Question time

Quick bit of blatant plagiarism from Mark Devenport’s blog, but I liked “Stormont spy’s” list of questions:

1. Will Sinn Fein fail to put forward McGuiness?
2. If it does happen will Robinson and McGuiness shakes hands?
3. Is this being done to bring Gerry Adams back to the spotlight?
4. What happens to MLA’s pay? Will it be suspended of the Assembly is dissolved?
5. Does the Executive members give up their departments to direct rule ministers?
6. What can Gordon Brown do?
7. Does the Civil Service go into “purdah”?
And finally to leave you with this… Who has more to lose? McGuiness or Robinson? My pension is on Robinson. Firstly he will lose seats to Sir Reg. Secondly he will lose seats to Jim Bowen (Allister). What happens then? What if Sinn Fein is the largest party? Will Robinson sit down in Government as a deputy?

What I think:

1: Probably, but I remain to be convinced that they’ll push it to an election.
2: Pretty unlikely, it’d be madness on Robinson’s part.
3: Not a bad call.
4: The same thing will happen as in normal election period circumstances – but only if SF refuse to nominate after the 7 day period I think.
5: I’m pretty sure not. I know that in Westminster during an election there are no MPs, but there are ministers. I assume it’s the same here.
6: Threaten to legislate over the DUP’s heads. The 42 day detention vote is looking more and more safe for him, so he will be more disposed to ignore the DUP.
7: No idea.
8: I couldn’t possibly comment.

  • Shore Road Resident

    Isn’t it the largest party of the largest designation that gets the first minister post, under St Andrews? Therefore, isn’t there really very little chance of a SF minister?

    Q3 throws up some interesting motivations though…

  • Michael Shilliday

    No, the DUP had that changed in order to blackmail the electorate into voting for them.

    http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2006/ukpga_20060053_en_3#pt2-pb2-l1g8

    (6) If at any time the party which is the largest political party of the largest political designation is not the largest political party—

    (a) any nomination to be made at that time under section 16A(4) or 16B(4) shall instead be made by the nominating officer of the largest political party; and

    (b) any nomination to be made at that time under section 16A(5) or 16B(5) shall instead be made by the nominating officer of the largest political party of the largest political designation.

    Ie the largest single party gets First Minister regardless of the designation.

  • DC

    Go on Alliance… 🙂

  • The DUP will lose seats to TUV first and foremost (potentially up to 6 or so). If, and it’s a big if, Sir Reg makes any gains then that will be do to STV, not support for his ‘party’.

  • Dave

    If Sinn Fein did become the largest party in NI after an election, then gaining the right to office of FM would be a meaningless victory, since it is highly unlikely that Peter Robinson would accept the office of DFM in the current acrimonious political environment. Ergo, devolved administration would fail, with Plan B being no more radical than restoration of direct rule from Westminster. The other option is reform of the system of mandatory coalition – something that Peter Robinson is in favour of. Success – with this twist of fate – is failure for Sinn Fein.

  • ZoonPol

    The ironic thing is that we know now that the DUP put power before principle so it would be akin to SF cutting off its nose to spite its face – and saving the DUP’s face as well.
    Let’s forget about wheather the St Andrew’s Agreement is a new deal or the GFA for slow learners and ask the real question:
    Do we need 2 pro-agreement unionist parties? What really divides them apart from personalities?

  • It was Sammy Mc Nally what done it

    Robbo makes a statement, Marty signs the book, P and J before 2009, Ireland to beat the All Blacks on Saturday – I’m off to my very good friend Paddy Power for odds on an accumulator.

  • Alternatively, it’s just the kids rolling on the Supermarket floor, screaming and yelling, because they haven’t had enough attention in the last while.

    Which is why everyone outside the select circle of “friends” believes this is all sound and fury signifying precisely … nothing. By the end of the week the tizz will be over.

    And, no: this time there’ll be no sweeties at the check-out.

  • Driftwood

    Competition time.
    Does anyone know how many unionist parties there have been in the last 40 years? Basically any party or political group with the word “unionist” in the name.
    I would be impressed if anyone could name them all.

