Tory Spokesman was not official….

The story posted with above title on Slugger O Toole has rattled many cages.

Responding to the narrative official spokesmen Jonathan Caine said:

“Both David Cameron and Sir Reg Empey made clear on Tuesday  afternoon their one hundred per cent commitment to the continuing partnership between the Conservative and Ulster Unionist parties.

“We remain determined to bring national mainstream politics to Northern Ireland and to end its semi detached political status.

“The person identified (in earlier post ) is not an official spokesman for the Conservatives and does not speak with authority of the Conservative Party.”

No one should doubt the standing or integrity of the individual quoted in earlier post.

As you can see Mr Caine was clearly not the author of those  quotes in the earlier post on Slugger.

I do my best to be fair.

  • “No one should doubt the standing or integrity of the individual quoted in earlier post.”

    Oh. Was it Jonathan Cainer, the astrologist? 😉

  • Garza

    Well if the link-up can survive this storm it can survive anything. Talk about a baptism of fire.

    Bad form Mallie, check your sources next time.

  • Paul

    very very poor stuff mallie you have being caught out hook line and sinker. you have scored massive own goal.you have damaged yourself and in fact deserve the comments posters have posted concerning yourself your shoddy thread.Its not the first time you have being caught out doing this.good luck to conservatives and unionists

  • Eamonn,

    excellent sfuff. Any chance of you emailing John Major for a quote?

    There will undoubtedly be more breaking of ranks from the unsustainable position of the Tory party supporting the anti-agreement UUP as the election nears.

    We can now look forward to the amusing prospect of the DUP (correctly)lecturing UCUNF on the need to put non-tribal politics behind them and to act in the interests of all the people of Ulster.

    …and David and Co will have an interesting time if and when they next visit the US of A.

  • Alias

    MU, if Dave is the next PM, the US Secretary of State’s lips will be firmly planted to his backside in the same manner that they are planted to the current PM’s backside. He will then decide British policy on NI (insofar as the Security Services advise him) and the US will then support it – as will the Irish government.

  • Mod UnUnionist

    “excellent sfuff.”

    I think you mean “fluff” there. FFS, Mod , Mr Mallie’s just admitted he’s dropped a journalistic clanger of the worst sort there, he most certainly will not appreciate your goodself as a cheerleader.

    OK, I’ve already given you a good outside tip to recover your losses to me, JA to take North Antrim, so here’s another. Anytime you see the headline on here “Senior NI Tory criticises pact blah, blah, blah” bet your bottom dollar with any bookie silly enough to take it that the “senior” Tory in question possesses the initials JP.

    Regarding David Cameron’s first meeting with President Obama, do you really, really think in the depths of your heart that Sir Reg will be on the agenda? A bit like your assertion of the Conservative vote crashing across the shires when the news of the Hatfield Talks broke…I think unlikely is the word I’m looking for.

  • Drumlins Rock

    oneil, I beginning to suspect the “senior tory” might not be JP himself but a mainland MP who is very close to him and takes his lead from him, he basically said the same thing at the time of the Hatfield talks and prob said sometihng similar when JP got the boot.

  • dodrade

    If Cameron cannot even strong arm a political pygmy like Sir Reg, what chance has he when in office of facing down the eurosceptic right wing of his party, especially after he caved in so quickly on Lisbon. Cameron is a spineless flake, a poor man’s Blair.

  • Harry J

    Mr Mallie’s just admitted he’s dropped a journalistic clanger of the worst sort there,……….

    how so, what is shows is that there is HUGE divisions within the tories over the pact with the UUP.

    what did you expect david cameron to say? they are heading for an election.

  • Oneill, me old chieftain, good to hear from you, still predicting 3 or 4 seats for the UUP?

    “Mr Mallie’s just admitted he’s dropped a journalistic clanger of the worst sort there, he most certainly will not appreciate your goodself as a cheerleader.”

    Eamonn referred to speaking to a ‘senior’ Tory are you suggesting he didnt? That is the substantive point, not if/that he incorrectly used the word ‘spokesman’.

