“I’m talking to Jim.”

One of the interesting points to note about today’s shenanigans in the Northern Ireland Assembly was that the Speaker’s ruling came about because of a complaint from Sinn Féin Chief Whip Carál Ní Chuilín that, during a debate on the Consultative Group on the Past’s report, the DUP’s Nelson McCausland had made an “allegation of criminal behaviour” against Sinn Fein’s Gerry Adams, MP, MLA. On Stormont Live today SF’s Carál Ní Chuilín and the SDLP’s Carmel Hanna discussed, sort of, what the general problem was.. And below the fold Nelson McCausland repeats his comments outside the chamber. For the benefit of anyone who missed them..

Here’s Speaker William Hay ejecting Nelson McCausland from the Assembly, for one day.

And outside the Assembly precinct BBC NI’s Jim Fitzpatrick spoke to DUP MLA Nelson McCausland.

Adds “scurrilous allegations”, apparently..

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  • Comrade Stalin

    The point about McCausland not repeating the remarks outside the assembly seems moot, given that there is a stack of books, newspaper articles and other things alleging that Gerry Adams was in the IRA and that he’s never once tried to take anyone to court for slander or libel despite threatening to do so many times. In fact I suspect that given that he has failed to challenge it to date, he would have great difficulty doing so now.

  • I think Adams knows that nobody would really gain anything from a court case. Would the court’s decision be accepted as the truth?

    And if saying ‘Provisional Sinn Féin’ is unparliamentary, then surely saying ‘New Labour’ in Westminster ought to be deemed unparliamentary!

  • Diluted Orange

    [i]’McCausland refuses to make the comments outside the chamber where they can be challenged?'[/i]

    So what possible challenge could be made to the statement of an unadulterated fact?

    Sinn Fein want Northern Ireland to have a consultation process on the past so long as it’s on their terms. They don’t want to recognise, nevermind scrutinize, the IRA’s major role in the events of the past, and Gerry Adams’, …, etc management role within the IRA in planning those atrocities.

    So I ask what is the point? If neither side is willing to do anything other than finger point and engage in the futile exercise of trying to demonstrate to the world that once and for all one side in particular acted much more heinously than the ‘good guys’ over the course of 40 years then there is no point in the whole debacle.

    It’s time to stop the hand-wringing and the posturing over a painful episode in history and move on – no matter how difficult it is. We have just got to accept that there is never going to be closure, we are never going to be able to put everything into a nice little box and move on. The honesty, willingness to forgive and will to disclose the truth just does not exist on either side to make such a consultation work. So frankly we should stop wasting time and money on it.

    As for Nelson McCausland – I guess he thinks he’s a big shot in stating the obvious. Flavour of the month amongst the clapping imbeciles within the DUP. If this is the best the Assembly can come up with in extraordinary times of economic woe they should just close the whole place down.

  • Comrade Stalin

    Reading Hansard, Diluted, anyone could be forgiven for feeling that way. The first 30 minutes of business in the assembly today were spent with cat-calling and barracking of the Speaker by the DUP. It’s an absolutely shameful way for a legislative body to conduct itself. Unfortunately, Speaker – this one and previous ones – have allowed spurious points of order to become the norm when Members wish to interrupt business in order to play petty political point-scoring.

  • Archie Purple

    [Keep it civil – edited moderator]

    McCausland was 100% correct in what he said.

  • Comrade Stalin

    Hmm, oh look. It says “Provisional Sinn Fein” right there in big letters on the front page of their homepage.

  • gerry a

    comrade stalin,

    the link you posted is not the sinn fein website or its homepage. this is….

    http://www.sinnfein.ie

  • cynic

    Arent the Shinners getting mixed up or am I confused?

    Gerry told us you cannot be a republican and a criminal. But now SF says that accusing him of being a member of PIRA is accusing him of a criminal act.

    Didn’t all those boys in the H Blocks fight for just this point?

  • CMB

    There seems to be a couple of threads on this topic but I feel I have to repeat myself partly again about this incident.

    Shame on the Speaker since when did the written truth never mind spoken truth become a reason for despatching someone from the Chamber, surely it is not unparliamentary to state the words of the IRA itself. Does the speaker have a difficulty with the truth about Mr Adams and if not why should that have given the speaker such a problem or is he in the pocket of Sinn Fein.

    Nelson McCausland was ejected from the assembly because he was stating facts which were written by the Provisional I R A themselves and the sooner the Speaker gets that through in his own mind and conducts the business of the Assembly in a more fair handed manner and not siding with Republicans who would not know the truth if it jumped up and bit them the sooner the public will take the house on the hill a bit more serious.

    I have to agree that the facts are in the public domain and it is obvious Gerry Adams does not like the past as it portrays him, as he sees himself as a roving statesman others may have a problem with this description but that surely does not abdicate the Speakers responsibility to stand up for the truth against Republicans trying to silence other members.

    Watching BBC Stormont Live today it says more about the background of some in that Chamber in wanting free speech silenced especially as it came from a convicted criminal and this is also common knowledge and she did not deny her background on air today pity Mr Adams was not as free in talking about his past.

  • Archie Purple

    Wasn’t Carol [edited moderator] extremely nasty to Carmel Hanna….bitchy perhaps and didn’t tell us anything…does she know that the shinners are only Provisional?

  • Dan Breen’s Revolver

    WOW JEEZUS CHRIST CAN THESE PEOPLE GET OVER THE GODDAMN PAST. THIS STUFF HAPPENS AT LEAST ONCE A MONTH.

