Trial begins of three arrested in MI5 sting operation

The BBC notes the start of the trial of three County Armagh men arrested after a two-year operation directed by “role playing Security Service officers”.  The three men were originally charged in June 2006 following a high profile joint PSNI and Security Service operation in Armagh and Fermanagh.

At an earlier hearing, noted here, the prosecution applied for anonymity for the 35 Security Service agents due to give evidence in the trial.

From the BBC report

Mr McCaugherty faces  seven including conspiring to possess firearms and explosives, using almost 46,000 euros for terrorist purposes, membership of the IRA, and making the deeds of a Portuguese restaurant available for the purposes of terrorism.

Mr Kearns is accused of conspiring to possess firearms and explosives, while Mr Gregory is accused of making the deeds of the Alvor restaurant in Portugal available for the purposes of terrorism.

During his hour-long opening, prosecuting QC Gordon Kerr said the operation began in August 2004 and ended with the arrest of the trio in June 2006.

The operation, which the court previously heard related to what police believe was an international gun smuggling operation, involved numerous meetings throughout Europe and even Istanbul in Turkey.

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  • Argosjohn

    45k euros would not buy much. And Armagh men running restaurants in Portugal? Whatever next.

  • Closer to home than Columbia I guess.

  • Neil McNickle

    so what is there to discuss here? Security services doing there job catching the bad guy! Don’t see why anyone who supports policing would have a problem with it!

  • Alias

    That depends on whether they support the PSNI or MI5. The spiel is that the PSNI is soon to be under the control of the local administrators of British rule but that doesn’t apply to the Security Services, who remain unaccountable to said local administrators and exist to defend the realm.

  • Neil McNickle

    I wouldn’t have any security forces under the control of unrepentant terrorists, but maybe thats just me?

  • Alias

    No, I’d agree with you there. At any rate, even when nationalists are no longer excluded from holding the justice portfolio as they are under the present sectarian arrangement, it will be accountability rather control so I probably used the wrong word there. The PSNI will remain operationally independent in the enforcement of British law, local oversight notwithstanding.

  • Rory Carr

    “I wouldn’t have any security forces under the control of unrepentant terrorists…”

    Given that these same security forces are themselves “unrepentant terrorists” I can sympathise with your difficulties, Neil.

  • TheHorse

    Neil McNickle maybe you didn’t read the first few lines.

    The BBC notes the start of the trial of three County Armagh men arrested after a two-year operation directed by “role playing Security Service officers”.

    The key word being “Directed” this is surely a case of entrapment being encouraged and directed to break the law then being charged by the same people who encouraged and directed you to do it – where else would you get it but under British rule.

    As for unrepentant terrorists in government we could look at the past dealings of the DUP and their connections to loyalist paramilitaries. Didn’t they create their own paramilitary army with military uniforms and all and didn’t that same paramilitary organization that the DUP created combine along with the UDA and the UVF to carry out armed robberies and import hundreds of weapons into the country that were then used to murder innocent catholics.

    Are the DUP unrepentant terrorists.

  • Ulick

    As mentioned above 45k wouldn’t buy too many weapons never mind the SAMs which were mentioned in the initial press releases. From speaking to one of those being charged, it’s a clear case of entrapment. His version of the story is that they were buying cigarettes and were offered all sorts of enticements to meet other prople. It was only at the subsequent meeting that these people then mentioned all the stuff about the weapons. It’s a set-up which would be thrown out of any fair court. Whether that happens in a Diplock court or not is another matter.

  • Seamus Crawley

    I agree, don’t let any British Party control justice as they have not accepted responsibility for past actions like Ballymurphy etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. Give it to local people who will collectively share blame should the need arise. They won’t hide behind the lie of national security, and most of their armies have ‘gone away’, unlike the Brirth army terrorists!!!

  • TheHorse

    Ulick this is a clear case of MI5 creating the illusion that justifies their position in Ireland, the amount of agents involved tells a story in itself they obviously played every role. I remember a John DeLorean claiming entrapment and being aquitted for similar offences.

