“Campaigning will continue to achieve an Irish Language Act..”

Previously it was the UK government, in the form of Jonathan Powell, writing speeches for Gerry Adams, now the Sinn Féin president is making statements on behalf of the UK government. As reported here, Gerry Adams has announced that

“The British government has committed to providing an additional £6 million expressly for the Irish Language Broadcast Fund when the current funding runs out next March. This new funding will cover the ILBF for a further two years.”

Still, at least that trip to Downing St was worthwhile.. Let’s hope someone remembers to tell the Northern Ireland Culture Minister.. Adds From the DUP’s Nelson McCausland – “It is hard not to feel a certain sense of pity for Sinn Fein over this issue..”

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  • interested

    I know that English isn’t Gerry’s first language but…

    “Campaigning will continue to achieve an Irish Language Act.”

    Continue to achieve does imply that there is one there already. Gerry may be right in one sense though – he’s got a few quid from Brown through the only mechanism available but he’ll continue to get the same Irish Language Act as there is now – NONE.

    Probably won’t stop Gerry’s “Brits In” campaign though.

  • PeaceandJustice

    If true, this would mean Brown interfering in devolved matters and bypassing the relevant minister.

    I await a statement from the NI Minister of Culture with interest.

  • interested

    PeaceandJustice
    I suspect that this is the only area where Brown was able to get involved because broadcasting (or at least elements of it) is still a reserved matter.

    An act is a completely different matter as its devolved and central Government doesn’t have control.

  • bob Wilson

    ‘this would mean Brown interfering in devolved matters’
    Broadcasting is not a devolved matter.
    Hence Brown can through a few million at it if he wishes.
    Consolation prize?

    Note Gerry’s remark about an Irish Language Act was a bit of a throwaway remark at the end. He used to say it would definitely happen even without Executive support now he is reduced to saying ‘campaigning will continue’

  • Sound Bloke

    Interested, If you take a short breath after continue, or add the words “in order to” it’ll make sense. Badly written but intelligible.

  • interested

    Just heard a statement from the Minister on Talkback.

    He “welcomes the funding and looks forward to comparable funding for Ulster Scots.”

    Doesn’t sound like a worried man to me. I suppose we shouldn’t be too churlish when Gerry’s getting some crumbs from the ‘Brits table’ should we.

    Look closer of course at what Campbell is saying too…. All Adams has achieved is restoring the fuding which was cut by Poots. When Ulster Scots gets the comparable level of funding it will take their funding to a much higher level than it was at before.

    Another small step towards equality of cultural funding.

  • ggn

    Good day for the Irish speakers no doubt. I think it will also placate much of the frustration with Sinn Féin felt by alot of Gaeil over the past few months.

    Interesting intervention from Brown and a useful reminder that British values as espoused by people in Britain are not necessarily those of the British community in Northern Ireland.

    The campaign for a ILA will of course continue, and I think everyone realises that it will take a generation or two of campaigning.

    It remains to be seen if Brown will ensure some of the more important provisions are dealt with through Westminister, i.e. the repeal of the The Justice Act 1737.

    Interesting that Gregory Campbell has welcome it whilst calling for more Ulster-Scots programing, something I would support provided we are talking about programming in Ulster Scots rather than aboot Ulster-Scots.

  • Sound Bloke

    An important point ggn. The Ulster Scots themselves seem to be split as to whether they are a language community or a cultural community. It seems to me there is little appetite amongst even the most committed Ulster Scot for programmes actually made in the dialect/language.

    It will be interesting to hear their ideas about what kind of programmes Ulster Scots supporters would like to see made IN Ulster Scots. Could they make the equivalent of Seacht or MPG or Deis Roc. for example?

  • interested

    Sound Bloke
    Fair point – they should edit their press statements a little better.

    Shinners still grasping at crumbs from Gordon’s table though…

  • perry patetic

    “a generation or two of campaigning”

    Did you mean to say that?

    How would repeal of the Justice Act 1737 work? If I demanded that my trial was held in Irish would that mean that all participating lawyers would need to have fluent Irish or would there be simultaneous translation for the non-speakers?
    What if I demanded it in Irish and then realised I couldn’t keep up. Could I also have a translation service for myself?

