“do their best to maintain a sense of law and order in their own communities..”

On Channel 4 News tonight Carl Dinnen reported from here on how, ten years after the 1998 Agreement, “the paramilitaries are still operating in Northern Ireland and many are still holding onto their guns.” He starts with the murder of Paul Quinn, and talks to Assistant Chief Constable Peter Sheridan about that and other republican paramilitaries’ activity. But perhaps the most interesting point comes when he interviews Jackie McDonald – described in the report as the “UDA’s leading brigadier” – about policing and “the people’s guns”. You can watch the video here. [direct link] And here are the relevant quotes.

Carl Dinnen: “What is the point, what is the need for the UDA?”
Jackie McDonald: “Some people.. while the paramilitaries themselves would see that the war is over, the war is over with Sinn Féin, IRA. But there is dissident republicans there. There is the threat from criminal gangs who will exploit the situation, as it happens in Manchester, Liverpool, areas like that. We’ve seen it all in the mainland. That is all going to happen here within the next year or two. There’s going to be dead bodies in the streets here and it’s going to be over territory, it’s going to be over drugs and who owes money to who. And loyalist paramilitaries are going to be loyal to the people who supported them for years and do their best to maintain a sense of law and order in their own communities.”

Well he did want to talk to Hugh Orde about policing.. and he may have seen something similar elsewhere..

, , , , ,

  • Gum

    [i]There is the threat from criminal gangs who will exploit the situation, as it happens in Manchester, Liverpool, areas like that.[/i]

    Is he having a laugh? He’s the biggest godfather in Belfast.

  • “…ten years after the 1998 Agreement, “the paramilitaries are still operating in Northern Ireland and many are still holding onto their guns.”

    I’m shocked – what next? Will we hear that some of the paramilitary leaders are in government whilst others are golfing companions of the President of the Irish Republic?

    Channel 4 – yesterdays new today.

  • aquifer

    “Manchester, Liverpool, areas like that” all have drugs gangs and possibly guns, but the guns were not bought to shoot or threaten customers first off.

    It may not matter very much what any one gang member says, the money and guns have their own dynamic. The danger for us is when they pretend this has anything to do with politics. We have had too much of the politics of the last five eejits with a pistol.

    “do their best to maintain a sense of law and order in their own communities..” Yeah right.

  • Belfast Gonzo

    David

    It is yesterday’s news to us, but I really doubt if many GB readers are aware of this!

    Wonder if Fox News are doing anything on this?

    ;oP

  • Dewi

    Understand all comments but Limerick in a real state – need subs for link but suspect murder rate right up there with Belfast.

  • Gonzo,

    If they did at least it would be fair and balanced 😉

  • majordolittle

    We should only be bothered with crime here in Belfast, Manchester, Londonderry, Glasgow etc Dewi, why worry about Bogota, Limerick, Johannesburg or other foreign cities?

  • joeCanuck

    Brigadier or Brigandier?

  • dewi

    “We should only be bothered with crime here in Belfast, Manchester, Londonderry, Glasgow etc Dewi, why worry about Bogota, Limerick, Johannesburg or other foreign cities? ”

    Majordolittle

    I dunno much about it but drug wars don’t really respect boundaries – and Limerick a bit like Palermo the last few years – and it’s fairly close to you.

  • majordolittle

    It’s a long way from here to Tipperary.

    It’s a long way from Bangor to Limerick, or Palermo.

    There are no drugs problems in Northern Ireland as far as i know. The odd housewife with a valium or codeine addiction. Easily dealt with through Gp’s.
    Some people drinking more Guinness than is healthy maybe. But nothing to get worried about. Noone is going to shoot people over it. Can’t see any drug problems in County Down. Too civilised.

  • moochin Photoman

    Pop
    Whats that sound?
    Oh aye majordolittles head being extracted from his rectum as the slow realisation dawns on him that actually there is a drug problem here.
    When you have 10, 11 and 12 year old able to describe and make their own bongs. I’d say that’s a problem.
    It might not be affecting you in your part of civilised Co Down, but i’d hazard a guess that if you went to say….Downpatrick and had a bit of a dander around it wouldn’t take you too long to find out the reality.