  • aquifer

    It must be time for another Supergrass trial soon

  • Seamus Crawley

    I agree. The loyalist and republican touts should name and shame the terrorists who CONTROL them!!!

  • Down South

    One of the accused has admitted to being an MI5 agent, according to Saturdays Irish News. It was common knowledge in the area that he was working for one of the security services.

  • Michaelhenry

    M.I5 AND M.I 6 MEMBERS WHO ARE TOUTS SHOULD NAME THOSE WHO CONTROL THEM.

  • There is a fine line between undercover work and enticement. It sounds like the Brits were engaged in a very big ‘sting’ operation, could it be seen as enticement, the Trial should tell.

  • TheHorse

    Yes Pippakin lets get a different arm of the same people who set them up to judge them. Im sure they will get a fair trial in the Diplock Court

  • The fact is they may get a fairer trial in a diplock court that in a jury court.

    There are 12 people on a jury, I doubt any of them can be refused because of their religion. One judge is far more likely to be unbiased than a jury.

    The Diplock courts became necessary because of threats to jurors. The threat remains, and now with the increased number of organised crime gangs, I think the Diplock courts will increase beyond terror trials.

  • Alias

    You can’t beat MI5, so you may as well do as the Shinners did and join them.

    Not counting the number of MI5, MI6, C3 or any of the agents on the books of the US and Irish security services, the FRU had 80 active agents on its books. Given that there were only 300 active Provos at any one time, a simple maths lesson will tell you that a hell of a lot of them were looking for British national security interests.

    That’s no suprising since Gerry and Martin placed British agents in control of the Provos internal security uint (the ISU) so the Provos had no realiable means whatsover of detecting British agents within their ranks.

  • TheHorse

    Pippakin we have had 30 years experience of the conveyor belt system of Diplock Courts where people were convicted on no evidence or the flimsiest of evidence, these cases are coming back to haunt the justice system now, and Judges are biased, who do you think picks them the Government. Ask the Birmingham 6, Guildford 4, Maguire family, and many others.

  • TheHorse

    Alias would you say then that the British military establishment and its controllers in the Government were directing terrorism on both sides of the conflict here from the start. That the cause of the deaths of thousands of people here can be laid directly at the door of Downing Street.

  • I did not say I like it, just that in some ways it can be a fairer system. You may not have noticed but the number of ‘tame’ judges has been steadily decreasing.

    The same trial process applies: trial, appeal, and finally Europe. As you say the Brits have been caught out before, but that does not mean they will change. In fact given that there was a trial without a jury last year in England, because of the risk of jury tampering, I still say such a system is likely to grow.

  • TheHorse

    There is no fairer system than being judged by ones peers the diplock system is unfair and unjust to be anywhere near fair it would have to be a panel of judges. And not Unionist ones like it was and still is.

  • Ulick

    And what makes you believe all “80 active agents” were part of the “300 active Provos”?

  • The Horse

    As I recall jury trials in the north were stopped because of jury tampering, ie intimidation, The ability to threaten a member of a jury was easier here, but now it is relatively easy anywhere, that means the trials may well grow.

    Please, please do not deny the obvious.

  • kells

    Talk a bit of sense! 45K.will get you loads of gear. Guy who worked for us is a Bulgarian.Going rate fo an AK is a ton and a pistol is knocked out for 20 quid.Bulgaria is a mafia state and money talks.Of course the prices I quoted are for locals.

  • TheHorse

    Pippakin how can I deny that – sure it was on the British News but regardless is a panel of judges not fairer than one single judge.

  • Yes, it would be much fairer to have at at least three judges in every trial that takes place with out a jury. I cant see it happening though, not yet anyway. It will take at least one big miscarriage of justice to do that.

