Slugger ‘Operation Orange’ plans firm up a little

Plans for the 12th weekend are firming up, I’ve decided we won’t be running anything via Slugger for the bonfires though I will be attending one. If anyone is particularly interested drop me a line and I’ll try to help out.

For the 12th, well the 13th, the intention is to get to the Ardoyne feeder, the main Belfast parade, then Bangor and back for the Ardoyne return (was taking transport issues into account and am open to amendments).

Anyone wanting to join the group or act as guides drop me a line. Or feel free to get out there, do it yourself and report back.

ADDS: I’d be particularly keen on hearing a suggestion for replacing the morning Ardoyne one with something more rural but as most of those interested are greater Belfast based need a sensible geographical suggestion.

  • slug

    I think you should consider going to one of the designated official ORANGEFEST events. The Ardoyne feeder is unlikely to be one of these.

  • Mark McGregor

    slug,

    I was told Bangor was one of the ‘Orangefest’ events. That’s why I chose it. If that is wrong I’ll review the plan.

  • Ed Graham

    Yes – according to the Grand Lodge web site http://www.grandorangelodge.co.uk/ there are three “Flagship Twelfths” – Bangor, Banbridge and Larne

  • George

    I suggest you go to a 12th which is not an orangefest – at least you will get a more accurate account of the orange order without the add ons which make a orangefest more ‘acceptable’! Belfast has not been selected as a flagship this year for some reason. I thought it was supposed to be the best 12th parade but obviously its not. I resent this.

  • villager

    Don’t know what this flagship guff is all about, sounds like a PR gimmick. The County Armagh demonstration is in Armagh, it usually has lots of culchies if that’s what you’re looking for.

  • RepublicanStones

    Will you be letting us know about your jolly ‘auld time at the boney Mark once the blue bags have settled?

    George has a point…I’d suggest you steer clear of the ‘Orangefest’ events and head for something more traditional, to get a better taste of the atmosphere !

  • DTA

    Mark, as no one responded to my comment on your previous thread, (as a long time viewer, occasional commenter it is expected), I feel compelled to recommend Lurgan as a venue for your ’11th night’.

    I think you would gain a useful insight into the ‘real’ loyalist lumpenproletiarian idea of an expression of ‘culture’.

    As a republican living in the area, (however couldn’t be described as part of the nationalist or republican community) I must admit that any prejudices I had were firmly reinforced by attending such a display of blind bigotry.

    Also, as Lurgan is arguably the last (typically Irish, dare I say) town to begin to move on from the recent conflict I’d imagine there would be a considerable amount of community tension over the weekend. That’s not to mention a number of loyalist paramilitary groupings are expected to have a ‘show of strength’ that night. It may be useful in examining the OO’s links and/or acceptance of loyalist paramilitaries and blatant displays of anti-nationalist/ RC symbols and culture within the ‘celebration’

  • Frank

    Mark, you could simply go to Belfast and see if you can spot the convicted Shankill Butcher carrying an Orange Order banner commemorating another loyalist UVF murderer. He’s part of the local UVF lodge.

    http://www.troopsoutmovement.com/marchesuvfonspringfieldroadPicture.jpg

  • Gréagoir O Frainclín

    So Orangemen will be marching this year on Sunday 12th July. But what about the “Lord’s Day” aka “The Sabbath” and keeping it holy as all “good Christians” do.
    It’s a day of rest as god in the high heavens said, and marching on the Sunday would be blasphemy would it not.

    Any Orange theologians on hand?

  • Scaramoosh

    Enjoy the flags when you are in Bangor; the local militia have turned the place into an absolute eyesore befitting of an East Belfast slum. Highlighting, of course, the question as to who really runs this town, and putting a serious question mark over the efficacy of plans to pump 100m into a seafront development project…..

    http://www.spectatornewspapers.co.uk/news-and-events.asp?id=365

  • Gragor, the Rising Sons of William (QUB) has dates and other details.

  • Gréagoir O Frainclín

    So no marching on the 12th this year?

    BTW would that mean that bonfire night will be on the Sunday, with the annual effigies of Catholics and Tri-Colours daubed with the initials K.A.T. burnt.

    Very unchristian indeed!

    BTW, just taking the piss too.