  • TAFKABO

    There are no drugs problems in Northern Ireland as far as i know.

    Let’s break that statement down a little and see if we can get to the bottom of it.

    There are no drugs problems in Northern Ireland

    Hmmm, whatever are we to make of such a comment?

    as far as i know.

    Ah, finally, I think I see where the probllem lies…

  • New Yorker

    This report is additional evidence of the failure of the ‘peace process’. Where is the peace when paramilitaries rule, murder, intimidate? Ten years on and all there is to show are areas controlled by organized gangs and a make-believe local Assembly, a failed experiment. Many around the world hoped for a better result than a young man beaten to death, no one charged and a possible ‘official’ fudge in the near future. You had your chance and you blew it.

  • Muad’Dib

    There is a very real drug problem in this country and living in pulling a Comical Ali in the form of “there are no druggies here” won’t fix that. Go to any of dozens of night clubs in Belfast City Centre and you will be offered drugs. In some cases rather forcefully

    I wonder how Jackie McDonald was able to keep a straight face while claiming that his illegal and unacceptable organisation was protecting communities from drug dealers. Does he forget Tigers Bay so quickly? I said it before and I’ll say it again every country has it’s gangsters, it’s criminals, it’s scum. The problem is the ones in this place try and excuse themselves by saying they’re doing it for Ulster or Ireland.

  • majordolittle

    I drive through Downpatrick quite often, on my way to the Mournes. It looks a crap town to live in, but nothing particularly sinister. What drugs are we talking about? I see no evidence of any drug problems anywhere I go. It’s a myth.

  • Prince Eoghan

    >>And loyalist paramilitaries are going to be loyal to the people who supported them for years and do their best to maintain a sense of law and order in their own communities<< The shocking hypocrisy of this statement astounds me. I seriously hope they intend to do some good for a change, snub out the drug dealers within their own ranks who prey on the loyal peoples children. And resist the best efforts and bloody talk from certain Unionists, and wannabee Yank rabble-rousers to madden them once again to pursue the blood of their neighbours. They seem content on the latter, but I fear will fight said upcoming gang-war to protect their turf, but not for the best of reasons. I hope I'm wrong.

  • Muad’Dib

    You’re not wrong Eoghan. I recall vividly the UDA/UVF fued of several years ago mostly based on the Shankill but it did spread in to other parts such as Hollywood and inner East Belfast. What part of the loyalist community did that protect? I recall a lot of damage and bloody mayhem, not so much with the protection.

  • cut the bull

    Jackies claims that the guns that ” “They’re not the UDA’s guns. They’re the peoples guns” with a further statement stating;

    “There’s going to be dead bodies in the streets here and it’s going to be over territory, it’s going to be over drugs and who owes money to who. And loyalist paramilitaries are going to be loyal to the people who supported them for years and do their best to maintain a sense of law and order in their own communities”.

    This sounds like a perfect get out clause presented by the UDA for the DUP in the policing debate in relation to devolved policing and justice.

    Having worn out the mantra about possible IRA violence in the knowledge that the IRA has decommissioned.

    The DUP may argue that as long as there are armed paramilitaries making thinly veiled threats in relation to the possble use of fire arms then policing and justice should remain with the Brit Govt.

  • Ian

    Majordolittle:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_troll

    Everyone else:

    DNFTT

  • “I hope I’m wrong.”

    Sadly, you’re probably right, Eoghan. Those with their finger on the local pulse will know that the loyalist and republican paramilitary godfathers rule the roost in many local communities. They’re a key part of the ‘peace process’ and you’ll find them at the heart of projects linked to, for example, the allocation of lottery funds.