  • TheHorse

    Where have you been Pippakin, do you not think we have had enough misscarriages of justice under the diplock system, lawyers all over the world have spoken at length at the injustice of it, the scales of justice are always heavily weighed to one side, and its not the defendants side.

  • Michaelhenry

    alias would try and tell us that it was the brits who exploded the tonne bombs at canary warf and manchesterin 1996.

  • Michaelhenry

    manchester

  • Yes I knew I should have added a sentence. You are not thinking Brit government Horse. The Brit government will not worry about the north, they will move if the English get worked up over a miscarriage of justice. How likely it is that the English would ever get worked up over a republican falsely accused and convicted I leave it to you to judge.

    I believe our government have also introduced a version of Diplock. There is serious organised crime here and in the UK. It is likely that juries will be increasingly at risk making the prospect of trial without juries more likely, In fact it is already happening. Thing is I honestly have no real argument against it. People must not be put at serious risk of harm and worse.

  • I wonder how long it will be before someone makes a film of the infiltration of the PIRA? It would be interesting…

  • Michaelhenry

    in IRAq there was widespread infiltration of the british army, so much so that they had to pull of the streers and let the hardline american army fight on, cowardly limeys is a common phrase now in america.

  • TheHorse

    Michaelhenry have a look at the hardline american soldiers you’re so proud of murdering innocent people in Iraq

    http://www.smh.com.au/technology/technology-news/wikileaks-video-shows-devastating-us-chopper-attack-that-killed-journalists-20100406-rnmq.html

  • Argosjohn

    Let’s imagine we are in a lunatic asylum, that we were all been committed there for various forms of dissident thought in 1971. Now, we are told the story of the penetration of PIRA and Sinn Fein by their enemies and that Sinn Fein run the 6 counties for HM QE2. Would we doubt our sanity?.

    Someone said am ovie should be made. John Le Carre perhaps could script it.

  • Michaelhenry

    any pictures of the british army making a run for it.

  • Well men in white suits already tried kidnapping a man and carting him off, no doubt to be ‘disappeared’.

    I suggested a movie, I think Le Carre might be a bit dry for the north, there was more liquid involved, a lot more liquid.

  • TheHorse

    I’ve seen them bolting many a time – Have you.

  • Reader

    TheHorse: Ask the Birmingham 6, Guildford 4, Maguire family
    Convicted by juries, as per your request…

  • TheHorse

    reader, read it again.

    “Judges are biased, who do you think picks them the Government. Ask the Birmingham 6, Guildford 4, Maguire family, and many others”.

  • Down South

    One of the three men on trial has admitted to being an MI5 agent. It was on the front page of Saturdays Irish News.

  • Michaelhenry

    comming forward, unfortunately, plus going the other way, but i wii not see them patroling again.

  • Michaelhenry

    will

  • wee buns

    It’s like talking to the wall.
    Despite being stated ad nauseam that there is absolutely zero evidence for governerment claims of increased intimidation levels concerning jurors, Pip resolutely clings to her programming.

  • Wee Buns…

    And it was such peaceful night, no sarcasm from socaire, no complaints about being too prescriptive, and then…

    Its about believeability. I find it likely the PIRA would intimidate members of a jury. True its likely the Brits would lie about it, but their lie would not kill anyone and I will always put safety first.

    As for programming. I would say the reverse is true, there’s none so blind as them as will not see…

  • wee buns

    The definitive work (novel or film) concerning the north is wide open & ripe for the picking, has been for the past ten years. But no takers yet. Fintan O Toole reckoned (in an opinion piece a few years back) that no current talent is up to the job given that historically & throughout the various layers of events, plots & sub plots, there exists nothing to rival to this outrageously complex story.

  • And some of the major players are still alive and might not stop at legal action…

  • Battle of the Bogside

    Brave soldiers or cowardly bullies? You decide!

  • TheHorse

    WOW Pippakin you’re in there for the kill you mustn’t let your prejudices get in the way of honesty.