  • Dewi

    All gotta promise not to google mind

    1) DUP
    2) UUP
    3) UKUP
    4) PUP
    5) United Ulster Unionist Party
    6) Vanguard summat Unionist Party
    7) Was there a NI Labour Unionist Party?
    9) Popular Front for the Liberation of Judea Unionist Party
    10) TUV

    Is that it?

  • observer

    All gotta promise not to google mind

    1) DUP
    2) UUP
    3) UKUP
    4) PUP
    5) United Ulster Unionist Party
    6) Vanguard summat Unionist Party
    7) Was there a NI Labour Unionist Party?
    9) Popular Front for the Liberation of Judea Unionist Party
    10) TUV

    Is that it?

    Posted by Dewi on Jun 04, 2008 @ 03:03 PM

    NIUP

    UUUC

    Popular Unionists Party

  • Dessertspoon

    “9) Popular Front for the Liberation of Judea Unionist Party”
    SPLITTERS!!

  • Spanishroomscrumpy

    All fine and well but what happened to the Raytheon post that was right above this story 45 mins ago?

  • Shore Road Resident

    Somebody crapped on it then threw it out the window.

  • Dewi

    Popular Unionist Party – Kilfedder right?
    And that UUUC was when they called all the by-elections?
    Can’t remember NIUP though.

  • Dewi, observer,

    1) DUP
    2) UUP
    3) UKUP
    4) PUP
    5) United Ulster Unionist Party
    6) Vanguard summat Unionist Party
    7) Was there a NI Labour Unionist Party?
    9) Popular Front for the Liberation of Judea Unionist Party
    10) TUV

    11) NIUP
    12) UUUC

    And;

    UDP
    Independent DUP
    UUAP
    WRUC

    I know the word ‘unionist is not in their title, but ‘ulster’ is a good proxy;

    UCDP
    UIM
    UIV
    UKIP
    Ulster Party
    Ulster Third Way
    UPRG

    And lets not forget …. The Alliance Party 😉

  • You’ve all forgotten the Unionist Party of Northern Ireland (party leader Brian Faulkner).

    And lets not forget …. The Alliance Party 😉

    Hey horseman, I hear the BBC are looking for a replacement for Folks on the Hill that’s actually funny, want to apply?

  • Dewi

    Horseman – if u r changing the rules then also Consevative Party….

  • Dewi,

    if u r changing the rules then also Consevative Party….

    That mightn’t actually be a rule-change. Weren’t they (maybe still are?) the ‘Conservative and Unionist Party’?

  • Or, as you might know it: the Plaid Geidwadol Cymru

    😉

  • Dewi

    WRUC???

  • Women Raising Unionist Concerns (WRUC) formed September 2005 in the aftermath of the Whiterock parade and subsequent rioting. I don’t think they are a party as such, more a ginger group. They’ve disappeared completely, of course, as do 99% of these type of groups within a few months.

    The original challenge said ‘parties or political groups’ so I reckoned this one counted.

  • Dewi

    Weren’t they (maybe still are?) the ‘Conservative and Unionist Party’?

    Good point – you get a full mark. (Plaid Geidwadol ac Unoliaethol Cymru in that case!!!)

  • Dewi

    Thank you. Missed the political groups thing in which case yon can add:

    Orange Order
    Indie Orange Order
    That Royal preceptory Black thingie
    All the alphabet soup thingies.

    Driftwood – it’s your fault – needed a better definition when we started !!!

  • There have also been a few parties or groups with the key-word ‘loyalist’ in their title, but without breaking the rules and googling I cannot remember them.

    There was also (long, long ago … ) a Unionist Liberal Party. Seems like an oxymoron now!

  • RSR

    Would be an interesting situation, as Michael mentioned, if Robinson ended up having to be deputy to McGuinness.

    It’s a distinct possibility if an election occured, the DUP may have nine seats more than SF at the minute, but given the evolution of the TUV and the reprecussions the Dromore bi-elecion have had, the DUP could easily find themselves in second place. Let’s face it, SF are hardly likely to drop too many seats, in fact i would say they might gain some, the likes of West Belfast springs to mind.