  • Moochin Photoman

    Nevin
    They may well be involved at the heart of projects but my experience of this is that the funds go to the people needed to bring the projects to fruition ie the artists and facilitators.
    There is a misconception that the money is going in to the pockets of the paramilitaries.
    This simply not the case.
    Yes there will some of these fellas involved in the decision making, what murals are to be replaced and with what but the money isn’t going into their pockets.

  • Chris

    The sad thing is that the PSNI could probably have a pretty good crack at locking up half these scumbags, but for the fact that they would run up against some sort of political immunity.

  • Moochin, a business acquaintance of mine was invited to apply for lottery funding but he wouldn’t touch it because the funding was being administered by people he considered to be part of a paramilitary organisation.

  • Chris, I’ve previously explained how the police couldn’t ruffle paramilitary feathers without (British and Irish) political clearance; they could observe wrongdoing but intervention required permission.

  • moochin Photoman

    Nevin,
    Fair enough i was basing my comment on a recent re-imaging project that i was involved with. I can’t see how such money would,could and should go to anyone other than the people involved with the production of work.
    If your business acquaintance was looking to make some money you can assure him that budgets are such that it would be nigh on impossible for the paramilitaries to get their hands on it.
    Would you care to comment further as to how these individuals would access the money?
    The budget crisis that the Arts here is facing because of the Olympic money grab and continual underfunding is such that those involved in the sector would not hesitate to highlight the misappropriation of funding.

    (PS i don’t work for the lottery)

  • Jimmy

    Would anyone agree that policing is a complete failure? As is In England, Scotland and Wales as well. The legislators for some unknown reason refuse to tackle the blight of crime to an extent at least in Northern Irelands unique case, Paramilitary’s are thus ‘forced’ to fill the vacuum of inadequate policing.

    Liberal Democracy has been an abject failure, it failed to tackle Terrorism in Northern Ireland and it will fail to tackle criminality. Is it simply apathy on the community’s part? who knows?. But it’s too late for Frank McGreevy and Harry Holland now.
    If or when the ‘Community Policy’ starts I will give it a guarded welcome, with a surreal ‘I told you so’ to the Politicians inevitable cries of unacceptability.
    So what if the UDA carries it out, some one has too do it. At least they are sticking up for their community (sic), something PSF and the IRA are simply not doing as they were obviously sold a pup on policing and are enthusiastic administrators of ‘acceptable governing’ i.e. new world order liberalism and lack of Ideology, absorbed into the new elite ‘political class’.

    I also believe that any changeover of justice and policing to the Stormont regime will simply be a waste of time, again because the administrators will refuse to make the powers necessary to tackle crime as they haven’t the gumption to do so without the accusations of a police state and loss of power base. So an acceptable level of crime is self evident for them. This is the failure of democracy where the political elite stay in power, do what they like with a minimum electoral mandate, the plebe encourage them by voting for them yet the politicians do nothing, as they will be returned at the next election its the perfect job description. Democracy thus policing does not work!!!

    We have armies of think tanks, guangos, focus groups, et al and a Police force that seems and feels separate from society and not imbedded within it redirect those resources!!. Without doubt the Politicians lost a great opportunity when discussing policing GFA to not include those community elements.
    We are now reaping what we have sowen.

  • Prince Eoghan

    Nevin

    >>So what if the UDA carries it out, some one has too do it. At least they are sticking up for their community (sic), something PSF and the IRA are simply not doing<< Whichever way you see it(and you and I differ) there is merit in Jimmy's comment above. There are no Republican Godfathers any more. Perhaps if there were(good and bad) then we would not now be witnessing the impoverishment of 'society' akin to British standards now taking place in areas like for example West Belfast. From my experience and evidence of friends who live in Republican areas, drugs were in the main kept out of Republican areas. It is my earnest wish that the sentiments espoused by Jackie McDonald would try to do their utmost to do likewise in Unionist areas. Thus they would truly be contributing to society and the people they claim to be protecting.

  • Prince Eoghan

    >>akin to British standards<< Aggggg........reads totally wrong. Should be akin to standards in British cities.