  • wee buns

    ‘I will always put safety first.’
    Be my guest o queen of sweeping statements; why let facts muddy the waters. I hope you never get called for jury service.

  • Im not prejudiced Horse Im a nationalist. What can I say I call it as I see it.

  • sdelaneys

    There was a claim in Saturday’s Irish News that one of the three is or was an MI5 agent so it seems strange that all three are in the dock.

  • TheHorse

    You’re a Nationalist who supports a single British judge to decide whether an Irishman/woman is guilty or innocent in a court where its up to the defendant to prove he/she is innocent rather than the prosecution proving them guilty.

  • Wee Buns…

    Prescriptive, sweeping statements, with an apparently regal edge. Oh my, I must have struck a nerve.

    What all you guys always overlook is I believe in peace. I also believe in innocent until proven guilty, and that includes republicans.

  • Get over yourself Horse.

    The crime was committed in Britain then the Brits would be entitled to extradite the accused to stand trial in, you guessed it, the UK.

    I am saying the Diplock trials are likely to extend, which, apart from anything else, will deny republicans the excuse of victimisation. In fact since there has already been another diplock trial in the UK, republicans can no longer claim they are singled out.

    Violence and the threat of more violence was the reason such trials were introduced and no one can deny the risk of violence has not gone away.

  • TheHorse

    In case you dont know Pippakin almost half the population here in the six counties describe themselves as Irish, they did not partition Ireland that was the British. The young men are Nationalists and Catholic who were directed and encouraged by British agents to act outside the law and then prosecuted by the very same British agents who directed and encouraged them. They now have to face a British court with a single sitting British judge with no jury and they are the ones who have to prove their innocence. Such trials were introduced to get a higher conviction rate which it did.

  • Pete Baker

    “The young men are Nationalists and Catholic who were directed and encouraged by British agents to act outside the law and then prosecuted by the very same British agents who directed and encouraged them.”

    No need for a trial at all then.

    Glad we’ve got that cleared up.

    Notwithstanding the innocent until proven guilty assumption of British justice…

    Let’s wait for the evidence to be produced before pronouncing verdict.

  • Horse, I did say I am a nationalist, what I am not is violent. I will not support any violent action and if someone is accused of a violent act, then they stand trial under the rules of the government of the day, that is Irish law and European law. It is no good to say we do not recognise the Brit court. Such an excuse would be laughed – out of court.

    One thing I have noticed about Brit trials, justice eventually catches up with it. The appeals will go through, to the European court if necessary and if there is a miscarriage of justice it will be exposed.

    I am tired now, got to get up early for the college course I am on. Irish folk lore: I will write about it at the week end.

    Good night.

  • TheHorse

    I think we can all make a fair judgement on British Justice by now Pete. No-ones saying they shouldn’t have a trial, why misinterpret what I said. Its about the Diplock System and whether its proper justice to be judged by a single person rather than a jury of ones peers.

  • Sorry, sorry, I did not mean to suggest I will be writing anything about it on Slugger! Oh, help, its late…Dont anyone have a go at me!

  • wee buns

    Not hit a nerve, just calling it as I see it. Given that single handedly you are responsible for a tremendous numbers of posts on this blog, the sheer volume of sweeping generalities & should-ery statements, is hard to ignore. To ‘believe in peace’, a lasting peace, you must necessarily be concerned with justice. Clearly that is not a prioroty otherwise you would be making the distinctions between fact & fiction here.

  • I was just about to switch off but, just for you:

    I usually make a comment, and then respond to comments to me, as now. If you do not want to correspond that is your choice – use it. As for fiction. Silly boy we’ve all been listening to that from Adams & co for years.

    As for the rest of your little diatribe. I have had enough of the lies, the sudden interest in justice. Where was the justice for Jean McConville, for the disappeared, for all the other victims of the IRA.

    Take a hike Wee Buns. I will not be bullied.

  • skinbop

    think there’s something wrong with your keyboard there MH…but i could decrypt enough to say you don’t half talk some bollocks – and there’s some competition out there too!

