Gregory Campbell calls for new council name

Gregory Campbell has called for the proposed new council created by the merger of Derry City Council and Strabane Council to have a name which would make it acceptable to unionists and nationalists.

His comments (from the BBC):
“We are going to enter into a new era in 18 months time with 11 new councils with new names.
“This is an opportunity if we want to draw a line under the difficulties.”
“We want to avoid an unwieldy name but we also want to have a name that will avoid the problems that occurred in the 1980s when the council’s name changed.
“Something like the North West Regional Council would at least encompass the entirety of the council area”

  • RepublicanStones

    You gotta love the third Proclaimer, at least hes’s consistent !

  • Rory

    It may be that Herself poured more than my normal helping of restorative morning gin on my cornflakes earlier but on the face of it I can find nothing wrong with Gregory Campbell’s proposal concerning the naming of the new authority.

    I do however find his particular name suggestion a little clumsy and over-bureaucratic and my own first inspiration of “Greater Derry” suffers to a lesser degree from much the same lack of elegance and I imagine that hackles might rise in some quarters at any employment of the name “Derry”.

    Which leads us to the inevitable worm in the apple, the suspicion that will also arise in other quarters that this may be no more than an underhand attempt by the Minister for Culture (so long as it’s not Irish culture) to airbrush the use of the name of the city and county, sans its “London” prefix, from common sight.

    However, let good will prevail and let us put all our misgivings and prejudices aside and see if we can really dream up a name that will be both sweet and elegant on the tongue and on the ear and one that will be happily spoken by all our citizenry.

    Although I envisage much bile and vitriol to come, who knows, maybe even “from the mouths of babes and innocents” a lovely new name may spring.

  • a

    Gotta love how these numpties stumble towards the answer and still cannot get it. How could the name “North West Regional Council” possibly be acceptable to Nationalists when it’s not all the North West?

    Foyleside – with the equivalent as Gaelige – might work – or Columbcille?

    Gregory Campbell must go down in history as the one man who, in 1968, rioted because he didn’t want the right to vote.

  • ggn

    Like ‘a’ I think it should be something based on ‘Foyle’.

  • ??

    Gregory Campbell must go down in history as the one man who, in 1968, rioted because he didn’t want the right to vote.
    Posted by a on Oct 18, 2008 @ 12:41 PM

    he did have the right to vote, just like every nationlist and unionist in northern ireland

  • Jack

    North West Regional Council would be accurate and we could not have that in Northern Ireland!

  • Greagoir O’ Frainclin

    “he did have the right to vote, just like every nationlist and unionist in northern ireland.”

    Every nationalist had a right to vote?????

    I don’t think so!

  • a

    ?? if you bother to check the facts you’ll know that the local government franchise in the North of Ireland was restricted to rate payers (of a certain value?) – hence the NICRA slogan of “one man, one vote”.

    This is what our Greg said to that:
    “I felt these people were trying to destroy Northern Ireland. They are marching for rights I don’t have” – he then goes on to say how he joined in with the RUC’s attempts to crush the Bogside with extra-legal force (ie he joined in a riot).

    It’s all on pp707 – 708 of “White Heat: A history of Britain in the swinging sixties” by Dominic Sandbrook (an excellent book, by the way – though the early one “Never Had It So Good” is even better).

    And no, if you are an Irish nationalist the term “North West Regional Council” is not accurate bacause the bulk of the landmass of the North West of the country is in Donegal.

    You might disagree about our view of nationality, but please try to respect it all the same.

  • fin

    why not alternate the city and council names to keep it fair, it could be LondonDerry and Derry Council for 5 years and then be Derry and LondonDerry Council for 5 years, you just need to store letterheads and road signs for 5 years at a time.
    Or rename it Gregory City in honour of his great contribution to bringing both communities together

  • ??

    ?? if you bother to check the facts you’ll know that the local government franchise in the North of Ireland was restricted to rate payers (of a certain value?) – hence the NICRA slogan of “one man, one vote”.

    So??? the same rights extend to both protestant and catholic. Next you`ll be telling us that there were no catholic ratepayers, President McAleeses father had more voting rights than protestants.

    The same rights were applicable to everyone. In westminster elections everyone had only one vote.

    You might disagree about our view of nationality, but please try to respect it all the same.
    Posted by a on Oct 18, 2008 @ 01:08 PM

    why when it is WRONG. Donegal is in IRELAND, not norhtern Ireland, you did sign up to the GFA and STA agreements remember?