    Regarding the Tories on tour in the US and trouble in the shires, we will have to wait and see but if the Labour party and the US Irish lobby play this well it will surely do damage. As many Tories are apt to compare Ulster to Afghanistan this just looks like a serious foreign policy blunder and that is even before they get into, if they do get into, power.

    What you should realise is that political parties spend a lot of money trying to drum up good publicity and when they get embroiled in embarrassing liaisons with inappropriate and irresponsible partners then they generally place that in the we fecked up badly column and seek not to repeat the mistake and that will surely mean trouble for project UCUNF.

    Tip for your goodself:
    When an official party spokesman denies that he is presiding over, what looks like a total disaster to most outside neutral observers, the poor unfortunate probably does not even believe it himself.

  • We remain determined to bring national mainstream politics to Northern Ireland and to end its semi detached political status.

    There’s only one way I read that (apart from total ignorance of the 1920 Act, all it embraces, and all that flows from it)…

    Remember: unless you support, vote for and show unswerving loyalty to Westminster (and one party in particular), you are “semi-detached”.

    I think I’ll await Dewi’s take on that one.

  • Harry J

    Lets not forget there is more trouble ahead for the UUP when sylvia declares her intention to run as an indepedent. Sir Reg will have overseen the 100% loss of ulster unionist seats, even before an election.

    Even Trimble couldnt manage that!

  • Garza

    lol this link-up with the tories must be doing something right, it is being hated on by all the right people.

  • Garza,

    “must be doing something right”

    Perhaps a bit unfair to ask, but maybe you could point to something, anything that might fall into that category since the good ship UCUNF was launched.

    Meanwhile a quick check from the very badly fecked up column

    Lost Sylvia.

    Lost some Catholics after just finding them.

    Lost their head of communications.

    Caused the leader of Tory party to be publically rebuked by the Obama administration.

    Forced the leader of Tory party to defend anti-agreement Unionism in Ulster.

    Forced the leader of Tory party to defend pro-tribal talks between UUP and the DUP.

    Publically re-inforced the UUP links with the Orange Order.

    Publically humiliated in Stormont in front of the worlds cameras first by Martin Mc Guinness and then by Peter Robinson for being anti-agreement and backward looking.

    Tip: Perhaps better to claim something more closely related to reality like Project UCUNF has been a complete shambles so far and we hope that with a fair wind it will not do any further damage to the UUP and our long suffering pals the Tories .

  • Sammy Wilson’s calculator for the sums

    “lol this link-up with the tories must be doing something right, it is being hated on by all the right people.”

    Most people on this website, especially four of its most prolific blog contributors, seem to loathe Sinn Fein: applying your logic, therefore, it would seem that the Shinners must also be doing something very, very right.

    P.S. Welcome back ItwasSammyMcNallywhatdoneit. Will your arch nemesis, L(T)U/Daphne’s husband also be making a long overdue return?

  • Drumlins Rock

    whos sammy?

  • Garza

    [quote]whos sammy?[/quote]

    Sammy is Moderare Unionist, he is a nationalist. For some reason he decided to play pretend to be a unionist.

    I wish I could say I was surprised, but I wasn’t.

  • Harry J

    how so, what is shows is that there is HUGE divisions within the tories over the pact with the UUP

    I don’t know how big Jeff or indeed his English Spokesman are physically, but I doubt they’d describe themselves as “huge”.

    “Oneill, me old chieftain, good to hear from you, still predicting 3 or 4 seats for the UUP?”

    Mod UnUnionist,

    As I told you before, instead of following the Slugger “Cognoscenti’s” interpretation pre the Euros, I followed my own instincts when I arrived at Mr Power’s establishment. Couple of weeks later, there I was again. Sinn Fein may not have been smashed in the interim, but believe me, I certainly enjoyed my caviar sarnies and champers regardless.

    Eamonn referred to speaking to a ‘senior’ Tory are you suggesting he didnt?