  • skinbop

    and coming…mate maybe you should just go to bed after the second tin?

  • aquifer

    If some faction are prepared to murder citizens of these islands to blackmail us into obeying their cultural dictats, they should be trapped and jailed.

    That is justice in any language.

  • Macanna

    pip, pity in some cases that it takes 15-20yrs to catch up. waste of a lot of lives. And not a lot of comfort to those wrongly convicted.

  • Granni Trixie

    Talking of Columbia (were we…these kind of cases currently being reported tend to blend into one in my mind, sorry if its off the point.)….anyway a story in INews today points to a SF chequebook being found with 2 cheques for Columbia 3 campaign along with money from N. Bank (a Bank official testified it was her signature on some of the notes). Isnt it amazing …one of our MLAs lead the Columbia campaign (ofcourse the 3 were over birdwatching etc weent they?. It beggars belief.

  • Rory Carr

    “..what I am not is violent. I will not support any violent action …”

    says Pippakin making me wonder how on earth then she manages to mash her potatoes.

    The most distinguishing mark of those who espouse total pacifism I have found is their almost sociopathic ability to lie, not only to others, but also to themselves.

    We all employ violence in our lives – cabbages could not be harvested otherwise – nor recalcitrant children made to attend school ( a firm grip on the upper arm is all that’s required – no need for whipping) and of course the state itself is the most violent institution in all our lives and indeed seeks a monopoly on violence which its armies, navies, air forces, police forces, secret services, courts and jailers are all to ready and willing to enforce, something that pacifists are ever ready to ignore (until they might be on the receiving end of a harsh word from a traffic warden and then it’s World War III !)

    Their principle of condemnation of violence is a moveable feast to be applied when and where it does not trouble their comfort zone. In short – they are not to be trusted.

  • Granni Trixie

    I consider myself a pacifist …but not a total pacifist. For example iin S Africa I can imagine how many were driven to vionece or in Germany under the Nazis.

    But in context of NI the conditions were such that there were options and so I simply do not know why the physical force came into play…it cost people so much and ultimately there had to be a return to legitimate means of change. A total waste.

  • “M.I5 AND M.I 6 MEMBERS WHO ARE TOUTS SHOULD NAME THOSE WHO CONTROL THEM.” …… Michaelhenry says: 5 May 2010 at 7:09 pm

    That will be a wasted journey, Michaelhenry, no greater than chasing phantom ghosts. Intelligence Control is an Art Phorm invariably Provided by the Uncontrollable and Wordy Wise.

    To sex that up you could always add Worldly Wise too to Add and Further Confusion to the Mix.

  • Ash Cloud

    What happened to the Fermanagh group involved in this? There seems to be a pattern here of arrests and releases? Maybe this is why they’ve been booted out of the dissers!

  • TheHorse

    Trixie everyone knows Sinn Fein supported the Columbia 3 it in fact it was one of their politicians who are up for election today that ran the campaign – whats up with that, they are their members. These bank notes you refer to, are you saying they were from the money taken from the northern bank, if so are you seriously suggesting a bank employee can remember that those notes definately came from the 26 million that was supposedly stolen.

  • Imagine Polanski capturing Intelligence Channels in Belfast as Resources are Primed and Educated to Refuse Being Excused Knowledge of Dodgy Sources. Open up that Can of Worms and you’ll Generate Candy FLOSS like Crazy. 🙂

    Now that is a SMART Warren for GameKeepers to Manage and Run.

  • Argosjohn

    “If some faction are prepared to murder citizens of these islands to blackmail us into obeying their cultural dictats, they should be trapped and jailed. That is justice in any language”

    That is waht Guiseppe Conlon got anyway. Ever see the Justice Statue outside Dublin castle? Back to the people and tilted scales.
    I see today’s Daily Mail is ranting about the two SAS terrorists the SAS freed from a Bastra jail, commititng murder and mayhem in the process. Lib Dem MPs are also campaigning for Simon Mann and the other “ex” SAS terrorists convicted of trying to stage a coup in Equatorial Guinea.
    No sign of Gerry Adams, Joe Costello or any other house trained Papists raising a murmur on behalf of Irish people unjustly incarcerated in Irish and British jails.
    British justice is an oxymoron by the way.

