Does Ahern have dirty hands?

DUP leader Ian Paisley has called for Taoiseach Bertie Ahern to keep his “dirty hands” off Northern Ireland. Is it correct for Paisley to use such terms when talking about the leader of one of Northern Ireland’s main trading partners and does this perhaps explain why Paisley still refuses to even shake hands with Ahern in public?

  • spirit-level

    Paisley would be in danger of a yellow card if he kept that language up here on sluggers , so what does that tell us?

  • maca

    If he kept his own dirty hands off NI the country might be in a better state today.

  • aquifer

    Not getting his hands dirty makes him superior?

    People who think they can keep harsh words and violence very separate here are moral imbeciles or calculating cowards or both.

  • Colonel_Grim

    Why shouldnt he say that?

    After all Ahern is the PM of a foriegn state which still illegally claims sovereignty over the people of its neighbouring state!

    Besides people always use harsh languge against Rev Paisley, and not one bats an eyelid! such double standards!

  • Henry94

    Do Paisley’s voters still buy this stuff? What do they think is discussed at Paisley’s regular meetings with Ahern?

    The issue around parades this year concerns the refusal of parade organisers to obey the laws passed by HMG.

    It is the Orange Order who are challenging the authority of the British state in Ireland now. We will soon find out if they can still get away with it.

  • Martin

    Dont agree with Paisley about the dirty hands;-greasy lips ( From all the brown Envelopes he has licked and received in the last 20 years) would have been more appropriate and would have had more cross community support.

  • maca

    CG
    “a foriegn state which still illegally claims sovereignty over the people of its neighbouring state!”

    In what way?

  • Crow

    This type of bravado, while classic Paisley and entertaining in the past, is ever more depressing given his expanded electoral mandate. But you get what you pay for or in this case vote for.

    The Republic (personified by Ahern and personalized by Paisley) doesn’t have it’s hands on Northern Ireland but rather is thoroughly engaged in a full body embrace.

    This is not 1985 and the good doctor knows this. Instead I would offer that he is engaged in magician’s art mis-direction. Look nothing up my sleaves as I prepare to pull the rabbit from my hat.

  • G-man

    Recently returned to NI after 20 years away and I am new to this board so apologies if this has been said before.

    Come from a prod background but non-religious and I find a lot of traditional Unionist politics totally alien.

    For example the reported comments by Rev Ian are just plain stupid. 30-40% of the population of NI regard themselves as Irish. It is, therefore, entirely reasonable for the Irish PM to show an interest in the internal affairs of NI.

    Typically Paisley, typically DUP, typically depressing.

  • martin

    He is just trying to play to a Unionist seige-mentality that is thankfully disapearing more and more every day–

    Dr Paisleys statements would fit the era of the 1960’s and 1970s Unionist politics,but that time of fear both real and engineered and whipped up by him and his is over.

    I think it says a lot about the younger people in his party that they cannot persuade him to enjoy a retirement thats long over due,and would help them with public relations–despite however large his majority was in winning the Westminster seat.

    Do DUP supporters believe that this party has any future or that it can possibly deliver them anything when its younger generation of up and comming leaders havent the guts to tell an 80 year old man the truth—-The IRA is probably going to retire =its greatest ever recruiting sargent should bow out with them

  • DavidH

    Henry94: It is the Orange Order who are challenging the authority of the British state in Ireland now. We will soon find out if they can still get away with it.

    Well – civil disobedience campaigns have both a past (the Nationalist Rate strike) and a future (Water charges) here in NI. So how about defining “get away with it”, and saying how civil disobedience campaigns *should* be handled?

  • Henry94

    DavidH

    Getting away with it would be marching illegally and not being stopped. If they won’t take responsibility for their marches then the marches will have to be stopped.

    If there is violence associated with the protests then I believe the Order should be declared an illegal organisation and its leaders charged and jailed.

    The principle must be established that when you bring people onto the streets then you are responsible for their behaviour.

    I would like to see unionists taking a lead in forcing the order to act responsibly. But I won’t hold my breath.

  • Alan

    Paisley’s words may be welcome from a Free P pulpit (though I doubt several of his congregation might challenge him on that), but they are shameful in the political context.

    I’m not against harsh words as such, particularly if they are challenging and relevant to the point in question. The use of the term *dirty hands* is neither of these things. It is cliched and merely abusive. The unfortunate thing is that people associate the speaker with the abuse, rather than the substance of their argument.

  • crow

    If you believe that if someone brings people onto the streets and there is trouble,would that reasoning also be levelled at Bob Geldof if there is trouble in Edinburgh at the G8 demonstrations(which a lot of people think may happen).Could Sir Bob become an illegal organisation?