  • Gréagoir O Frainclín

    “Mark, you could simply go to Belfast and see if you can spot the convicted Shankill Butcher carrying an Orange Order banner commemorating another loyalist UVF murderer. He’s part of the local UVF lodge.

    http://www.troopsoutmovement.com/marchesuvfonspringfieldroadPicture.jpg

    Ah, now where is that “Ulster is me homeland” bloke to give his two cents worth on this?

    BTW, wonder what ever happend to the “Peace & Justice” person as well as the “Cruimh” person too?

    Peace & Justice’s contributions were hilarious all of the time.

    Gréagóir O Frainclín

  • New Blue

    Gragoir

    While I in no way claim to be a theologian, I always believed that the new testament reaffirmed only 9 of the pre-christian 10 commandments – Jesus did not discuss the keeping the sabbath holy, he instead stated that every day should be given unto the lord.

    Maybe those who have a stronger understanding of such things can advise of the accuracy of my interpretation – am I right or am I speaking out my arse?

  • “the ICCP (Intra Community Cohesion Project), which erected the flags.”

    “who really runs this town”

    Scaramoosh, London and Dublin have ‘unofficially’ delegated control of many communities to loyalist and republican ‘heid yins’; PSNI officers are expected/directed to liaise with ‘community representatives’. It may not have been written into the 1998 Agreement but it’s what we’ve been given by the facilitators of our justice system.

    PS Don’t expect the MSM to educate us about this part of the political process.

  • “BTW, just taking the piss too.”

    Gragoir, there’s no harm in asking questions. I’ve asked lots of questions on NALIL blog. Some might feel that I’m taking the piss out of Ministers, MLAs and senior civil servants. Occasionally I am.

  • Gréagoir O Frainclín

    Aye, true indeed, cheers Nevin.

    It’s often the case that folk don’t know about the other community or ‘the other side’ and vice versa. And it’s often the case too that folk in either communities don’t even know about their own side.

    Gréagoir O Frainclín

  • eranu

    mark, heres a bit of a dare for you. if you are going to ardoyne, how about actually joining one of the lodges that are parading? maybe someone on slugger could have a word and get you a dress uniform (or whatever its called) and get you in to walk with a lodge? just an idea. you could get to experience taking part in a parade and probably also what it feels like to have abuse shouted at you. why experience watching when you can experience taking part???

    ofcourse if you’re scared you can always say no …. 😉

  • daisy

    Or you could all take the day off and go to the beach and enjoy yourselves, instead of trying to confirm what you already know of these events.

  • Drumlins Rock

    at last i can log a comment! (when did the requirement to register come in btw?)
    Mark, when you initially posted that you were going to take a chance and attend the 12th parade to try and see the other viewpoint I admired you for your courage, therfore I am disappoint to read what your plans are on this post, if you were genuinely interested in getting a different viewpoint and getting a real flavour of what its all about Ardoyne should be the very last place you should go to, in fact I think you should get well away from Greater Belfast, maybe you dont want to see a different viewpoint at all and are picking the palces they will most likely be reinforced.

  • Frank

    ‘mark, heres a bit of a dare for you. if you are going to ardoyne, how about actually joining one of the lodges that are parading? maybe someone on slugger could have a word and get you a dress uniform (or whatever its called) and get you in to walk with a lodge?’

    I suppose if Mark is comfortable marching with an Orange lodge that is led by a band who commemorate UVF terrorists!

    http://secure.bebo.com/PhotoAlbumBig.jsp?PageNbr=1&MemberId=9309370723&PhotoAlbumId=11014249425&PhotoId=11014307999

  • Jimmy Riddler

    Mark:

    If you want, if you really really want, I would accompany you to Scarva on the 13th (14th)?

    I grew up around those parts and know the field well but haven’t been in ages, and nor would I intend to go under normal circumstances.

    I would now consider myself a sceptic about the whole thing but I’m certain you’d be surprised by the relative banality and indeed peacefulness of that particular venue.

  • Mark McGregor

    Drumlins Rock,

    I don’t drive so Ardoyne, Belfast and Bangor seemed a fair spread. People haven’t been exactly beating the door down helping get it sorted so I had to make a call. As I said I’m open to sensible suggestions for dropping one of the Ardoyne legs.

    btw: I went to a rural parade tonight in Crumlin, well I lasted half of it.

  • Ulsters my homeland

    Hi Mark,

    If you are serious you would go to Kilkeel in the 11th, its rippin (is that that the right word?)….maybe cool?