  • Macanna

    And remember trixie, the three were actually found not guilty in court before that was overturned on appeal for reasons known only to the columbians.

  • wee buns

    Pip.
    I do hope you are not suggesting that you are being bullied by me. Untrue, as well as being an invalid means of persecuting your opinions.

    Furthermore hope it is not I you refer to as a ‘silly boy’, being that I am neither young nor male.

    If you can’t bear that your views & how you express them, be challenged, without resorting to crying victim, departing from the issue or jumpimg to fantastic conclusions, then get out of the kitchen Pip.

  • Brian MacAodh

    What that doesn’t tell you is that wikileak edited that video.

    They found 2 Aks and 1 RPG on the dead men. There was also a firefight in an adjacant neighborhood shortly before that encounter. Doesn’t justify what happened but I don’t think websites should be showing film they have editted to get maximum effect on their viewers. They should show the whole thing and let the public decide.

    I have lived in DC the past several years and I have never heard the phrase “cowardly limey”. My brother in law is in the 82 airborne has done 3 tours and I also have a cousin over in Kabul right now. The only thing like that I have heard them say in that regard is that ISAF is referred to by american soldiers as I Saw Americans Fight. Most European soldiers aren’t allowed to leave their base and do very little. They also comment on many of them are overweight. They have had nothing but good things to say about the British soldiers they have encountered.

  • Granni Trixie

    TheHorse: for clarification,the bank employee (according to I News) identified in court that it was her SIGNATURE which was written on some of the N. Bank notes which were found.

    As for Columbia 3 – thhis is one of the few cases where it defies belief to say that those men were on an “innocent” holiday. And I think I am entitled to judge badly Catrina and SF and even “certain people” representing a prisoners support group in NI for going over to Columbia to get them back.

  • wee buns

    I did assume you were both young and male, must have been something to do with your manner.

    I did not cry victim!, apart from the fact that victimhood is a status some republicans reserve to themselves, I actually gave you a list of real victims, which I note in true shinner fashion you have managed to completely ignore.

    Justice is not a one way street reserved for republicans. If you do not like what I have to say, tough.

    You better learn: in a democracy everyone is entitled to an opinion. You have spent the last several days becoming increasingly insulting by the comment.

    Get a life – and try and make sure its your own.

  • Macanna

    I did say when we get to hear about it at trial, it might be a case of enticement. The appeal process is not the same now. The last court of appeal is Europe.

    I am not in favour of Diplock, but I have to say I am even less in favour of juries being intimidated.

  • Rory Carr

    How very… unsurprising…and coming from you, mediocre. I have been told off by a shinner for commenting too much, so dont bother to reply, Im sticking to reading until something interesting takes my eye…

  • TheHorse

    Brian maybe you are listening to disinformation as it says nowhere else on the news or internet your version of events.

    “Two soldiers who were in the same company as the culprits featured in the infamous Wikileaks “Collateral Murder” video, which showed troops in Apache helicopters slaughtering Reuters cameramen and children while laughing about it, have apologized for the massacre while stating that the footage only begins to depict the suffering inflicted upon innocent Iraqis as a consequence of the occupation”.

    http://www.prisonplanet.com/u-s-troops-apologize-for-wikileaks-massacre-video.html

  • TheHorse

    Trixie because her SIGNATURE was on some of the bank notes does not nessesarily mean they were from the same money that was taken from the Northern Bank.

    As for the Columbia 3 can we take it as fact now that if a couple of British muslims went backpacking in Pakistan people like yourself would immediately have them locked up because they went there for no other reason other than clandestine activities.