  • Ulsters my homeland

    What about calling it Venniconia?

  • Sneakers O’Toole

    Gregory’s suggestion is eminently sensible.

    Foyle Valley would do.

    ??, btw, is spot on. Donegal’s not in Northern Ireland, it’s in northern Ireland!

    So get your facts straight!

  • ??

    ??, btw, is spot on. Donegal’s not in Northern Ireland, it’s in northern Ireland!

    So get your facts straight!
    Posted by Sneakers O’Toole on Oct 18, 2008 @ 01:28 PM

    ooohhh.scary upset nationalist…wise up

  • a

    ?? – you said “he did have the right to vote, just like every nationlist and unionist in northern ireland” and now you say it’s alright, he had equal right to be deprived of his vote??

    Well, as I said, he must be the only person on the planet who rioted in 1968 to ensure he didn’t get a right to vote.

    Donegal’s not in Northern Ireland, it’s in northern Ireland!

    Is that the best you can do?

    I’m not upset. I’m just telling you why the name “North West Regional Council” is a non starter.

    You guys are the ones who have to wake up to what the GFA means. It means if Nationalists don’t agree it ain’t going to happen. I am merely explaining why nationalist won’t agree.

    Rant and rave about it all you like but because your fathers and grand fathers ran the North as a political slum it is where we are. So you had better get over it.

  • Steve

    how about London’s bane

    ?? you neatly proved Greagoir’s point for him I am sure he appreciates your help

    Campbell did riot because he didn’t want the vote

  • Sneakers O’Toole

    ?? I’m not upset, I’m messing around you eejit.

    It was a joke on the fact you forgot to capitalise “Northern”:

    “Donegal [is not in] northern Ireland”… which is most definitely is!

    Take it easy fella.

  • Rory

    “Venniconia”? Close, but no cigar,UMH.

    Too Latinate – you’d never sell it to the Prods.

  • dewi

    I hate names like North West Regional Council – they’ve done the same sort of thing with the glorious old names of Glasgow constituencies. Why not have a consultation and ask for suggestions?

  • I like Strathfoyle; it has an Irish and a Scottish ring to it; the meadow on the banks of the Foyle.

  • ??

    I’m not upset. I’m just telling you why the name “North West Regional Council” is a non starter. ……..

    Funny how nationalists werent so accomodating when they changed the name to Derry city council. No thought for protestants…nationalists only complain about majority rule when theyre in the minority

  • perry

    I tend to agree that these compass point regional identities are a bit anaemic but if nationalists would be upset at the idea of a North West Regional Council how come a Sinn Fein Education Minister created North West Regional College (Strabane, L’derry & Limavady)?

    http://www.nwrc.ac.uk/

  • Comrade Stalin

    You might disagree about our view of nationality, but please try to respect it all the same.

    Seems to me like Campbell is trying to be helpful here by at least accepting that “Londonderry” isn’t going to work.

    The constructive way to respond is to suggest alternatives that might be better.

  • a

    The constructive way to respond is to suggest alternatives that might be better.

    I did.

    I suggested Foyleside in both languages or Columbcille.

    The Latin name suggested earlier would, I suggest, always leave people saying “where”? But on that basis why not pick the townland or barony that is most central? (Assuming it’s not called something like “popeland” :-))

  • b

    I wonder has Gregory any ideas to give ‘East Londenderry’ a name acceptable to the whole community?

  • a

    Funny how nationalists werent so accomodating when they changed the name to Derry city council

    In doing so simply replicated the bahaviour of the people who changed the name of the place to Londonderry.

    But that’s not my point. I am saying let’s pick a name that genuinely works for all sides. But that means it will have to be either bilingual or not in either language!

    For once UMH is pointing in the right direction.

  • Modernist

    As a Nationalist I’m a bit suspicious of this statement by Greg Crooked Jaw(Cambell). Its seems like a repetition of what I view as classic DUP strategy of the “flip flop (political feigned withdraw). I DOUBT THE INTEGRETY of his statement, I’m interested to see how he intends on gaining political capital from the current impasse on the naming issue. Im also interested to see Robo running to Dublin with his tails beteen his legs to sort out the current executive impasse.

  • riverlagen

    And no, if you are an Irish nationalist the term “North West Regional Council” is not accurate bacause the bulk of the landmass of the North West of the country is in Donegal.

    You might disagree about our view of nationality, but please try to respect it all the same.

    What is accurate is that the six counties are not part of the country named Ireland. Respect? You can’t even respect the name of this region of the UK. To get respect you have to earn it.

