Queen in Dublin next month..?

THE Queen is to visit Northern Ireland next month to distribute Maundy money, in a move described by the News Letter as “unprecendented since the beginning of the Troubles” – a reference to the fact that it’s safe enough to announce it well in advance. (Should give éirígí enough time to prepare their protest). There will be the usual speculation that Her Maj may even take a wee trip to Dublin, which would make her the first British monarch in nearly a century to visit the city. If now isn’t the right time, when is?!

  • Garibaldy

    How about Easter Sunday instead?

  • Have her over for the Easter Rising commemoration.
    Lay a wreath at the Garden of remembrance.

  • Elvis Parker

    Great news – Long May She Reign Over Us
    Its brillant that democracy has triumphed over violent Irish nationalism so completely that these events can go ahead without the complex secrecy and security that used to be needed

  • Elvis she can evn visit us here in Donegal.
    We have a thriving German ex-pat community here already;0)
    She doesnt reign her ;0)

  • Eireannach Saolta

    Elvis parker I guess your just a troll. But anyway Ive taken the bait. Your belief that Irish nationalism is undemocratic is inherently flawed. Irish nationalism has always been about acheiving democracy for all Irish peoples. While some have used violence the same can also be said for loyalism/unionism. Loyalism and unionism have constantly supported the nepotitic undemocratic nature of the UKs head of state.

    That said if the queen wants to visit Ireland I have no issue with that. I dont really care where she visits

  • Mark McGregor

    Gonzo,

    éirígí won’t need much time to plan. Their protests have been ongoing since this was raised with another already scheduled.

    Though, I assume many of those that would have previously voiced objection will have now have no problems with an English monarch in Dublin.Hell, they may as well kiss her ass with the rest of them.

  • Richard Walsh

    RSF OPPOSED TO WINDSOR VISIT

    It has been reported that the English Queen, Elizabeth Windsor, is to visit Armagh City on Maundy Thursday. A spokesperson for Republican Sinn Féin has said that they are opposed to all British Royal visits to any part of Ireland.

    National Publicity Officer, Richard Walsh, said: “We are on record as being opposed to any British Royal visit to our country whilst England continues to illegally claim Ireland. Mrs. Windsor’s visit to Armagh City can only be viewed as a softening-up exercise for a State visit by the Crowned Head of England to the 26-Counties in the near future – something which Bertie Ahern mooted recently.

    “Normal relations between Ireland and England can only develop after the Brits have permanently left our shores. Until this happens England can only be viewed as a hostile power.”

  • mythspelt

    Bring her on, bring her on, she’s a great lady ( though her ma was the biz!!). Take her by the hand to Croker then over to Galway for the oysters.All she represents weakens by the hour. She and her hangers-on are no threat to man nor beast any more on this island. I would be more worried by yer Chinese premier pushing suspect inward investment our way and yer Russian oligarch telling us where to get off if we should even slightly question his commitment to democracy.

  • It was Sammy Mc Nally what done it

    Can we get her to say as well that she has no straegtic, economic etc interst in Non Iron and of course a couple of apologies would not go amiss.

    p.s. What a corker at Twickers as club team beats pub team.

  • ulsterfan

    I honestly hope Gerry and Martin don’t let themselves down by not giving the right type of bow and address her correctly as Your Majesty at first and then there after as Ma’am.
    There must be a Dept at SF to deal with such protocols.
    They must act with proper decorum and show respect to Her as Head of State whose Government they so willing support.

  • wild turkey

    The persistence of these medieval traditions practices is deeply moving. However, Maundy Thursday is a custom I am not familiar with.

    Is the maundy money part of the peace dividend?

    are there matching EU funds?

    can she claim the Garvaghy road as one her ‘highways’ and walk down it as long as she hands out the money?

    I’m really looking forward to the worlds richest grandmothers visit doling out small change. In 1976 the Queen visited American cities as part of the bi-Centennial. In many cities the local queens came out in adulation of one of their own. It was great. This visit has obvious has great theatrical potential.

  • Mark McGregor

    I can’t see how SF could object, sure they had no objections to a vote on their elected representatives being permitted to join the ‘Commonwealth Parliamentary Association’.

