“beaten to death by persons who were or are members of the Provisional IRA..”

The Quinn Support Group had previously announced that the family of Paul Quinn would be meeting with leaders of political parties, except for Sinn Fein’s Gerry Adams, and last night Fine Gael leader Enda Kenny did just that. The Irish Times has some of his comments after the meeting [subs req], and the Irish Examiner has more.

“The death of Robert McCartney in Belfast three years ago was an outrageous and grotesque act. This is actually worse in that the murder of Paul Quinn was premeditated and executed in a manner of military fashion in the style of punishment beatings that were carried out in this area many times during the troubles,” [Enda Kenny] said.

More from the Irish Examiner report

The Quinn family have consistently maintained Paul was killed by the IRA because of a personal feud with one of its members and have rejected claims by senior SF figures that the incident was linked with fuel smuggling.

“Shortly after the murder of Paul Quinn, SF attributed this to criminal activity. There is apparently very strong evidence now Paul was beaten to death by persons who were or are members of the Provisional IRA,” Mr Kenny said.

“I hope in the debate in the Dáil, that the SF party will clarify any remaining doubts about Paul Quinn being deemed a criminal by them which has been clarified by all parties with the exception of SF.”

Joined by local TDs and councillors, Mr Kenny insisted the murder would be the litmus test for the future of the peace agreement. He also took the opportunity to criticise the Taoiseach and Minister for Foreign Affairs for failing to redraw statements alleging Mr Quinn was involved in criminality.

And from the Irish Times report [subs req]

Mr Quinn’s family say the attack was carried out by members of the IRA because of a personal feud between Mr Quinn and a south Armagh republican. Sinn Féin has been alone among nationalist parties in maintaining that it stemmed from a row over fuel-smuggling that was criminal in nature.

Mr Kenny reiterated his view that there was very strong evidence that Mr Quinn was beaten to death by current or former members of the Provisional IRA.

He also said that he will ensure that the murder of Mr Quinn will be debated in the Dáil. “When the Dail resumes we can have a short debate of an hour’s duration where all parties of the House can put on the record their belief that this is truly important in the context of the peace process.”

, , , ,

  • It was Sammy Mc Nally what done it

    To paraphrase Grizzly – Paul Quinn isn’t going away you know.

  • Quagmire

    Bloody blue shirts. They don’t even care about the north of Ireland nor about the Quinn family for that matter. Nothing but a bunch of wee free staters. The only time they comment on the north is when it is to attack Sinn Fein. Is it any wonder that they are in a perpetual state of opposition in the 26 counties.They should be re-named the horrible free state west brit oppurtunist party! That is all.

  • It was Sammy Mc Nally what done it

    Quagmire,

    there may well be something in what you say but it is a measure of how badly wrong SF have called this one that FG’s position on this is probably more widely shared by Nationalists\Republicans in the non iron than is SF’s.

  • barneyben

    Yeah Sammy, you’d know.

  • Slieve Gullion

    Quagmire,
    To the best of my knowledge Enda Kenny never mentioned Sinn Fein. There is a family here with a dead lad, so how do you manage to make Sinn Fein the victim? I have seen nobody attacking Sinn Fein as such on the Quinn murder, but I have seen a wide range of people attacking what Sinn Fein said; that the Provos didn’t do it and Paul was a criminal. The first is a nonsense and the second is simply a vicious lie designed to make the first more plausible – which it has signally failed to do. Nobody asked or forced Sinn Fein to get into this murder investigation or set themselves up for justified criticism from across the political and social spectrum north and south. They did it off their own bat for reasons which only they can explain, but clearly it was a foolish move. They have done nothing to extricate themselves and by all accounts Conor Murphy is still digging.

  • lib2016

    Just how right or wrong Sinn Fein have called it will be seen at the next elections. Even a temporary reversal in their fortunes won’t change a great deal. The overall nationalist vote will continue to close in on the unionist majority.

    In the meantime Fine Gael are being pushed into becoming a de facto unionist party which is probably a good thing. I’m all for hands across the border.

    Just as the GFA had to be presented as a defeat for republicans so that all but one of the parties had to back it so the rapproachment between North and South will be presented as a strengthening of the union.

    Surely it’s only a matter of time before Fine Gael and Alliance move towards some kind of formal co-operation?

    If Fianna Fail capture what’s left of the SDLP then FG will need to make a play for the other Northern populist rightwingers.