    Do you not think there is the slightest chance, that he is perhaps flattering the ego of the Tory in question in hope for further material for dodgy blogposts?

    Regarding the Tories on tour in the US and trouble in the shires, we will have to wait and see but if the Labour party and the US Irish lobby play this well it will surely do damage.

    They’ve taken zero collateral at the opinion polls over linking up with Mr Kamenski and his merry bunch, so I doubt there’ll be any effect in the wider UK. The “Irish Lobby” in the US? They hated the “Brits” before, they’ll hate the “Brits” after, no change there. Possibly we’ll now get the Iowa Democrats joining their colleagues in California and Phili in calling for “a “United” Ireland someday, maan”- most Unionists will be able to live that.

    What you should realise is that political parties spend a lot of money trying to drum up good publicity and when they get embroiled in embarrassing liaisons with inappropriate and irresponsible partners then they generally place that in the we fecked up badly column and seek not to repeat the mistake and that will surely mean trouble for project UCUNF.

    Question, despite the f-ups, and I’ll admit there’s been the odd one, what effect do you think it will have on the overall UK result? There’s perhaps rumblings in the dinner parties of Islington Central (doubt it though), maybe even the odd irate Comment is Free piece- again in the big picture, all that means zero where it really counts. Any longterm effects on the relationship will be most felt in NI and the jury is still out on that. But much more confident today about that too than 2 months ago.

    When an official party spokesman denies that he is presiding over, what looks like a total disaster to most outside neutral observers, the poor unfortunate probably does not even believe it himself.

    Would you include yourself as a “neutral observer”? How about the Dupes? Mr Mallie?

    When overexcitable journos cocks things up, then up it is the responsibility of party spokesman to put them right

    And finally, back to Harry J,

    Lets not forget there is more trouble ahead for the UUP when sylvia declares her intention to run as an indepedent. Sir Reg will have overseen the 100% loss of ulster unionist seats, even before an election.

    Even in DupeLand, where reality is never quite the same as the rest of sane humanity sees it, it should be acknowledged that it is the number of seats post not pre-election which counts. I’d rather Lady Hermon follows her political beliefs and stands for Labour, so we could have the same kind of contest that the rest of the UK sees, but if she wants to stand as independent, fair enough. I’m sure she won’t be counting her chickens the way her newly converted fan-club on here are doing.

  • GavBelfast

    The Ulster Unionist Party is NOT “anti-Agreement” – you know, the one they were architects of and which the people of Northern Ireland and the island backed overwhelmingly.

    But they ARE anti-Hillisborough “agreement” – the tacky carve-up they were all but excluded from.

    Huge difference.

  • whos sammy?

    Sammy is Moderare Unionist, he is a nationalist. For some reason he decided to play pretend to be a unionist.

    I wish I could say I was surprised, but I wasn’t.

    Posted by Garza on Mar 11, 2010 @ 06:46 PM

    Has that been confirmed?

  • oneill,

    no I would certainly not refer to myself as ‘neutral’ being a moderate unionist (cough) meself, although I’m quite a fan of the neutrality as expressed by the last Tory government whose views are reflected permanently in the GFA.

    I do like the “the f-ups, and I’ll admit there’s been the odd one” I feel we are making progress here and in the spirit of honesty in relation to your question “what effect do you think it will have on the overall UK result?” the answer is we dont know. If the Labour party have any sense or cunning they will beat the arse of the Tories with it, but I suppose bad publicity is like the old adage about advertising “50% of it is a waste of money, the trouble is no one knows which 50%”.

    Garza,

    I know you do like to hear from me and I was just wondering how you were getting along with your list of benefits (to go along side my long list of what my newest bestest betting pal Oneill calls f-ups ) springing from Project UCUNF – and just a reminder these will have to be real things that people can actually see rather than things that only exist in someone’s imagination sitting somewhere in deepest Surrey or some other far away place.

    Conquistador,

    re. Spot the Taig.

    to quote the great David Cameron a chap with clearly a great grasp of matters pertaining to the Northern Irish territories – “we need to move away from seeing things in terms of Nationalists and Unionists”.

