‘Balkanisation isn’t UK integration’…

AFTER Eric Waugh voiced regret and suspicions over the INLA assassination of Tory intelligence supremo Airey Neave, the former political adviser to the Thatcher cabinet member disputed his theory in the Belfast Telegraph.Waugh drew parallels between Neave’s “one or more regional councils”, which the MP believed would better integrate Northern Ireland into the UK, and the outcome of the recent Review of Public Administration some 25 years later. But Neave’s old adviser doesn’t see the comparison, arguing “they will carve up the province between unionists and republicans, with each having their own sphere”.

Is Balkanisation really inevitable?

  • topdeckomnibus


    about the Sue Ryder Homes founded by MI6 officers including Neave (would one of the NGOs the Soviets would be advised to look at in Moscow be the Leonard Cheshire Home set up there to debrief (sic) care for Russian Army Afghan Wat veterans ?)


    The Territorial Army paramilitary there (ex Army Intelligence HQ Templar Barracks Ashford ?) was he associated with Neave’s alleged paramilitary recruiter Col Robert Butler ?

    The lines of inquiry not pursued in the Hilda Murrell murder case ?

    All paths to Airey Neave paved with unlawful police no go areas.

    Let us hope that all paths from him would not end up the same way

  • Jeremy

    Quote from http://www.preventableterror.co.uk :

    In 1996 Gerry Adams, having the hump about the arms decommissioning proposals, told HM Govt it could have total war. Then the IRA electric mains attack team deployed

    The electric team?. Not sure about the site but i recommend it just for the experience. Its a real home alone effort.

  • Brian Boru

    Yes unless powersharing is restored. It would create a context where the 2 communities could work together for mutual benefit, rather than the usual “them and us” psychosis.

  • Ultonian Scottis American

    The encroachment upon Ulster is as old as the Tain Bó Cuailnge. Success one way or the other depends upon will and ability.

    St. Patrick saw Ulster whittled down to Ulidia, east of the Bann. It’s western border The Dane’s Cast, rather than Black Pig’s Dyke.

    Ulidia was finally broken in the 7th Century at the Battle of Moira, it’s Dalriadan resources in Ireland brokered away by St. Columcille at the Convention of Druim Cett earlier. Even help from allies in Britain couldn’t overcome this.

    It never quite went away, eventually becoming the Earldom of Ulster.

    So, now history is attempting to repeat itself.

  • topdeckomnibus

    Thanks Jeremy

    The site is referring to the pre-emptive arrests of an IRA team who were spotted on surveillance at Broad Oak sub station Canterbury in July 1996.

    They were found to have a number of devices in their London accommodation and viable plans to black out London and South East for 6 months.

    If such a plan were to succeed then the means to distribute energy collapses … so the means of supplying energy (that suddenl has nowhere useful to go) needs to shut down.

    The shut down of nuclear power plant requires power from the plant diesel backup generators.

    Hospital generators maintained properly to NHS standards are expected to fail 11 times out of 600 starts.

    Those on nuclear sites are assessed at 99% reliability.

    The failure of a backup in such a role (as at Chernobyl) causes problems about four hours after shut down when the plant goes critical.

    Whether this consequence arose by coincidence or otherwise I think the result might just fit the bill of “Total war”

    After the 1996 arrests Kent Police still refused to investigate the alleged saboteur of Cummins Petbow Generators.

    In August 1997, when more emerged about the connections between the Territorial Army recruited paramilitaries, the guard with the false army record of service who worked at the bombed Deal barracks and the alleged saboteur the fact remains that Sir John Grugeon Chair of Kent Police Authority called on his Chief constable David Phillips for inquiry.

    Kent Police refused to report to the Police Authority .. at this time the same Kent officers were conducting the Stephen Lawrence inquiry.

    In 1998 David Phillips Chief constable of Kent was sent to invigilate the Rosemary Nelson murder case.