    Alliance on their own haven’t the resources to get anywhere and the NI Conservatives didn’t capture anyone’s imagination but if they got together with any remaining moderates in the UUP we could see the beginning of something interesting.

    That’s all about the political implications of what we should be treating as a personal tragedy but then that’s what Kenny and others have already started.

  • Slieve Gullion

    lib2016
    We should definitely not be treating the murder of Paul Quinn simply as a personal tragedy. It wasn’t a bolt of lightning or a runaway truck that hit him, it was a 12-strong team of masked, boiler-suited, surgical-gloved men with their own forensic clean-up squad. The only element of accident was the final blow. It was carefully planned as an extreme punishment beating which lasted almost half an hour, and along the way the beaters reminded him and his friends: now you know who is boss around here. Not only was the getaway route premeditated, so was the political smokescreen which kicked in within an hour of Paul dying in Drogheda. Several selected journalists got briefing calls to tell them that if they heard anything about a death related to South Armagh, there was no real story, the guy had been involved in a fight outside a pub in Castleblayney and it was all to do with diesel smuggling. Next day we got the criminal feud story from Adams, and a couple of days later broad hints from Conor that Paul was an all-round bad egg. Meantime the rumour mill on the ground attributed every bit of anti-social behaviour in South Armagh to him. Why the hell should anyone treat this just as a personal tragedy? The politics started before his body was cold. We need a better response than personal sympathy for his family. Any ideas for preventing such ‘personal tragedies’ happening again? Any room in your clinical political analysis for that? The structures that planned and conducted his murder are still there, still going strong. The smoke machine is still there too.

  • It was Sammy Mc Nally what done it

    “That’s all about the political implications of what we should be treating as a personal tragedy but then that’s what Kenny and others have already started.”

    SF politicised this before FG by trying to do a ‘Widgery’ – i.e. blame the victim for his own death in the hope that they would not be damaged by the fall out. Conor threw a complete miscalculation and handed a political stick to his enemies.

  • Jo

    “The structures that planned and conducted his murder are still there, still going strong. The smoke machine is still there too.”

    Almost 3 months now, too.

    And certain Republican blogs that were part of the smokescreen have gone all quiet.

    Strange.

  • moniker

    Quagmire your other moniker wouldnt be chris gaskin would it he also was a cold hearted sort of person.

  • New Yorker

    TDs should ask fellow TD O’Caolain to substantiate or withdraw statements he made at the recent Quinn Support meeting in Castleblaney.

  • Boofetr Murphy

    [see Commenting Policy – edited moderator]

  • Certain Republican blogs were not part of any smokescreen and are no longer quiet now that technical issues have been brough back under control.

  • Moniker

    The owner of this site can confirm that I am not Quagmire or any other person, unlike others on this site I only post under one name and it’s my own name.

  • Boofetr Murphy

    As reported in the local Newry Papers today at the recent Justice Support Group family members of Vincent Trainer, whose home and property has been attacked because of what he claims were allegations made against him in the wake of the murder of Paul Quinn, presented two members of the Group with what they claim to be clear footage showing the son of a prominent member of the Support Group leaving a device on the window sill of his home. The family member also stated that they had handed a copy of this footage into the PSNI. was one of those allegedly involved. OH what a tangled web we weave when first we set out to decieve

  • Quagmire

    I am not cold hearted nor am I Chris Gaskin. I have every sympathy with the Quinn family and their loss and I am utterly and honestly sickened by the manner in which Paul Quinn lost his life, however I believe it is important to point out that in my opinion anything Fine Gael have to say on this matter is both morally bankrupt and entirely politically motivated. Indeed I would go further and question the motivations of some of the people involved in the support group. Are they really there for the family at all? The whole scenario reminds me of a slogan on a wall in Belfast which read ” Santa Claus isn’t coming this year-blame Republicans”. I’m no detective but maybe the young lad was involved in fuel smuggling? Maybe he was a criminal? Who knows? If this were true it certainly dosen’t justify his death however lets not start the Republican bashing ala Mc Cartney style which is unfortunately and true to form the type of activity that Fine Gael love to indulge in.

  • Quagmire

    Oh and by the way Mr Gaskin I would like to add that I frequent your blog over there at balrog from time to time and would just like to congratulate you on a very well run site indeed. Adh mor.