  • picador

    He (Campbell) “welcomes the funding and looks forward to comparable funding for Ulster Scots.”

    Said through gritted teeth no doubt. How dare this grotty little man equate the Irish language with a Buckna accent. He is about as culturally literate as Hermann Goering who famously stated ‘Whenever I hear the word culture, I reach for my revolver.’

  • ggn

    ““a generation or two of campaigning”

    Did you mean to say that?”

    15-30 years.

    “How would repeal of the Justice Act 1737 work?”

    That is a question for MPs in the houses of parliament.

    In my opinion and change of the status of Irish would involve the use of an interpreter, which has actually happened in Northern Ireland already, regardless of the Act involved.

    I would also suggest that provision of court docs. in Irish would also be a realistic expectation.

  • Sound Bloke

    Why the bile, interested. The ILBF has been a rip-roaring success. It has made many more hours television than it was funded for and it has given top-class training in TV production to many of our young people. Some of the programmes were of a low quality. most were excellent and a few were utterly brilliant.

    It is a pity that the Shinners had to go “grasping at crumbs from Gordon’s table” is that the local minister, for whatever reason, is blind to the job creation possibilities and the undoubted cultural buzz that the ILBF has created.

  • interested

    Sound Bloke,
    No bile here – a little derision maybe, but no particular bile.

    Glad to hear its been such a “rip-roaring success”. Lets hope its equally successful for Ulster-Scots broadcasting and we get further progress towards cultural equality here.

    “s blind to the job creation possibilities and the undoubted cultural buzz that the ILBF has created.”

    You’ll have to inform us how many jobs it has created of course – we’ll then judge if the spend per job is good value or not. Again, lets hope the ‘cultural buzz’ is similar when the Ulster Scots broadcast fund gets similar extra cash.

    My bile (if there was any) and derision is purely directed at Sinn Fein as opposed to the Irish language. It is they who have made a mockery of Irish and who are scrabbling around for a fig leaf of sufficient size to cover the gaping hole left by the lack of an Irish Language Act.

  • PeaceandJustice

    bob Wilson – “Broadcasting is not a devolved matter”; interested – “broadcasting is still a reserved matter”

    Thanks for the correction – of course you’re both right as it’s the Irish Language Broadcast Fund. It still seems a bit rude if Brown did not inform the NI Minister of Culture? But maybe as discussed, the DUP can use it to get equality of funding for the Ulster-British community.

  • Dewi

    What’s happening here

    Still quite can’t get my head around how a devolved body could apply a language act top to bodies established outside NI. Fr’instance the new powers given to our Government (but under a UK act) compel the Olympic Delivery Authority to produce a Language Scheme – I can’t see how devolved legislation could do that? Surely outside juristiction ??

  • ggn

    Dewi,

    Are you sure it is develoved. Wasnt the Welsh Language Act passed as Westminister?

    I dont know.

  • picador

    The Ulster-Scots buiness is a complete red herring. The DUP raise it only in order to distract from their determination to pursue the policy of cultural genocide begun by our colonial oppressors in centuries past.

  • Sound Bloke

    Lots of demands for “eqality of funding.”

    There’s a big difference between the Ulster-British community and the Ulster-Scots-speaking community and that goes back to the point I made about how the Ulster Scots see themselves – are they a language community as Irish speakers so obviously are or are they a cultural community.
    Just a question – is their British identity not served already by Coronation Street, Eastenders, Holby City and 99.9 per cent of British broadcasting.

    That leaves us with the Ulster- bit. How would you spend £3 million a year? It’s the Irish Language Broadcast Fund so do you want a £3 million Ulster Scots Language Broadcasting Fund and if you do, what kind of programmes would you make in Ulster Scots?

  • Paul

    Is there an Ulster-Scots dictionary available? I need a good giggle.

