“It is a small element who were involved..”

An interesting convergence of stories in west Belfast where we had been told previously that “volunteers” had been “working in their communities on the streets” and “patrolling” Belfast neighbourhoods. A matter of days after Fr Aidan Troy highlighted a “suspected INLA extortion campaign” three men were reported to have been arrested in Poleglass and UTV noted that “Police say community representatives in the area had also reported a number of extortion attempts in recent days.” Meanwhile the Irish News front-page today carries a report of “community worker” Martin Kelly whose home was attacked by up to 40 people, his son assaulted, and his family “ordered [] to leave the district within 24 hours”. According to a BBC report [not included in their online version which adds, “One man who was arrested has been released on police bail”] this happened after an Andersonstown News article was printed about the St James Community Watch of which Mr Kelly is a member – Mark has noted that particular story here, “Who is watching the Community Watch?”. Adds My mistake, the BBC report didn’t refer to that previous article. It actually referred to the reaction when the Andersonstown News reported this incident. The background detail would seem to be relevant though. From the Irish News [subs for now]

The 48-year-old ran from work to his home at St James’ Road after a panicked phone call from his wife who told him that a gang had gathered outside and were chanting about burning the house down.

Mr Kelly is also quoted in the report

“This is a personal vendetta against me because every weekend I am out on the streets trying to keep the area safe.”

And from Sinn Féin councillor Marie Moore

“It is a small element who were involved in this antisocial behaviour and I would ask the community to stand by their own area and to give support to Martin and his family.”

, , , , ,

  • wild turkey

    For the moment, leaving aside political considerations and whatever local undercurrents/fueds might be involved, and, assuming the reports are accurate, a question.

    Excuse my naivety but how the fuck is it possible for a family to be under siege for two hours by an ‘angry mob of 40 youths’ and one of the family members have the shit beaten out him in the process?

    Do neighbours not give any assistance? (yeah, I await the slagging for asking that one)

    Do the polis stand idly by?

    Are any calls made for assistance? If so, to whom? What’s the response for help?

    If your home is under siege by 40 angry youths for two hours, the minutes turn to hours.

    Sorry guys, but just WTF is going on?

    all plausible explanations welcome.

  • Grassy Noel

    I find this all very confusing. Not so much what the right honourable wild turkey reffed above, but the tension that seems to exist between this branch of the community watch and the rest of that organisation – and by extension other republicans?

    Can any locals shed any light on this?

    I did go to the thread Mark started, but apart from the news that a certain someone has resigned from the ATN (surprise!) no real insight into what in blazes is going on.

  • joeCanuck

    I’m totally confused too. It would seem that the community workers are cooperating with the PSNI so why did no-one call for help? Damn weird.
    And just who exactly is doing the “ordering” these days?

  • It seems that some republicans are now getting a feel for the kind of thuggery that goes along with being on the field with active militant republicans just as SDLP people experienced the same during the Troubles.

    There are no lengths to which militant republicans will not go to bully and intimidate vulnerable people. This is just the beginning of the process of exposing Sinn Fein’s strategy weaknesses, i.e. Your problem is that you simply don’t have any guns (Mr Mallon).

    One has to wonder whether Sinn Fein will have the same determination and commitment to non-violence as the SDLP.

  • Garibaldy

    It seems from the fact a police woman was assaulted (as noted in one of the linked reports) that the police were called, and did intervene. The question is whether they allowed this to continue after they were called, and if so, why.

  • Shore Road Resident

    I’m also confused. Is this a case of SF using its newspaper to monster a community group it doesn’t control, then backing off when the monstering gets out of control?
    Because that’s what it looks like.

  • waffler

    Memories of Ballymurphys spate of intimidation and exclusions come to mind.
    Surely sinn fein knew the caliber of people they were victimising and in turn would have known time would be no healer due to the feeling of total betrayal felt by those who had always towed the leaderships line.The unletting slur against anyone who questioned the leaderships true agenda.
    All the time people who would not have joined the frontline in the war against the brits throwing in their pennys worth (shall they be so eager to back the leadership in times to come)?
    Especially as many republicans have recently become aware of what had really been going on behind the scenes (and their backs) for years.
    As seen in Derry with the death of another young man recently the leadership have now begun recruiting community workers etc as another weapon in their arsonal to score political points against anyone not prepared to tow the party line.
    These same people have been totally silent for 30 years so WHY NOW ?
    The simple fact is that republicans want answers to republican leadership collusion and as long as its not forth coming long standing republicans are more easily dispencing of that once unbreakable loyalty.