    An objection was sent to Jack Straw, Mo Mowlem and Ronnie Flanagan against Philips deployment in the Nelson case when he was refusing to report re the Deal Barracks bombing, the failure to charge 21 TA paramilitaries and the 1996 attempted attack on mains electric.

    Flanagans Chief Exec Officer phoned the Home Office to expedite response from the Home Office to the call for Home Sec power to compel the inquiry and report called for in Aug 1997 by Kent Police Authority.

    David Phillips returned to Kent and the Home Sec did not compel the inquiry related to Deal bombing, Stage 3 sabotage, TA paramilitary, mains attack team

    The complainant against Phillips Ulster deployment was then threatened by a member of Kent Police Authority as was an expert witness re live fire paramilitary traing in Kent.

    Kent Police refused crime complaint against the police authroity member.

    But common law informations of misprision of treason were laid against the police authority member and a supt.

    The site does say that in the imaginary garden dont fail to seek the real toad.

    The Scottish Energy Minister contacted the author about the three serious nuclear incidents at Dounreay.

    Geeral De Chasterlain submitted a report to the NI Sec.

    The NI Sec was supposed to be declaring a position why the Garland Plan was not reflected in the decommissioning terms of the Peace Agreement.

    On April 18th 2005 (during the election campaign) Tony Blair contacted the author to say that his reports (complaints against Kent Police) had that day been copied to the NI Office on PM direction.

    Since then two more reports re the techniques of backup genny sabotage were acknowkedged by direct comms Downing St.

    Hope this is helpful

  • topdeckomnibus

    Here is a link to the McGill site


    Who spies for whom ?

    If I live long enough to see a truth emerge I would love to know whether a lot of skulduggery in England tagged against IRA was totally unknownn to them !!

    Such as thesetting up of vast safe house networks using sophisticated multiple address frauds against the mainland benfits system (the take making that Northern Bank robbery thing look a bit puny by the way ?)

  • Brian Boru

    “The encroachment upon Ulster is as old as the Tain Bó Cuailnge. Success one way or the other depends upon will and ability.

    St. Patrick saw Ulster whittled down to Ulidia, east of the Bann. It’s western border The Dane’s Cast, rather than Black Pig’s Dyke.

    Ulidia was finally broken in the 7th Century at the Battle of Moira, it’s Dalriadan resources in Ireland brokered away by St. Columcille at the Convention of Druim Cett earlier. Even help from allies in Britain couldn’t overcome this.

    It never quite went away, eventually becoming the Earldom of Ulster.

    So, now history is attempting to repeat itself.

    The earliest people in Ulster were the Gaels. Anything else is mythological. Dal Riada was founded by an Irish king – Niall of the Nine Hostages, whose ancestors, including the O’Neill’s, Neills, and McNeill’s and others were the kings of Dal Riada.

  • Ultonian Scottis American


    The earliest settlers in Ulster pre-date the Celts. Ulster had the only flint sites in Ireland, leading to a wealthy Neolithic power center there.

    The earliest Celtic people in Ulster pre-date the Gaels.

    None of the above is myth.

    Arguably, the Uladh of late 1st Century BC, spoke a P-Celtic language.

    As Eochaid Cairbre Rioghfhada is listed as king of Dal Riata in 165 A.D., it’s hard to reconcile to your statement re it’s founding by a 5th Century AD Niall Noigíallach.

    Dal Riata was a sub-kingship that owed its allegiance to their Uladh overlords, at least until Columcille’s actions.

    Recent research suggests that Dal Riata in Antrim was colonised by the Epidii from S.W. Scotland, which would make them P-Celts.