  • joeCanuck

    Campbell’s suggestion is a good one.
    Have a public competition, choose a few for a short list and let the voters decide at the next election.
    That’s what we did in my municipality a few years ago after amalgamation.

  • Brian Walker

    None of you appear to come from the area so it’s pretty cheeky of you to comment. Foyleside is a shopping centre; can you imagine anybody saying: “I’m going up to the North West regional council area for a pint?” Gregory is a Watersider and so only half counts. We citysiders within the Walls with Strabane connections are the full fruit of the vines and wish to retain the historic names. And so it shall be named: Derry and Strabane.
    I know it’s too obvious but everybody knows it
    will be.

    If only Gregory saw, the larger council area even eases some of the pressure over the London prefix. The area is now so much bigger than the city within the old boundary that a different name is is needed anyway. There are plenty of people who would like to get off the tedious old hook. The trade -off is obvious. You can make anything work, if you show a bit of good will. Council areas come and council areas go.. whatever the council areas are called, they will always be the six counties.

  • RepublicanStones

    About riverlagen me ‘aul flower the lack of respect stems from unionisms lack of respect for the democratic will of the irish people pre-partition which precipitated the establishment of the northern Rhodesia. If your gonna demand respect, don’t do it from such shakey ground. What was that saying about earning something?

  • sammaguire

    “We want to avoid an unwieldy name…”

    Funny, Gregory doesn’t appear to have a problem with “The United Kingdom Of Great Britain And Northern Ireland” for some reason…

  • Comrade Stalin

    “a”,

    I may be misunderstanding you, but why does the name have to be in Irish ? None of the other cities in NI are.

  • Comhairle an Fheabhail would suit it as a name I think.

  • Sean Og

    “I tend to agree that these compass point regional identities are a bit anaemic but if nationalists would be upset at the idea of a North West Regional Council how come a Sinn Fein Education Minister created North West Regional College (Strabane, L’derry & Limavady)?

    http://www.nwrc.ac.uk/

    Perry has the wrong end of the stick.

    It was DEL who set up the college he refers to. Minister Reg Empy (Unionist).

    But hey, don’t let the facts get in the way of the story.

  • OC

    It seems odd to argue over the proper name.
    In Irish, it’s “Doire”.
    In English, it’s “Londonderry”.
    Any English language reference is properly “Londonderry”.
    Any Irish language reference is properly “Doire”.

    And why is Dublin unacceptable compared to Baile A Cliath? Isn’t “Dublin” straight from the Irish?

  • ulsterfan

    What about” Bready, Newbuildings and Magheramason District Council”, with the District referring to Londonderry and Strabane?

  • Rory

    But, Dublin is perfectly acceptable, OC. It’s only Dubliners that the rest of Ireland has a problem with.

    Apart from The Dubliners of course.

    http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=jxBKgOyMzSc

  • Sneakers O’Toole

    It’s a perfect opportunity to settle the matter. The unionists and nationalists have both at some stage refused to be magnanimous in naming the council; it’s 1-1 now.

    Let’s not miss the chance to make the place a tourist attraction. Donegal has “Muff”, there’s a town in Austria called “Fucking”.

    I propose “Qunt Council”

    Off topic slightly, someone mentioned about other Northern Ireland place names not being in Irish. They’re actually a little more Irish than a lot of people realise…

    Ask an Irish speaker, in Irish, to take a dander down the “Old Church” road in west Belfast in his Celtic shirt and you’ll get a funny look.

  • ggn

    Sneakers O’Toole,

    The fact that the ‘culture’ minister’s name means ‘twisted mouth’, the leading anti-Irish bloke in the UUP name means ‘son of the ashamed one’, the leading unionist opponent of Irish medium education is called ‘son of the gentle servent’ and the uup’s deputy leader is called ‘ugly head’ is also moderately amusing.

  • Sneakers O’Toole

    Interesting, didn’t know that haha.

    “Edwin Poots” is a cracking name though. Very unusual.

  • Derry Regional Council is as accurate as it gets and it is fair in the sense that very soon there won’t be a Londonderry City, only a Derry.

    I’m sorry Gregory, you’re in a minority.

  • Brian Walker

    What about” Bready, Newbuildings and Magheramason District Council”, with the District referring to Londonderry and Strabane? ”

    Not bad ulsterfan, – why not the Ballymagorry, Artigarvan, Newbuildings, Gobnacsale, district council, abbreviated as BANG council?

