IRA still gathering intelligence…

According to the Irish Times, IMC will report (this week?) that the IRA is still centrally organising intelligence operations, but is not clear as to whether criminal operations by its members are sanctioned by the leadership.

  • gypsynolan

    If the IRA is as heavily penetrated by crown force agents, as we have all been led to believe (aka Ingram/West et al); how can anybody be sure that the persons doing the intelligence gathering are not just said agents.

    Or, are we all to believe, that it is only the “clean skin” IRA men who are gathering the intelligence; unknowingly facilitated in their efforts, perhaps, by the agents (as per Donaldson).

    And just to clarify matters further (sic); given Martin Ingram’s recent assertion that he believes Martin McGuinness to be a British agent; but intelligence briefings to journalists suggest that said McGuinness is no longer serving on the Army Council; just who are we talking about now, when we read of operations being sanctioned by the “leadership.” And how many of them are we to believe are British agents.

    The problem is, that since the outing of Donaldson and Scap, few are now prepared to believe that the IRA is an autonomous body free from the influence of crown agents.

    Accordingly, it is hardly surprising that any assertion that the IRA is still “gathering intelligence” is met with downright incredulity and laughter.

    You simply cannot have it both ways…………

  • Fenian Bastard

    The IMC is fast becoming the Frankenstein of the peace process. It would be all but impossible for anyone to say of any organisation (IRA, PSNI, BA, Loyalist groups) that all of the members are now fully law abiding citizens. Yet this is the bar that has been set for the IMC to say about the IRA so as to ensure Blair and Ahern can prod Paisley into talks.

    If the IRA are involved in intelligence gathering well frankly at this stage the IMC need to be a lot more specific and say; what is the intelligence they are gathering, what units are involved, how many is involved, and what are they doing with the intelligence. Crucially I think then that a link has to be established between this “intelligence gathering” and Sinn Fein political project.

    This last point is crucial, after all if the IRA is involved in intelligence gathering but this intelligence is not being used or accessed by SF, then it is ultimately irrelevant.

    Have we now reached the stage in the process whereby an off the record confidental briefing by an anonymous cop or spook, who may have strong personal or political incentives to embelish or exaggerate, to the IMC can stall all political progress. From where I am siting I think we have.

    This has become pathetic.

  • Oilbhéar Chromaill

    There’s no doubt that the ‘intelligence gathering’ charge is a bit of a come down to what was being touted over the last few weeks by the various pinocchios in the media used by the spooks.

    But it will still provide the fig leaf for the DUP and their fellow travellers in the UUP and the SDLP to carry on their anti democratic crusade against Sinn Féin. Who would have thought that the IRA would have delivered all their weapons after years of campaigning by these parties that they would have said everything’s alright now, let’s get down to business. The drowning man’s grip on reality…’s slipping.

  • seabhac siulach

    Fenian Bastard:

    “This has become pathetic.”

    IMHO it has been pathetic for years now…

    It has always been and is in the Brits power to start talks right now, irrespective of any IMC reports. No IMC reports were necessary to start the negotiations of the GFA, or the subsequent start-up of the assembly with the UUP, SDLP, etc. It is mere political sophistry and pantomime continuing this charade of the IMC now and into April and beyond. This is not democracy, it is rule by spooks.
    Dermot Ahern now tells us in the Sunday Business Post that only optimists could expect power sharing to be restored before the summer. So that is practically another year gone then…as all political activity ends in July/August. So we must all be patient again, is that it…

    “Yes, ruling by fooling, is a great British art – with great Irish fools to practise on”

    James Connolly, 1914

  • martin ingram


    Quote”You simply cannot have it both ways………… “Unquote

    Agreed, at some stage HMG must take responsibility for this activity but you must accept HMG as every right to penetrate these criminal gangs.

    Mr Bastard,

    Crucially I think then that a link has to be established between this “intelligence gathering” and Sinn Fein political project.

    The linkage is clear the upper echelon of Sinn Fein are members of the IRA, you know it and I know it.Intelligence gives HMG the ability to see what is happening within the IRA but I remain convinced HMG is pulling the strings so the IMC are being asked the impossible. At any moment in time the Brits can pull the rug,How? merely by asking an Agent to involve the IRA in an act and then produce the Intelligence for the IMC.

    I would like to know does the IMC operate to Privvy council rules? does it know the ID of the Source and can it access past Intelligence to form its own any analysis of the grading which should be attributed to the source. I doubt it? but maybe I am being unfair?


  • heck

    could “intelligence operations” be that SF are trying to expose the touts in their organization. If so, what is wrong with that?

    could it be that they are looking for dirt on other politicans? This is called opposition research. What is wrong with that?

    This is a fig leaf for the DUP and the IMC is a hinderance to the peace process.

  • Baluba

    This is nonsense. And what else could you expect from such a nonsensical entity such the IMC?

    From whom do they get their ‘intelligence’?

    Blair and the rest of his paternalist government need to realise we don’t need or want them to run our affairs for us and get the assembly up and running. If the unionists don’t want to play, who gives a damn. We’ll work away anyway and watch just how quickly they climb down and get back to work.

    What a load of oul’ bulls*”t as per bloody usual.

  • martin ingram


    Quote”What a load of oul’ bulls*”t as per bloody usual.”Unquote

    Dont be too hard on yourself.


    PS. An assembly without the main players I dont think so. Dermot Ahern made it clear recently that the Assembly wont be up and running this year, why? because the IMC is an issue.

  • Why doesn’t the IRA leave the stage,
    They are the real peace-wreckers, so it’s dishonest of Gerry Adams to focus on spooks, securocrats etc, as the real problem is in his own back yard.
    “And why do you look at the speck in your brother’s eye, but do not perceive the plank in your own eye?

  • PaddyCanuck

    I agree with heck, this is a huge red herring and evidence of political policing.

    The securocrats can throw anything and it will stick.

    If they had anything that was real, they would make arrests, they could pursue charges, and we would see convictions. But no, they are not even able to say that actual crimes have\are being committed.

  • martin ingram

    Paddy Oh Paddy,

    Come into the real world, the police have a lot of evidence against a lot of people. In many cases they are stopped from making those arrests and laying charges because it is not in the “NATIONAL INTEREST” to give two examples , Martin McGuinness and Mooch Blair.

    Quote”If they had anything that was real, they would make arrests, they could pursue charges, and we would see convictions. But no, they are not even able to say that actual crimes have\are being “Unquote

    Over the years volumes of electronic Intelligence as been generated, tapes , video etc. One day these media forms will make it onto the public stage and watch certain people squirm and run to the courts just like Freddy did.

    The IMC have a job to do, who gave em that Job ?. The Irish and British Govts who! supplies them with the Intelligence ? the Irish and British Govt.

    Pretty clear what and who are the problem .