  • TAFKABO

    Af for the Loyalists, I grew up in a loyalist estate, and I can tell you right now that the biggest source of pain and misery for ordinary working class people was from their self appointed protectors in the loyalist paramilitaries. These scum bastards are parasites who fund their lifestyles by exploiting the very people they claim they’re there to protect.
    I could offer up stories of family members beaten and shot by these bastards, but it even goes so far as the fact that two years ago when my sister dared to buy a new awning for her front door she was told by one of the local loyalist leaders that she had to take it down.

    Why?

    It was green.

    The sooner Northern Ireland is shot of these filth, the better it will be for all.

  • “There are no Republican Godfathers any more”

    Of course not, Eoghan 🙂

  • Moochin, my friend didn’t wish to be ‘beholden’ to paramilitaries, not even if they or their associates were on the Irish president’s guest list. It wasn’t a matter of the money going into their pockets; it was one of keeping well out of their sphere of activities.

  • jude whyte

    gosh i am so happy that jackie ” UDA person “will protect us from Criminals…. looking forward to a good sleep to night after all those years of worry ,anxiety,stress and depression that the UDA would kill me as I am A fenian ……in theory
    get real for heavens sake

  • Moochin Photoman

    Nevin
    Thanks for the clarification, which is a little different to your previous statement.

    “a business acquaintance of mine was invited to apply for lottery funding but he wouldn’t touch it because the funding was being administered by people he considered to be part of a paramilitary organisation.”

    If someone had told me 10 years ago that as part of my role as a photographic artist/community facilitator that i would be sitting around a table with paramilitaries and a so called brigadier i would have laughed them out the room. The fact that i was shows how far things have moved on.
    It is a far from perfect set up but there was a genuine willingness to engage in an artistic process for their area. Now whilst some would question the motives(i know i did) they couldn’t be excluded from the process and are entitled to their involvement. I think that the penny has dropped within loyalism and that loyalism has to move with the times. There is also a recognition that they are behind SF as regards their handling of the media.
    As for the management of the monies i state again….. that is done by lottery funders and associated bodies. There are no brown envelopes being passed. It is a highly regulated and wholly transparent process.

  • Gregory

    “Is he having a laugh? He’s the biggest godfather in Belfast. ”

    Nothing is forever, look at what happened to Jack Spot. One is only as tough as the last throat-cutting, it is not an honorary doctorate kind of deal. Look at West Belfast,

    the OnhE were defeated by the hoods, Big Brother No1 can pretend otherwise, but he’s wrong. He walks about with a 18ft security blanket, the rest of us don’t have that.

  • “they couldn’t be excluded from the process and are entitled to their involvement.”

    Moochin, I don’t think paramilitaries, or their equivalent, would be acceptable as lottery fund ‘administrators’ in the rest of these islands.

    “It is a highly regulated and wholly transparent process.”

    Would you be surprised to find someone who was found guilty of financial fraud continuing to act as a director of a heritage initiative body, a body responsible for the disbursement of around, say, £2 million?

  • Moochin Photoman

    Nevin

    Where did i say that they were administering the lottery funds?
    I suggest that you re read my statement and if you have anything further to add please feel free to but don’t paraphrase incorrectly ffs

  • Moochin, I said it, not you; I was referring to my friend’s story.

  • Prince Eoghan

    >>#

    “There are no Republican Godfathers any more”

    Of course not, Eoghan 🙂
    Posted by Nevin on Apr 10, 2008 @ 01:28 PM<< Actually I don't believe that there were ever any Republican 'Godfathers' after the style you intend it in. However as far as I know there are no visible signs of these mythical type beings in Nationalist areas. Hence my point as to the rapid breakdown of 'society' to mirror that of British cities. Drugs especially are now visible and used widely. The IRA good or bad kept this scourge at bay, even the likes of marijuana was not particularly widespread, Nationalist choofers more often than not(if they bothered) having to score from friends outwith Nationalist areas.