  • Peking

    And these are the people who want power over policing and justice placed in their hands.

  • picador

    It’s at time like this when ‘The Blanket’ is sorely missed, in terms of elucidating the events that are taken place.

  • Greagoir O’ Frainclin

    “There are no lengths to which militant republicans will not go to bully and intimidate vulnerable people.”

    Militant Republicans have small brains in their thick baldy skulls. They are so like the BNP and the Billy Wright/Johnny Adair brigade. Why do people support them and their thuggish actions?

  • wild turkey

    ‘It’s at time like this when ‘The Blanket’ is sorely missed, in terms of elucidating the events that are taken place. ‘

    Picador, fair enough and a sentiment shared. However things have come to a pretty pass when in the absence of McIntyre leads to confusion and incredulity in making sense of an event like this.

    Then again, maybe there is no sense, as in sentinent empathetic beings, in all this.

    I remained perplexed, befuddled and scared.

    Very scared.

    It appears thugs can, with at least impunity and perhaps encouragement, lay siege to a family home inflicting fear, pain and damage.

  • picador

    Several questions arise:

    1. Does St James ‘Community Watch’ co-operate with the PSNI?

    2. Are Sinn Féin involved in St James ‘Community Watch’?

    3. Are ‘dissidents’ (note use of quote marks) involved in St James ‘Community Watch’?

    From the sounds of it ‘hoods’ were central in this attack. But have these hoods been stirred up for ‘political’ motives to do with control of the area? Or have they spontaneously decided to take action against someone who has been countering their activities?

  • billie-Joe Remarkable

    A dreadfully introduced thread. Does slugger have to have a reference to every f***ing story from the last few weeks in an effort to guess its way to some sort of narrative?

    Fun though to see so many people on here admit they haven’t a clue what’s going on. Indeed.

    So much for “hugging the inside track”.

  • willis

    B-J R

    Fair enough critique. That’s just the way Pete does it. I’d be more succinct probably. To reprise my previous question. Is it the darkness or the candle?

  • TAFKABO

    Billie Joe.

    From the sheer number of times you’ve moaned about this thread and that thread over the last few weeks, one wonders why you bother logging on if it annoys you so much?

    Why not just find a site which posts the things you want to talk about instead?

  • wild turkey

    ‘A dreadfully introduced thread. Does slugger have to have a reference to every f***ing story from the last few weeks in an effort to guess its way to some sort of narrative? ‘

    Pete has made an admirable effort in giving us access to relevant reports and previous posts. I suspect it is made in a genuine effort to inform discussion on this disturbing topic.

    Well BJ with the benefit of time and hindsight, let us now read your astute, pithy and insightful alternative intro to the topic at hand.

    Your remark in this instance, as in many others, has no relevance at all to the thread.

    It is getting beyond the point of tedium.

    Put up or shut up.

  • billie-Joe Remarkable

    Well, see, here’s the thing. I like politics and political sites. This one could be good and I’m trying to suggest some of the obvious flaws. Like the amount of times the same subject is flogged to death.

    Turgon recently decided to start a thread because he “likes to blog” and because he wanted his take on an exhausted subject to be top of the thread. Such arrogance.

    As someone else pointed out there are 8 threads on one subject. And do we really need “I agree with JS Mill and then a big cut and paste job as Duncan Simply dreadful did last night? It’s like a politics essay. From fifth year.

    I appreciate it may be “tedious” but hopefully now you all realise how many times I can make the point because (and here’s the heart of the matter) WHOEVER STARTS THE THREADS seems to just rattle out any old shit again and again. Now that is tedious. GYAC Gail Walker’s article has just appeared again. Why? That election in Fermanagh and several other issues just come up again and again.

    I comment when – get this – I have something to say. And I try to keep it short.

    It’s all about opinions and you can criticise my opinion and I’ll do the same. That’s how it works, isn’t it?

    Now, do f*** right off

  • cynic

    Pete is right to cross reference if he thinks or suspects that there is an emerging pattern.

    Information on just what is going on in the St James seems sparse so does anyone have the inside track?

    I would make two points.