  • link!

  • Sammy Wilson’s calculator for the sums,

    re. “Welcome back ItwasSammyMcNallywhatdoneit.”

    I’m sure the boul whatdoneit would approve of such sentiments but any suggestion of the return of the unmoderated LTU may be a cause of some disquiet.

  • Oh dear!

    On this site most posters views are known in advance and that is fine each is entitled to his/her opinion.

    If someone purports to be unbiased in his/her reporting of events, he should bloody well make sure he sustains that image at whatever cost.

    It is not good enough to be one thing to one person and another to someone else. We have politicians for that sort of thing…

  • Comrade Stalin

    I think you mean “fluff” there. FFS, Mod , Mr Mallie’s just admitted he’s dropped a journalistic clanger of the worst sort there, he most certainly will not appreciate your goodself as a cheerleader.

    It appears that some of the UCUNFers lack basic reading comprehension. Quoting Eamonn above :

    “No one should doubt the standing or integrity of the individual quoted in earlier post.

    Mallie is reporting the Tory rebuttal but he is standing by his source and what he said. I wouldn’t see eye to eye with him on a lot of things, but he is a journalist with a reputation for integrity and it’s a grave situation when people are accusing him of fabrication in the way you appear to be doing.

    You boys are spinning frantically but it’s going nowhere. The UUP’s decision to vote down Hillsborough was a serious miscalculation, apart from the fact that it demonstrated a world of difference between Cunningplan House and Central Office.

  • alan56

    Lets all use pretend identies and then we can all watch Alice In Wonderland and make sense of it

  • Harry J

    But they ARE anti-Hillisborough “agreement” – the tacky carve-up they were all but excluded from.

    Huge difference.
    Posted by GavBelfast on Mar 11, 2010 @ 07:02 PM

    —————

    Pity the Tories arent , they are split right down the middle coming into the election

  • alan56

    If all parties in devolved administrations followed exactly the national party line on everything…. then what is the point of devolution?

  • “No one should doubt the standing or integrity of the individual quoted in earlier post.”

    Comrade Stalin,

    No link, no name.

    When he comes back with either of the two then he’ll be take a bit more seriously.

  • Brian Walker

    I’m amazed at the amount of energy being burnt on this topic. What takes the biscuit is an earlier comment from “ijp” who I believe is the budding politician Ian Parsley. I think he may be saying the source isn’t me mate, although once again, he makes sure we know how close he is to the inner circle. As Trotsky’s career showed, cheek is an asset when you’re a loner but it also requires you to own up to failure. To blame the whole thing on Shaun Woodward is truly embarrassing. At this rate, Ian will soon have to take his carpet bag somewhere else.

  • alan56

    Brian,
    cannot see the IJP comment. Was it on another thread?

  • smellybigoxteronye

    Slugger really has gone downhill recently with the domination of posts from these so-called ex-“professionals” Emmonn and Brian and their joint anti-UUP campaign. Though maybe I shouldn’t have used the words “so-called” or the quotes judging by the absolutely dire quality of some of the journalists that we get on local Northern Ireland TV.

  • IJP

    What takes the biscuit, Brian, is someone who has burned more energy on this topic than anyone on Slugger expressing amazement about how much energy is being burnt on it! You personally have raised it more often than anyone else on here!

    You are also quick to resort to personal attacks against people you know very little about, but unwilling to address their actual arguments. Which, if I may say so, says an awful lot more about you than me.

  • IJP,

    You do seem like a reasonable kind of chap and we were promised ‘new politics’ would be ushered in by project UCUNF but I cant see how there is anything ‘new’ about trying to pin the blame for the UUP not voting YES on the SOS. This is real Yah-Boo politics of a very old sort – namely if something goes wrong you simply blame your political enemy ands in this case it just sounds plain silly.

    …and here’s a little query for you. According to David Cameron becuase the UUP and the Tories are separate parties he could not therefore tell the UUP how to vote BUT according to the BBC David Cameron did try to persuade the UUP to vote in favour of the deal. Can you confirm which is true?