  • Granni Trixie

    TheHorse: Afraid I just cant suspend my intelligence/judgement as you seem to be able to do.

  • wee buns

    ‘I did not cry victim’.
    You were suggesting I had bullied you.
    Sorry I can not (despite being in occasional agreement) take the majority of what you say seriously. I have explained why. Continue to disregard the facts. Continue to assume far too much about everything & everyone. (I have never been a member of SF so your latest remark is a mystery.) The north & it’s native people, (meaning those of us who have lived through the conflict), have long contended with the phenomena of parachutists, their opinions & agendas. Entitled as you are, it does not make your opinion relevant. We can agree to disagree on this one. Good luck.

  • wee buns

    If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, chances are – its a duck. Or, of course it could be Gerry I was never in the IRA, Adams.

    If you are my sort of age, you were around when Jean McConville was kidnapped and brutally murdered. I am sure the police would be interested in any information an expert such as yourself could give them. Which reminds me. You have not mentioned the disappeared, or the other victims of the PIRA.

    Maybe we do agree on somethings, we certainly agree on a united Ireland, but I have to say, for someone who resents the number of comments I make you are adding to their number, considerably.

    Pax Wee Buns, we both want a united Ireland, if we can agree on that we should be able to tolerate the rest.

  • Reader

    ArgosJohn: I see today’s Daily Mail is ranting about the two SAS terrorists the SAS freed from a Bastra jail, commititng murder and mayhem in the process.
    Do I blame the Mail or yourself for the erroneous suggestion that the SAS men were actually in jail? The local police had handed them over to the Shia militia.
    At which point, as I am sure you will agree, it was a race against time to save their lives.

  • wee buns

    Pip
    please desist in future, from assuming what my politics are.
    I have nowhere stated that I consider myself to be an nationalist.

    Please also curtail your apetite for assumption when it comes to my political allegiences: I have stated before that I have never been a member of ANY political party. Sorry if you can not get your brain around that.

    ‘Get a life; and try and make sure it’s your own.’
    You might take care in future please, to desist from such offensive innuendo. I have never advocated violence, on this site or anywhere else.

    ‘If you are my sort of age, you were around when Jean McConville was kidnapped and brutally murdered. I am sure the police would be interested in any information an expert such as yourself could give them.’
    An outrageous response. Riddled with provocation & again, the suggestion of violent involvment. Pax indeed.

  • wee buns

    I didn’t start this little slanging match – you did. I tried to be polite, you were insulting. It seems you can give it but you can’t take it.

    I assumed you were a young, male. SF supporter because that is what you sounded like to me. Even now after, what, four/five comments you still have not acknowledged the real victims of the troubles.

    You were the one who said you were the expert on the north. I merely suggested something useful you could do with your expertise.

    Enough now! I did not want to argue with you in the first place. You wanted that.

  • TheHorse

    Theres always an excause – disinformation, sure we will all believe. Perfidious Albion

  • wee buns

    Native, I said, not expert.
    Enough is right.
    It would be better if such incitant remarks as yours be removed.

  • “If some faction are prepared to murder citizens of these islands to blackmail us into obeying their cultural dictats, they should be trapped and jailed.” ….. aquifer says: 6 May 2010 at 9:18 am

    Educated to change crazy thinking would be better, acquifer, for that is ITs Source Core Ore.

    The Study and Practice of Madness, Insanity in Sanity, is No Fools’ Task in a World of Future Derivative Hedges and Shelves with Virtual Command and Control Options.

    That is judicial in any language? Oy vey, Allahu Akbar, Amen, Hi…..

  • wee buns

    Don’t know how I missed this one, but yes, here we have Pip running her own little personal Diplock Court. She decides which political allegience this poster holds, then ascribes origins, locations & crimes wittnessed. The only blessing is she does not have the power to convict me.

    The quantity (of posts) would be fine btw if they were in any way relevant to the issue.