    Time will tell I suspose, an interesting few days lie ahead.

  • Dewi

    “Let’s face it, SF are hardly likely to drop too many seats, in fact i would say they might gain some, the likes of West Belfast springs to mind”

    Another seat in West Belfast – now that would be a pshephological achievment……

  • Surely, Dewi @ 03:58 PM, any political group that formally recognises partition and accepts the link with GB is technically “unionist”?

    That allows in the Tories (with or without the “and Unionist” appellation).

    It also brings in NILP and even the “Belfast Communist Group” of the 1930s, which sailed a different tack to the CPI in Dublin — the split into a separate CPNI came after the CPI suspended itself in 1941. If we really want to mock (and in this case, surely, we should), H.C. Midgley moved seamlessly from being an “Independent Labour” candidate in 1921 to NILP and flirting with Stalinism (as Chairman of the Belfast United Front in 1933), then, via his own “Commonwealth Labour Party” (formed specifically to accept partition) so that in 1943 he was into Brooke’s “reconstructed” Unionist Government. By 1957, the People’s Harry was telling the folks of Portadown what they wanted to hear: “All the minority are traitors and always have been traitors to the government of Northern Ireland”.

    The alphabet-soup of various factions of Unionism goes with a whole cess-pit of other shifting allegiances.

  • Dewi

    Malcolm – fasinating – I reckon if the same exercise was conducted with “Labour” or “Socialist” over the last century you’d almost get as many groupings !!!

  • Driftwood

    Dame James Kilfedder’s UPUP (Ulster Popular Unionist Party). Didn’t Cedric call himself the NIUP? Yes Faulkner as UPNI. There was also the Official Unionist Party under Gentleman Jim Molyneaux.
    It would be easier to just add numbers eery splt eg Unionist Party 65 or something, or maybe New Unionist, and doesn’t anyone remember a certain Protestant Unionist Party in days of yore!
    Could someone sum up with what we have so far and we can agree a definitive list, including 1 man bands.

  • Dewi

    Driftwood – absolute clarity on rules please ! (Word “Unionist compulsory or not ??)

  • Dewi

    So far:
    1) DUP
    2) UUP
    3) UKUP
    4) PUP
    5) United Ulster Unionist Party
    6) Vanguard summat Unionist Party
    7) Was there a NI Labour Unionist Party?
    9) Popular Front for the Liberation of Judea Unionist Party
    10) TUV
    11) NIUP
    12) UUUC
    13 UDP
    14) Independent DUP
    15) UUAP
    16) WRUC (If acceptable under your scientific criteria)
    17) UPUP
    18) NIUP

    Have they have to have fought elections to count ?

  • Dewi

    19) Unionist Party of Northern Ireland
    20) Conservative and Unionist Party

  • Driftwood

    Missed, or typo meant Faulkner’s UPNI at No.11.
    Did the Protestant Unionist Party morph in to the DUP? and presumably the *Official* Unionist Party (OUP then known) became the UUP. Yes the word Unionist has to be there I think. Pretty sure we havent exhausted all titles yet though.

  • Dewi

    21) UPNI
    22) OUP
    23) Protestant Unionist Party

    Sorry – I think there was an NIUP….as well as UPNI….not sure though.

  • I admit to being impressed. I thought such trivia was my personal prerogative.

    As we disappear further into the shrubbery, can I be assured that the name of the “Ulster Unionist Council” survived/was briefly revived? This then, wisely, added “United” in front of the most unfortunate phonetic abbreviation since the British Fascists (who, of course, inserted “Union of..”). I’m pretty sure the BFs had the odd shirt or two in NI, and would qualify as the BUF were it not for the forty-year rule.

    Hey! that reminds me that Mosley (Dad, not petrol-head son of the curious sexual predilections) retreated to somewhere in Ireland after 1951. Any sightings in “Unionist” circles?

  • I thought such trivia was my personal prerogative.

    Nooooooo …….

    Given the climate (both sorts), can you wonder that there are so many anoraks (both sorts) in (northern) Ireland?

  • Turgon

    Can I propose a religious version of this game:

    Name the different Protestant dominations in Northern Ireland. My rules are that only churches with two or more congregations count, so for example I will not really accept Whitewell.

