Stupidity Mars Game

It was sad to hear that there was trouble at last night’s historic game when Linfield returned to the Brandywell after 36 years. The game ended with a 1-1 draw with little trouble in the stadium. However after the match buses taking the Linfield supporters home were damaged when missiles, mainly stones and fireworks, were thrown by hooligans. Luckily nobody was seriously injured, but buses were damaged and several people
were treated for shock.

Football fans attacked after game

  • willowfield

    Very sad that sectarianism ruined a historic and symbolic football match.

    Provo councillor Gerry O’Hara has to take some blame for stirring up sectarian hatred with his pre-match comments.

    Apparently there was also racist booing by a small contingent of Derry City fans, but generally speaking both sets of fans were well behaved during the match, and Derry fans applauded the arrival of the Linfield fans.

    A peculiar feature of Derry City matches is the absence of police in or around the ground. One wonders who exactly is providing the security …

  • Cianoc

    Hmmmn, are you aware of this, Mary McAleese?

  • maca

    Willow
    “A peculiar feature of Derry City matches is the absence of police in or around the ground”

    Not sure i’d call that peculiar, though being a “cross border game” perhaps they should have had police there last night.
    Do you normally have much of a police presence at games in the North?

  • Roger W. Christ XVII

    I’m sure there’ll be some politician or other on to complain about how the riotious behaviour was “provoked” by the heavy handed bus tactics that were shown by the bus drivers.

  • Alan2

    There are normally police at all major sports events in NI and the UK but in this instance it the Linfield and Derry organisers had their own Stewards and a Security firm.

  • smcgiff

    AFAIK, Derry are the only UEFA licensed team that don’t have a police presence at their games.

    The security outside the stadium was conducted by the restorative action group (or some name like that).

    Surprised that Derry weren’t beaten considering their current form. Fair play to Linfield for there recent acts of friendship.

    Hopefully the actions of the mindless thugs will not deter future cooperation.

  • maca

    Was this game part of the mini-comp the FAI & IFA are running?

  • Ringo

    Eamonn McCann or Goerge Jackon or Henry McDonald said the same as you, Smcgiff, on the wireless yesterday or the day before – they are the only club in Europe with a UEFA licence who don’t use a police force at games.

    Supposedly the Security inside the ground was to be provided by Stewards from both clubs, and outside by a community organisation. And in fairness it looks like all of them did their jobs.

    Never though I’d say it – between this and the camoige – fair play to Linfield.

  • Ringo

    Maca-

    no, just a ‘friendly’.

  • maca

    Thanks Ringo, do you know when this mini-comp is kicking off?

  • Ringo

    March by the looks of things. Here’s the
    draw

    Derry aren’t in it this year, which is probably for the best.

  • maca

    GRMA Ringo.

  • willowfield

    The security outside the stadium was conducted by the restorative action group (or some name like that).

    Supposedly the Security inside the ground was to be provided by Stewards from both clubs, and outside by a community organisation.

    Sounds ominous …

  • smcgiff

    ‘Sounds ominous …’

    Why?

  • Davros

    Are you old enough to remember when the Rolling Stones used a “community group” for security S’ ?

  • smcgiff

    ‘Are you old enough to remember when the Rolling Stones used a “community group” for security S’ ?’

    Not by a very long shot!!!! 😉

  • Davros

    LOL, well have sympathy for us old devils (gedditt ? )

  • smcgiff

    ‘(gedditt ? )’

    No. But I’ll respectfully hang my head in shame!!

  • willowfield

    smcgiff

    Given the location of the ground, the combination of “security”, “community group” and “restorative justice” should be enough to set off a few alarm bells.

  • Fraggle

    willowfield, maybe you’d prefer the kind of security provided by the RUC during the last match between Belfast Celtic and Linfield.

    It will probably be a long time before the people of the brandywell accept the PSNI as an impartial police force and until that is the case, their presence would not be conducive to a peaceful sporting occasion.

  • maca

    “well have sympathy for us old devils (gedditt ? )”

    Grooaaan!!

  • smcgiff

    Willowfield,

    The stewarding inside the ground was bi-community. Hardly ominous.

    I’ve no idea what the provenance of the Restorative Action group might be, but suspect it may have had a relevance to the community it was trying to police.

    Lets not forget that even policed events in the UK would regularly fail to prevent hooligans from acting out.

    The plan introduced for the travelling fans seems to have been well worked out. Having armoured cars present, which would probably have been necessary to have stopped the mindless thugs, would have gone against the spirit of the event.

  • smcgiff

    Actually, Davros, I get it now! Better late than never, eh! 🙂

  • Davros

    Better late than never, eh!

    That’s what I said about my divorce 😉

  • Ringo

    Willowfield –

    the starting point should be that no sporting event should require a police presence for security in or around a ground. The expectation should be that aside from traffic manangement nothing would occur that would necessitate their intervention. Look at big stadium gigs with massive crowds – you don’t have a visible police presence and yet the same age profile of people are there- most tanked with drink and a substantial amount of them out of their box – with little trouble.