  • Billy

    How odd that, when the council name reflects the feelings of the vast majority of the City population, Campbell is worried about trying not to offend anyone and wants a “middle-of-the-road” name.

    He wasn’t too bothered for all the years that the council was gerrymandered and the wishes (and rights) of the overwhelming number of Derry citizens were ignored.

    The current council name reflects the way the overwhelming majority in Derry want it – if Campbell doesn’t like it, he can always move. It’s called Democracy.

    Typical DUP, try to change the rules when the outcome no longer favours them, and they have the cheek to leccture other people about inconsistency. No wonder they’re such a laughing stock in Westminster.

    You couldn’t make it up.

  • ggn

    John,

    “Derry Regional Council”

    Strabane is in Tyrone, I think they may object to this!

    I can see it now … ‘aye, an’ them Dearry wans is sayin tha’ we’re in Derry too hi!’

  • ggn

    Culmore is not strictly in Derry city but it is almost as big as Strabane.

    For getting industry and jobs and prosperity Derry Regional Council would be best, and that respects the dominance of Derry in the region, rather than tries to please every indigenous area of population.

  • Brian Cowen

    Damn. I’ve looked it up and Kabul’s already taken.

  • The Raven

    Many of us over towards the Causeway are dead chuffed not to be involved in this particular spat, and indeed feel sorry for those in Strabane at having to be lumped in with them there Derry wans.

    However, there are some suggestions to remove the other sticking block, and change the County name back to its original….

  • borderline

    So.

    Gregory Campbell, that well-known moderate, and Glasgow Rangers cheerleader, wants an agreed name for his home turf.

    Fuck Off.

  • The original Sam Maguire

    The attitude of John O’Connell is one which would illustrate as to why Derry City Council should have been left untouched in these proposed New Council structures – nobody in their right mind would want anything to do with them.

    But on the flip side the first election should be good craic – Will the SDLP be completely wiped out in the old SDC area or will Eugene McMenamin be able to hang on to one of the two remaining SDLP seats?

  • Harry Flashman

    Strathfoyle would be a lovely name but for the fact that it’s already the name of a rather grim housing estate in Derry and anyway I’m not sure that Strabane is on the Foyle is it? I thought it was on the Mourne, I stand to be corrected.

  • Harry Flashman

    As regards Gregory’s alternative, how unimaginative, it reminds me of the local council area in Scotland based around the historic city of Sirling and encompassing Bannockburn and the beautiful Forth Valley.

    What name did the proto-Stalinists give this area?

    “Central”.

    Yes that’s right, it’s called Central Region.

    Fuck me.

  • Democratic

    “The current council name reflects the way the overwhelming majority in Derry want it – if Campbell doesn’t like it, he can always move”

    Ironically enough Billy – spoken like a true loyalist….

  • Harry Flashman,

    … I’m not sure that Strabane is on the Foyle is it?

    Strabane is on the Mourne, but just downstream the Mourne joins the Finn and seems to become the Foyle from then on. The bridge between Strabane and Lifford is called the Foyle Bridge. So Strabane is barely a few metres from the Foyle (and the Foyle forms the northern border of Strabane District).

  • Briso

    Foyle and Mourne Council could work.

    Brian W, were you serious about Derry and Strabane?

  • Dev

    How about Campbellgrad?

  • Big Maggie

    Brian W, were you serious about Derry and Strabane?

    Strabane should be in the name, but like this:

    West And North Council Excluding Regional Strabane

  • Billy

    Democratic

    “Ironically enough Billy – spoken like a true loyalist….

    As a constitutional Nationalist, I have always maintained that, as long as the majority of people in the North want to remain part of the UK, then so be it.

    The same rules apply to Derry Council.

    However, the difference is that I don’t ever support anyone being deprived of anything purely because of their religion and/or political views.

    For decades in Derry, Unionists gerrymandered the council to deprive Nationalists\Catholics of votes, jobs, houses etc. I don’t recall many Unionists, least of all the DUP, being concerned about anyone’s sensitivities particularly the Nationalist majority.

    Now, because the DUP are no longer able to do Nationalists down, lo and behold they are suddenly concerned with “fairness and sensivity.”

    Hypocrisy at it’s finest.

    Likewise, at local council level. Personally I don’t favour some of the steps that SF are taking re the removal of British symbols.

    However, there are many Unionist controlled conuncils in NI where, not only are Unionists not interested in a “neutral” environment but they go out of their way to be provocative to Nationalists on occasions.

