UKIP approach to Allister?

Blogger Shane Greer is claiming an exclusive, that Jim Allister has been approached by the UKIP. Will Allister seek a home under UKIP’s umbrella and will the rest of the discontented?Former UUP member, Henry Reilly, ran as a UKIP candidate in South Down in the 2007 Assembly election. He polled 1229 (2.7%) of the vote. In the European Parliament UKIP is a member of the Indepedence and Democracy Group.

  • nineteensixtyseven

    I find it bizarre that UKIP take their seats in the European Parliament. It is almost the equivalent of Robert McCartney sitting in Dáil Éireann.

  • RDRR

    If Allister joins Independence and Democracy Group Kathy Sinnot will leave it. Northern Ireland UKIP branch – I just don’t see it taking off. The vote for big Reilly was a personal one from the Kilkeel end of South Down and certainly not a vote for the oily Nigel Farage and his bizzare bunch!

  • “It is almost the equivalent of Robert McCartney sitting in Dáil Éireann. “

    Or the provos sitting in Stormont. Oh wait… 😉

    Where does this leave the UKIP in relation to the DUP- to the right of it? Did Reilly move from the UUP and bypass the DUP to arrive in UKIP? Or would a move such as this by Allister merely be a badge of convenience for a politician who has left the DUP and has nowhere more extreme to go, save the BNP?

  • Frank Sinistra

    He’d fit in perfect with Independence and Democracy; he wouldn’t be the nuttiest, the most homophobic or the most right-wing. Though hooking up with an anti-semitic holocaust denier may stymie those pro-Israel rants he is so fond of.

  • RDRR

    El Mat

    I think you are broadly correct. Lets face it, some of the people around Allister are clearly the type who if they lived on the mainland would be BNP-types. Of course, Iain Dale has documented co-operation between UKIP and the BNP on his diary. Allister must no that UKIP are a bunch of Little England nutters. He would be mad to hitch himself to that particular wagon. Still it makes little difference, he’s out on his arse in two years anyway, why shouldn’t he have a bit of fun?

  • RDRR

    Frank

    I and D doesn’t include FN. Although it does include the ultra-Catholic League of Polish Families, I wonder how a certain JA staffer would feel about his boss hooking up with stauch defenders of the “Anti-Christ System”? They (Le Pen et al.) are in ITS grouping.

  • Frank Sinistra

    RDRR,

    I know who makes up ID, I’m taking about the Greeks (Popular Orthodox Rally) as the holocaust deniers.

  • pith

    Frank Sinistra is not just broadly correct. He has hit the nail on the head.

  • Frank Sinistra

    On Kathy Sinnott, I can’t see her leaving if Allister joins, she puts up with the other loopers and is a bit out there herself but as she couldn’t easily join another group and would lose the much needed logistical support of ID, I doubt she’s going anywhere.

    And she won’t be getting reelected as she is invisible on the ground (hardly a surprise given she has relocated both her own kids and the children of her deceased sister to Brussels) so she really is seeing out 18 months of her essentially single issue, disability rights, singe term before retiring.

  • CTN

    Already on the ropes if he makes this move it will kill him of

  • Bemused

    Excellent news – just the place for him – Frank Sinistra has indeed hit the nail on the head.

  • Frank Sinistra

    I disagree, joining ID, that seems to be the rumour, rather than joining UKIP does have benefits at very little cost.

    Since the DUP were never in a political group they had to essentially set voting lists across a range of European competencies when they at most sat on two of the relevant committees – a huge task but a strong local organisation could pick up that slack. Since he left he will have been snowed under just keeping on top of his voting for Plenaries. Joining a group gives him access to a vote list he is very unlikely to disagree on outside Agriculture and Fisheries.

    He also gets access to additional funds for group propaganda. He can use this for newspapers ads, publications etc.

    Seems sensible enough to me. And they all share similar politics to him. Though barring a miracle I think he joins Sinnott in collecting the pension come 2009.

  • PeaceandJustice

    Jim Allister is merely reflecting the views of quite a number of Unionists – hence the sectarian hatred from the Pan-Nationalist Front on here.