  • longlake

    picador
    what do you think of the people in camloch (sth armagh) who have called their annual triathalon ‘the crooked lake triathalon’? this in an area where the signposts are covered in stickers demanding ‘gaelige’! more cultural genocide or the ‘equality agenda’? i hear that on the equality issue the camloch people are to rename nearby ‘sturgon brae’ as ‘the hill’, can’t let the ulster scots ‘aff’ either. time that caitriona put ‘an béal bocht’ on the curriculum aris. all codding aside, i’d love to hear the rationale behind translating ‘camloch’ especially as the locals are prone to get upset when someone makes the mistake of spelling it as camlough! ‘camlough’ is too english, apparently, but ‘the crooked lake’ is o.k. ireland, you’re rearing them still.

  • “‘camlough’ is too english, apparently,”

    I always thought Lough was a derivative of some Irish-Gaelic word as distinct from Loch which was from Scottish-Gaelic, is that not the case?

  • Dewi

    Are you sure it is develoved. Wasnt the Welsh Language Act passed as Westminister?

    It isn’t – which was the point I was trying to make – badly obviously….

  • ggn

    Beano,

    Lough is an anglicised spelling of the Gaelic loch.

    90% + of the words in Scottish and Irish Gaelic are exactly the same, though some recent spelling coventions can disguise this.

    Officialy the name of Camloch is Camlough, though that form has falled out of fashion.

  • West Belfast

    Paul – one of my favourite Ulster Scots words.

    maggot-fly (-ah-) – the bluebottle. maggoted infested with maggots

    Im glad it had a description – otherwise I would never have guessed.

    Whats your favourite word?

  • RG Cuan

    Great news for Irish speakers and anybody interested in promoting diversity.

    As for the hamely tongue ‘movement’, of course there is a certain linguistic element to it but most events only concentrate on Highland Gaelic dancing and music.

    Money for the Irish language is spent on the Irish language. Ulster Scoots groups have to make a decision either to focus on the dialect or find new – non-language body sources – to fund other cultural events.

    As for the triathlon in Camloch, it is obviously not about renaming the village but branding the event!

  • longlake

    R.G
    ‘Branding the event’; that’s fine but why does it have to be branded in english in an area which claims to place a great importance on gaelige? Surely if this event is important the the original name , camloch (the village is obviously named after the loch, not the othe way round) should be retained. if we are demaning that the brits do this about gaelige, the brits do that about gaelige and oh how our language is still being denied to us then why oh why oh why do the people (or a few of them) want to use an english translation , especially as it is Never used in daily life in reference to an camloch. how can our demands be taken seriously when we have our own people voluntarily putting english on our place names.

  • Dewi

    feile Chamlocha Sounds like a wonderful festival.

  • Picador,

    He is about as culturally literate as Hermann Goering who famously stated ‘Whenever I hear the word culture, I reach for my revolver.’

    He’s famously misquoted as saying that.
    It was actually a line from a character called Thiemann in the play “Schlageter”, written by Hanns Johst.
    And the actual quote was “Wenn ich Kultur höre … entsichere ich meinen Browning”; translating as : “Whenever I hear ‘culture’…I remove the safety from my Browning!”

    But describing Gregory as “culturally literate as Thiemann” doesn’t quite have the quite same wallop I suppose.

  • picador

    oneill,

    Is it beyond the realms of possibility that Goering paraphrased Thiemann?

    But describing Gregory as “culturally literate as Thiemann” doesn’t quite have the quite same wallop I suppose.

    No of course it doesn’t. With his twins loves of marching in quality military formation and the ‘Hun’ football team with a well-documented antipathy to untermenschen the comparison with Goering is much more apt I think.

  • picador

    oneill,

    Is it beyond the realms of possibility that Goering paraphrased Thiemann?

    But describing Gregory as “culturally literate as Thiemann” doesn’t quite have the quite same wallop I suppose.

    No of course it doesn’t. With his twins loves of marching in quasi military formation and the ‘Hun’ football team with a well-documented antipathy to untermenschen the comparison with Goering is much more apt I think.

  • Reader

    oneill: It was actually a line from a character called Thiemann in the play “Schlageter”…
    Thank you. It’s nice to see a bit of culture in a discussion on culture, for a change.