    Any protest would seem a tad hypocritical. Surely it is just a matter of how complete their endorsement is and how fully they participate?

  • Crataegus

    That’s one event I don’t have to worry about attending.

  • Dewi

    Sammy – missed Queenie at Twickers…..where’s the 6 Nations threads?

  • It was Sammy Mc Nally what done it

    Dewi,

    total loss of nerve by the Englezes (queenie’s grandson in law off injured)- Johnny had Nightmare, Balshaw lived down to his reputation. Have tickets for game against your boyz at Croker – by then Ireland will hopefully only have lost to France and Wales will be unbeaten.

  • The popularity of the monarchy in England is mostly driven by sentiment and misplaced patriotism, also of course by affection for the Queen who I would agree, is a strong character worthy of respect on a personal level.

    However the monarchy itself with the retinue of aristocrats, hangers-on and celebrities in-the-wings hoping for the nod, is really a total fucking farce.

    Ireland has never embraced this bullshit, and I hope it never will.

  • The Vatican though continues to exert a nefarious influence on the politics of Ireland – another dead weight we can all do without.

  • Garibaldy

    Ireland has never embraced royalty and its retinue?

    I wonder about that, I really do. For example, the royal visit in the early C20th, never mind the C17th and C18th when the people fought for their monarchs, and the history of multiple kingdoms.

  • The Dubliner

    “Ireland has never embraced this bullshit, and I hope it never will.”

    It depends on what you mean by ’embrace.’ The rest of your post I agree with totally.

    As a head of state, she should be accorded the upmost respect on her visit if she visits the Republic. I’d much rather the UK had an elected head of state, but as it doesn’t, it’s a case of ignoring personal preferences and being as respectful to their monarch as one would be to any other visiting dignitary from a friendly state.

    Those who have political objections are, of course, fully entitled to protest – provided they do so in a dignified and peaceful manner.

    If nothing else, it’ll be interesting to observe how this plays out with the irredentists within the Irish media, as to their curious agendas re a more repugnant form of ‘embracing.’

  • joeCanuck

    There will be no compulsion to go out to wave or be waved at, whether it’s a visit to the north and/or the south.
    Ignoring the whole thing is probably the optimum “protest”.

  • The Dubliner

    Joe, peaceful assembly (and with it the democratic right of protest) is a constitutional right. Why should those who oppose remain silent just to appease those who approve? If you oppose, oppose, and if you approve, approve – silence, evil, and good men, etc. 😉

  • heck

    Eireannach Saolta suggests that elvis parker is a troll.

    He equates having a monarchy with democracy!!

    A hereditary head of state and democracy? [Play the ball – edited moderator]

  • Eireannach Saolta

    Heck please email me with that response. Id like to know what was edited

  • michael

    Great news – Long May She Reign Over Us
    Its brillant that democracy has triumphed over violent Irish nationalism so completely that these events can go ahead without the complex secrecy and security that used to be needed

    Aye, the Monarch is oh so democratic.

  • joeCanuck

    Dubliner,

    I didn’t “deny” those methods of protest. Just suggested that ignoring is powerful too. Lots of people hate that.

  • The Dubliner

    Joe, I disagree. Ignoring something is de facto approving it. It is particularly important to protest in a political context where northern post-nationalists are supportive of Ireland joining the commomwealth, for example, prior to any unity talks as a form of appeasing a minority who identify themselves as British. Commomwealth today, monarchy tomorrow. Disapproval should be registered so as to avoid creating the false impression that a monarchy is acceptable to a republic.

  • RepublicanStones

    Why would a country with so many catholics welcome a member of a monarchy which is anti-catholic? perhaps not in their personal outlook , but they are ‘protected’ by anti-catholic legislation, and seem perfectly happy for it to remain.

    remember princess margaret and her opinion of the irish?

    [edited by moderator]

  • PeaceandJustice

    What’s all the fuss about? Mary McAleese is regularly in Northern Ireland on official business. Remember her comments comparing Northern Ireland Protestants to Nazis. If people in Northern Ireland are to continue to accept frequent visits from the President of Eire without protest, Pan-Nationalists should have the manners to do the same.

