Green New Deal – PEB

I received an email saying Slugger hasn’t linked the Green’s PEB, so here you go:

  • Daphné Tremble

    What a load of shite. He looks like a cross between a ponce and an ageing redundant pornstar.

    What sort of economics is that? Easy to talk shite when you have no chance of getting into power.

  • nineteensixtyseven

    I thought it was very good.

  • Barack Obama

    How is it shite exactly?

  • RepublicanStones

    One wonders what kind of porn Daphne watches !

  • Reader

    Sloppy thinking – incineration is not an alternative to reduce, reuse, recycle – it’s just step 4, better than landfill.
    And they are anti-nuclear and anti-GM too. So they will leave us all up shit creek without a paddle in 20 years. They need to offer a tempting, worldwide plan, but they absolutely refuse to offer us anything realistic.
    Nice people, but a bunch of Eloi.

  • the joxer

    He looks likes he’s up shit creek without a paddle…

  • Comrade Stalin

    Here’s a tenner son, way down to the Executive and get a haircut!

  • Nomad

    Hmm.. He does need a haircut and a suit that fits him..

    but the policies sound nice..

    though he can’t say “northrern” ireland…

    but on match your vote he seems to top everyones list. I hope he’s knocking on every door in the state to get his message out!

  • Mark McGregor

    Aside: got a leaflet from the Greens today with a heap of others. They haven’t put the agent’s name on it. tsk

  • Mark,

    I think we were the only two people in NI to notice that.

    I don’t agree with half the policies, but it’s reasonably well produced given it must have been done with a limited budget.

  • John O’Connell

    Maybe you could put the SDLP PEB link on Slugger as it has been overlooked mysteriously.

  • Rory Carr

    Right, Mark, so they’re engaging in leaflet pollution as well as sight pollution – what a haircut, what a suit. I thought he was auditioning to replace Paula as the weather man on a certain east European tv channel, “Ballymena – scorchio! Cullabeckey – scorchio! Fivemiletown – scorchio!”

    As for the 33,000 jobs he believes Green policies can produce which ” are not outsourceable” but which he lists as “plumbers, fitters, engineers,electricians, sales and marketing staff and project managers” we have to ask, ” Hello, Steven, don’t you know any Poles? You really must get out and about a wee bit more.” We have no power to stop the free movement of (cheaper) labour within Europe and jobs in Norn Iron do not necessarily mean jobs for Norn Ironers. Besides which one Green MEP could do absolutely Sweet Fanny Adams (no relation) to implement the policies he maintains would create such jobs. And he knows it. “Liar, liar, pants on fire, Steven!” (and while you’re at it throw the rest of that atrocious wardrobe on the pyre).

    But I must say that these Green people with their nice Bambi sentiments and goody-goody momma’s boy demeanour seeking political power really are worrying for we can be quite sure that once power was achieved the nastiness would come out big-time and I would bet a pound to a penny that they would be more than happy to align themselves with the far right and Fascist groups in order to get within sniffing distance of the big trough.

  • Mark McGregor

    Sammy,

    And both of us can name them all. Sad. In this case the missing Brian Wilson.

    John,

    Give me a link and I’ll put it up once I get back from the shop.

  • Reader

    Rory Carr: …we can be quite sure that once power was achieved the nastiness would come out big-time…
    Too cynical. But wait until they start calling themselves ‘New Green’.

  • LittlePoint

    It has a good clear message and at least gives the Greens’ stance on some of the issues which is more than the others do. I do agree that the suit does him no favours.

    Reader; the report ‘Burn or Bury’ shows that incineration has no significant environmental or economic advantage over landfill.

  • nineteensixtyseven

    Mark,

    Here’s the SDLP PEB: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=raX5P4oDV2o

  • Reader

    LittlePoint: Reader; the report ‘Burn or Bury’ shows that incineration has no significant environmental or economic advantage over landfill.
    The report compares ‘social costs’ rather than just environmental costs, and reaches that conclusion because landfill is cheap. Dirt cheap, in fact.