  • ggn

    “Money for the Irish language is spent on the Irish language. Ulster Scoots groups have to make a decision either to focus on the dialect or find new – non-language body sources – to fund other cultural events”.

    RG,

    One would think that that would be sensible but it is the policy of the NIO to marry Irish LANGUAGE and Ulster-Scots CULTURE, or as Nelson McCausland puts it ‘cultural outlook’.

    We know form joint Irish / Ulster-Scots events that that some of the Ulster-Scots representatives even went as far as to acknowledge on a public platform that they were not interested in the language part.

    I came to the conclusion that this is a reflection of what they assume goes on in ‘Irish language circles’ – an assumption in itself I acknowledge.

    Perhaps some unionists believe that Foras na Gaeilge funds Irish ‘cultural outlook’ activities regardless of the Irish language?

    Some more cyncical Gaelic speakers go as far as to claim Ulster-Scots is an anchor designed to hold back the growth of Irish, i.e. the use of the NI 50 : 50 rule.

  • Democratic

    You have to love the type of person that would talk of “The Hun” while morally posturing with feet firmly planted on the cloud of their own self-righteousness- eh Picador?

  • picador

    Oh I’m sorry Democratic, I didn’t realise that you were one of the horde who trashed Manchester recently.

    Gregory Campbell as Culture Minister – what a joke! Parity of funding for OOlster Scoots – what a sick joke!

  • Democratic

    LOL Picador – you’re really not doing yourself any favours now – give it up….you’re only making yourself look bad.

  • picador

    No, democratic. Having a bigoted cretin as Minister of Culture makes our beloved pravince look bad.

  • Mike

    Interesting that picador uses the phrase “bigoted cretin” barely an hour after throwing “Hun” into the coversation…

  • picador

    Well, if you will insist on placing things out of context you will arrive at the wrong conclusion.

    The DUPs refusal to contemplate an Irish Language Act marks them out as bigoted cretins. I’m sorry if that offends some of you ‘garden centre’ prods out there who feel ashamed of voting for them but them’s the facts.

    Ian Paisley & associates – espousing bigoted cretin-ery for half a century and more.

    Tír gan teanga, tír gan anam.

  • picador

    Will somone remind me of Matthew Parris’s reaction to the DUP’s last Minister of Culture?

    Oh, that’s right, he was so taken aback at Poot’s views that he used the word ‘nutter’. I wonder what he’d make of Gregory.

  • Pancho’s Horse/ Capall Pancho

    Speaking of cretins, did you hear Nelson McCausland commending ‘poor Barry McElduff’ for frequently using Ulster Scots. When prodded by Dunseith for an example, he cited “Wait til he comes” where “til” is the Ulster Scots for ‘to’. Does the gabshite not know that it is butchered English for ‘until’? BTW, the foclóir Ulster Scots is highly reccommended. I have seen grown men cry while reading it.

  • Dewi
  • ersehole

    This Camloch business interests me.

    Camlough is changed (back) to Cam loch which means ‘crooked lake’

    Cam is name of the crooked river which flows through Cambridge, named by the Brits.

    It is also the source-name of the river Camac which flows through Dublin, by Inchicore.

    McCambridge is a Belfast surname which means
    Mac Ambrose and had nowt to do with crooked or Cambridge.

    I’m well-named you know.

  • Sound Bloke

    As for Sinn Fein – and I’m not a Sinn Fein voter – Adams said on Raidio na Gaeltachta that he had warned Poots that the ILBF money was running out and that he (Poots) could get the money from Westminster. Poots did diddly squat.
    “So I had to do it myself,” said Gerry A. So not only is he writing British government press statements but he is also doing the work of the Minister for Culture.
    Wouldn’t it have been much better and sent out a lovely message if the then-MInister for Culture had saved the non-threatening ILBF himself in the best interests of a culturally pluralist and open Northern Ireland?

  • ggn

    http://www.newsletter.co.uk/news/Fury-over-PM39s-6m-for.4194932.jp

    This is the Lord Laird response, wha disnae spake a wurd a tha hamely leid at aw an’ I thank am richt in sayin wha disnae hie nay intrist at aw in lallans, th truth b’ towd.