  • Driftwood

    Does anyoneknow if Bill Craig is still alive?

    I think Vanguard Unionist was deffo a party, IIRC, they even had their own Vanguard flag. I wonder if Lord Trimble has one in the attic?
    And I seem to remember someone in the Republic standing as some sort of Unionist at 1 time.
    Just 1 more thing, was Cedric ever in Bob’s UK Unionists?

  • Too easy, Turgon, since the Census provides a handy Excel table of the top hundred or so.

  • Does anyoneknow if Bill Craig is still alive?

    He is, but we shouldn’t have long to wait.

    He has not been in the public eye since 1982, and continues to reside in Bangor, County Down.” So sayeth Wikipedia.

  • Driftwood

    Turgon, is Whitewell not Church of God? Or Hizbollah in Arabic.

    I think Pastor Mcconnell has several ‘metropolitan tabernacles’on the go. But it may be on a franchise basis like KFC.

    What denomination was Pastor Jack Glass? Now there was a true believer!

  • Driftwood,

    And I seem to remember someone in the Republic standing as some sort of Unionist at 1 time.

    There would have been lots, certainly in earler days. I think even Kilfedder or someone was born in County Leitrim. But I think you’re thinking about Conor Cruise O’Brien, who was an active member of the UKUP until he was ‘retired’ for telling the truth – i.e. that unionists would be better off starting to negotiate with Dublin now, rather than waiting too long and seeing their numbers dwindle.

  • I think there was an NIUP….as well as UPNI

    Yes, there was. Two very different beasts.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UPNI

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northern_Ireland_Unionist_Party

    I loved the NIUP’s stange, crypto-fascist, clenched fist logo.

  • Driftwood,

    Or did you mean someone standing in the republic as a unionist? I don’t know if anyone has done that since partition, though several known unionists do stand. David Brewster used to be very interested in some small group in County Donegal who (he felt) represented the ‘oppressed Prods’ of that bailywick.

    And, of course, there is the ambivalent Senator Ross, rrepresenting TCD.

  • graduate

    Think you’re also forgeting the UUCP- United Unionist Coalition Party. Currently has a fistful of members in Ballymena, a few in Limavady (disaffected DUP cllr called Leslie Cubitt- yes, brother to Lyle in Ballymena) and the odd (very odd!) one or two elsewhere.
    On churches you’ve got me,I’m just a humble Jedi Knight (on the last census anyway)

  • Driftwood

    So Cedric and co split from the UKUP? Fell out with Bob over a “principle”. Anyone see a pattern here?
    NIUP wiki lists them as right wing, LOL!

    Interesting on the UPNI wiki, that Vanguard was the Vanguard Progressive Unionist Party,or VPUP.
    Another amend to the list Dewi.

    Horseman, I’m sure someone stood for the Dail on a Unionist ticket, but can’t be sure.

  • Driftwood

    From the UPNI wiki-

    *In 1981 the party admitted the weakness of its own position during the local government election campaign admitting that power sharing on the 1973 model was no longer a viable option.*

    So it goes….

  • Jonathan McCullough

    I think the Protestant Unionist Party were the precursor to the DUP although as I recall the name was also used by Cllr George Seawright after his expulsion from the DUP. His wife stood for the same party after his murder.
    Wasn’t there also a Volunteer Political Party, which although not having Unionist in the title was the political wing of the UVF and certainly a unionist party. Didn’t win any seats but I think it was Ken Gibson, a former UVF leader, who stood for them unsuccesfully in elections.
    “Vanguard summat Unionist Party “, I think was correctly called Vanguard Unionist Progressive Party.

  • PaddyReilly

    Has there never been a Raving Looney Unionist Party?

  • Driftwood

    For accuracy, is not/was not the DUP the UDUP?

    By my reckoning we have had 24 or 25 Unionist parties,with the word unionist in the name, and probably 6 or 7 others which didn’t qualify because of a derivative word in their title. That’s quare goin’.

  • Has there never been a Raving Looney Unionist Party?

    Of course. See the lists above! They cunningly disguised their names though.