    The fact that UKIP is anti-EU doesn’t make them less politicians than others. Some of the Pan-Nationalists on here support Sinn Fein IRA whose death squads murdered people. I guess it’s hard for them to understand what constitutes a normal political party.

    I think many people would vote for Jim Allister under the UKIP banner.

  • Outsider

    I think many people would vote for Jim Allister under the UKIP banner.

    I think many people will vote for him regardless of what party he alligns himself to.

  • snakebrain

    “Jim Allister is merely reflecting the views of quite a number of Unionists – hence the sectarian hatred from the Pan-Nationalist Front on here.”

    A useful shorthand in NI is to instantly relegate anyone who uses the term “Pan-Nationalist Front” to the joker box. It’s such a clear sign of wilful misunderstanding and misinterpretation.

  • slug

    UKIP tend to do surprisingly well in PR elections across the UK. There is a strong anti-EU sentiment.

  • Frank Sinistra

    Slug,

    It’s not like UKIP would be facing Europhiles here, it’d be a battle based on local issues like every other Euro election. A fight to ensure one tribe doesn’t get beaten by the other. Allister will lose because a vote for him is a vote for SF as the largest party (I could work in the DUP press office). IMO he was a beaten docket when he refused to run for Stormont.

  • Outsider

    Snakebrain

    It wasnt too long ago that the ‘pan Nationalist’ front hated Paisley, now he is deemed their saviour while Jim Allister is the boogey man.

  • snakebrain

    Ah yes, that must have been decided at one of those secret meetings between the Army Council, John Hume, Fr Aidan Troy and the editorial team of the Irish News that were obviously happening on a weekly basis to allow the Pan-Nationalist front to retain its cohesion.

  • slug

    Frank – yes and no. I think those arguments about SF as largest party are more persuasive for Assembly elections where it makes a difference. For the EU I think that people have an opportunity to vote differently.

  • Outsider-

    “It wasnt too long ago that the ‘pan Nationalist’ front hated Paisley, now he is deemed their saviour while Jim Allister is the boogey man.”

    Outsider alright- outside reality.

    Where has the SDLP or indeed any other part of this ‘pan-nationalist front’ apart from Sinn Féin been seen to view Paisley as some sort of saviour? And as for Allister, why would nationalists give a toss about him?

  • Outsider

    Outsider alright- outside reality.

    Where has the SDLP or indeed any other part of this ‘pan-nationalist front’ apart from Sinn Féin been seen to view Paisley as some sort of saviour? And as for Allister, why would nationalists give a toss about him?

    Well I can remember a time on these boards when every post from a Nationalist about Paisley was completely derogatory but now Allister seems to have assumed his mantle.

  • Frank Sinistra

    Slug,

    Look at the EU election results. The most credible sectarian divide candidate tops their respective vote base by a mile. It was Paisley/Hume for years, then Allister/de Brún. Nicholson was always an also ran, Morgan slaughter, was it Gilliland supported by every other and his dog gave it a go?

    The EP election has never been about policy. It’s a referendum on unity. That’s how we get such useless feckers in the jobs.

  • nineteensixtyseven

    “Well I can remember a time on these boards when every post from a Nationalist about Paisley was completely derogatory but now Allister seems to have assumed his mantle.”

    What on earth could a nationalist say about Jim Allister that is positive?

  • snakebrain

    “What on earth could a nationalist say about Jim Allister that is positive?
    Posted by nineteensixtyseven on Oct 09, 2007 @ 11:04 PM”

    He might have a hot daughter. Robin Stirling does.

  • Outsider

    What on earth could a nationalist say about Jim Allister that is positive?

    A statement like that really illustrates your lack of understanding for a large section of the Unionist community.

  • Ok Outsider, please tell us what a nationalist could say about Jim Allister that is positive. Answers on the back of a stamp acceptable.

  • snakebrain

    Is that what’s known as a silence that speaks volumes Matador?

  • Billy

    Outsider

    I don’t know 1 nationalist, however moderate, who could say anything positive about Allister.

    His contempt for the nationalist community is obvious as is his hypocrisy and double standards in reacting to “loyalist” terrorism as opposed to Republican terrorism.