    A canae wurk oot for by he and yer man Nelson disnae gae oot an dae a bit a larnin roon Buckna way?

    An’ then, tis Nelson wha says ‘ poor Barry McElduff’ fur Barry says oul spakes whin he’s mean’t for tae be spaken guid Inglis!!

  • DK

    Sound Bloke – would be good story if it was true. Don’t forget that Adams is a politician with his own story to spin.

    Favourite Ulster Scots word – scundered/scunnered

  • Sound Bloke

    DK,
    I’ve heard that it’s true from non-Sinn Fein sources.

    Favourite Ulster Scots word – Ulstèr = Ulster. Why is there an accent above the e and who put it there? I’d really, really, really like to know.

    PS I’m till waiting on ideas for programmes IN Ulstèr-Scotch that would be paid for if matching funding were forthcoming. You can’t just say, “well, those pesky Irish-speakers have got it, we want the same.” You have to have an idea as to how you would usefully spend the money.

    PPS I recommend Ian Knox’s cartoon in today’s Irish News.

  • interested

    Sound Bloke
    Even if your story is true all Adams has got is the money which Poots cut. So they’re celebrating over getting nothing new.

  • ggn

    Sound Bloke,

    “Why is there an accent above the e and who put it there? I’d really, really, really like to know”.

    It is a feature designed to make Ulster-Scots look different from English, it was an ‘innovation’ put forward by, well let us just say an amateur linguist.

    The majority of Scots / Ulster-Scots writing would avoid this as it servers no phonological role.

  • Sound Bloke

    Hiya interested,

    a) It’s not “my” story.

    b) If, as you write, Poots cut the money then the money doesn’t exist. Now it does exist. That’s a gain, surely.

    If you’re told one of your loved ones is going to die and they pull through, that’s a cause for celebration, isn’t it?

    BTW, do you know, as a supporter of the leid, why there is a grave accent in Ulstèr?

  • ggn

    Sound Bloke,

    I think it should be noted that the word ‘leid’ is guid Scots. However that word does not exist in Ulster speech.

    So the question would have to be put on a linguistic basis, do efforts to make Ulster-Scots more like Scots, and might I say East Coast Scots, actually threaten traditional Ulster forms of Scots?

  • ggn

    I might add that James Fenton refers to Ulster Scots speech as the hamely tongue rather than ‘leid’.

    http://www.amazon.co.uk/Hamely-Tongue-Personal-Record-Ulster-Scots/dp/1900423006

    Fenton’s word is the most valuable and authentic (apart from perhaps The Concise Ulster Dictionary).

    It is a great pity that san academic linguistic did not write a phonetic representation of it or that no cd was available.

  • Con

    In terms of “parity of funding” for Irish and ‘Ulster-Scots’, when the ILBF was set up and funded over a four year period to create Irish language programming, create jobs and train young people, the ‘Ulster-Scots’ crowd was given the same amount over the same period to develop their ‘language’.

    And then Poots made the decision that Ulster-Scots deserved more money than Irish. For what possible reason could that have been, so the Ulster-Scots Agency could bankroll more Orange Order CDs? (CDs that don’t even pretend to be in ‘Ulster-Scots’.)

  • Sound Bloke

    It’s interesting that no-one demanding parity of funding has posted any ideas about programmes they would like to make actually in Ulster Scots.

    Equally deafening is the silence from the Boord o Ulstèr Scotch. Why no strong demands for equal funding from them? Is it because they know that they would be hard pressed to come up with the breadth of output that the ILBF has assisted?

    Why are we listening to Nelson McCausland and not Mark Thompson?

    Why did the Newsletter talk to Lord Laird and not George Patton?
    Why did the Newsletter say “fury erupted” over the £6 million when they spoke only to Laird (a man who could spend the money on taxis alone) and quoted from Nelson’s very, very childish press release?

    And why is every single “forthcoming course” mentioned on the Boord’s website to do with dancing and not a single language course?