    EVERYONE KNOWS HE WAS IN THE PIRA. HIS SUPPORTERS< THOSE WHO HATE HIM< AND THOSE OVERSEAS. WHAT IS THE POINT OF ALL THIS

  • NCM

    Cynic: “Gerry told us you cannot be a republican and a criminal. But now SF says that accusing him of being a member of PIRA is accusing him of a criminal act.

    Didn’t all those boys in the H Blocks fight for just this point?”

    Perhaps SF should stop selling the hunger striker posters in its online bookstore and replace them with posters of Thatcher instead, to keep SF from being seen as opposing the British state and to make sure its new-found love of British law and order is promoted and to make sure Gerry Adams isn’t seen as associating with unwashed and dirty people who wouldn’t just admit that they were common criminals who rightfully should be classified as such by the British state [sarcasm].

  • Christopher Madden

    Nelson McCauseland, as usual, is trying to stir up unnecessary trouble. Who cares if Adams was a member of the IRA 20 years ago. The assembly should stop debating these trivial issues and get down to sorting out the economy.

    I noticed the only person who didn’t stand up to give Nelson a farewell was none other than Dr. Paisley; clearly the only man on the DUP side with a bit of decorum.

  • disgusted

    Very disappointed in Carmel Hanna. Caral could be immature and call the SDLP the stoop down low party or some other reference where she would clearly be having a poke at them but shes not going to go down that road. Carmel going on about Provisional Sinn Féin is just silly chat, the official name is Sinn Féin and the SDLP would do well to stay clear of the playground politics of the DUP.

  • cynic

    WHAT IS THE POINT OF ALL THIS

    Dan

    Very good question. Why does he lie about it? That’s a problem of the present.

  • Comrade Stalin

    gerry a:

    Both sites are hosted on the same ISP, and the http://www.sinnfein.org site looks like how I remember it from about ten years ago. I don’t see why the term “Provisional Sinn Fein” would have been okay back then but not now.

  • Archie Purple

    TAKEN FROM THE SINN FEIN WEBSITE: [edited by moderator]

    Provisional Sinn Fein
    Sinn Fein seeks the establishment of a new Ireland based on sustainable social and economic development; genuine democracy, participation, equality and justice at all levels of the economy and society; and a lasting and meaningful peace with unity of purpose and action.
    Specifically:

  • Censor at work

    I would like to know who did the edit to Carál Ní Chuilín’s comments on the Stormont Live video as it certainly doesn’t match exactly what she said yesterday while live in the studio. The BBC IPod cast is the same. Watch carefully at 6.43 and you will see the clear but very careful edit which has her saying “the usage of words and the way in which the Br.. conduct their business at times I think in a derogatory way”

    I definitely heard the words “British parliament” being uttered yesterday but they have now been cut out. Who asked for the edit and who agreed to the edit???
    Seems someone wanted to cover-up her slip of tongue.

  • blinding

    Unfortunately Northern Ireland has to suffer these dinosaurs until the grim reaper in his wisdom decides to move the old duffers on.

    Hopefull in ten or more years there will be a new generation of politicians with some new ideas on how to go forward and end to this lot that because they thrived in the conflict of the past are loathe to leave it behind.

  • Mark McGregor

    To the best of my recollection:

    The sinnfein.org website is not an official Sinn Fein website. It used to be years ago.

    When they upgraded many moons ago the old webmaster took the nick, kept the domain name, kept running the site and charges for content while having nothing to do with SF.

  • Folks

    Gerry Adams really does have a problem in admitting that he is a former leader of the IRA.

    It relates to his links with the Catholic Church in Clonard and his desire not to be convicted of being regarded as the Antichrist, a possibility that he became aware of in 1986.

    I think you’ll find that there is no other explanation for his refusal to face up to his reality.

    The simple explanation is that his name comes out at 666, and he fulfils several of the descriptive prophecies in the Book of Revelation and he is worried.

    Being a cute hoor, he thinks that he can fight this Antichrist designation by simply ignoring it and laughing at all who raise it.

    Wouldn’t you do that too, if you were surrounded by the kind of people he is surrounded by (who all think that they’re great Christians fighting the Just War).

  • Earnan

    I had always hoped the anti christ would be someone more important, powerful, and epic.

    Not some two bit former para military leader turned politician for some tiny, irrelevant (to the greater world) province of the UK

  • Earnan

    The Antichrist has many parallels with the Christ, all of which you have touched on.

    Jesus was a two-bit healer and teacher who, despite his credibility problems as a nobody in Caesar’s domain, chanced upon a great message and changed the world.

    Adams is similar. He is a nobody by all accounts but inpires extreme emotions in people. What’s the probability that he has actually chanced upon the negative of Christ’s message despite all the pressures for him to have been a nobody. Violence is one thing he made perfect, brutality, intimidation, loyalty through fear. Sinn Fein is the perfect Antichristian Church, and was acting fulsomely in this way in the 1980’s when I calculated the name at 666.

    Nietzsche would be proud of Adams in that he was, like Adams, the originator of the Antichristian philosophy. See his book, The Antichrist.

    He rejected compassion, lambasted the early Christians for undermining the Roman empire and all empires and is generally extremely right wing.

  • Comrade Stalin

    Mark,

    Thanks for the correction. That’s what happens when you let the American wannabes have too much say 🙂