“requesting information on the Order..”

Obviously it’s good news to hear that Sinn Féin president Gerry Adams has attempted to learn what the Orange Order’s actually traditions are by writing, some months ago, to Orange Grand Master Roberts Saulters requesting information on the Order – and it’s also good news that the Order has just met in the Republic of Ireland for the first time since partition. According to the BBC report, “Mr Saulters said he had replied, sending Mr Adams some literature on the traditions of the institution.” And that, “Mr Adams wrote back confirming he had received Mr Saulters correspondence.” But shouldn’t Mr Adams have informed himself of the Order’s traditions a long long time ago? Rather than spend so much time criticising from a position of apparent ignorance, that is..

, , , , , ,

  • It was Sammy Mc Nally what done it

    Pete,

    I think we can safely assume Grizzly is familiar with the fine work of the OO – after all he is the leader of the Nationalist community’s largest politcal party – a community on the receiving end of the sectarianism that characterises this the most the most popular of Unionist organisations.

    This may well be a only political gesture but something needs to be done to help draw the OO out of their sectarin bunker and acquaint them with some of the realities of the 21st Century and discourage them from their unhealthy and divisive infatuation with the 17th.

  • Dewi

    Come on Pete – that must be good musn’t it?

  • the future’s bright the future’s orange

    probably another meaningless political gesture but I guess it does send positive signals across the wider community so definitely welcomed.

  • Richard James

    Sammy,

    The great bearded one by his own admission knows little of the OO’s traditions beyond Nationalism’s Pavlovian MOPE.

    It’s disappointing that Saulters limited himself to sending a few leaflets instead of taking the opportunity to inform. Adams may not have actually been interested in what he had to say but it would have done the OO no end of good in PR terms.

    Sadly I don’t envision the OO getting out of the hole it has dug itself until Saulters, Bailie et al are gone.

  • Henry94

    Sinn Fein has effectively destroyed the Orange Order as a political force. The Order, the RUC and the Unionist Party were the three legged stool on which the sectarian state sat.

    All have been changed utterly by the peace process. It is a kindness to the Orange Order for nationalists to be open to finding a role for them other than the role that has been taken away from them.

    If an examination of their traditions helps to find something worthwhile for them to do then why not. This is the organisation which allowed a senior member to criticise Tony Blair for marrying a Catholic.

    They are lucky to find anybody who cares enough to ask the question.

  • dub

    That senior member being none other than Robert Saulters…

  • truth and justice

    Wae Martina Anderson not meant to be the Sinn Fein person that was meant to reach out to Unionism I have yet to see her make any effort. If Adams is serious about understanding then I believe the OO must call his bluff and play his game?

  • Mick Fealty

    Sammy,

    I would say you could be right. He told Stephen Sackur on BBC’s Hardtalk that he’d never heard of me either (without being egotistical about it, that’s something I sincerely doubt). You just never quite know what you’re getting with Gerry.

    Whether it was genuine inquiry or a signal that those undeclared hostilities that Henry indirectly refers to are coming to an end, it’s probably a good thing for those in wider society who’ve suffered from them.

  • runciter

    He told Stephen Sackur on BBC’s Hardtalk that he’d never heard of me either.

    The man has no shame.

  • USA

    Hyperlink Pete,
    Are you really so blinkered to think that Adams is only now educating himself on the Orange Order?
    Refering to Adams as having a “position of ignorance” concerning the order is another fine example of your pathetic little childish cheap shots that are prompted by your own political bias.
    Any examples of these types of exchanges and dialogue can serve a greater good in society, sniping from the sidelines from people like you offers nothing constructive. The tone of your posts on SF is consistantly negative, the world is not black and white Mr Bater, no matter how much you would like it to be.

  • Richard James

    “Sinn Fein has effectively destroyed the Orange Order as a political force. The Order, the RUC and the Unionist Party were the three legged stool on which the sectarian state sat.”