  • Andrew

    An observation. Ian Paisley comes across as a rambling idiot in the media. Southern people can’t understand this nut, take as an example when he won his seat he went up and started singing. People must admit this was a bit strange. As long as Unionism has him at the helm Unionists will not be understood. There is no way in the world that Dublin could or should do any Business with this guy. The people who run the Celtic Tiger economy, the 05-D Merc drives that pay no tax and live off shore are not going to do business with a man who rants and raves and is prone to bouts of public singing at very inappropriate moments.
    Just think what Bertie and the FF boys think. Have to hand it to him when he went on about Brian Cowen’s lips. Great stuff!
    The other three main parties should form a Government without the singing preacher and just move on like the rest of the world.

  • MARTIN

    I wouldnt think there is any truth in the dirty hands bit though–with Aherne spending 170,000 euro per year on beauty treatment and nail manicures–he’s being ripped off though he’s still an ugly, shifty ,squirmy little toad .

  • Tochais Síoraí

    NI unionists are consistently let down by their political leaders – the lack of political nous, the ignorance and the simple bad manners is unbelievable (Trimble wasn’t an awful lot better at times).

    People in Britain and the Republic simply do not take Paisley seriously. He’s been shouting his mouth off for so long and behaving so ludicrously that most people just switch off. When someone asks him a question that he doesn’t like or can’t answer he tries to bully them or else he goes off on some ridiculous tangent. Ahern ignores the bad manners and like Blair, swallows his pride big time to be in the same room as Paisley for the sake of some sort of normal future for NI.

    I’d say Ahern would rather nail his fingers to the wall than meet this guy never mind shake hands.

  • Tochais Síoraí

    NI unionists are consistently let down by their political leaders – the lack of political nous, the ignorance and the simple bad manners is unbelievable (Trimble wasn’t an awful lot better at times).

    People in Britain and the Republic simply do not take Paisley seriously. He’s been shouting his mouth off for so long and behaving so ludicrously that most people just switch off. When someone asks him a question that he doesn’t like or can’t answer he tries to bully them or else he goes off on some ridiculous tangent. Ahern ignores the bad manners and like Blair, swallows his pride big time to be in the same room as Paisley for the sake of some sort of normal future for NI.

    I’d say Ahern would rather nail his fingers to the wall than meet this guy never mind shake hands.

  • Bored

    Colonel Grim – Articles 2 and 3 – they’re gone you know. I know that people like you want to turn the clock back to 1952 but this is taking things a bit far.

  • Nathan

    “I wouldnt think there is any truth in the dirty hands bit though–with Aherne spending 170,000 euro per year on beauty treatment and nail manicures–he’s being ripped off though he’s still an ugly, shifty ,squirmy little toad .”

    For the sake of accuracy, it needs to be pointed out that Ahern’s appearance has costed the taxpayer 167000 euros since he took office in 1997, rather than the ridicious figure you give per annum. They say Ahern wears it in public to make himself look younger.

    While I’m at it, can I ask all you plastics to make the necessary effort when spelling the surname of the current Taoiseach (without the ‘e’ at the end, by the way).

    Thanking you

  • We Bonzo

    Isn’t everybody who doesn’t agree with Big Ian a traitor and their hands unwashed?

  • tiny

    how long did it take Paisley to tell Ahern to mind his own business, the meeting lasted 1 1/2 hours?

  • Alan2

    You all take Paisley`s flamboynat language to literally. He uses the same language about himself and sinners etc etc in his church about how the Lord saved a filthy wretch like him etc etc.

  • martin,

    Nathan,

    I have read the figure of 170,000 per annum in several newspapers, even your figure of 167,000 that Captain Corruption may have spent in taxpayers money since 1997 on his personal appearance could have been much better spent on seat-belts for scool busses.

    p.s I know a woman who teaches speech therapy for 10 euro per hour maybe the little pudgy fellow could avail of it, he badly needs it.

    p.s.s careful with the term plastics—you may find it could be as innacurate as your leaders testimony at the mahon tribunal.

  • Nathan

    “I have read the figure of 170,000 per annum in several newspapers, even your figure of 167,000 that Captain Corruption may have spent in taxpayers money since 1997 on his personal appearance could have been much better spent on seat-belts for scool busses.”

    I agree wholeheartedly, thats the whole reason why I responded to your comment in the first place. You were implying that his make-up money originated from his own pockets, which is why I took the opportunity to clarify matters as it is the taxpayer that is being “ripped off” and not him.

    “p.s.s careful with the term plastics—you may find it could be as innacurate as your leaders testimony at the mahon tribunal.”

    Take your point regarding plastics, it is a term which should only be used sparingly. By the way, I’d rather abstain from the voting process altogether rather than vote for the Fianna Failure party. These guys couldn’t shovel shit from a canary. They’re bad eggs and thats all there is to it.

  • martin

    Nathan,

    sorry about mis- understanding ,I just took it for granted that it was assumed that Bertie didnt spend any of his own money-just that of the tax-payer.

    Nathan don’t fall into the trap of not voting just because of FF -thats what they want, vote for anyone else but them thats what they dont want.

    When i said he was being ripped off I should have said we–I just meant that with the amount spent on his puss,there are no visable improvements–by the way Id love it if Celia Larkin told the real truth about him in public-that would be interesting.