  • Brian Boru

    Oops. I didn’t mean to say the Gaels. The point I was trying to make is that Ulster was not ethnically distinct from the rest of Ireland in history before the plantations. I know that the Celts or whoever are supposed to have invaded the island in 600 BC or so, but they do not seem to have displaced the original ppl but rather they brought their language here, as the Arabs did in their invasions. Evidence about the earliest known habitation on the island of Ireland suggests it goes back 11,000 years. DNA testing by scientists in the South – including Donegal, Monaghan and Cavan which are part of historic Ulster – indicates that 80% down here are descended from the earliest people’s on the island. There is no reason to assume the results in the 9 counties would differ from the the rest of Ulster pre-plantation.

    Most of the High Kings of Ireland came from Ulster. Also, it is significant that St.Patrick was supposed to have been brought to Ireland in the early 5th century by Niall,as the 5th century was supposedly when the “Scots” went to modern day Scotland. This strongly suggests that the so-called “Scotii” were actually just the Irish. The near identical similarity between the Irish language and Scots Gaelic is especially indicative of this.

    DNA comparisons between Southern Ireland and Wales indicates a near identical match with 80% of the populations of men in both places sharing a DNA hapologen with the Basques, of all people. This ties in with an Irish legend of coming originally from Spain.

    The so-called Scots were Gaelic speakers and all are agreed on this.

    I would also point out that while you might be able to say that some of present-day Unionist community in NI may be descended from those who originally departed Ulster in the 5th century, that this could not be said of those of English descent as they are mainly Anglo-Saxon. Do you accept this?

    Note in particular the surnames shared by the Irish and Scots: Kennedy, MacDonald, Campbell, Lindsey/Lindsay, and the similarity between names like Doherty (Irish) and Docherty (Scottish) and Gallagher (Irish) and Gallacher (Scottish). This is clearly far more than a coincidence.

    Any wars between Dal Riada and other parts of Ireland should be seen as Irish civil wars, rather than wars between 2 countries.

  • Ultonian Scottis American

    Much of what you say is of course what has been long accepted.

    One can make an argument, however, that ancient Ulster belonged to a sphere of influence that included Earraghaidheal and the Hebrides, rather than the south of Ireland. Gaelic hegemony over Ulster in the 7th Century was of course a partial result of the spread of the Irish Church into north Britain.

    The DNA analysis of even “Anglo-Saxon” populations in England seems to suggest that even they are basically genetically the same as the pre-Celtic folks there.

    I am unclear as to English settlement patterns in Ulster since Elizabethen times, but of course the settlements of Scots from western Scotland and the Southern Uplands brought whole communities to Ulster. Some were Catholic Highlanders in the pay of Irish clan leaders. Others remnants of the Lordship of the Isles supporting the MacDonnell’s of Antrim. Others Gaelic speaking Protestants from Argyll. And still others Scots speaking Borderers. These last had once spoken Gaelic, and Cumbric before that.

  • Ultonian Scottis American

    BTW, when Brian Bóruma visited Armagh, he was recorded there contemporaneously as “Imperator Scotorum”, rather than “Imperator Hibernii” or such.

    I would be interested as to how he was styled in Latin in Leth Moga.

  • topdeckomnibus

    Thank you Slugger readers. That was interesting.

    I note the erudition of the historians.

    I wonder if they would give us the benefit of their expertise with regard to another couple of historical events ?

    (1) The return unharmed of Captain John Cornwell captured by IRA early 1970s. The implication being that he was more use to the IRA left in situ as a disciple of sandhurst chinless wonder officer in the British Army ! (It made a few of us laugh at the time but also we realised, with some trepidation, that the Irish were maybe a bit more on top of the game then the HMG command)

    (2) In 1970 RCA was installing some defence technology for USAF at Orford Ness Suffolk. A bit down the coast from Walberswick which was the home of Clement Freud MP and a social scene. There was a man who socialised with the Freud group. But he also had friends who were share fishermen working from the coast there above Orford Ness.

    A young NCO from a unit commanded by Captain John Cornwell was one of a number of Army technicians to transfer early to the reserve to take up civilian occupations. And he went off from the Army to work for RCA. It was not long before he found a had a buddy in Suffolk.

    This is the man referred to at the link above which I repeat