PSNI come to the rescue of Orangemen as legal cases dropped (again)

It looks like many of the Orangemen and their supporters who were involved in the intense rioting last Autumn will escape prosecution after what is being termed a ‘bureaucratic blunder’ by the PSNI. Many will note that this is the second time a PSNI ‘blunder’ has resulted in Whiterock Orangemen evading prosecution. Both Sinn Fein and the SDLP have observed that no such bureaucratic blunder was committed when 23 nationalists were brought before the courts two weeks ago over charges relating to the rioting last July in Ardoyne.

  • Crataegus

    Those responsible loosing their job? If not there will be no encouragement to learn to do things correctly.

  • bertie

    I am very very disappointed that any rioters should get off Scot free. However incompetance in any branch of the public sector fails to suprise me.

    I think that we need to know what investigation has taken place, what the lessons learned are and what the implications are for how the police does business. This sort of incompetance should not be tolerated. I know that some will read political bias into this but incometance and complacence about incompetance is rife throughout the public sector.

  • fair_deal

    CD

    “in Whiterock Orangemen evading prosecution”

    Neither the PPS nor the PSNI have identified who the 13 are so on what basis are you claiming they are members of the OO?

  • big K

    Shoddy piece of reporting with one thing in mind to try to keep the myth going that prods get special treatment from the police, i would expect this from some republican toilet roll but it looks like you are moving to the same level.

  • Belfast Gonzo

    Judging from the next blog entry on this website (by Fair Deal), it seems that both sides get the occasional by-ball from the PSNI.

  • fair_deal

    CD

    “Both Sinn Fein and the SDLP have observed that no such bureaucratic blunder was committed when 23 nationalists were brought before the courts two weeks ago over charges relating to the rioting last July in Ardoyne.”

    It’d be useful to check if it is different DCU’s responsible for producing the files.

    The North Belfast DCU has been pretty thorough in dealing with rioting charges both nationalist and loyalist e.g. the anti-police riots organised by the UVF in Woodvale. The senior officers in North seem to be the effective sort.

    As West Belfast DPP is mentioned then it was probably up to West Belfast DCU. Arrogance seems the main qualification for senior rank in West Belfast.

    “the rescue of orange rioters (again)”

    The headline is also wrong. The first charge against an Orangeman was not for rioting. So he was in no way an “Orange rioter” and to describe him as such is potentially libelous statement.

  • Chris Donnelly

    “This is the second time charges against Whiterock Orangemen have been dropped due to a bureaucratic bungle.”

    Fair Deal,
    Not my words, but those of the journalist at the Irish News responsible for the story.

  • Chris Donnelly

    Point taken, FD. New heading should avoid confusion.

  • fair_deal

    CD
    1. Dodgy reporting on the Irish News’s part, why did I just know it was old Barry at his work.
    2. Thanks on the headline change

  • English

    The headline is also wrong. The first charge against an Orangeman was not for rioting. So he was in no way an “Orange rioter” and to describe him as such is potentially libelous statement.

    Posted by fair_deal on Apr 17, 2006 @ 12:33 PM

    The thing that amazes me is that Orangemen were caught red handed on camera rioting and attacking the security forces, how these people were not charged I do not know. If that was in England they would be charged and punished for their wrongdoings.

    Perhaps the fact that the Orange Order stated that Orangemen were not involved in criminality (even though they obviously were) set the example for this investigation of yet another example of many violent Orange events.

    English

  • This – recycled SF press releases – is getting *very* boring. The “body slugger” can doubtless take more of this dull, dull, dull stuff, but let’s not kid ourselves that most readers of this site want pro-Provo propaganda day after day after day. Their opinions to one side, it really is remarkably boring stuff.

  • Reader

    betrie: I think that we need to know what investigation has taken place, what the lessons learned are and what the implications are for how the police does business.
    The article answers that question: “The PPS is understood to have accepted responsibility for the 13 cases but voiced concern that the PSNI had only submitted files seven days before the six-month timeframe elapsed.”
    “The mix-up is understood to have led to the introduction of new guidelines which mean the PSNI has to submit prosecution files to the PPS 20 days in advance of any requirement for a court extension.”

  • Comrade Stalin

    Karl Rove, Slugger seems quite balanced to me. We’ve got Chris D and Fair Deal putting the case from different perspectives. If you don’t like it then (a) offer Mick your services as a blogger or (b) go away and whine on A Tangled Web or something.

  • Forgive me Joe, but I couldn’t give a toss whether you think it’s balanced or not. Not least as that wasn’t my point. My point, to repeat for the slow Joes, was that, “more cut n’ paste Provo speak = more boredom for Slugger readers”. And yeah, I’ll go (and I won’t be the only one), leaving you to the directives from the SF press office. Enjoy.

  • qubol

    at best this is incompetence – at worst complicity in a crime. Fair Deals points about the PSNI are interesting, I don’t know a lot about the organisation of the PSNI in north and west belfast but why does it take multiple errors (at best) to fix this – what action can we expect to be taken against those responsible?

    Karl Rove: “it really is remarkably boring stuff”
    hardly karl, those riots did huge damage and our attempts to prosecute those responsible have foundered because of the PSNI again. Quite a serious matter I think.

  • fair_deal

    English

    There is nothing in the Irish news article to sustain the claim the 13 cases involved were members of the OO.