  • Eurocrat

    Its Friday night and some people obviously have nothing better to do than launch childish personal attacks on Steven Agnew. I know Steven and, although I don’t agree with his politics, he deserves to be treated with a little more respect. Afterall at least he has the balls to stand for a high-profile election like this, unlike some of the anonomous arm-chair politicans on this forum. Fair play to ya Steven, I liked the PEB, figures on green growth were slighty opimistic but I’ll certainly give you my #2

  • all good

    i have to say for the smallest party running i thought this was the best produced and i thought Agnew came across as pretty sincere regular guy compared with a dead behind the eyes politician. this is a good thing as it shows political diversity developing and hopefully more people will engage with politics. all good i say

    also people love puppys i bet the DUP wish they had thought of that

  • prolefodder

    Rory Carr, play the ball not the man – the figures about the jobs are not even from the Green Party but from the Carbon Trust.

    ‘Non-outsourceable’ jobs is perfectly consistent with fellow Europeans coming here to take them up…unless you think non-outsourceable means ‘locals who look like us and were born here’. He’s not doing a Gordon Brown talking about ‘British jobs for British people’ after all.

    And for your information there are 42 outgoing Green MEPs, so unlike a DUP or god forbid a TUV MEP, a Green one will be a member of a coherent group, unlike a SF MEP for that matter.

    And as for the Greens getting into bed with the far right…give me a break! The Greens in various European countries from Finland, Germany, France, Italy etc have beein in regoipnal and national government and NOT once have they aligned themselves with the far right. But I suppose this evidence should not get in the way of your childish and ill-informed wee rant that’s more appropriate to the name-calling in the playground than here on Slugger.

  • Mark McGregor

    prolefodder,

    Indeed. Some people are treating Steven as if he was still in short trousers and hasn’t started shaving.

    I’ve met him and his mum clearly lets him wear long trousers.

    He is a nice guy though but lets be honest if he gets 10k votes it’ll be a massive victory for the Greens. He like Parsley is an also ran, a candidate using this election to position himself for a council and MLA run – perfectably acceptable but lets not kid ourselves him or Ian ever entered the race as serious candidates.

  • prolefodder

    Mark
    Fair dues, but this thread is not about his chances but his PEB and policies etc. and the type of ‘analysis’ offered by some here is not worthy of the name – surely that’s the point here? Of course he’ll not win and doubling the Green vote to 10,000 will be an achievement but surely what Slugger is also about is an analysis of the policies and principles as well the horse-race?

  • Neil

    Christ, some people here really have too much time on their hands. He has shoulder-length hair and a beard? Big deal!

    And to whoever was making remarks about his suit, do you vote based on whether a candidate’s tie/shirt combo is colour coordinated? Grow up.

    Now that I think of it, there is no shortage of MLAs in Stormont who have an appalling dress sense and dodgy facial hair, so your argument doesn’t add up.

    Daphné Tremble – do you have any knowlege of green/sustainable economics? I’m no expert in economics, but the green version of economics makes a lot of sense, I suggest you read up on them before making baseless accusations of “talking shite”.

    The figures for 30,000 jobs weren’t some green propaganda effort, they came from the Carbon Trust, so the Greens didn’t magic them out of thin air.

    Rory Carr – Greens teaming up with fascists? What planet are you on?

    This is the only PPB that is really putting out a positive message rather than just resorting to slagging the opposition. Agnew is getting my vote.

  • Its a sound, issue driven broadcast and while I’m not instinctively a Green Party supporter I thought it was a good PEB.

    For the purposes of this election, Stephen’s making best use of the platform he’s been given and more power to him for it.

    On the production side the intermittent use of blue screen plays a discordant note (I always get worried when clouds don’t move) but what can you do on a limited budget?

    And really, his hair? Mark (McGregor) has put up a Eirigi leaflet on another thread, which has a go at the generally uniform appearance of politicians – pale, male and stale I think is the theme they’re going after, that and some general agit-prop which makes wild generalisations but doesn’t explain any alternatives.