  • Driftwood,

    Horseman, I’m sure someone stood for the Dail on a Unionist ticket, but can’t be sure.

    In 1997 Jim Devenney stood in the Dail election in Donegal North-West as an independent. He was widely seen as a crypto-unionist, however, for reasons of his various (Orange?) connections. He came bottom of the poll with 1657 votes, and his votes mostly transferred to Paddy Harte of Fine Gael, which is in most cases the preferred party of southern Protestants.

    Devenney is probably similar to whoever it is you are thinking about. I’m not aware of anyone in recent decades (and certainly during 1969-1998) who would actually have put a ‘unionist’ tag on themselves south of the border. That would have made them electorally untouchable (in the Indian sense).

  • Driftwood

    A pity Devenney didn’t get 33 more votes!

    I,m sure some one in Dublin put themselves forward, but i’m not sure how serious they were.

  • Do you remember when? Because all the results are available on the web (http://electionsireland.org/index.cfm)

  • The problem, Driftwood, is that if someone stands as an independent their policies do not get recorded in the results. Since only registered parties are listed, and no unionist party ever has registered (in modern times) in the south, your possible ‘unionist’ candidate will be untraceable amongst the independents.

  • Concerning the big list of unionist parties and groups, has anyone yet mentioned the Ulster Clubs?

  • Dewi

    Sammy et al – you are all cheating now. No Wiki and no google until Driftwood decides.

  • But the Unionists could never unite.

    No, let’s not go down that road.

    This has been a day which has crossed into the surreal. Let me first count the ways.

    There was the booze-up on the London Underground which was anthropologically misunderstood.

    Then, the best bit of writing I found in the public prints was Richard Morrison, in the Times, celebrating a sewage pumping station:

    If you ever go to Crossness (and I really think you should) try to forget the faint but unmistakable pong of … well, you know what. And the fact that, by its very nature, the building is located next to the accumulated product of what eight million Londoners ate last week. No, just feast your eyes on the ornate decorations that Bazalgette bestowed on the place. Here are intricate cast-iron screens, floridly coloured arcades of columns, Romanesque mosaics and arches – and, the crowning glory, a spectacular octagonal atrium at the building’s heart.

    I now hear Young-Earth-shocking news of bdelloid rotifers:

    small transparent animals that live in damp places such as puddles, or patches of moss. Among evolutionists, these animals have something of a cult following, because they have a lifestyle that is not supposed to exist. As far as anyone can tell, the bdelloid rotifers are ancient asexuals: they appear to have been living entirely without sex for more than 85 million years. And each time we learn more details of their lifestyle, the wackier it becomes.

    And then yous lot are at it like ferrets, especially Horseman @ 07:01 PM, whose question really got me going [Damn good blog, Horseman: strongly recommended — “ambivalent Senator Ross”, indeed].

    May I draw attention to one unionist (in all but name) who sat in Dáil Éireann for Fine Gael between 1951-73? Sir Anthony Esmonde was TD for Wexford: he never disguised his “west British” background, accent and attitudes. In our folly, we lefty “progressives” mocked him for it. He inherited his baronetcy from his elder brother, Sir John (a middle brother was killed, aged 19, in WW1: a half-brother, Eugene, was awarded a posthumous VC for a futile torpedo-bomber attack on the Scharnhorst).

    Sir Anthony’s eldest brother, Sir John Esmonde, was dead before I became politically aware. He was elected MP for (I believe) North Tipperary in 1915 (while serving as an engineer officer with the Leinsters in France). He was FG TD for Wexford for the 9th Dáil and 10th Dáil. Perhaps here, or elsewhere, somebody can remind me of any other active MP-cum-TD. In the curious politics of 1948, when the cumbersome coalition came to power, the egregious Seán MacBride proposed John Esmonde as a compromise Taoiseach, on the ground that he had no baggage from the Civil War.

    Autres temps, autres moeurs.

  • Well, Horseman @ 08:04 PM, Jim Devenney was High Lama of the Donegal Ulster-Scots the last I heard. That may not be a declaration of Unionist affiliation, but “if it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck …’

  • Dewi

    Fascinating Malcolm but please try and focus on the quiz mun !