    And perhaps the Queen could attend an Ireland rugby home game and represent Northern Ireland – as McAlesse seems to think she represents the whole island.

  • lib2016

    PeaceandJustice,

    Unionists have been increasingly gracious in their attitude to Mary McAleese and are an example for the rest of us to follow. Don’t know about the rugby thing as I hate the whole ‘sport as a replacement for war’ type thinking that so many people on both sides seem to favour, but the Queen should certainly be made welcome wherever she is invited.

  • The Dubliner

    lib2016, I may be the victim of a flawed memory here, but I seem to recall you posting something to the effect that you would like to see Ireland become a monarchy in order to make unionists feel at home. Do you really think that is a valid criterion for rejecting a republic in favour of a monarchy, or for abandoning independence? A monarchist is an antonym of a republican. I think you call yourself a republican but if I have quoted you correctly, then you are most assuredly deeply confused about the two diametrically opposite forms and are not a republican. This is the confused thinking that PSF has subjected the nationalists to.

    Anyway, of course she should be treated with respect as a visiting head of state of a friendly foreign nation (not yet the head of this nation despite the price that northern post nationalists would have others pay to remove the border and unite the island under de facto British rule, completely losing the plot on that one). However, as the citizens are not being paid to be ambassadors for Ireland, they are under no obligation to censor any political objections they may have to the visit on that pretext. If you think Ireland will embrace the monarchy so that you may have the border removed, you should think again.

  • Slugger O’Toole Admin

    Red card to OHYEAH

  • lib2016

    Dubliner,

    I’m a socialist, a republican and a democrat – the last thing I would wish for anywhere is a monarchy. The British model IMO is merely a pretext used by the establishment to introduce all sorts of undemocratic ideas into the politics of the country. Even the British Labour Party is full of ‘top-down’ ideas rather than a respect for the good sense of ordinary people.

  • Greenflag

    ‘Ireland has never embraced royalty and its retinue?

    I would’nt say ‘never’ The Irish embraced King James against the usurper William in the late 17th century . Earlier Irish supported minor Kings and Chieftains and while the old Brehon laws were more ‘democratic’ than feudalism. The native Irish had a hierarchical class system just like all other countries in Europe with nobility (armed thugs ) at the top aided and abetted by the ‘learned class’ ( abbots , priests and further back druids ) . Serfs,slaves, the landless as usual at the bottom.

    ‘I wonder about that, I really do. For example, the royal visit in the early C20th, never mind the C17th and C18th when the people fought for their monarchs, and the history of multiple kingdoms.’

    Not really a wonder if you think about the political , economic and social conditions /environment of the time . A lot of people had no choice . Great Britain was the world power with almost one quarter of the world coloured in ‘red’. Ireland was by far the poorest part of Great Britain in 1911 with Dublin having the worst rate of infant mortality -shortest life expectancy etc etc .Amidst the poverty there remained a minority of privilige mostly what was called the protestant ascendancy but with an increasing number of the rising Catholic middle class ( as in Northern Ireland 1970 – ?)

    For the vast majority of poor Irish i.e those who could not inherit a farm -Dublin was just a large town through which they passed on their way to England , America , Canada , Australia etc etc in the hope of a better life. The rural ‘poor’ in the rest of Britain had some opportunity to find employment in the new industries .

    There was virtually no economic development and Dublin post the Act of Union went into a sharp economic decline . The only outlet for many of the fast growing population was in the Army or Navy which is why at one point some 40% of the British Army was Irish .

    With the Gaelic ‘revival’ in the late 19th century came a renewed interest in Ireland as a separate nation and questions were asked re it’s sad and sorry state ?

    Eventually once most of Ireland ‘spoke’ English and there was a big enough ‘middle class’ which understood why Ireland was relatively poor the earlier calls from O’Connell for Repeal of the Union were resurrected -dusted off and rewrapped as first Home Rule and when that became impossible -full independence .

    Gladstone was about the only British PM who could have reversed the ‘break up’. But at the height of it’s power and with imperial ‘jingoism’ Britain’s 19th century Tories just like the 18th century Hanoverians were averse to any sign of Irish separatism.