    To be fair to Stephen he’s laying out his stall and it’s a damn sight better then this ‘top the poll’ crap we are getting off the DUP and the Shinners

  • pete whitcroft

    Leaflet info noticed by more than 2 people.
    If he wins a seat, I’m sure it will be brought up along with expenses.
    Lets see what pans out.

  • circles

    Now there’s a turn up for the books – a post where I actually find myself thinking that Rory Carr is full of shite. Is the missus making you eat those tofu burgeres again or what Rory?
    FFS what utter nonsense in each of the three paragraphs.
    The dig at the haircut and suit – admirably reactionary. It seems your radical days have come and gone.
    The blind stab at the job creation possibilites of sustainable industry – nationalist and short sighted.
    Greens aligning themselves with fascists – I hope this is the carry out speaking otherwise I’m surprised at how clueless you are.

  • faolchu

    Really, you might as well give Steven your number 1 and give your sectarian head count vote number 2 or if feeling very progressive vote Alliance 2 and then your sectarian head count 3. Don’t worry your ‘uns will still get in. I hope a bit more of a push in the Green direction will change the view that there are “no votes in the environment” to quote a certain sdlp member some year ago.

    Eventually the Green’s will drop the non nuke and anti GM posturing and listen to guru Dr James Lovelock in more detail. I.e become more scientific in their arguments rather than the heart felt ones. Not into fox hunting myself for instance but don’t think they are doing much harm except to an insignficant bit of the fox population. Fox hunters will die out soon due to inbreeding so why put it on manifesto? I know it gets a certain type of vote (but they are usually a bit nutty).

    Still voting Green no 1, other parties talk pants when it comes to protecting the environment.

    Bit annoyed about the attention to given by some posts to the look of the Green Candidate – what has that really to do with anything.

  • circles

    Faolchu – what speaks in favour of intoducing GM crops?

  • Rory Carr

    Since we are discussing the effectiveness or otherwise of an election broadcast it is perfectly correct that we comment upon upon all aspects of that broadcast including the effect the hair style, dress sense and general demeanour of the candidate might have upon the general public. Unworthy maybe but sadly not petty as on such unworthiness often rests the future of any candidate. Remember Michael Foot and his “duffel coat” (which in fact was not a duffel coat but a rather expensive Loden). Goodbye Michael. And Neil Kinnock’s gaucherie exposed as fell into the tide? Goodbye Neil. And remember Tony won out over Gordon merely because of his advantages of two working eyes, a flashing smile and an English accent. Yucky, I admit, but there you go, that’s modern democracy for you.

    It was Agnew who tantalised his audience with the possibilities of jobs that were “not outsourceable” by which he slyly intended Joe Public to think “jobs for locals”.

    I stick by my gut instincts that sooner or later the Greens will link up with the far right. I see such a drift as inevitable.

    In any case it is all irrelevent as indeed is Agnew and his party so he may as well please himself and dress and groom himself as he pleases. Just like the rest of us who aren’t going anywhere in public life either.

  • nineteensixtyseven

    “I stick by my gut instincts that sooner or later the Greens will link up with the far right. I see such a drift as inevitable.”

    A party that saw electing a leader a breach of non-hierarchical consensual principles until 2008 is hardly on its way to Fascism…

  • prolefodder

    Rory, on what basis are you claiming the greens will somehow inevitably link up with the far right? I find it frankly scary that anyone could think this as informed analysis? Come on,share what your crystal ball is telling you…and why

  • what were you watching?

    what greenscreen?

  • Eurocrat

    The Green PEB is very good. Good performance from Steven, he comes across genuine and down to earth and a positive message from the party. But realistically a vote for them would be the equivalent of putting a message in a bottle, dumping it off the coast of East Antrim and praying it reaches Brussels!

    Steven is a good, sound candidate and a nice guy to boot but some of the figures in the broadcast are just pie-in the sky! Yes the potential is there for a Europe-wide process of ecological modernisation and a green new deal that can help recover economies from the economic crisis.