  • Dread Cthulhu

    Prince Eoghan: “The shocking hypocrisy of this statement astounds me. I seriously hope they intend to do some good for a change, snub out the drug dealers within their own ranks who prey on the loyal peoples children. ”

    Sure, and then they’ll cure cancer and perfect cold fusion for an encore…

    Jimmy: “Liberal Democracy has been an abject failure,”

    Democracy never fails — the people always get the government they deserve.

    Jimmy: “So what if the UDA carries it out, some one has too do it. At least they are sticking up for their community ”

    Close, but no cigar, Jimmy… the UDA may be sticking it *to* their community and sticking up their community, but they are hardly out there representing for their neighborhoods, save for the basest fashion, much as the Bloods or the Crips would in Los Angeles.

  • Gregory

    “The IRA good or bad kept this scourge at bay, even the likes of marijuana was not particularly widespread, Nationalist choofers more often than not(if they bothered) having to score from friends outwith Nationalist areas.”

    What? I’d collect 50 pieces of drug paraphernalia over an average weekend (from one small street) during the IRA’s last pathetic attempt to walk the streets in groups.

    If they can’t do it, I don’t see how the rest of us can. Maybe Gerry is in bed by eleven, that might be it.

    As for the drug thing, try 11 year olds drinking vodka, a natural high in Gransha from Turf Lodge as one approaches the only slot left un-gated, it is grim. Lots of drugs, for sure.

    G.

  • Dread Cthulhu

    “The IRA good or bad kept this scourge at bay, even the likes of marijuana was not particularly widespread, Nationalist choofers more often than not(if they bothered) having to score from friends outwith Nationalist areas.”

    Ironic, given their role in the larger drug trade. Now, admittedly, the IRA used drugs as a substitute for currency in a sort of crude barter economy (IRA training for FARC drugs, then trade the FARC drugs for weapons from Balkan arms dealers), but that is a distinction without a difference. Personally, I find that distinction too small to find much of the moral superiority.

    All their local activity proves is that they’re smart enough not to defecate where they eat and live.

    http://www.loc.gov/rr/frd/pdf-files/WestEurope_NEXUS.pdf

  • Gregory

    The IRA copped most of their weapons free of charge, before that they were given hard cash by the fountain of North African wisdom.

    Any FARC connection, historic or otherwise, would however be quite sordid. I wouldn’t over-state it.

    Between blank stares and the inability to call a spade a spade, shinners are the quintessence of semi-bucolic yokels with a few nice suits.

    I mean that in the nicest possible way.

    G.

  • Prince Eoghan

    >>What? I’d collect 50 pieces of drug paraphernalia over an average weekend (from one small street) during the IRA’s last pathetic attempt to walk the streets in groups.< < Good on ye Greg(if that is your thing) when was this? You see if it was in recent years you might be backing up my point. Dread. Wow! I hope you don't intend taking the hearsay from that link to a court of law. Your outrageous linkage would be laughed out of court. Far too many 'believed to be's' 'may have's' and thought to be's' for credibility thanks. >>Personally, I find that distinction too small to find much of the moral superiority.<< And if your comparison is bullshit? There is no distinction. Uncle Sam is no stranger to tarnishing the names of those they do not control, for shame.

  • Eoghan, if you’ve got the time and the inclination you might like to browse through the cross-party NIA Select Committee reports on organised crime:

    http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200506/cmselect/cmniaf/886/886i.pdf

    http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200506/cmselect/cmniaf/886/886ii.pdf

  • Gregory

    “Good on ye Greg(if that is your thing) when was this? You see if it was in recent years you might be backing up my point.”

    It was recent enough, it was virtually warfare, SF were opposed to the PSNI at the time,

    the scheming sausages left old age pensioners and the disabled of my community to their fate.

    The PSNI are a lot better, they may turn up late, but they turn up, sometimes to watch, but at least they arrive eventually.