  • Dread Cthulhu

    Quagmire: “I have every sympathy with the Quinn family and their loss and I am utterly and honestly sickened by the manner in which Paul Quinn lost his life, however I believe it is important to point out that in my opinion anything Fine Gael have to say on this matter is both morally bankrupt and entirely politically motivated.”

    Mayhap, but so was the song and dance routine put on by Sinn Fein. Hell, Gerry Adams histrionics were worthy of vaudville.

    Quagmire: “I’m no detective but maybe the young lad was involved in fuel smuggling? Maybe he was a criminal?”

    Assumes facts not in evidence, with more than a bit of wishful thinking. Also, it does nothing to “normalize” the gang-handed mass of boiler-suited hoods in the surgical masks and what can only be described as the counter-forensic team in their wake… not to mention the wave of “nothing to see here” phone calls — also, not a normal thing in the course of affairs.

    Hint: normal hoods do not kill one another in that fashion.

    Now get yourself back to Quohog and stop this foolishness.

  • aye but

    aye but sure thing chris and Quagmire the old aye but shinner spinners you can say what you want chris no one gonna take you to the barn .

  • sceolaing

    boofetr murphy.
    Your post caused me to re read the newry papers and none of them mention a mamber of trainors family saying anything or handing in anything at the ‘blaney meeting. they both quote that mythical beast ‘a source’.
    i was at the ‘blaney meeting. no member of that family spoke . a man, not related, did hand up still photos which caused a bit of giggling when the chairperson described them as being of a youngster peering at the security cameras.
    the truth is that a couple of bangers, squibs, fireworks, were let off that night. far from some kind of bomb or incendary attack.
    other photos handed up included those of graffitti in crossmaglen which had supposedly shocked and horrified those named; why then were s.f. handing them out at a public meeting. all s.f. and the ira had to say at the meeting was basically ‘please let us alone, people are turning against us.’ fair play to the people. incidently anyone who wanted to saw all the photos after the meeting and many were amused by the fact that the so called ‘explosive’ ones were 2 weeks old! no complaint before, no reports of an attack, no urgency because no truth.

  • Red Diesel

    The Provos are running an absolute grievance factory in Cullyhanna and Crossmaglen in a desperate attempt to take the focus off the main story, and the Balrog blog is absolutely instrumental in that process. They have been trying to hang something, anything, on the Quinn family and the Support Group for weeks – the moderated input was just a particularly clumsy, nasty and clearly actionable attempt. Briege Quinn issued her call for no retaliation of any kind through Fr Cullen at Paul’s funeral mass, and she has repeated it – and specified that it covered minor vandalism and graffiti – at public meetings and in a number of statements. Yet they keep coming back, trying to make victims of somebody, anybody, trying to concoct a vendetta out of broken windows, mysterious and extremely suspicious lorry burnings, and now penny bangers.
    Some of their efforts in the local press have been distasteful and pretty close to the rantings of some on this thread. I hear the PSNI were out today knocking doors in St Patrick’s Park in Cullyhanna where the banger incident took place. Good. Anyone engaging in petty vandalism or throwing fireworks should feel the full riguours of the law. But without condoning anything, a little perspective please. On a scale running from zero to getting battered to death by a dozen masked men, to my mind window-breaking, graffiti and throwing fireworks don’t quite make the half-way mark. People are angry and bad things are happening, young lads are slapping each other outside dance halls as they have done for centuries, a woman got beaten in Crossmaglen just for mentioning Paul Quinn, but there is no campaign against anyone, except the campaign of denigration against Paul, his mother and his father.

  • “The Provos are running an absolute grievance factory in Cullyhanna and Crossmaglen in a desperate attempt to take the focus off the main story, and the Balrog blog is absolutely instrumental in that process.”

    Complete and utter nonsense!

  • Turgon

    It was Sammy Mc Nally what done it,

    I hope you are correct that this issue is not going away because it is about justice for Mr. Quinn and his family. However, I am concerned that the issue is gradually going away. Look at the number of articles in the local papers and on the local television; they are gradually decreasing. Even look at Slugger. Where once we had threads with more than one hundred comments within a couple of days now we struggle to have a full page of them.

    Initially it may not look as if media coverage is critical to obtaining justice but ongoing media attention and overt public outrage are necessary to keep up pressure on the Republican movement. Since no one (apart from Mr. Gaskin and his croonies, and of course the DUP) seems to believe that the IRA were not massively involved in this; public outrage and media pressure might have made the republican movement assist the police on one side of the border or another.