    First, when for 35 years you have urged communities to resist the state and authority and then one day they all wake up and find that you have become the authority, there is a difficult transition to be managed.

    Second, to police any area effectively the police need the support of the community. That is the source of their legitimacy. Community policing, in a difficult inner city area anywhere, is hard. There are many competing interests and views which have to be balanced. It demands effort, resources and fairness and needs to be seen to be responsive and effective.

    There are those in the Republican community who have conflated electoral success and past history with the right to police the detail of peoples’ lives including their disputes with negighbours, lifestyle, behaviour etc. They believe that they have the right almost to define the norms for those communities and to enforce them ‘on behalf of local people’.

    Well, it ain’t necessarily so. That past history, even that electotral success, doesn’t automatically confer that policing legitimacy. It also doesnt make them good at community policing because being good at it is not about the use of force and is not the same as intimidating into submission various factions in the community.

    In saying this I am not attacking all those involved in many of these community groups. Many of them followed different models in different areas. In the past they sometimes also provided a real lifeline in communities with major, deep seated problems.

    But time moves on and peoples’ attitudes and expectations change. They want more policing and more effective policing and they want that policing to have legitimacy.

  • Chris Donnelly

    Oh dear.. what really should have been a simple case of reporting a thuggish assault by hoods on a west Belfast resident who happens to volunteer some time to his local community watch has been transformed through smoke and mirrors to an attack on republicans.

    What an accomplishment for some…

    The linking of Fr. Troy’s statement and the incident on the Stewartstown Road is perplexing, given that they would appear to involve dissident republicans, whereas this is a straightforward example of hoods picking on members of a community watch scheme in one area- something which, unfortunately, is an all too regular occurence, though not involving the numbers or level of violent intent apparently involved on this occasion.

    I hope I haven’t ruined things…

    oh, and I hope Mr. Kelly and his family recover from the incident and the hoods involved spend time behind bars.

  • The Raven

    B-J-R, Slugger is pretty much the window on the NI world for some of us who now live outside of areas such as these which we used to frequent.

    I for one am glad to see stuff like this posted. Cos it gets damn all discussion elsewhere. Unless, of course, you think that this is a non-story? On a par with David and His Imaginary Flute?

    Anyway. Sorry I live in the sticks.

  • picador

    Chris,

    I’m familiar with PB’s republican-bashing tendencies.

    This ‘Community Watch’ group came up in a thread posted by éirígí member Mark McGregor recently which cited an Andytown News story on tensions involving something which appeared in a local news-sheet. I didn’t pay the thread much attention at the time but now there has been this attack. It’s reasonable to wonder if there’s any more to this that sheer thuggery on the part of ‘hoods’.

  • Pete Baker

    “Oh dear.. what really should have been a simple case of reporting a thuggish assault by hoods on a west Belfast resident..”

    That’s what the BBC is for Chris, surely.

    I prefer to add as much available context to the story as possible – as ‘wild turkey’ noted.

    “transformed through smoke and mirrors to an attack on republicans.”

    Really? Where’s that attack in the original post?

    “whereas this is a straightforward example of hoods picking on members of a community watch scheme in one area- something which, unfortunately, is an all too regular occurence, though not involving the numbers or level of violent intent apparently involved on this occasion.”

    Feel free to blog such straightforward examples on a regular basis.

    Some of those examples are linked in the original post.

    And ‘cynic’ makes some good points worth considering.

  • morgy

    this was a family feud that has been blown out of proportion by the person under attack lets just say the decision to go public with this story was a political one and thats why an incident that happened on sunday night was only first reported on thursday the person under attack assulted a 13 year old last year and this has been simmering since then

  • picador

    lets just say the decision to go public with this story was a political one

    On the part of who?

  • LURIG

    I am a Catholic from North Belfast who works in West Belfast and they are TWO big SHITHOLES. From the Upper Glen Road to Divis St and Carlise Circus to Bawnmore it’s one big unlawful ghetto/township with anti-social scumbags, drunken lazy layabouts, benefit scroungers, drug heads, drug dealers, marauding gangs, criminals, pseudo republican groups, rich republican groups, disaffected republican groups etc. The decent hard working people who do hold down a job are very much the minority so when stories like this appear you just don’t know what to believe. You have people who do a hard days work living beside lowlife who do NO work but seem to have endless income to sit up half the night partying or outside boozing all day when the first burst of sunshine comes. Like most ordinary people in these areas I would leave these two stinking hellholes behind but am tied by job and mortgage. Maybe I should pretend I am an alcoholic, lone parent, depressed or unloved then I would get ALL the money and housing the government could throw at me.