    The IRA would tend to be in the pub when the trouble happened. And to be candid, the IRA were a little afraid of the hoods.

    I’ve never had the luxury of outnumbering the thugs when I had to take them on and I did so out of a sense of self preservation.

    When they’re in your face, they’re in your face.

    The IRA will potentially pay separately for what they could have dealt with collectively.

    The IRA handed over control to the hoods, not to the PSNI. That was a mistake.

    G.

  • Prince Eoghan

    Nevin

    Had a look at the first link, some vague passing reference to collusion between Loyalists and Republicans over drugs. The second link I wouldn’t send my worst enemy to trudge through 😉 Perhaps you could point out the part you wish me to note?

    Greg

    In your opinion, being there on the ground. How do the IRA deal with the drug situation in the past, and the developing problem that exists now that they are gone?

  • Dread Cthulhu

    Eoghan: “Wow! I hope you don’t intend taking the hearsay from that link to a court of law. Your outrageous linkage would be laughed out of court. Far too many ‘believed to be’s’ ‘may have’s’ and thought to be’s’ for credibility thanks.”

    Try selling your kool-aid to someone who’ll buy it, Eoghan. Your mock-outrage and hen-like sputtering aren’t even entertaining. Next thing you’ll be telling us is that the three IRA fellas were eco-tourists.

    That the IRA would use drugs as a proxy for currency is hardly an outlandish notion, nor is that they would maintain a two-faced policy of “defending their turf against the poison of illegal drugs” domestically whilst sharing the benefits of their fellow revolutionaries productivity in a more international arena.

    I mean, it would hardly be the first lie they’ve uttered to further their own ends, now would it?

  • Gregory

    “In your opinion, being there on the ground. How do the IRA deal with the drug situation in the past, and the developing problem that exists now that they are gone?”

    The IRA use to whack drug people, the only IRA people I speak to tend to wonder what it was all for, the war and everything.

    it is a tough gig to do a belt of Christmases in the pokey only to be told ( by Gerry) that the hoods are not to be left in a heap.

    The IRA are not a hot gang, not to themselves and not to the hoods. They’re as down and out as Jack Spot was when the Krays showed up.

  • Prince Eoghan

    Dread

    So instead of evidence we are to insert half-hearted supposition, gotcha!

    As for the name calling. The hypocrisy that is now all but uniform from our dear Yank friends like yourself directed at those not under their sphere of influence is beginning to make Unionists look lightweight. More than one world view is allowed you know, smears and innuendo, well va fungoo!

    >>a two-faced policy of “defending their turf against the poison of illegal drugs” domestically whilst sharing the benefits of their fellow revolutionaries productivity in a more international arena.<< That's supposing they are two-faced, and thus far the only tangible evidence is of usefully protecting young people, whilst all around them a generation or two has been blighted by drugs. Greg Thanks.

  • Eoghan, I thought you might have spotted the following activities in the contents:

    “Main areas of organised crime 13
    Oils fraud 13
    Cigarette smuggling 16
    Intellectual property crime 18
    Illegal dumping 19
    Social Security Fraud 20
    Armed Robbery 21
    Drugs 21
    Human Trafficking”

    You may well find that the various factions have had different ‘specialities’.

    Then there are protection rackets where it’s been reported that the godfathers have had ‘mutual’ understandings with ‘themmuns’ over territory and on percentage ‘mark-ups’ for government projects.

    Not to mention the increase in ‘punishment’ beatings and shootings during the ‘cessation’ as the godfathers attempted to increase their grip over local communities. You might also note that that grip has lessened somewhat as the ‘favoured’ godfathers have become ‘gentrified’ – trips to Chequers and golf with ‘the establishment’.

    And there are ‘respectable’ people at the trough:

    “The PSNI informed us that in a small number of cases under investigation, ‘professional’ advisers, including accountants, independent financial advisers, and solicitors have “assisted and advised criminals to conceal assets and avoid attention”.