  • Harry J

    so IJP are you for the hillsborough agreement or not.

    Reg isnt, McNarry isnt, in fact no UUP member is

    Are you?

    the splits are very clear now

  • Driftwood

    HarryJ
    2 simple questions

    Can a gay (ex) psychiatrist ‘cure’ gays? (including the ex husband of the daughter of the first minister)?

    How old is the planet Earth? (estimate).

    I could go on..

    But first things first.

  • dwatch

    [i]Sir Patrick Cormack, chairman of the all-party Commons Northern Ireland select committee, warned it would be “odd” for the UUP and Tories to stand on the same ticket in the general election after taking different sides. “It does look odd and it does look inconsistent,” Cormack said of the way in which the UUP voted no yesterday against the advice of Cameron. “But [the UUP] have got to explain themselves to their electorate. They’ve got to explain why they did not feel able to follow the advice of David Cameron.”[/i] http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2010/mar/10/uup-ulster-unionist-party-conservatives

  • Slugger really has gone downhill recently with the domination of posts from these so-called ex-“professionals” Emmonn and Brian and their joint anti-UUP campaign

    You may not agree with what’s contained in the posts but I’d say the quality of the blogging of *amateurs* on here, Donnelly, Mark, Turgon etc far outstrips anything delivered by the alleged professionals. Blogging is all about polemics and opinion but somewhere along the line to be taken seriously, you also need to back up that opinion with at least some hard, incontrovertible evidence.

    Furthermore, the difference between particularly Walker and the 3 other guys I mentioned is the little, but very important question, of transparency regarding personal political beliefs. I detest Donnelly’s views but he,at least, makes no attempt to mask them under a cloak of faux journalistic impartiality.

  • dwatch

    Lord Kilclooney, former UUP Strangford MP John Taylor is opposed to the UCUNF linkup. See Irish Times article:

    http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/ireland/2010/0311/1224266044301.html

  • oneill,

    I think your are being over sensitive (in what are clearly very difficult times for the UUP) as long as you accept Eamonn’s posts are based on facts , then they are clearly a boost to to the Slugger ‘product’.

    In relation to Brian, I cant really see any difference between what he is doing and what Pete Baker does in that both have their own views though both present them in a much less direct way than the three boyos you mentioned above as it the subject matter that is important not the messenger or the fact that the messenger once was a ‘proper’ journalist.

  • Driftwood,

    the fact that the DUP have a bunch of crazy policies does not in any way detract from the fact that on the issue of the transfer of police and justice the DUP have called it right and the UUP have called it worng.

  • Drumlins Rock

    MU, or SammyMcnally, or whoever, I see Eamonn still has not actually responded to any of the comments that his posts have raised, which you must agree is rather bad form on slugger?
    Anyways the finger seems to be pointing at Sir Patrick atm. as his “senior tory” and JP as his “local tory” which if true would make it just about factual, but not really a story as they both have been saying the same thing for months and months, Sir Patrick would count as senior in age terms, but despite his long service would def not be on the inner circles of the party I suspect.

  • Harry J

    DRIFTWOOD, are you speaking on behalf of IJP? is that his reply to the question: so IJP are you for the hillsborough agreement or not.

  • EM tweet: Bloggers are getting very exercised on website over Tory/UU links. People should stay calm and approach all this professionally!

    No. Really 🙂

  • Mod UnUnionist

    I think your are being over sensitive (in what are clearly very difficult times for the UUP) as long as you accept Eamonn’s posts are based on facts , then they are clearly a boost to to the Slugger ‘product’.

    Drumlins Rock’s answered that one. I think the first post produced by Mr Mallie was hyperbole for someone of his experience. Jeff Peel is good copy and actually an interesting read (if you don’t already his blog put it on your daily list) for journos, the fact that he and his English spokesman disagree with the link-up with the UUP is not news nor worthy of a post on here. Regarding Mr Mallie’s worth to Slugger, in all honesty his little gossipy titbits fit better into the Twitter concept

    In relation to Brian, I cant really see any difference between what he is doing and what Pete Baker does…

    Check out a Pete Baker post and count the amount of links in comparison to what Walker puts up in a typical post- that’s the difference. You may not like what he’s saying or interpret it the same way but he’s provided the factual back-up for what he’s saying.

