“neither justice nor truth..”

Several reports on the leaked proposals from the Consultative Group on the Past – the ‘bad bank’ option to deal with the toxic debt of those poisonous foundations – include a quote from co-Chairman Denis Bradley which illustrates the problem with focussing on victims, however defined, rather than society in general. From the Irish Times report.

“Over the past number of days we have heard some victims’ groups saying we don’t want money, we want justice. Others have said we don’t want money, we want truth. They are right to say that and our report will reflect both points of view,” Mr Bradley said.

“Equally they have to respect those who told us that they wanted neither justice nor truth. Others that we met want recognition by our society of their loss and suffering,” he said.

Justice, after all, is the glue that holds society together..

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  • Bemused

    The nutters strike again…..

    http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_ireland/7855035.stm

    If Willie and Cedric are against the £12k then maybe it’s not such a bad idea after all?

  • William

    The Government have enshrined in law the definition of ‘victim’, namely that anyone killed due to the 30+ years of terrorism is a victim.

    It is not one I share – I cannot see how Begley, one of the Shankill bombers can enjoy the same status as the Frizzel family, three of whom perished, along with others, in the bomb. Likewise the innocent Dog club members in Le Mon House, or victims of Bloody Friday, or the nine innocents in Claudy. Are these people who died the same as Jim Lynagh, who murdered over 30 [we are told] and met his death whilst trying to bomb Loughgall RUC station. Those are just some incidences that come to mind. There are prepretators in both main communities – loyalist killers are no different than Republican terrorists and equally should enjoy any financial benefits because of this report from Eames/ Bradley.

    The idea that all are victims is a total nonsense, whilst the tears may be same for families, perpretators should not be elevated to the same level as those who died because of them.

  • William

    CORRECTION

    ‘…equally should NOT enjoy any financial benefits because of this report from Eames/ Bradley.’

  • cynic

    “Over the past number of days we have heard some victims’ groups saying we don’t want money, we want justice. Others have said we don’t want money, we want truth.”

    So who wanted the money then?

    That’s the immediate cause of the conflict in this.

    Eames is also quoted as saying that ‘there is no hierarchy of victims’. Well, in once sense they are all equal in the graveyard.How and why they came to be there is quite a different matter.

    This will drag on and on to no real effect. I think its now time to draw a line in the sand. Terribly sorry. Many many people were killed but its over. No more enquiries. No more futile investigations. It’s done.

    Perhaps some enhancement of support for Victims through the Victims Commissioners (remember them anyone?) whose profile has been vanishingly small. We will probably need some additional investment in medical support for thsoe suffereing Post Traumatic Stress Disorder (whether from the loss of a loved one or what they have seen on the streets).

    But that’s it. It’s over. No more picking at the scabs of old wounds. No more funding for a victims industry.

  • Driftwood

    Well said cynic
    And goodnight to the victims commissioners freeloaders

  • cynic

    “victims commissioners freeloaders”

    I don’t totally agree with you on that. They have been ineffectual but have really been sidelined by those ‘political leaders’ and ‘community reps’ seeking to make a fast political buck from Victims issues. MOPEery gone mad.

  • cynic

    “The nutters strike again”

    ….actually Wullie looked almost quite reasonable in what he did on camera in the BBC clip. Who was the bald guy so keen to engage him at close quarters though?

  • cynic

    Oh yes…and there had to be a sash there! Lest we forget!

  • Driftwood

    From the Telegraph:
    At Prime Minister’s Question Time, Gordon Brown hinted that he would not take up the controversial recommendation, telling MPs: “We must respect the fact that innocent people lost their lives and that should be something that is never forgotten.”

    Nigel Dodds, Democratic Unionist MP for Belfast North, told Mr Brown that the “obnoxious” proposal to award all families the same level of compensation, from a £300 million pot funded jointly by the British and Irish Governments: “effectively does away with the distinction between murderers and those they went out to murder and kill.”

    He added: “There can never be an equivalence between terrorists on the one hand and the innocent victims of terror.”

    The Prime Minister replied: “There can be no justification for terrorist violence. We will never forget the thousands of innocent victims in Northern Ireland.”

  • cynic

    “We will never forget the thousands of innocent victims in Northern Ireland.”

    How can this be true? Surely Gordon spends every waking hour thinking about ordinary people and families and how he can solve the worlds problems and protect their money and jobs. We know this because he told us so.So how will he have time to think about the poor victims in Northern Ireland?

    Watch this space.

  • Driftwood

    This was on the mainland news tonight. There is NO way Brown can pay out on this. I think the majority of UK voters would be appalled. Every potential suicide bomber will be thinking their families will be quids in.

  • Odd

    Mainland!

  • IJP

    You can’t buy justice for £12K, I’m afraid.

    Indeed, it’s about time we realized we can no longer be bought at all. No bad thing, either.

  • the truth is out there

    what media seems not to have picked up on is the recommendation of effectively an international commission on what happened here- which is something many groups have been asking for in the past.. cant see this getting passed at westminster