    Instead the profile of this terrible event is slowly but surely waning. The republican spin machine has been sucessful thus far. Firstly it dismissed the event, then it smeared Mr. Quinn, then it presented itself as the victim, then offered a fig leaf to the Quinn family. It has behaved exactly as it did over the murder of Mr. McCartney. The script is clearly well rehersed.

    The McCartney murder has I am afraid to say no political relevance now and soon I fear the political relevance of Mr. Quinn’s murder will dissapate. SF and their hangers on have handled this extremely well. Thus there will be no reprecussions at Stormont (the DUP will continue to help there) and SF clearly calculate that the political damage in South Armagh is sufficiently minor to be coped with.

    The result of this: the thraldom of the people of South Armagh to the thugs and murderers will continue and most importantly there will be no justice for Mr. Quinn or his family, just as no one now really expects justice for Mr. McCartney and his family.

    I hope I am wrong on all this.

  • sceolaing

    Red Diesel
    Rang a friend of mine in that Park and she said the p.s.n.i were indeed out. She described it as very cursory, low key stuff,not asking about anyone in particular, going through the motions stuff. Apart from the windows broken 2 months ago no one seems to have any knowledge of these other ‘attacks’ taking place. If Chris had the courage to visit the area or attend the public meetings he would see and hear the ‘grievance machine’ at work but he prefers to listen to people like the one you call ‘the baldy o.c.’ you probably saw the photos yourself in ‘blaney if you were there. Why do you think they were showing photos of graffiti they claimed to be bitterly opposed to? More new victims, do you think and if so would it make you wonder who is at the graffiti?

  • It was Sammy Mc Nally what done it

    Turgon,

    yes I agree pressure needs to be kept on SF and it shows what a crazy world we live in when the people who seem least inclined to seek clarity on this issue are the largest political party in the area (SF) and their partners in government (DUP) who claim to want to weed out the last vestiges of paramilitarism.

    All this whingeing about FG ( who I have no love for ) but who have a track record of condemning ALL paramilitary acts of violence is pure smokescreening.

    SF will next be embarassed in Dail on this and presumably the family support group will ( hopefully ) keep highlighting this issue until
    SF is forced to take a credible stand.

  • sceolaing

    The pressure must be kept on and I think it will. No doubt it will not remain as high profile as it is but I think the local people will not let it go away. The family and their supporters have plenty of options as to what they should do and apparently more and more people, both local and further afield are offering them help.People in England and the U.S.A are inviting them over, meetings are being offered in a whole lot of places.
    S. F. believes that if they keep their heads down this will go away but this one is not going away.
    There are far more people involved in this than just the few prominent through their public roles on the committee. Something has changed big time in that area, changed for the better.

  • no nonsense

    Complete and utter nonsense! Posted by Chris Gaskin
    Thats right mr gaskin thats all you write. You and the other shinner spinners what about the wee romper room in francis street that the republican heros kept oh nothat was a sinn fein office .A lot of us catholics/nationalists will never forget or forgive sinn fein.Come on up here bertie dont mind a few bob here and there but robbin thievin murderers like the hero repulicams of south armagh and environs no thanks no vote.Your time is running out thank god.

  • sceolaing

    No nonsense.
    You’re right about Francis street but that would be away before Gaskin’s time. he really has little in dept understanding of the past because he takes as gospel what some very unsavoury characters tell him without understanding that they have their own very personal reasons for feeding lies to peole like him.

  • New Yorker

    Sceolaing

    St. Patrick’s Day is only two months away and the Quinns and McCartneys might just be invited to NY and Washington. And it will not be they who will be on the hot seat.

    You are correct about the depth and breath of support for the Quinns. We live in a global village.

    You are also correct that some are slithering in the underbrush but when least expected it might ignite. And then it will be every snake for itself.

  • no nonsense

    The problem sceolaing is there were and are francis streets all over the north and they are still operating thats why and how young Quinn came to be butchered murdered smashed beaten to a pulp (they havnt gone away you know)and now chris gaskin and co are on the scene telling us we are wrong. Young QUINN WASNT THE CRIMINAL HERE oh no the criminals here were the big republican heros of south armagh who i am sure to a man vote sinn fein oh the hereos the boyos the great gang of 20 who stood around and took turns for OVER HALF AN HOUR TO BEAT YOUNG Quinn TO A PULP TO SMASH EVERY BONE IN HIS BODY WHAT MEN WHAT FUCKIN MOTHER SPAWNED THEM.