    But the figures of 33,000 green collar jobs in Northern Ireland is simply not reliable research. I acknowledge that this research was not conducted by the Green Party- but the Cabon Trust are not a wholly independent body on the issue and frankly are promoting their own agenda. Ever heard of Environmentality?

    I think the assertations on this forum that the Greens represent the only vechile towards creating a more sustainable model of development are quite facile and generalised. The SDLP, have a much stronger record at Stormont in representing green interests and in presenting policies or initiatives aimed at protecting the environment. And at the European-level, during his tenure in the European Parliament John Hume had a 100% voting record on green issues: http://www.foe.co.uk/northern_ireland/press_releases/euro_green_votes_result.html.

    I agree with alot of the Green’s policies, particularly in regards to keeping the EU GM-Free and standing against despicabel fox-hunting.. but the Green Party are not the only political authority on ‘green politics’. There are alternatives.

    But good luck to Steven in the election, as Donal mentions, at least his candidacy has prompted some actual debate around policy issues- representing a refreshing departure from the usual top-the-poll guff spewed out by the DUP and SF. Who the hell cares? I’d much rather talk about more serious issues such as flawed carbon trading initiatives in the EU.

  • Rory Carr

    It is simple really, Prolefodder, it is a rule of thumb that ardent individualists with a single issue fetish of current fashion such as the Greens, group together politically only in the hope of singular advantage.

    Their total lack of any societal analysis betokens a slavish acceptance of the very economic staus quo which has produced all the ills against which they rail. They therefore cannot hope to develop a programme to combat all that they say is wrong and can only really squeak along seeking the recognition of the masters for their well-meaning, doe-eyed critique. This is happily given by the multi-nationals as green image branding has proven highly successful with little cost outside of new green image packaging and advertising expense.

    They are thus capable of being defined as a party of opportunism and inevitably in times of great economic crisis such groups gravitate (with astounding rapidity) further and further to the right.

    The most dangerous fascist imagery of our era is not so much the swastika as it is Bambi that much more deceptive cutesy-pie emotional deceiver.

    Anyway, you’re young yet, you should live to see it.

  • circles

    Is that what happened with the greens in germany rory? They started painting a black bambi in a white circle on a red flag?
    Prolefedder may be young, but are you not slipping into your dotage? Of course if you could provide a single example you may seem slightly less off kilter.

  • guillaume

    Are these the same Greens that sold out Tara to get into bedroom with FF?

  • ricky tiky

    This guy looks out of his depth. Cadogan Eright would have made a much better candidate.

  • faolchu

    I do recall John Hume’s glasses being slighty skewed all the time and his hair somewhat unkempt but that didn’t stop his vote. Of course if you are new on the scene first impressions are important but style fascism is something we have to get away from too and I’d vote for that. I personally don’t care how politicans look.

    Now that I’ve mentioned fascism it may be worth mentioning that the NAZI party sort of began as an proto- eco group living in the forests of germany. But things sort of got out of hand with the idea of the survival of the fittest fitting in with a bruised national identity and a fear of the rise of communism, hyper inflation and numerous other factors and unfair Treaty of Versaillles. Don’t think we are going to get into in the same position with Steven somehow.

    Also whereas John Hume had good green credentials others in the SDLP most recently have had a poor record. All I am going to say is although I have the greatest respect for many in the party some have a very pro development agenda and a short termist view that could lead us into a Donegalisation of the Northern Ireland Countryside. By that I mean uncontrolled housing and road development everywhere with no concept of the damage it causes on lots of different levels. Next time a listed building or important habitat is bulldozed during the night they will all be on TV condemning it but will do zero in terms of tightening up legislation or enforcement.

    As for GM and fox hunting I think they are important but not the most important issues for a Green party to be worrying about. Don’t forget that we have been genetically engineering crops since farming began (9000 years ago approx). An interesting take on GM is that the use of some GM crops means less fertiliser and herbi/pesticides
    thereforeless pollution of waterways. What we need is a good accreditation system before using them as some could be toxic to wildlife or cause genetic pollution.