  • Driftwood

    I’m afraid I’ll have to disqualify independents. But leave in Independent DUP..I Know, I know, but a line has to be drawn somwhere.
    However, it’s early days. What are the people who leave the TUV when Jim Allister “sells out” going to call themselves?
    Can we come forward with possible titles forthwith?
    The winner gets a deposit on the next MEP election. I am ruling out ‘Independent TUV’immediately so as not to complicate.

  • Dewi

    Driftwood:

    1) Have they had to stand for election to Westminster?
    2) If it’s obvious people have?
    i) googled or
    ii) been on steroids

    Are they disqualified ? – (And what’s the appeal procedure !!!)

  • I’m just a humble Jedi Knight (on the last census anyway)

    Yes, graduate, but are you Catholic Jedi Knight or a Protestant Jedi Knight?

    I know, too obvious, but it had to be done!

    Wasn’t there also a Volunteer Political Party, which although not having Unionist in the title was the political wing of the UVF and certainly a unionist party.

    As I’m not allowed to use Nicholas Whyte’s site presumably, I think they were the UVF-linked candidates who stood in West Belfast in the 1973 Assembly elections.

    No Wiki and no google until Driftwood decides.

    Dewi, I’m offended in your lack of faith in my über-geekness! I was well aware of both parties, just providing links for those struggling with the difference between them (small difference in names, big difference in ideology). And I love looking at that clenched fist with the pointing finger! Vorvärts Kameraden!

    Didn’t a Unionist candidate (listed as Non Party on the returns) stand in Sligo-Leitrim sometime in the 1980s or early 1990s and get a derisory sub-100 vote?

  • Driftwood

    All appeals to John O Connell. It’s only fair the SDLP adjudicate on this. Shit, Wiki and google all you like, but I need a definitive answer on number of ‘pure’ Unionist parties (any election) by 11am tomorrow.
    Tie breaker is the name for TUV breakaways when Jim Allister declares a policy on something.
    Good Night y’all

  • Dewi

    “Shit, Wiki and google all you like”
    But what about steroids ? – Nos Da !

  • Dewi

    Pro – Assembly Ulster Unionist
    United Ulster Unionist party
    United Unionist Assembly Party

    From “History of British Political Parties” Boothroyd…read that Malcolm?

  • Sammy Morse,

    Didn’t a Unionist candidate (listed as Non Party on the returns) stand in Sligo-Leitrim sometime in the 1980s or early 1990s and get a derisory sub-100 vote?

    I’ve looked through the results from 1977 to 2007, and there is no sign of one at all. The few independents that stood in Sligo-Leitrim are usually known crackpots, or the perennial Stalinist, Declan Bree!

    A guy called John McCrea stood in 2002, and although he shares the same name as a leading Orange Order person, he is definitely not the same person. Sligo’s John McCrea is still there, writing cranky letters to the local papers, and doesn’t appear to be a unionist at all.

    I voted in Sligo-Leitrim in the 1980’s, and I have no recollection of any unionist candidates – and they would not have gone unnoticed!

  • Dewi @ 08:20 AM:

    I’ve seen David Boothroyd’s book (either it passed through the house in the clutches of a daughter doing Politics as her subsidiary subject, or I leafed it through in a bookshop). I think it’s properly titled The Politico’s Guide to the History of British Political Parties, which implies that I saw it in Politico’s, before the bookshop proper closed down. I remember it as the equivalent of an Ian Allan trainspotter’s guide. If it lists these groups here, that’s reliable info.

    Without scrolling through all the previous pages, has anyone tagged the “Union Group”? I know they have/had a webpage (all poetry and JFK), but no contact details.

    At risk of Dewi never being nice to me ever again, can I mention another southern Unionist of curious interest?

    St John Brodrick (MP in Surrey, but with Irish estates) was the leader of the Irish Unionists, which formalised as the Irish Unionist Alliance (not to be confused with the Ulster Unionists, who had their own agenda long before partition came up). He had a long history of service to the Tory Party, including being Secretary for War during the South African campaign.