  • Drumlins Rock

    well considering Eamonn is the supposed “professional” maybe he should have calmed down before he posted his original half baked story.

  • Slugger really has gone downhill recently with the domination of posts from these so-called ex-“professionals” Emmonn and Brian and their joint anti-UUP campaign.

    Now now smellybigoxteronye, Eamonn is a really good journalists and his slugger posts are really interesting.

  • oneill,

    re. P. Baker, “but he’s provided the factual back-up for what he’s saying.”

    I’m sorry but I cannot let that little demi canard slip by – a more selective bunch of facts you would not find in a big bunch of marching sundays as we fun loving Unionists are wont to enjoy.

  • Reader

    MU: I’m sorry but I cannot let that little demi canard slip by – a more selective bunch of facts you would not find in a big bunch of marching sundays as we fun loving Unionists are wont to enjoy.
    Hypothetically, you always had the option of responding with a few facts presenting the opposite case.

  • I’m sorry but I cannot let that little demi canard slip by – a more selective bunch of facts you would not find in a big bunch of marching sundays as we fun loving Unionists are wont to enjoy

    Mod UnUnionist,

    Sundays other than for “Somme Sunday” are not a great favourite for marching for obvious reasons for the fundos- ie it’s mentioned in the 10 commandments. I digress.

    As I said in my original post, whether you agree with those facts or their interpretation isn’t the point, with a Baker post they’re there. Walker’s, on the other hand is the equivalent of the pub-bore down Donaghdee Golf Club putting the world to rights over his GnT and Havanna.

  • Comrade Stalin

    I don’t see how an anti-UUP campaign is necessary, and indeed I do not see one. All of this could have been avoided had the party chosen to make a logical decision last Tuesday. The fact that they did not is – quite simply – a story in it’s own right.

    Let’s look in a bit more detail at the spinning that’s going on, especially from certain local Tories on here. The way I see it, there are two possibilities.

    – Cameron consulted his Conservative candidates, and his shadow NI Secretary, and asked for their opinion before speaking about the deal, which would mean that the local Tories supported the deal (like John Taylor and Sylvia apparently did). If that is the case, then how can local Tories justify their link with the UUP, and in particular, how can local Tories contributing to this thread justify trying to cover for the UUP ?

    – Cameron did not consult his candidates or his NI secretary and decided to make his comments on his own bat; or if he did consult, and they sided with the UUP, that he decided to ignore them. If that is the case, don’t local Tories feel let down by their party leader making a pronouncement that they disagree with on a major issue ? Do they want to argue to local voters that they should support a Prime Minister who completely ignore the concerns of local political representatives ?

    I suspect the truth is that Cameron, quite correctly, moved to uphold the bipartisan policy in Northern Ireland which was, in all fairness, started under the Conservatives in the first place. I also believe that local Conservatives do support the deal, being as they are somewhat more pragmatic than the UUP. This implies to me that Eamonn’s original contribution here from his source was almost certainly close to being on the nail, and it also leaves me wondering why local Tories are scrambling to defend the UUP’s serious political error.

    I do wish local Tories would spend more of their time trying to sell their policies and their linkup, rather than frantically scrambing to try to justify themselves by covering up UUP bad decisions which they know themselves to be wrong. Someone told me a long time ago, that if you find yourself defending the indefensible, it’s time to get out.

  • Reader

    Comrade Stalin: then how can local Tories justify their link with the UUP…
    Does that mean that a coalition can only survive if both parties share policies on every topic?
    And why should a difference of opinion over a bit of devolution be a deal breaker between a local party and a UK wide party? Especially since the deal doesn’t even cover elections to the devolved assembly!