    Another example on GM: Carrot orange hue is
    due to artifical plant breeding in Holland in the 1700’s. But it’s soooooo unatural. How did we let that happen. Anti GM arguments are 95% pants. I think it’s the agressive marketing of Monsanto in the US and developing world with their GM seeds that has got peoples backs up and rightly so.
    I am still voting Green number one-show the other parties that you give a shit about the world you live in and give the Green’s a healthy amount of 1st votes. your vote can be transfered to your next favoured person. In green terms it’s got to be Alban or Parsley. The rest are a bit nutty.

  • circles

    Faolchu – there is a major difference between selective breeding, where particularly chracteristics of plants are emphasised through their selection, and GM where genetic information from other sources is introduced into the plant itself.
    Rolling out the old nonsense that agriculutre in itself is GM is a load of bollox. The genetic information is not modified in agriculture it is accentuated – just as it is in dog breeding.
    What GM is, is another example of people getting ahead of themselves and thinking that because we can do it, we should do it, with absolutely no clue of what the broader consequences might be.

  • Rory Carr

    “Is that what happened with the greens in germany rory? They started painting a black bambi in a white circle on a red flag?”

    Not yet, Circles, but it’s early days. Give ’em time.

    As to references to a candidate’s general appearance and dress sense, at least Turgon agrees that it is fair comment as we can discern from his latest thread on the election campaign:

    “I must admit that DeBrún herself has been much more impressive on the media than I remember her from before. The clothes look expensive and yet close to trendy: her whole appearance is much less the school teacher spinster than I remember from before.”

  • circles

    Yeah I saw Turgon’s thinly disguised liebeserklärung to Ms DeBrún – whatever would Jimbo A make of that?
    Although a bit of an “across the barricades” love story wouldn’t go amiss to liven this place up a bit.
    But I won’t be waiting for Joschka Fischer to be growing that wee moustache and pulling on the knee high boots for a triumphant march back into the Bundestag as part of a far right coalition any day soon Rory.

  • Pancho

    The green party moving to the far right???

    Trimble will be leader of the Alliance next!

    Anybody who has actually read up on the Greens or even have a basic understanding of their principals would never be stupid enough to claim that they might even tip-toe to the right. That claim astounds me.

    Are people scared of the Greens here? The personal attacks towards a very strong politically minded politician are horrendous, childish and pathetic. Obviously he needs a bald patch and a belly.

    Ridiculous.

  • Rory Carr

    “Obviously he [Agnew] needs a bald patch and a belly.”

    Well then, Pancho, he won’t have long to wait – he’s well on the way already and is clearly already practising his combover.

  • Reader

    circles: Rolling out the old nonsense that agriculutre in itself is GM is a load of bollox. The genetic information is not modified in agriculture it is accentuated – just as it is in dog breeding.
    Actually, some types of selective breeding have stressed the breeding population to increase the mutation rate and produce a more diverse population to breed from. This was before anyone knew about genes, and long before GM allowed people to control mutations specifically. There was loads of cunning stuff before GM.
    Anyway – back to nature:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plant_breeding

  • Observe

    Christ some people on this blog are dour twits! haha.

    Come on guys, the PPB is very well put together for a party that has to be on a low budget. They have one MLA and from their rather surprising assault on the 2007 elections they must have blown all their savings.

    The production and content is pretty sound and the candidate comes across as genuine.

    Also watching Agnew on hearts and minds a couple of weeks ago he hugely outshined Alban Maginess who appeared rude and arogant or the Alliance candidate who simply waves his hands infront of him during interviews to try to distract us from the non-sense he comes out with.

    The greens have done a great job in pushing their message forward with this election campaign. They dragged the Alliance out for a fight, they presented themselves well and they will ultimately get a good vote. They will not get in but for f**ks for trying!