  • willis

    As Chris says, on the surface this looks straightforward. The problem is the size of the mob and the confidence they had that they could do what they wanted unimpeded.

    morgys comments only make it more curious. Political? how?

    If the News of the World is interested there is some proper investigative journalism needing done.

    Too risky, – Thought so.

  • cynic

    “The problem is the size of the mob and the confidence they had that they could do what they wanted unimpeded. ”

    Yes….it shows it wasnt perhaps just a ‘small element’ but there must be some specific trigger / circumstance behind this. We are not being told the full truth – not by Mr Kelly I stress, who seems to have had a terrible experience – but there seems to be some trend here.

    What is actually going on in this area and what triggered this? Fights in West Belfast happen every day. Who ‘placed’ this one in the media?

  • Grassy Noel

    Lurig,

    as a person from the west, I agree with your sentiments on some days, usually bad days, in the summer when the sun is shining and I go for a walk from my very quiet mixed street down onto the lower springfield and then onto the Falls and down past Divis. Such soul destroying, blood boiling sights and sounds you are unlikely to find anywhere. But not everyone here is like that. The overwhelming manjority of people are decent and hard-working, it’s just that the scum are so visible and loud.

  • morgy

    ‘On the part of who?’

    the person who came under attack is a sf member

  • morgy

    mr kellys account in the irish news said his house came under attack for two hours not true

    he also claimed on the bbc newsline that he had to fight them off for an hour and a half also not true

    from the time first shouting started at the distubance until the psni arrived on the scene was ten minutes and they arrived with 4 jeeps and 4 cars the area was clear 45 minutes after when the psni left the scene there was no damage done to the property which the papers should have found amazing after 40 people attacked a house for two hours there wasn’t a window broken

    the person in the van was trying to get his drunken soninto the van and take him home not ram the house as claimed but this man was also drunk and was arrested drunk driving (the drunken son had approached the house mouthing off because mr kelly had ejected him from a local bar where he works as a doorman this doubled with the long standing family dispute led to the escalation)

  • Grassy Noel

    Thanks Morgy – sounds a lot more plausible.

  • IRIA

    Are the “40 thugs” alleged to actually be “dissident” republicans?

  • strange goings on

    Morgy, you seem to know a lot about this, I take it you’re part of the eirigi faction (if that’s what its called) of the st james community watch.

    Am I right in guessing that you appear to be defending the attack on Mr Kelly?

    The ringleader of the attack is a well known thug and it would be pretty sad if you’re aligning yourself with him.

    If this is eirigi’s attempt to bring themselves into mainstream politics, then they will fail considerably. Not that I think they’ll be successful anyway, too many chiefs (and rockets) methinks.

    West Belfast and the rest of the nationalist electorate will continue to speak loud and clear. Small squabbles and maniacs will be rejected. In any event, Eirigi will get fed up once the novelty has worn off, or once they realise how many people are actually shaking their heads in disbelief, thinking ‘god love that wee squad, what a crowd of self publicists and egotists’.

    And if you do know anyone in Eirgi, ask them to start graffiting outside their own houses. Let’s make West Belfast more attractive, not graffiti laden.

  • cynic

    “If this is eirigi’s attempt to bring themselves into mainstream politics, then they will fail considerably. ”

    Sorry but I am confused and increasingly reminded of that scene in Life of Brian:

    BRIAN:
    Are you the Judean People’s Front?

    REG:
    Fuck off!

    BRIAN:
    What?

    REG:
    Judean People’s Front. We’re the People’s Front of Judea! Judean People’s Front. Cawk.

    FRANCIS:
    Wankers

  • Damian O’Loan

    Is this not a rejection of paramilitary control over republican neighbourhoods by those who were too young to be part of the movement or who are now outside it?

    The Community Watch and Restorative Justice schemes, following CJI approval, have the green light for long-term government funding. That means they aren’t going anywhere. But it seemed to me that plenty of young people were saying, effectively, ‘fuck that, I’m not doing what you or anyone else tells me to.’

