stupidly

Dave from Nottingham” with his arts co-ordinator PC-whatever title should take his skills elsewhere…try your hand feeding the poor in eritrea or something mate…you’re a walking joke….

Perhaps I’ve missed the point. Would someone explain to me their vision of honest, free and open discussion in Northern Ireland?

stupidly (on the bemusement of a community arts worker)

stupidly –
i let them have it their way
did not bind them up
cut out their tongues

stupidly
i did not make sure
they could not
move an inch

(we don’t want freedom here
– we’re not stupid)

stupidly – i considered
their work valuable

i asked them for their poem
but did not interject when they
found their own words

(they gave me bags of small change
when i should have asked
for even amounts in pounds)

stupidly i let them
use their own language – make a joke
enjoy the process
talk about the lies that we
as adults make – oh how stupid!

stupidly – i did not give or
order the words for them
put them in a stanza for myself
that slips like treacle
off the tongue…

and how stupid could i be?

i did not chalk upon the board
which words were suitable
which words would sell

o children
how can we make this acceptable
not raise the shackles of perfectionists
make sure we say the right thing
raise the correct political point?

stupidly – i did not block them
cujole them
bully them
order them about
tell them they were crap
keep them silent

stupidly – i should have written
the poem for myself

but it wouldn’t have had
the same flavour

stupidly

  • nutjack

    not exactly Arctic Monkeys style social commentary is it now?

    heard of Scrabble?

    FFS save us all

  • wordsmith

    Dabble?

    at Scrabble?

    That Rabble?

    With their babble and their gabble?

    Err, I’ve ran out of ‘abble words..

    Pity the same hadn’t happened Dave (you can almost feeeeeel his pain) and his motley crew…..

  • Dave, have you been introduced to the boys with the baseball bats and wearing balaclavas. It looks like they comment here on Slugger too.You find that these types are only strong and mouthy in a crowd, if you meet them on their own there “scared shitless”. I suppose they wouldn’t really worry you as at present isn’t Nottingham the gun capital of the UK.

    It must be hard to play Scrabble wearing a balaclava 😉

  • Its our taxes that fund this rubbish. I’ve asked Dave three times how much public money his group gets each year – he has so far refused to answer.
    His poetry reminds me of the story of the Emperor’s New Clothes. I bet everyone in his organisation fawns over it, but when he brings it to an independent audience we all show it up for the shite it is.

  • spare us

    Yeah, that money should be going to more worthy projects like ads in Daily Ireland, or more funding of the Andersonstown News Group, now that’s literature!!

  • TAFKABO

    Everyones a critic.

    I think it’s too easy to dismiss subsidised art without considering the value of what it provides for those who take part in it, regardless of how we might percieve the poems it produces.

    If Dave, and his organisation, manages to turn young people on to poetry or other non tradtional forms of cultural expression, then it doesn’t necessarily matter if they turn out good poetry themselves, rather that they are now better equiupped to go through life being able to appreciate this art form they may otherwise have missed.

  • Paul,
    I’d check out http://www.seupb.org/index.asp

    Cross border co-operation, building peace and reconciliation are at the core of the work of the Special EU Programmes Body. Meet The Team
    What We Do

    We are one of the six cross border Bodies set up under the “Agreement between the Government of Ireland and the Government of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland establishing implementing bodies” signed on 8 March 1999 (the British-Irish Agreement of 8 March 1999). The Agreement was given domestic effect, North and South, by means of the North/South Co-operation(Implementation Bodies) (Northern Ireland) Order 1999 and the British-Irish Agreement Act 1999 respectively.

    We manage the EU Programme for Peace and Reconciliation (PEACE II), worth over €707 million, and the €182 million INTERREG IIIA Programme. We are also involved in the cross border elements of other Community Initiatives (LEADER +, URBAN II and EQUAL) and are responsible for implementing the Common Chapter.

    We have three offices throughout Northern Ireland and the Border Region. Our headquarters are in Belfast, our office in Omagh is primarily concerned with the PEACE Programme and our office in Monaghan oversees the work of the INTERREG Programme and Other Community Initiatives.

    I’m sure if it’s public money it’ll be available information for the public. It mightn’t be published though for a few months or even years.

    To finish, you typed…
    “His poetry … we all show it up
    “we” I only speak for myself. If Mick decides to run a poll about Daves poetry on this site it might give a better reflection of what commenters on this site think about it.

    Fuck, is that the time…better go!

  • moochin photoman

    Paul Panther
    FFS, wind your neck in……i’ve already posted elsewhere on slugger about how community arts are undervalued and unappreciated.
    Your attitude harks back to time when there was little or no provision for events and activities such as this.
    The end result is not the be all end…its all about the process of engagement and involvement for the participants and what skills and knowledge they might be able to bring to their everyday existance and environment.
    Chgange of attitude is a possibility.
    How much do you earn?