    Despite what you may think, Nationalists are not stupid. We are capable of distinguishing between Unionists who genuinely despise all sectarian violence and those whose attitude changes depending on who the guilty party is.

  • al in bangor

    Despite what you may think, Nationalists are not stupid. We are capable of distinguishing between Unionists who genuinely despise all sectarian violence and those whose attitude changes depending on who the guilty party is.
    Posted by Billy on Oct 10, 2007 @ 02:33 AM

    Could swap the placement of nationalists and unionists in that quite easily.

    Then view the numbers who vote for SF/IRA and the number who vote for say, the PUP

  • Nevin

    “Despite what you may think, Nationalists are not stupid.”

    Oh, I don’t know, Billy. Just look how many voted for alleged members of the legitimate government of Ireland ie rafiaism.

    The pan-Unionist front has always looked less organised than the pan-Nationalist one during the past fifty years.

  • Mrs Norris

    “His contempt for the nationalist community is obvious as is his hypocrisy and double standards in reacting to “loyalist” terrorism as opposed to Republican terrorism.”

    Not true. He has stated his complete support for Margaret Ritchie’s position with regard to loyalist arms.

  • me

    Mrs Norris,

    I welcome jim going with the UKIP, if that is what happens. Firstly it gives voters a choice, and I believe the old traditional patterns of voting are going. In the near future I see the citizenry of NI voting accross the sectarian divide. Not yet…but hopefully not in the too distant future. Let the UKIP in to NI, bring in FF/Irish labour and for the first time ever, get rid of the two opposing blocs at stormont where there isn’t even any opposition, and where everything rests upon a sectarian head count.

    Bring it on…

  • Nevin

    I’ve just had a look at Shane’s blog. It seems he ‘escaped’ from NI into the ‘clutches’ of the Leadership Institute and Survival Values!!

  • PeaceandJustice

    Billy – “We are capable of distinguishing between Unionists who genuinely despise all sectarian violence and those whose attitude changes depending on who the guilty party is.”

    Jim Allister has consistently opposed violence. Maybe you don’t like him because he speaks out against Sinn Fein IRA which the majority of Roman Catholics support. Then there is the SDLP which tries to out-green SF IRA to get votes.

    Which Unionists do you like Billy?

  • al in bangor

    Which Unionists do you like Billy?
    Posted by PeaceandJustice on Oct 10, 2007 @ 11:09 AM

    Haha hard one there even for someone like me, who is a unionist. I can’t think of many I like so he might have an even harder time. I always liked Bob down here in Bangor because he was good craic to listen to.

    Still a lot of them are infinitely preferable to the likes of Comrade Marty, Not a psycho Gerry Kelly or Personality bypass Mark

  • Well, UKIP is a kind of British separatist party.

  • CTN

    Ally has 1 thing goin 4 him that nationalists like- he’s a splitter but unfortunately for them he has no platform- The only difference between him and the doc is the testing period for SF that Ally was goin to risk joint authority over.

    It will be over with 3 years of stability in the bag 4 the dup by the time the election comes.

    The reason detre for his entry into politics will then be null and void….

  • So another self-regarding big fish in a small tank is going to join UKIP. There can’t be any charges of inconsistency since UKIP has always contained a range of people with virtually nothing in common beyond one single issue, with a propensity to fall out and squabble with one another. Nothing like that’s ever been seen in Northern Ireland, oh no!

  • Sir Herbert Mercer

    If anyone seriously believes that the DUP will be the biggest party here for ever and ever and ever and ever then get your brain tested

  • Ballygobackwards

    TRP

    [edited by moderator – play the ball] Take a look at the recent history of your own party if you want a fine example of circular firing squads!

  • páid

    Outsider claims that “Jim Allister is the boogey man”

    He makes the DUPers jump
    when he plays reveille
    ‘Cos he’s the boogie woogie bugle boy of UKIP

  • I wonder…

    I would hope he joins the UKIP. What vote exactly did that party get in the Assembly elections?

    PS: Do PAJ (sic) and Outsider have, by any chance, similar IPs?