    After the Treaty he was appointed to the Seanad (as the newly-ennobled Earl of Midleton), along with a couple of other Tories, the Earl of Dunraven and Horace Plunkett. Zach from Denver, CO, who posts here as “yourcousin”, will appreciate the link to Dunraven: it proves all his worst fears about the British upper class. Dunraven snaffled Estes Park (the Rocky Mountains NP today) as a personal hunting estate.

    What makes Brodrick a passing curiosity for me is his relation by marriage to the von Trapps (of The Sound of Music infamy). Brodrick’s sister married Whitehead, the inventor of the torpedo (and so arguably the most significant strategist in 20th century naval warfare). Their grand-daughter (and Whitehead’s heiress — therefore the basis for the von Trapp wealth) was the first Baroness von Trapp. I think von Trapp met Agathe Whitehead when she launched his first submarine command. The eldest von Trapp daughter was named Agathe for her Whitehead mother.

  • Driftwood

    I fear I may be responsible for initially moving us off thread, but into possibly more interesting territory.
    Dewi, any chance of a latest draft of the list?

  • Dewi

    I get all the dirty jobs……I’m not enirely sure (hmmm) that there is no duplications and do the WRUC count ?

    Anyway – there you go.

    1)DUP
    2) UUP
    3) UKUP
    4) PUP
    5) United Ulster Unionist Party
    6) Vanguard Progressive Unionist Party
    7) Labour Unionist Party?
    9) Popular Front for the Liberation of Judea Unionist Party
    10) TUV
    11) NIUP
    12) United Ulster Unionist Council
    13 UDP
    14) Independent DUP
    15) UUAP
    16) WRUC (If acceptable under your scientific criteria)
    17) UPUP
    18) Unionist Party of Northern Ireland
    19) Conservative and Unionist Party
    20) UPNI
    21) OUP
    22) Protestant Unionist Party
    23) United Unionist Coalition Party
    24) Protestant Unionist Party
    25) Ulster Clubs
    26) Pro – Assembly Ulster Unionist
    27) United Ulster Unionist party
    28) United Unionist Assembly Party

    When they had all those by-elections they got people to stand for the Agreement as Nationalists only stood in potential gains. What was that party called?

  • Dewi

    Another question:

    If Mr Robinson suceeds today what will the FM and the DFM have in common?

  • Driftwood

    Didn’t they all change their names to Peter Barry? or whoever the Republic’s foreign minister was at the time. Halcyon Days!

  • Dewi,

    When they had all those by-elections they got people to stand for the Agreement as Nationalists only stood in potential gains. What was that party called?

    You mean all the multiple ‘Peter Barry’s’? (aka Wesley Robert Williamson)

    I think he/they stood under a ‘For the Anglo-Irish Agreement’ banner.

  • Dewi

    The Continuity Traditional Unionist Voice?

  • ZoonPol

    Did they both do auditions for the series Allo Allo with their berets on?

  • Dewi

    I might actually be wrong on this.

    Convictions in both juristictions?

    But on reflection has the DFM ever been convicted of anything in the North?

  • But on reflection has the DFM ever been convicted of anything in the North?

    Nor has the proto-FM, IIRC.

    Perhaps that’s it. They both have ‘records’ in the south, but not in the north.

  • Dewi

    Yes he was convicted for obstruction on a bridge – I’ll look it up.

  • Dewi

    “Robinson and his DUP buddie Ruth Patterson were both found guilty of obstructing the Albertbridge Road in September 2002.”

    That’s from an old Elblogador blog.

  • “Robinson and his DUP buddie Ruth Patterson were both found guilty of obstructing the Albertbridge Road in September 2002.”

    Curiously enough, it is entirely absent from his bio on wikipedia, which deals with Clontibret in some detail.

    But maybe El Blogador mixed him up with someone else?

  • It seems I misjudged El Blogador. The BBC coverd that as well:

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/northern_ireland/3373535.stm

    The deputy leader of the Democratic Unionist Party, Peter Robinson, has been found guilty of obstructing a public road while he was the Stormont minister responsible for roads.

    And this twit will be FM in a few hours ….