DUP to chase Stormontgate answers

The Republican line on Stormontgate affair is that it was ‘a part of the Save Dave campaign’ to retain David Trimble as leader of the Unionist community. It seems the DUP is not convinced about the motives of the British unexpectedly dropping the same prosecution three and a half years later are either transparent or wholesome.

  • Cynic

    This is the ideal outcome for Govt. – both ‘sides’ can cry foul at the same time and the true story gets lost in the process. Methinks that nationalists and unionists doth protest too much.

  • Thomas

    And here was little old me, thinking that the DUP were supporting the Sinn Fien members for their wrongfull arrest, and standing up against the injustice done to these 3 innocent people.

  • heck

    Could someone explain exactly what is supposed to have happened in the Stormontgate affair? As I see it, even if the allegations that have been made are true, (and that is now in doubt) all that happened was that a civil servant leaked some documents to a political party. While that is technically illegal it is certainly not the first, or last, time it has happen, and the unionist parties are not clean here either.

    Could one imagine if police storm troopers had raided the House of Commons in the 30’s because civil servants were leaking documents to Churchill about German rearmament?

    I would like to know more that the repeat of the phrase “spy ring”. This is a loaded phrase with no details to back up its use and suggest a propaganda exercise on the works.

    Until someone posts more information that what I have my view it that the shiners’ are probably closer to the truth the most people on this site are willing to admit.

  • aquifer

    “a civil servant leaked some documents to a political party”

    Documents that contained the names and addresses of potential terrorist targets?

    What this could be demonstrating is the effectiveness of militant republican countermeasures against justice. Simply refusing to co-operate with the police while hiring the best lawyers in town.

    Until Sinn Fein recognise the police suspect the worst is the safest bet. That is, they are a communist conspiracy intent on subverting states north and south, who will use all sorts of shadow organisations under their control to discredit lawful authority. And if we call them for that and the tax fiddles and fraud, expect threats and worse.

  • Henry94

    acquifer

    i What this could be demonstrating is the effectiveness of militant republican countermeasures against justice. Simply refusing to co-operate with the police while hiring the best lawyers in town.

    Isn’t this exactly the kind of thinking that led to the murder of Pat Finucane.

    Hiring a lawyer is not a countermeasure against justice. It is part of justice.

  • Butterknife

    I read in the News of the World that the collapse was to protect an informer.

  • topdeckomnibus

    This is an interesting thread. I have been blocked, a number of times, by the absolute custodianship power of the Attorney General.

    In my case in the background was the roles played by Airey Neave and Henry Sporborg (those who were the powers behind Margaret Thatcher).

    Those who get to rule then get to rule what is the public interest the Attorney General’s secret power protects.

    Pat Finucane was mentioned. I wonder about the Pat Finucane Human Rights Centre.

    Kent’s Chief constable was initially deployed on the Rosemary Nelson case. I objected to his deployment from England.

    In 1987 after arrests of 21 Territorial Army recruited paramiltaries (Unlawful Drilling Act 1819) there were no charges brought

    Yes …. a public interest decision

    These arrests occurred in Kent and were of men who had Kent Police issued firearms certificates for arsenals .. like two calibres of high velocity and 9 mm pistol and unlimited ammo and round refill (powder licence). After the public interest decision not to prosecure … the firearms certs were re-issued in the face of objections in Kent.

    Given the background to the solicitor murders of alleged co-operation between security forces and loyalist paramilitaries, then deploying Kent Chief constable (already then allegedly the former leader of the Greater Mabchester Police Get Stalker campaign) deploying Kent Chief constable did not strike us as a way to promote justice.

    Equally strangely to our minds was the response from the Pat Finucane Human Rights people

    “Perhaps it is time the Rosemary Nelson case went on the back burner”

    Almost as if they, like the public interest and Kent Chief constable, did not want Territorial Army paramilitaries investigated ??

  • pakman

    Thomas

    “3 innocent people” hmmm.

    A failed prosecution does not an angel make.

  • Thomas

    pakman.
    I didnot say they were angels, what i said was they were innocent of the charges laid against them.
    The only angels ive seen in Ireland, are my two daughters.

  • heck

    so what are they suppose to have done? Everyone cries “spy ring” and all I see is some leaked documents.

    The fact that the northern ireland media repeats the line that the assembly was brought down because of an “IRA spy ring” and does no ask hard questions of the government suggests to me a propaganda excerise at work.

    So I ask again–other than a civil servant leaking documents to elected representatives what is supposed to have happened?

  • J Kelly

    Heck I am with you but what about this for a thought. The special branch were running an operation and when the time suited they pulled the plug and brought the Assembly down. Remember the time Trimble had made this pledge that if the IRA did not decommission he would pull the Assembly down, but what happens instead special branch do his job for him and lay the blame with republicans.

    Now after three years the case collapses because it would not be in the public interest to allow in public view the level of power and control that special branch have over policing in the north.

  • PaddyReilly

    What you need to understand here is the nature of judicial thinking. To be successfully prosecuted for obtaining or passing on information that could be of use to a terrorist organisation, it first has to be shown that there is some active terrorist organisation to which the information could plausibly be passed. There is not. Given a Republican Army which only acts to divest itself of its arms, no intelligence gathering by any Republican party could be regarded as dangerous. We are to assume that al Qaeda would not be interested in the addresses of NI prison officers. If, at some time during the past three years, the Unionists had managed to provoke a Republican insurgency, then the prosecution could have gone ahead. But as things are at the moment, the action would inevitably fail.

    Otherwise, the charge of ‘spying’ is only the sort of thing one could expect from Iranians and Chinese at the time of the Cultural Revolution. It merely means we are hostile towards you because you are different from us.

  • aquifer

    henry94

    “”Simply refusing to co-operate with the police while hiring the best lawyers in town.”

    Isn’t this exactly the kind of thinking that led to the murder of Pat Finucane?”

    No Henry. I’m just a bit jealous that I might one day have to face charges without the benefit of communal coaching in obstructive silence, or without help in getting the best lawyers.

    The Sunday Times is claiming that the case was stopped to protect the identity of a civilian informant.’The local person was not a high-level agent within the IRA but a local person who reported his suspicions to the police’

  • Henry94

    aquifer

    I’m just a bit jealous that I might one day have to face charges without the benefit of communal coaching in obstructive silence, or without help in getting the best lawyers.

    You don’t need the best lawyers the basics. For example even a half-drunk half-wit of a lawyer is going to look for discovery of evidence.

    So for The Sunday Times or anyone else to pretend that discovery was unexpected in this case is absurd.

    That’s just a bit of spin designed to fool the gulible ie the same people who believed David Trimble when he claimed this was bigger than Watergate, who believed the PNSI raided the Sinn Fein office at Stormont for anything more than a ohoto-opporyunity and who believed there was ever a chance of this case getting to trial.

    Because the reality is this case has been falling apart from the start. These are simply the last charges to be dropped against the last accused.

    I’m sure the lawyers would be flattered that you think they are all briliant for doing something so basic that even the kind of lawyer you could afford would think of it.

    In any case you just remember to keep your mouth shut until he gets there. And remind him about the discovery thing. just in case.

  • Dread Cthulhu

    Just to echo what I’ve said elsewhere and Henry94 said above, discovery is de rigeur to the trial process. If the defendant’s lawyers *HADN’T* made the request, they would have grounds for appeal based on an inadequate defense.

    As a matter of factual inquiry, has *anyone* been charged, let alone convicted, out of this whole debacle?