Sinn Fein unveil ‘good’ collusion…

GERRY Kelly is on speaking terms with the police. Gerry Adams said so. Baby steps…

  • heck

    nothing wrong with talking, after all jaw jaw is better that war war, but if SF are going to endorse the PSNI/UVF without major reform, including a complete and transparent investigation of torture, shoot to kill, and collusion policies, then count me out.

  • skinbop

    heck – consider yourself counted out.

  • Henry94

    heck

    Let’s not confuse two things.

    a complete and transparent investigation of torture, shoot to kill, and collusion policies

    is absolutely necessary but should not get in the way of a resolution of the policing issue which consists of one single point. It is current accountibility that matters if republicans are going to get involved in policing.

    Only accountibility can give the policed confidence in the police.

  • Nevin

    Is this call for transparency selective or comprehensive? Do we really want to know what ‘Daddy did in the war’ irrespective of who Daddy was? I suspect some folks might be a little surprised if they knew all about Daddy!!

  • seabhac siulach

    This de-facto recognition of the PSNI should be recognised as what is by Unionists…and welcomed…
    Each one of the planks on which they base their opposition to Sinn Fein in government are being withdrawn, one by one. Really all that is left is illusion. Hopefully the IMC report in October will bury once and for all any lingering doubt.
    This is strong signal that full Sinn Fein recognition of the PSNI is really only a matter of time (until, that is, the DUP ever start negotiating).
    Really the matter is in the hands of Unionists…
    Sinn Fein will sign up to policing if there is power sharing. That is the message, I would think.

  • Nevin

    [i]Sinn Fein will sign up to policing if there is power sharing. That is the message, I would think. [/i]

    LOL. There was power sharing some years ago ….

    Any thoughts on what the asking price on policing currently is?

  • seabhac siulach

    “LOL. There was power sharing some years ago ….”

    Yes, but we are closer to a full resolution of the problem now, post IRA-decommissioning, etc. The whole political scenario has changed with that act and the de-facto disbandment of the IRA…time has moved on…

    “Any thoughts on what the asking price on policing currently is?”

    I would imagine it is the full transfer of policing and justice powers to Stormont…apparently the Brits already have the appropriate legislation written up…so it is just a question of getting power-sharing agreed between the parties here…
    It is a Catch-22 situation really, Sinn Fein will not sign up to policing before the Stormont executive is set up and the DUP will not sit in a Stormont executive until Sinn Fein sign up to policing. Both sides will need to jump together on this, if serious about resolving these problems…

    Less of the LOL, please…

  • Nevin

    [i]the de-facto disbandment of the IRA[/i]

    What? No more love letters signed P O’Neill? No more ‘legimate’ government of Ireland hooey? Can you post a link to a report on the standing down of the Sinner Army Council? Even one without the names of the seven ‘ministers’ would do …

  • seabhac siulach

    Nevin:

    “What? No more love letters signed P O’Neill? No more ‘legimate’ government of Ireland hooey? Can you post a link to a report on the standing down of the Sinner Army Council? Even one without the names of the seven ‘ministers’ would do …”

    You sound like you miss them…(but then I guess things were simpler for you back then when the bombs were going off…)
    I used the words de-facto…meaning that, of course, there is no official report…
    And likely there never will be, instead the Provo-IRA will likely evolve into some sort of legitimised grouping eventually, or just fade away from inertia (This is realpolitick, as no army that does not consider itself defeated will ever officially disband itself)
    In any case, an army without guns, that has publicly pledged all its members to ‘exclusively peaceful means’ and to ‘not engage in any other activities whatsoever’ is clearly not much of an ‘army’ any more, is it?
    We could, in a bit of whataboutery, of course, also ask has Ulster Resistance disbanded and where is their statement of such? We could also ask where is their share of the weaponry (AK47s, grenades, etc.) imported from South Africa in 1988, with the help of Brit. Intelligence, and distributed between all the loyalist groups…

    Give it a rest, will you. There has been almost a year since the IRA statement of last year
    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_ireland/4724599.stm
    .
    Read it. And consider again the last 12 months…
    Obviously there has been a changed environment, which the IMC report in Oct. will likely further confirm.
    Unionists should consider all of these changes and recognise them as changes and react accordingly. Surely it is in the interests of Unionism to tie Republicans into the structures of the state (policing, Stormont) and in this way preserve the Union or am I missing something? So, why not negotiate? Do you think that nationalists will forever wait outside the gates?

  • páid

    Gerry is talking to the PSNI, Bertie is talking to the UDA but the wife won’t talk to me because I came home late last night.

    Funny ol’ world.

  • Nevin

    Seabhac, I do my own analysis and I try to differentiate between politicians and parapoliticians.

    I can observe the actions of loyalist paramilitaries and I can get various perspectives on republican ones. I’ve also noted a tendency on the part of some bankers, accountants, lawyers and businessmen to eat at the same trough as the paramilitary godfathers. I wouldn’t be at all surprised if some councillors and MLAs were also up to their necks in these dodgy deals.

    I’m not taken in by the honeyed words of loyalist and republican ‘political’ spokesmen and I’ll continue to highlight appeasement tactics of the political establishments in London and Dublin.

    I also find it quite disturbing that loyalist and republican godfathers are being promoted as role models for children. How sick is that?

  • harpo

    ‘Sinn Fein will sign up to policing if there is power sharing. That is the message, I would think.’

    SS

    Sorry, but we have heard that one before. Last time it was ‘the PIRA will decommission if there is power sharing’.

    It didn’t work then, and it won’t work now.

    I don’t really see that it matters if PSF sign up to policing or not. The PSNI exists and is operating.

  • harpo

    ‘You sound like you miss them…(but then I guess things were simpler for you back then when the bombs were going off…)’

    SS:

    So here we have the oldest of the old cliches – that unionists miss the PIRA. Why do nationalists keep on saying this, or that unionists would prefer ‘the war’ back?

    It’s nonsense, and is aimed at avoiding the point that we are cynical as to whether the PIRA has really gone away as people like you claim.

    Until the PIRA disbands it still exists, and as many a nationalist said in the past with respect to decommissioning ‘the PIRA can always get more weapons’.

    That remains the situation, so long as the PIRA exists (as it does), issues statements (as it does), and engages in criminal activity (as it does).

    Why shouldn’t we be cynical about your stupid claims about de facto disbandment? It either actually disbands or it doesn’t actually disband. Which one is it?

    And is that cliche to be used every time the PIRA is mentioned, even though it still exists? We want it to fuck of out of existence, and no, we can’t miss it since it still exists.