someone to guess the name of the main road near where I live. That narrows it down to within a few hundred houses. Safe enough, given that it’s not that easy to guess.”

    What utter bollocks, why talk about things you clearly know nothing about ?

    All joe public can glean from an IP address is his *ISP’s* geographic location, not HIS. Secondly some ISP’s still use dynamic IP addresses (BT for example) so one day an IP could be in Belfast, and the Next day it could be Bradford. Thats why the “red card” system on this blog is useless.

    The police can go to your ISP and request IP logs (which DO Identify an Individual to an IP over a limited time frame).

    An even more stupid comment is

    “I.P tracing is not a great big secret intelligence tool…unlike the tools who lack the intelligence on how the magic computer works.
    Have to laugh as it sounds like bloody witchcraft.
    If hackers break into highly restricted computers, then without a doubt it would be “WEE BUNS” to pin point and I.P.”

    Anyone who wants to hide their tracks can make it *EXTREMELY* difficult to trace, it is quite easy for hackers to route traffic all over the world before hitting their target, using hijacked systems. And how wee buns would it be to go to say the Chinese or Russians to get logs (Which some ISP’s in these countries don’t reveal or even sometimes keep?). What if the initiation point is a stolen 3g or hacked wireless point ?.

    A hacker could sit outside your house and easily use *YOUR* internet connection and its gonna be your door kicked in at 5am a week later……”WEE BUNS” ?.

    Its not like all those Holywood films folks.

  • Low rent Dave

    ‘just a couple of low-rent trolls shooting the messenger and name-calling.’

    So says ‘Dave’ as he indulges in err…low-rent trolling and name-calling…lol

  • Prof Teapot

    “However, with respect you are entirely ignorant of life in Strabane. If you had any inkling of the situation in the town it would turn your stomach to hear a particular individual lauded as a prophet of truth and to watch him claim, on another forum,

    “that he was able to access the IP addresses of individuals using this very site and subsequently ascertain their location.”

    Im not too bothered about what this thread is about tbh, personally I believe the IRA let the Hunger Strikers die.

    “there seems to be someone scaremongering about what details can be found out posting on a public forum/blog.”

    the *ONLY* way this is possible is if slugger admin (taking they host their own server, which i take they do) release this information to a 3rd party, then if this 3rd party takes this information to the relevant (bloggers) ISP, who then reveal data personal to an individual (which they simply will not do). unless this person is well placed in the security forces this is not a trivial thing to do without getting noticed.

    Sounds like someone is trying to call someones bluff.

    PS I got the in dependent’s articles on MP’s expenses, but it only goes back a few years, does anyone know what the Rt Hon Bobby Sands food expenses were ? seriously ?

  • John O’Connell

    [Adams] scuttled the ICJP settlement, and later would have the Red Cross chased, and used the prisoners, who were not informed of the details of what he was doing, as cover to prolong the hunger strike to the election of Owen Carron.

    Top class, Rusty Nail. You must be very near a Spotlight or Insight programme, which would really set this place on fire. Good luck.

  • Dave

    “However, with respect you are entirely ignorant of life in Strabane.”

    Totally, since I only passed through it in darkness once.

    I’m not going to comment on a named individual – even innocuously – because I have no desire to become involved in any potential libel proceedings. I suspect, anyway, that the owner of the site will delete all of your comments for the same reason.

    Trolling is deliberately throwing a thread off-topic. That’s what you are doing by focusing on someone who has no relevance to the topic. And with due respect to the thread’s author, I’ll not be replying to you again.

  • empty threats

    [i]Trolling is deliberately throwing a thread off-topic. That’s what you are doing by focusing on someone who has no relevance to the topic.[/i]

    except that’s rubbish because the individual was responding to silly little vacuous claims, including one made at post 7 in page 1 of this thread, that the irsp somehow is able to trace the location of individuals using the ip addresses of contributors to slugger and politics.ie

    [i]I have no desire to become involved in any potential libel proceedings. I suspect, anyway, that the owner of the site will delete all of your comments for the same reason.[/i]

    what do you do when you want to sue for libel but no libelous comments have been made against you and you don’t accept the authority of british courts in northern ireland?

  • biggus dickus

    after what does the orange/gaa etc etc mean to you can admin start a thread on what the catholic church means to you, dont know where else to put this until I get admin rights.

    http://www.thisisderbyshire.co.uk/news/Steve-Ilona-s-love-conquered-paralysis-Catholic-Church/article-754708-detail/article.html

  • hodgie

    who cares about the truth of 1981 and deaths through starvation. let’s focus on ip addresses and willy:

    it ain’t going away no matter how hard you try!

  • cynic

    Nice attempt to spin the story away from what Rusty Nail wrote guys.

    Getting a bit too close?

  • very, very cynical

    Please do explain how someone with a very dark, tragic secret to hide could possibly think that, by questioning the sad little fantasies conjured up by the IRSP regarding their abilit to trace IP addresses on this very site, they could possibly hope to delay the inevitable i.e. the truth coming out and Adams held to account once and for all? I can’t wait to hear your explanation

    Anyone and everyone now seem to be wearing the cloak of immunity available for hire to all those questioning the seemingly dubious veracity of Adams’ account

    X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft Exchange V6.5 Content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html; charset=”iso-8859-1″ Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Date: Mon, 20 Jul 2009 01:54:33 +0100 Message-ID: X-MS-Has-Attach: X-MS-TNEF-Correlator: Thread-Index: AcoI1KUnmMpD3CK3SUuCPS3401PCcA==
    Please do explain how someone with a very dark, tragic secret to hide could possibly think that, by questioning the sad little fantasies conjured up by the IRSP regarding their abilit to trace IP addresses on this very site, they could possibly hope to delay the inevitable i.e. the truth coming out and Adams held to account once and for all? I can’t wait to hear your explanation

    Anyone and everyone now seem to be wearing the cloak of immunity available for hire to all those questioning the veracity of Adams’ account