    It’s all very easy. A godfather noted the attention of ARA/SOCA and transfered property into the name of his solicitor. Perhaps SOCA should have a look at investment and property companies to see whether or not their growth has been entirely linked to the property boom.

  • Prince Eoghan

    Nevin

    >>it’s been reported that the godfathers<< Ahhh gotcha Nev, I've been so busy with my own agenda that I forgot that you also have one 😉 The last three apart, all of us would know someone who has done a bit of that foolishly or otherwise, some of us have even participated I bet. Are we 'Godfathers' never mind Republican ones? I would also argue that of the last three, armed robbery could certainly be laid at the door of the IRA, certainly not human trafficking and evidence points to the IRA being anti drugs, as per my agenda. My contention is that there are no Republican Godfathers of the type you mean. Plenty of if's but's and maybe's (thanks Dread) and certainly desire and wishful thinking. Alas though, the shoe will not fit if there is no Cinderella.

  • Gregory

    Some of those activities were carried out by state agencies and therefore I hope you are not blaming merely the criminal elements.

    The myopia of SF, is that they screamed collusion, and them they stopped screaming it at the same time the DUP stopped saying SF/IRA.

    I have missing persons to find as well. Everybody and their dog is happy enough for them to stay buried.

    Here is the place I am now.

    I have pornography merchants in both the USA and Europe, who would not dare F with my head,

    assuring me that the NCIS/SOCA & SB types are the true authors of Ms Ruane’s vetting policy.

    (That should be an issue for SF, why are spooks interested in teacher vetting?)

    State-sponsored racketeering.

    DEL, DETE, and DWP were all in the juvenile sex trafficking business.

    I worked four exotic dancer programmes, one in Canada, one in Dublin, one in Belfast, one in London, and all were trafficking kids to pimps.

    Jane Kennedy & Fiona MacTaggart still have a lot of questions to answer, as does Mary Harney, and I suppose, given the least of them, so does Beverly Hughes.

    SF, PDs, SDLP, it is all fake morality, they don’t believe in God,

    the first ‘temporary’ suspension of exotic dancer permits in Dublin was because Jimmy Guerin wrote an article about forty dancers living next to McDowell and annoying his neighbors.

    That was September 2002, the UKIS would raif the DELNI candidates later in the year for me, the PSNI pointly refused to upset their SB coleagues by raiding it when the Home Office requested the raids.

    I got a call from a Home Office official asking me to tell him how he explains to the PSNI, that he is in charge and not their chief constable.

    SB had a sex industry hobby and they flipping hated me rotten for ruining on them. A free blow job is a free blow job.

    C. Ruane should wise up.

    G.

  • Dread Cthulhu

    Prince Eoghan: “So instead of evidence we are to insert half-hearted supposition, gotcha! ”

    Hey, if rumor, innuendo and promises is good enough for the IMC — funny, we never hear you complain about them when they except the mutters from the street that work in the IRA’s favor.

    Prince Eoghan: “More than one world view is allowed you know, smears and innuendo, well va fungoo! ”

    Kind of like when you said there were no useful Allied-held ports at or about the time of the Battle of the Bulge? You may be entitled to your own view… but the rest of us aren’t obligated to take it seriously, particularly when you’re making things up as you go.

  • Prince Eoghan

    >>Kind of like when you said there were no useful Allied-held ports at or about the time of the Battle of the Bulge?< < Using bitchy comment is usually a sign that a spoiled brat has made an arse of himself, funny this is the second time I have been attacked in this puerile fashion in recent weeks. No argument to offer I suppose. Do you remember when you made the stupid comment regarding the US declining Finland's declaration of war? Some made fun of you, I brushed it off as no big deal, perhaps a sign of class that you are not showing here Dread. We all get it wrong on occasion. Oh and Antwerp was not fully operational so in a sense I was right. Va fungoo pisano! >>particularly when you’re making things up as you go.<< Please show me where I am doing this? Idiotic chatter does not an argument make.