    It’s not surprising that SF are mismanaging the process of becoming community police – they shouldn’t be allowed to do it without careful guidance and supervision. So the allegations like the assault on a youth of thirteen don’t arise.

    Nor is it surprising that the PSNI Community Policing budget has been cut to zero in favour of restorative justice, but it’s still the wrong approach.

    These projects will be poorly managed, there will be continued revolt by those who understandably question their authority. But to those who do, I would say be very careful not to fall into the trap that’s been set. Governments need a threat to justify things like curfews. Prisons are a business, and people grow businesses and look for new markets. The hands behind the paramilitary-control hangover of the local solution approach are not only SF’s. By attacking the community protection rackets, you’ll give them a role for years to come. By reporting them to the PSNI, if any crimes are committed, they’ll have to disappear quickly or shape up quickly.

  • andy pandy

    Kelly has a cheek to appear on any news programme yapping about the alleged attack on his house. he and his wannbe cronies have tortured the youth of his area for more than ten years. they are laughed at by all who know them and I also noted in todays Irish News a story about “community activists” rallying at Kellys house in a show of support for him and his family. Two living legends,who live a stone throw away form Kelly are highly respected across Belfast and beyond were noted by their absence. They know a bad bet when they see one.!

  • picador

    Ah, the fog begins to clear. There’s more to this than hoods. Would be Black Panthers are involved.

  • andy pandy

    Ah, the fog begins to clear. There’s more to this than hoods. Would be Black Panthers are involved

    yes,Would be Black Panthers are involved, Kelly is part of the local “community watch” group that printed the now infamous picture in their newssheet. Many of the 137 members have distanced themselves from this group in the past week and a signed letter from them is enroute to the Andytown news letters page. chances of it seeing the light of day are slim as the shinners will get their friend and comrade marty miller to censure it as community watch is nothing more than SF reserve police force.

  • picador

    AP,

    Maybe the Irish News would have been the place to send the letter.

    There’s something I don’t get here. Perhaps you could clarify. Andytown News criticised the CW group in the first place over the Black Panther stuff, so it seems unlikely that it (the BP stuff) originated from SF members of the group. Is it the case that éirígí members had become involved in the CW group and that they (and perhaps others) are now standing down due to SF reasserting control after the Black Panther episode? Are these tensions connected to the disturbance reported above?

  • Observer

    Seems to me that a family home was attacked by a mob.
    Local people defended the home until the police arrived.
    The mob attacked the police.
    Identified members of the mob have been torturing the local community for years.
    But hey, this is Slugger!
    Lets turn it into an attack on Republicans and permit whatever allegations we choose to be posted by whoever we like against the victims of the attack.
    Trying to gain an understanding of whats going on on the ground through Slugger is like planning a holiday in Zimbabwe on the basis of an interview with Mugabe.
    Last time I visit this shithole of a site.

  • steve

    we will miss you terribly observer

    except we know you will be back

  • andy pandy

    A number of points need cleared up here,
    1 The C/W is and always been controled by SF members.
    2 The people writing letters to A/town news justifying the Black panthers photo are SF members.
    3 A family home was not attacked by a mob of 40 people ( There was no damage to the house)
    4local people did not defend the house until the PSNI arrived (there was no attack on the house, therefore the house didnt need defended)
    5 One person from the gathered crowd assaulted a female PSNI officer and was arrested.
    6 This only became news 4 days later when SF contacted A/town news on what was clearly a slow news week.
    7 If Mr Kelly is such an upstanding community worker then why did the majority of community activists and local republicans fail to attend the rally in support of Mr Kelly and his family.

  • st james,

    andy has a point to an extent. myself and a core of friends stayed out every weekend watching for attacks on our area from loyalists. same people every time. we were laughed at by people heading home drunk knowing we were the idiots who were looking after their interests. in those days parents made sure their kids were out of harms way. now parents are unable to or are unwilling to control their offspring which has culminated in the attack onn martin kelly annd his family. in a roundabout way i would like to ask andy and morgy, are you happy to let the scumbag element rule st james,s because the next burglary ,assault or rape victim could belong to you. there are a lot of great kids in st james,s but there is an awful lot of wankers also. they drag a once proud area down. i for one would rather walk past the c/w on my way home than be confronted by these so called angels. i know a lot of their parents and they are good people but they need to get their heads out of the sand. to say martin kelly and his ilk hav been torturing the kids in st james,s for the past 10 years is total balix.there is a hardcore of bullies and thugs there and everyone knows who they are. they should be ostracised. question for morgy and andy. if some dickhead called your mother/wife /daughter a whore would u do nothing? i await your reply.