    Even in Derry, there have been some moves at compromise by Nationalists, namimg the walled part of the City as Londonderry etc.

    However, even that isn’t enough for Unionists.

    For Campbell or the DUP to try and paint themselves as trying to be even-handed and crying foul about offended “Unionist sensitivities” is grossly hypocritical and, frankly, laughable.

    They are always in favour of majority rule (gerrymandered or otherwise) when it favours Unionists. However, it’s a totally different tune when it favours Nationalists.

    Are you truly surprised that the people in the UK/Westminster have long since seen through the DUP for the hypocrites they are.

    Is it any wonder that they are viewed scornfully outside the North? I think not.

  • ulsterfan

    Billy

    The DUP were not responsible for any gerrymandering in Londonderry.

  • Ian

    A Recollecting Nourish Town

  • riverlagen

    RepublicanStones

    So you believe it would have been acceptable for the whole of Ireland to be free of British rule – neglecting the fact that Unionists did not want to be part of a Republic. At least be consistent in your views. Partition was the fairest option.

  • Valenciano

    “Foyle and Mourne Council could work”

    The problem with Mourne is that it’s better known as the name of the the mountain range, which is not in this area obviously.

    “I hate names like North West Regional Council – they’ve done the same sort of thing with the glorious old names of Glasgow constituencies. Why not have a consultation and ask for suggestions?”

    Actually if you check their website they currently are having a consultation – members of the public have until 12 November to submit written representations and that will be followed by local enquiries in relevant areas. In short quit moaning on Slugger about it and make your views known!

  • Modernist

    “So you believe it would have been acceptable for the whole of Ireland to be free of British rule – neglecting the fact that Unionists did not want to be part of a Republic. At least be consistent in your views. Partition was the fairest option. ”

    Riverlagen the majority of Irish people never wanted to be invaded and then subdugated by the brits. Im going to rehash your statement that you aimed at RS.

    “So you believe it would have been acceptable for the whole of Ireland to UNDER British rule – neglecting the fact that 80%+ did not want to be part of a Union. ”
    Riverlagen Partition by the way it was carried out was a very unfair option especially for the Irish speaking areas of Tyrone or the majority nationalist towns/cities/areas of Derry/Newry/South Armagh etc.etc where the majority of people were forcably steamrolled(BY the guns of TERRORIST ORGANISATIONS such as the RIC, UVF etc…etc.;..) into a foreign state they wanted nothing to do with. Repartition in the 1920s may have brought about a lasting peace but the all or nothing approach of unionism really forced nationalism into a corner and British soldiers murdering unamrmed protesters in cold blood(some of whom were running away) didnt help things.

  • RepublicanStones

    ‘So you believe it would have been acceptable for the whole of Ireland to be free of British rule’

    Yes.
    Nevermind the manner in which British rule was extended over Ireland.

    ‘..neglecting the fact that Unionists did not want to be part of a Republic.’

    Ahh but you see, the irish never wanted to be part of your beloved union. Nevermind certain historical facts which lead to a ‘loyal’ minority in the north east of the country. But it seems you think every different politcal stance no matter how small the grouping may be, should be able to dictate to the vast majority. Ireland was viewed as one entity, there was no ‘Northern Ireland’ pre-partition or are you unaware of this?

  • perry

    “I hate names like North West Regional Council – they’ve done the same sort of thing with the glorious old names of Glasgow constituencies. Why not have a consultation and ask for suggestions?”

    Does anyone except maybe some of those in “East Londonderry” complain about the names of our westminster constituencies?

    Didn’t the UUP propose a 15 council model? Was that to be the 4 Belfast westminster constituenices + the 14 others? Anyone know what was wrong with that?

    And if we needed less could we not have just joined a few pairs of westminster constiuencies, perhaps in the more populous eastern counties to keep the areas down.

    How’s about;

    1.Belfast (4)
    2.North Down & Strangford (2)
    3.South Down & Lagan Valley (2)
    4.Newry, Armagh & Upper Bann (2)
    5.South & East Antrim (2)
    6.Foyle (1)
    7.Mid-Ulster (1)
    8.Fermanagh & South Tyrone (1)
    9.East Londonderry (1)
    10.North Antrim (1)
    11.West Tyrone (1)

    Can anyone tell me why we didn’t just do that? From a North Down perspective it makes more sense than a North Down and Ards deal that sees Dundonald being run from Lisburn.

    Map so you can see the westminster areas.

    http://www.ark.ac.uk/elections/