  • Pete Baker

    moochin

    “The end result is not the be all end…its all about the process of engagement and involvement for the participants and what skills and knowledge they might be able to bring to their everyday existance and environment.”

    I agree entirely, as I also pointed out in earlier threads.

    However, and I think this may be the problem here [although it doesn’t excuse the abusive comments from some – play the ball people], we are being presented with the end result and asked to comment on it alone [sorry Dave].

  • Miss Fitz

    Pete
    I dont neccesarily agree with that assesment.
    I am more inclined to agree with mooch on this one, that the process is as if not more important than the end product.

    Goodness Pete, if we were able to create a harmonious society through this kind of work, which do you think would be more important:

    The standard of the work
    or
    The fact everyone achieved a better understanding of each other.

    And a word to Paul Panther:
    What on earth are you talking about? Have you read Dave’s blogspot where he describes the project? I have referred you to the Cnon na Feola project here before, have you done that?

    Dave did a one-off piece for a group in the Mournes. Big frigging deal. I gave of my time, and a little of my skills as a volunteer for the project. This is not some big state subsidy yoke, probably enough to cover some expenses and the publication.

    As my friend has said, FFS wind yer neck in

  • Pete Baker

    Miss Fitz

    Erm… didn’t I agree with Moochin?

  • Miss Fitz

    Ach Pete, I wasnt trying to be mean!! 😉

    You said that we were being asked to judge the end result alone, and I think Mooch was making the point that its the process not the product, and we cannot judge the end result on its own if learning or reconciliation has taken place in the interim

    Perhaps I was being subtle (I dont know what that feel like)

  • Pete Baker

    Miss Fitz

    Perhaps I was being too subtle :o)

    I was agreeing with Moochin that it’s the process, not the product, that is important.

    But, and it’s an important but, all we are being presented with here on Slugger, and all we can comment on, is the product.

  • Green Ink

    I’m afraid Pete’s right, presenting the poem “cold” and out of context kills it. Poetry is an especially difficult form and expecting the musings from a workshop to stand up on Slugger or elsewhere is expecting too much. The process is what’s of primary importance in community arts, so better to feed back on the tangibles (how/if the project is achieving its goals) than quoting the verse that results (did the participants give permission for their work to be used in a public forum by the way?).

    The converse of this is: don’t get so bogged down in negatively criticising the work if the participants are taking something positive from it (like feeling accomplishment at having their work featured on Slugger!)

  • Miss Fitz

    Sorry Pete, get what you are saying now, and I see totally what you mean. I am knackered after my big day out in the city!

  • Miss Fitz, Green Ink, Pete, I take your points on board – bottom line though it is still crap.
    I can’t see how it acts as a vehicle for reconciliation or why it should be on this website – it neither falls into the politics or culture categories.

  • armalites r u

    Sl this is the famous Peace Dividend. Grants for Englishmen and American blow ins. On this evidence, war is better than jaw jaw.

    “Oh it’s down in the Bogside
    That’s where I long to be
    Loying n the dark
    With a Provie Company
    A comrade on my left
    Another on my right
    And a little clio of ammo
    Fore my old Armalite”

    More subsidies for Provo poets, less for UVF graffiti artists, and none for English and Americna blow ins please. Find another cash cow to milk.

  • moochin photoman

    Paul Panther,
    if you can’t see what role dialogue and engagement has to play in our society and if you are an indication of attitudes generally i would despair.
    Fortunately i have experiences gained here that tell me otherwise so i will not worry myself with such a narrow minded view……you didn’t tell us how much you earn by the way.

    armalite r u
    if there are any stray armalites around you know where you can consign them.
    BTW……Would that little “clio” be painted gun metal grey and made of decommissioned weaponry by any chance?

  • ozzy

    Yes Dave, you are stupid. Letting people use their own words and voice their opinions is a dangerous thing to do. Others are not always prepared or willing to listen and understand what is being said. As well as making bad poetry!!

  • Valid points discussed here that I seemed to have missed last night…

    “I think it’s too easy to dismiss subsidised art without considering the value of what it provides for those who take part in it, regardless of how we might percieve the poems it produces. Posted by TAFKABO”

    “Poetry is an especially difficult form and expecting the musings from a workshop to stand up on Slugger or elsewhere is expecting too much. The process is what’s of primary importance in community arts, so better to feed back on the tangibles (how/if the project is achieving its goals) than quoting the verse that results

    The converse of this is: don’t get so bogged down in negatively criticising the work if the participants are taking something positive from it (like feeling accomplishment at having their work featured on Slugger!)

    Posted by Green Ink”

    And…
    The words of the poem “stupidly (on the bemusement of a community arts worker) remind me of words written by the prophet Jeremiah.What do you think of that Dave, now you’re being compared to an Old Testament prophet.

  • ballymichael

    I enjoyed the poem. A good play on the various meanings of stupidly (shading into stupefied).