    Henry the Orange Order has never been an effective political force. For example it’s support failed to prevent the fail of Terrance O’Neill. Another good case would be it’s breaking of the link with the UUP only when it became clear it had become a clear political force. In fact Loyalists have traditionally claimed the Orange Order has been controlled by the UUP/British Establishment. The fact Nationalists regard the OO as controlling Unionism shows their paucity of understanding of both.

    “It is a kindness to the Orange Order for nationalists to be open to finding a role for them other than the role that has been taken away from them.”

    So Orange Order members should be grateful for the vilification as one dimensional bigots? Are the families of the victims of Tullyvallen to thank Sinn Fein, the party you support, for justifying the murder of their loved ones murder?

  • Richard James

    *become a spent political force

  • Cahal

    “The fact Nationalists regard the OO as controlling Unionism shows their paucity of understanding of both.”

    How many unionist MLAs are orangemen or members of the other charley chaplin fan clubs?

  • LURIG

    More grandstanding, media friendly, luvvy bullshit from Adams! “I wanted to hear & learn more so I wrote to them”. SIGH!!!!!” Such fawning crap and nonsense from a Sinn Fein leadership COMPLETELY detached from it’s base! If you want the truth about the Orange Order Gerry do what I did last year. Go and stand in Royal Avenue and you will find out EVERYTHING you EVER wanted to know about the Orange Order. Watch from Carlise Circus as the Red Hand Luke types mingle and chat merrily with the Grand Masters and Unionist politicians. Close your eyes, throw an empty beer can and you will more than likely hit a Loyalist paramilitary killer. Listen to the lovely UVF/UDA bands belt out the Sash as they march behind Lodges named after Loyalist butchers while the pissed families and kids look on and cheer! Lovely……..it isn’t!

  • USA

    How dare Gerry Adams pretend he does not know you?
    You are the best dancer Ireland has produced in years.
    Here’s to you Mick Flately.

    PS. Will you be wearing those tight pants in your next show….lovely.

  • steve

    if you want to know where your enemies weaknesses are, the easiest way to find out is simply ask them for a guided tour

    code word order

  • abucs

    I view Gerry’s request as wanting to draw a line in the sand. With the old Northern Ireland a thing of the past, the question for many groups now is – where to from here ?
    And how do we relate with other groups in order to come together ?

    With the political environment completely changed to where it was 40 years ago, how do each of the groups in northern Ireland now define themselves in this new journey.

  • Mick Fealty

    Thanks for the recognition USA, but my tight pant wearing days are long over… 🙂

  • Richard James

    “How many unionist MLAs are orangemen or members of the other charley chaplin fan clubs?”

    TBH I haven’t conducted a head count; but if you are trying to imply being a member of the OO is a prerequisite for any aspiring Unionist politician I would suggest you take a look at the careers of Ian Paisley and Peter Robinson.

  • It was Sammy Mc Nally what done it

    Richard James

    “TBH I haven’t conducted a head count; but if you are trying to imply being a member of the OO is a prerequisite for any aspiring Unionist politician I would suggest you take a look at the careers of Ian Paisley and Peter Robinson. ”

    If you are trying to imply being that Ian Paisley and Peter Robinson are not memebers of the OO and didnt need to be in order to be successful unionist politicians – then fair enough – but in the case of these 2 individuals, they were able via their high public profile, to prove their their bigotry in other ways.

  • hagakensei

    Ah Hagakure. A quote for every occassion:

    To ask when you already know is politeness. To ask when you don’t know is the rule

  • Richard James

    Sammy,

    As you are someone who doesn’t regard the IRA’s murder campaign against Protestants as being criminal you are in no position to denounce others as bigots. Going the odd march and saying nasty things about the Pope pales in significance to what and who you support.

    Although at least you seem capable of recognising that the Orange Order doesn’t control Unionism.

  • Steve

    Richard James

    As has been alternatively shouted and then denied by onionists the PIRA campaign was not a murder campaign against protestants…….they killed everybody