    Taken out of the context of Fraggle’s remarks, the idea that Derry can manage without the police is a credit to the club. I’ve never heard of any trouble in the Brandywell for LOI games. I’d like to think that even after the PSNI is welcome by the likes of Fraggle, that Derry City still won’t have to use them.

    Fraggle –
    Were you even alive when that game happened? Move on, man.

    Maca –

    had to think about it for a while, the pingin finally dropped. TFR 🙂

  • willowfield

    Fraggle

    Your comment about policing at a match 56 years ago reaches new heights of irrelevance.

    It will probably be a long time before the people of the brandywell accept the PSNI as an impartial police force and until that is the case, their presence would not be conducive to a peaceful sporting occasion.

    A sad indictment on Derry City supporters.

    smcgiff

    The stewarding inside the ground was bi-community. Hardly ominous.

    I was referring to the “security” outside the ground. It is ominous that this seems to be a no-go area for police. It’s like going back to the early 70s. It is ominous that “community groups” and “restorative justice” groups are apparently providing an alternative police force. Very ominous.

  • smcgiff

    ‘I was referring to the “security” outside the ground.’

    Your 1:15 post looked as if it referred to both inside and outside.

    I’ve no idea who the restorative group are, but as Ringo pointed out, police presence is not always necessary. Or are rock concerts no-go areas as well?

  • willowfield

    Police absence OUTSIDE the ground is ominous.

  • smcgiff

    If you take a broader view, willowfield, the presence of police is also ominous by definition.

  • willowfield

    The reason it is ominous is because it implies this area is some kind of no-go zone for the police, in which paramilitaries are in control.

  • Billy Pilgrim

    Willow.

    “Given the location of the ground, the combination of “security”, “community group” and “restorative justice” should be enough to set off a few alarm bells.”

    What the hell do you mean “given the location of the ground”?

  • barnshee

    “What the hell do you mean “given the location of the ground””
    Location in scumbag city –what do you expect from the proverbial pig clear of back to the FAI and take the rest of the city with you

  • Panda

    Just wondering..has O’Hara condemned the sectarian attacks yet-or where the securocrats up to their old mischief again?

  • Billy Pilgrim

    Barnshee

    “What the hell do you mean “given the location of the ground””
    Location in scumbag city –what do you expect from the proverbial pig clear of back to the FAI and take the rest of the city with you.”

    Yes, that’s what I thought Willow meant. Jesus, the sectarianism is just so naked. My recent depression just keeps deepening.

  • slug9987

    U mean the naked sectarianism from those kids throwing bricks, Billy?

  • willowfield

    Billy Pilgrim

    I would respectfully request that you retract your disgraceful accusation against me.

    There is no sectarianism, naked or otherwise, in referring to the fact that the ground is located in a republican area.

    If you’ve nothing constructive to say, don’t say anything.

  • Billy Pilgrim

    slug9987

    “U mean the naked sectarianism from those kids throwing bricks, Billy?”

    Well, yes and no. I mean, of course they threw the bricks because there was a sectarian reason to do so, but to be honest, it wasn’t really about sectarianism. Whoever threw those stones at the Linfield fans last night – they were just thugs and hoods. They’ll throw stones at someone else tonight for reasons that aren’t sectarian. Maybe at the weekend they throw stones into the Fountain – again for sectarian reasons. Then they’ll get drunk and kick some poor bastard’s head in – for non-sectarian reasons.

    If the stone-throwers in Derry were the only sectarian people around, then we’d have no problem. But I have come to the conclusion that our problem here is how we consistently choose to react to events in the most nakedly sectarian way. Look at the front page of the News Letter today for example – it’s an emotive picture and a screaming headline, both of which they are perfetly entitled to use. But just look at how it panders to our prejudices.

    So I suppose my point is that in reality, thugs throwing stones are not the problem. There will be thugs doing thuggish things every night in every part of the world from now til doomsday. The problem is when, from some distance, the great silent majority take a quick glance and say “what would you expect from them”.

    It’s attitudes like that that explain why our middle class is so virulently affected with a sectarianism that goes beyond that of the normally maligned working class.

    Willow.

    Know thyself mate.

  • slug9987

    ” I mean, of course they threw the bricks because there was a sectarian reason to do so, but to be honest, it wasn’t really about sectarianism. Whoever threw those stones at the Linfield fans last night – they were just thugs and hoods. They’ll throw stones at someone else tonight for reasons that aren’t sectarian. Maybe at the weekend they throw stones into the Fountain – again for sectarian reasons. Then they’ll get drunk and kick some poor bastard’s head in – for non-sectarian reasons. If the stone-throwers in Derry were the only sectarian people around, then we’d have no problem.”

    You mean that the stone-throwing people aren’t intrinsically sectarian but just use it as an outlet for anti-social behaviour? Thus, one should not, in this case, focus too much on the fact that the recipients were protestants?