    “on camera rioting and attacking the security forces, how these people were not charged I do not know. If that was in England they would be charged and punished for their wrongdoings.”

    Cathcing anyone on film doesn’t mean the police can identify them, find them and charge them. So you are claiming everyone in England caught on CCTV ends up in court and gets convicted? Hmmm.

  • George

    Fair_deal,
    in your honest opinion, did any members of the Orange Order riot that day?

    Do you think the IMC would have given the organisation a clean bill of health for its behaviour that day?

  • elfinto

    I just read Barry McCaffrey’s article which is available at newshound.com and I really can’t see why FD sees fit to attack the messanger for reporting another disgraceful piece of collusion between elements in the PSNI and the Orange Order knuckle draggers who caused mayhem on the streets last October.

    What is incredible is that this is the SECOND time that the PSNI and PPS have used the SAME EXCUSE for failing to prosecute Whiterock Orangemen. In any accountable organisation heads would roll. I look forward to the SDLP members of the Policing Board seeing to it that they do.

  • Dread Cthulhu

    Elfinito: “I just read Barry McCaffrey’s article which is available at newshound.com and I really can’t see why FD sees fit to attack the messanger for reporting another disgraceful piece of collusion between elements in the PSNI and the Orange Order knuckle draggers who caused mayhem on the streets last October. ”

    It does not fit in his internal monologue of how these events should be seen and, as such, is reflexively attacked on the narrowest of grounds. Its abit like putting cover-up make-up over a zit or eye — nothing to see here, move along, please. The original Newshound article refers to Loyalists at an Orange Order parade, not Orangemen. Rather than address the meat of the issue — the PSNI’s repeated bureaucratic bungling of this matter — he sallies forth to obfuscate matters by picking nits.

  • English

    English

    There is nothing in the Irish news article to sustain the claim the 13 cases involved were members of the OO.

    “on camera rioting and attacking the security forces, how these people were not charged I do not know. If that was in England they would be charged and punished for their wrongdoings.”

    Cathcing anyone on film doesn’t mean the police can identify them, find them and charge them. So you are claiming everyone in England caught on CCTV ends up in court and gets convicted? Hmmm.

    Posted by fair_deal on Apr 17, 2006 @ 05:03 PM

    Fair Deal,

    Come off it! Of course not everyone in England are convicted by CCTV, but an increasing amount of people are – due to advances in technology. For example if members of the NF or football hooligans riot they are always traced back to their organisations and dealt with accordingly – this is a fact and also acts as a deterrent (obviously). Wny do you think that Police use camera’s at such events?

    It appears that SF are correct in their claim about political policing, and I wouldn’t normally subscribe to their point of view. However, there is little excuse for not bringing to justice such people caught red handed on national TV in broad daylight – unless it is the Orange Order in Northern Ireland! This is not a fair deal and it appears that some people in this society can do whatever they like!

    English

  • Yokel

    Its called political policing English, like the Met quietly ignoring some Moslems calling for people to be killed etc at protests in London only for public complaints and a press campaign forcing them to actually enforce the law.

    It happens eveywhere and on a human level who would you want to show preference to, a group that refuses to recognises your existence and tried to blow up your colleagues for 30 years or anther bunch who have their sporadic incidents but by and large haven’t given you so much grief over that time? Just like many nationlaists who oppose violence yet didnt want to see Sinn Fein excluded even though their armed wing was still holding weaponary because, in short, they are one of their own, unpleasant or not.

    Excusable, no. Understandable on a human level yes. Its breaking out of that is essential.

  • English

    Yokel,

    It is because of political policing that Sinn Fein does not recognise the PSNI. The full implementation of the Patton Report, 50/50 recruitment, continuing reform and monitoring (by everyone including Sinn Fein) is the only way forward. The Police have to gain trust from the whole of society, and they are slowly but surely gaining this in Northern Ireland.

    You cannot compare the Police in England to the PSNI. The first role of the Police is firstly to protect the state and secondly to uphold law in both instances. The English Police spend the majority of their time upholding the law however. There isd no need for checks and balances on the English Police as they have mass support from the public.

    In contrast the PSNI appear to spend most of their energy in protecting the state. The PSNI are placed in a unique situation, and have a history of very inappropriate and illegal behaviour, which is unnacceptable when one considers they are supposed to be upholding the law. If they are to gain the trust of the public, inappropriate political policing has to stop.

  • Dr Strangelove

    Karl Rove –

    “This – recycled SF press releases – is getting *very* boring. The “body slugger” can doubtless take more of this dull, dull, dull stuff, but let’s not kid ourselves that most readers of this site want pro-Provo propaganda day after day after day. Their opinions to one side, it really is remarkably boring stuff.”

    While this little local NI difficulty might seem a trivial matter from the distant shores of the Lone Star State, I think the taxpapyers of Northern Ireland have a right to know who will be held accountable for the profilgate waste of their taxes in policing and then clearing up the mess, both literally and metaphorically.

    It is academic whether the rioters were members of the Orange Order or not. It is reasonable to believe that a few of those mentioned in the files presented would have had a serious case to answer before the courts. Personaly I am a bit annoyed that millions of our hard earned dollars were diverted from other resource starved areas and no one will be held to account for that.