  • Billy

    PeaceandJustice

    “Which Unionists do you like Billy?”

    I am in agreement with anyone (regardless of religion or political viewpoint) who is unreservedly against ALL violence and speaks out against it without qualification.

    That rules you out as you only ever condemn “loyalist” violence when pressed and the vast majority of your posts condemn Catholics/Nationalists but rarely mention Protestant/Loyalist violence.

    I am not and never have been a Sinn Fein member, supporter or voter so don’t even go there with me.

    I am not stupid either. There has been a very close relationship between many top “loyalist” politicians and terrorists over the years as David Ervine and many other UVF/UDA/LVF members have confirmed.

    Vanguard, the UWC strike, Ulster Resistance, the OO + Billy Wright, the OO + it’s banners bands supporting “loyalist” terrorists, George Seawright, Clontibret, UVF “bodyguards” outside a leading DUP man’s house, The UUP + DUP voting for PUP and UPRG members when both the UVF + UDA were slaughtering Catholics, Trimble/Wright, McCrea/Wright etc.

    So, don’t try that line about there being no support for “loyalist” terrorism in the “loyalist” community. Unionist people are well aware about the double standards and hypocrisy of many Unionist politicians with regard to “loyalist” violence yet continue to vote for them in droves.

    How have the UDA/UVF managed to thrive in the “loyalist” community for the best part of 40 years without considerable support?

    Even here in England, where there is little or no interest in NI, the media and people are aware of the crocodile tears that many Unionist politicians “shed” for the victims of “loyalist” violence.

    The type of one sided nonsense that you try and peddle may go down well in the type of company that you keep.

    I’m glad to say that, in the wider world, people aren’t so easily fooled. They can tell who really condemns violence and who tries to cover their true feelings with insincere weasel words.

  • I wonder…

    I am neither nationalist nor republican and I cannot think of one positive thing to think or say about Jim Allister (and I remember him from his 80’s incarnation as well.)

    I equally cannot see any words or phrases that constitute “sectarian hatred from the pan-Nationalist front” (sic) in any of the first 12 posts on this subject.

    I suspect that “He who smelled it, expelled it”
    might be an appropriate phrase?

  • Turgon

    I suspect that Allister will not join UKIP. Although UKIP have a policy which is supported by a significant minority of the UK electorate (leaving Europe), they are seen as lunatics. I do not know any of them and am aware that without very careful media managing perfectly normal people can easily look naive, mad or irrelevant (think of some of the comments made on TV or radio phone ins). So they may be sensible people who seem mad. I fear this is being charitable and, even if true, they do still appear mad. In the current media age appearence is vitally important.

    Allister’s greatest danger is being seen as irrelevant and being protrayed as a personally intelligent member of the “lunatic fringe”. He is, I am sure, well aware of this and will I suspect thank UKIP for thier kind offer and decline it.

  • Outsider

    Is that what’s known as a silence that speaks volumes Matador?

    Snakebrain

    Hardly as I simply went to bed and that is why I am only responding now.

    Jim Allister is I believe genuinely opposed to terrorism and its sympathisers, a genuine defender of the Union and a hard working, effective and articulate politician.

    If in power would he come corrupted like Trimble or Paisley, who knows?

  • pith

    On the subject of UKIP and Northern Ireland, one of their leading lights seems to be a gent by the name of David Campbell Bannerman. They claim that as a Conservative he was a special advisor on the peace process to Tory secretaries of state (???I know). Tbey also make much of him being a descendant of the hypenated Liberal PM Campbell-Bannerman. Anyone ever heard of him in the peace process context?

  • Bigger Picture

    I think UKIP just saw an opportunity to boost their MEP ranks, don’t look for the hidden message.

  • Bigger Picture

    Turgon

    “being portrayed”!?! Is that not what is happening to him on a daily basis?? Jim has a tough choice he either forms a party and is labelled a headbanger for the rest of his days (or until he himself gets into power) or simply state he is bowing out at the next election and be subjected to taunts by the Paisleys. Hard choice but i believe bowing out is better than simply going into a Prodiban party which he is not overly enthusiastic about