  • maca

    “Thus, one should not, in this case, focus too much on the fact that the recipients were protestants?”

    I didn’t realise Linfield were a protestant only club. Disturbing if that is the case, as you imply.

  • willowfield

    Pathetic comments by Billy Pilgrim. Apparently I’m “sectarian” for pointing out that the Brandywell is located in a republican area, yet local thugs who attacked a bus filled with Protestant football supporters aren’t sectarian!

    I suppose I was being too generous in expecting him to apologise.

    Not specifically at you Willowfield, but this is starting to look like yellow card territory. Please Guys, ball not man ! A.U.

  • maca

    “Apparently I’m “sectarian” for pointing out that the Brandywell is located in a republican area”

    That’s not what you said, re-read your post.
    Billy asked you what you meant and you didn’t respond (at that stage), you also didn’t correct Barnshee when he said you meant “Location in scumbag city”.

  • GavBelfast

    It was the Ourselves Alone attitude articulated and practised by some of their ‘political representatives’ that is bound to rub-off in the behaviour of the thugs witnessed last night.

    The description of Foyal Road as “mainly nationalist” in the media amused me. Just mainly?

    Last night seemed like just the latest outworking of the west bank experience for Protestants/Unionists or those perceived as such: Keep Out.

  • CavanMan

    Scumbag city?seeing as most of the trouble in the last 30 years happened in Belfast,if Derry is a scum city,what is Belfast?
    You dont bring Linfield with their loyalist baggage into a Republican Heartland and not expect trouble,hell last year at the Cavan/Derry All-Ireland qualifier match there was trouble,between local youths and the ‘free staters”,if they would act this way to the people whom alot of them seeas their own,Then bringing Linfield to the Brandywell was a stupid idea in the first place if you ask me.

  • Davros

    Noted that the SF website ignores this.

    How much of this was down to media hype before the match ? In some ways some of the coverage seemed to be throwing down a gauntlet to the local yobs ….
    It seemed to be being presented as Linfield (Your enemy) are coming to town. What was the local media like ?

  • CavanMan

    The Comments by Sinn Fein’s Gerry o’Hara didnt help matters,i just do hope this is not a sign of things to come in regards to the All-Ireland Competition next month.

  • Davros

    What comments did he make Cavanman?

  • CavanMan

    Davros i am searching for the link to the story,But O’Hara was very much against Linfield playing in the Brandywell and warned of trouble if the match took place.

  • Davros

    Thanks Cavanman – disappointing as he seemed to me to be on the Dr Jekyll wing of the party.

  • Panda

    Cavanman,
    “Then bringing Linfield to the Brandywell was a stupid idea in the first place if you ask me”.

    No, you’re wrong. I think it was a brave attempt on the part of both clubs at bridge building-both sets of fans behaved impeccably and the action of a few local sectarian hooligans shouldn’t be allowed to overshadow this.

    The Setana Cup will work if correct policing is carried out, which was the only mistake that Derry City made on tuesday.

    Still no condemnation from O’Hara?
    Obviously too busy building the “Ireland of equals” to condemn the thugs within his own community.

  • Young Fogey

    It’s absolutely amazing that somebody thinks that when a bus full of Protestants is stoned in a Republican area, it isn’t really about sectarianism. Maybe when a block of flats is attacked on Sandy Row because a few Catholics happen to live there, that isn’t really about sectarianism either. Or when Chinese people get burnt out in the Village, that isn’t really about racism.

    Maybe when Steven Lawrence was murdered, the people who attacked him were just thugs. It wasn’t really because he was black – sure they just would have found somebody else to kill if he wasn’t there.

    Oh, yes, and Lennie Murphy, he was quite happy to kill Protestants if he couldn’t fund a Catholic. I suppose the Shankill Butchers weren’t really about sectarianism, either.

    Wise up, Billy. Do you think buses get randomly stoned in the Brandywell every day? (Because if you do, then you really do have a low opinion of working class Republicans).

    I’m not the fact that I’m not denying that middle-class sectarianism exists, or that it’s offensive, but I don’t see how it is responsible for what happened in Derry the other night. A lot of people in this society are bigots, middle-class, working-class, or otherwise, but most of them still think attacking people because of their religion or the colour of their skin is wrong.

    The other night we saw a group of bigoted thugs in Derry who are too blinded by hate even to realise that. So actually, thugs who throw stones are the problem. Sorry.

    What really annoys me about this bourgeois Socialist need to put every crime carried out by someone who happens to be working-class down to middle-class evils. But then most orthodox Socialists I know live in comfortable bourgeois areas and are safely insulated from high levels of crime, so they can afford to.

  • Davros

    A lot of sense in what you write YF.

  • slug9987

    Billy

    YF raises the point: why do other busses (e.g. supporters of other teams) not get stoned in nationalist areas if this is really just delinqnancy rather than intrinsic bigotry?

  • slug9987

    Billy – just hoping you might be able to answer this one at some point.

  • Occasional Commentator (aus Bamberg)

    Interesting discussion.