    Thus in Ireland -Irish nationalism became in the popular mind equated with Irish democracy and even if later Republicans came to the fore nevertheless the Irish ‘political ‘ mind now sees Ireland’s that imperfect independence as the main reason for the country’s present prosperity and confidence . This is the reason IMO why many Irish have little understanding and probably not a whole lot of respect for the ‘Unionist ‘ position. This should not be mistaken by Unionists as being anti British based on ancient or even recent history. Millions of Irish people ‘know’ England and are not averse to things ‘English’.

    Queenie is welcome to visit if for nothing else than to confirm that the Republic has moved on -and that HM finally accepts that there is no going back to a ‘role’ for any British or indeed any other monarch in the Republic’s political future.

  • pfhl

    And perhaps the Queen could attend an Ireland rugby home game and represent Northern Ireland – as McAlesse seems to think she represents the whole island.

    Posted by PeaceandJustice on Feb 03, 2008 @ 01:20 AM

    The fact she has not, shows how much she cares. Is this a dig at Mary mcAleese? Why? Because she attends the games.

  • Brian Boru

    While a constitutional republican I would welcome Elizabeth Windsor’s visit down here in the name of normalising British-Irish relations.

  • Kilian

    “While a constitutional republican I would welcome Elizabeth Windsor’s visit down here in the name of normalising British-Irish relations.

    Posted by Brian Boru on Feb 03, 2008 @ 06:07 PM”

    Hear Hear !!

    Let sanity prevail.

  • Oiliféar

    And welcome she is too. It’s quite ridiculous to protest her visit. Not only is there the simple fact that she is the head of state of a European partner, but she is also the descendent of our previous monarchs, the head of state of a part of Ireland and of the neighbouring island (not to mention our “cousins” in Australia, New Zealand and Canada).

    Add to this this the fact that it was, if anyone cares to remember, the British monarch that put an end to the Tan War by complaining to the British government of the atrocities that they were committing and suggesting that a truce and negotiations take place. If truth be told, the independence of the 26 counties is owed to the interjection of the British monarch in the conduct of the UK government on behalf of Irish people. If anything she should be welcomed as the granddaughter of an independence era patriot.

    (Talk about democracy and monarchy being the irreconcilable are misplaced. The British monarch, like every other European monarch today, does not represent “real” politics anymore. The UK is a democracy. It’s been a long time since feudalism now.)

  • It was Sammy Mc Nally what done it

    Olifar,

    The Irish attitude to the Royal family is not determined by the behaviour of individual monarchs ( the few good apples theory) but rather by the behaviour of the British state towards Ireland through the centuries.

    As the monarchy has come to symbolise the British State during that period our attitude now should be one of tolerant politeness. Her Majesty should be left under no illusion that
    we expect continued good behaviour from her soldiery and governements but should they revert to any of their previous shenanigans then there will of course be consequences. Presumably there is diplomatic protocol for this type of message which herslef should readily understand having had to visit many former colonies in her lifetime.

    I have little doubt that part of speech will underline how the British state’s attitude to Ireland has now moved from one of neighbourhood bully to well behaved neighbour – we may need to
    give her some space and understanding for her to get this probably coded message across.

  • Pancho’s Horse

    It’ll not do the Armagh ones a bit of harm to get their feet washed. The last time was when the Mall flooded. It’ll bring back memories of the Famine when the English Monarchy sent us a handful of coppers.

  • RepublicanStones

    Lib…..i don’t believe you ran whinging to the moderator…

    moderator, i don’t believe you took a new years resolution to axe your sense of humour.

  • Oiliféar

    It was Sammy …

    “The Irish attitude to the Royal family is …”

    Thank you for taking the time to explain the “Irish attitude” to me. I will take the appropriate steps to readjust my attitude, which in the darkness had wandered so far from the mainstream, to conform to the narrow, parochial foolishness that you have described.

    Many thanks.

    Will you be performing yourself should Mrs. Windsor visit?

  • Johnny

    I think that it’s excellent news – shows how far the Republic has moved on, brings the two nations closer to more understanding and co-operation.

  • Pancho’s Horse

    To which two nations do you refer, O benign One?