  • andy pandy

    you say that you and a core of friends stayed out every weekend watching for attacks from loyalists. What were you going to do if loyalists did attack the area?

    you also used the term “in those days parents made sure their kids were out of harms way” just how far into history are you going here.

    then you go on to list a number of crimes that could happen tomothers/wives/daughters etc. the one crime that you forgot to mention was…. what if some bullyboy wannabe C/W member wants to make a name for himself and over reacts and attacks a member of my family? who do I report this to?

    PS this incident started in a local club where Mr Kelly is the doorman at weekends, is this an extention of his community watch duties or a job that he gets paid to do?

    I look forward to your answers!

    PPS could you also provide an answer to point 7 on my last post.

  • Exjimmy

    I lived in the area a long time ago and was involved in the nightwatch at sensitive times.

    “you say that you and a core of friends stayed out every weekend watching for attacks from loyalists. What were you going to do if loyalists did attack the area?”

    We put ourselves in the way.
    Surely you know this?

    “what if some bullyboy wannabe C/W member wants to make a name for himself and over reacts and attacks a member of my family? who do I report this to?”

    The police.

    On your earlier point 5
    “5 One person from the gathered crowd assaulted a female PSNI officer and was arrested.”

    I don’t think he was arrested. My understanding is that he ran off and has yet to be apprehended.

  • andy pandy

    re; Exjimmy

    could you explian what “We put ourselves in the way.” means, because I have checked lost lives and it fails to mention any members of C/W killed in action defending the area from loyalists.

    Regards the person that assulted the PSNI woman who you claim ran away, are you willing to inform the police of this persons name and/or whereabouts as you have stated in your post that the police should be contacted if a C/W member oversteps the mark.

  • st james,s

    so andy ,you have to die to get your your notice.

  • st james,s

    also andy. if you are from st james,s you wouldnt be asking such daft questions.why dont you ask your parents. maybe they stood with us but by the sound of you, they werent

  • jt james,s

    should have read they werent there. easy to shout from the sidelines andy. get a life. answer my question andy. would you rather your mother walked home past c/w or a bunch of scumbags who abuse anyone who has the misfortune to walk past them?

  • st james,s

    as for history andy, it wasnt a million years ago and im not drawing a pension.if you,re from st james,s you must know what has happened over the years. sadie larmour.skipper burns.paddy mc allister. how can you stop murder squads that had the back-up of the british establishment. but by puting people on street corners who knows what was thwarted. im no fucking hero but while there were people standing at corners then your ma and da were able to produce you. they shouldnt have bothered

  • andy pandy

    RE stjames;
    A number of points to come back at you on

    My answer to point 22 is; Thankfully no members of C/W were murdered by loylists in the course of their “duties” I know the good work done over the years by locals in defending the area at great personal risk from the British/ loyalist front,but please dont insult these people by comparing what they done with what C/W are doing in the area today.

    My answer to point 23 is;Im not here to justify what my parents did or did not do.

    My answer to point 24 is; you sk silly question here
    “would you rather your mother walked home past c/w or a bunch of scumbags who abuse anyone who has the misfortune to walk past them?”

    C/W members or scumbags or anyone else who abuses any member of my family will find me at their front door and if you were to check the facts of what really happened last Sunday and the people involved you will understand what I mean

    My answer to point 25 is; I answered some of this question already but have to take issue again with your obsession about what my parents were doing while you were keeping the area safe. well to answer you question, my father went to prison in 1979 where he remained until 1985.

  • Grassy Noel

    As someone not from St James, but who was born and reared in the west, can I just add that it is depressing to see so many on here rush to defend the scummy lumpenproletariat that make life a hell for people living in their areas.

    What would possess a so-called neighbour to do such a thing?

    Andy Pandy?

  • andy pandy

    At no point in any of my posts did I or will I defend the scumbags that torture our communities.

    but I cannot support C/w in this area as they an unaccountable group of wannabes.

    this area needs help from other areas to organise a proper C/w structure.