UDA want £70m to move on…

THE Prime Minister’s right-hand man, Jonathan Powell, is in talks with loyalist terrorists about a funding package. The UDA has asked for £70 million. So last month we had the biggest robbery in history, this month we’re looking at possibly the biggest bribe in history?!

  • AndrewD

    I would question why and what exactly they want this money for.

    Money is currently being put into places such as Creagh Estate in order to combat the various Social Problems. It aids things such as Community Programmes.

  • Dec

    And you think the UDA/UVF are best placed to administer this work (and funds)?

  • maca

    Money for drugs?
    Give ’em nothing! ‘Cept maybe jail time.

  • George

    Can’t they just rob it like everyone else.

  • peteb

    AS I was about to say, Gonzo.. and Jonathan Powell has such a succesful track record at this kind of negotiation as well.. (that’s more sarcasm, BTW)

  • Ziznivy

    Dear lord! There’s less gangsterism in most Central Asian countries than here. Disgraceful that this is even being negotiated.

  • Donnie

    Who says crime doesn’t pay?

    Prepare a fresh influx of gold jewellry, BMWs and PVC conservatory’s. Dear oh dear, that this is even being considered is an affront to all the tax-paying, law-abiding citizens of NI.

  • Roger W. Christ XVII

    This is one of the most obscene things I’ve read about in a long time. The particularly obscene part is that the government actually appears to be considering the possibility. Equally obscene is the fact that unionist politicians, as usual, are saying nothing about this matter. In the quoted article, Burnside appears quite comfortable with the idea, he never says that the UDA should be denied the money and instead switches the subject to that of the NB robbery. Typical unionist acquiescence when it comes to armed paramilitarism which isn’t republican.

  • Belfast Gonzo

    On a related note, the DUP’s Jim Allister MEP wonders if Colombian birwatcher and mortar bomb innovator Jim Monaghan was receiving Peace and Reconciliation moey from Europe.

  • willowfield

    Round ’em up, put ’em in a field, and bomb the bastards.

  • Belfast Gonzo

    “Kill ’em all, let God sort them out”, WF? – how very Johnny Adair…

  • willowfield

    More Kenny Everett than Johnny Adair. Maybe you don’t remember.

  • George

    It’s actually Pope Urban II, the crusader Pope Willowfield.
    Didn’t figure you for a papist or have you just forgotten?

  • DCB

    I think the words were “Kill them all, God will know his own”

  • Pat Mc Larnon

    Maybe they are looking at it as payment for services rendered.

  • AndrewD

    The payment would be paid over a period of 5 years and it would aid them getting their members away from organised crime.

    They should try the Job Centre and if need be there are various Government Training Programmes available.

    Can they really be trusted?

  • TroubledTimes

    The one good point about this story is the fact that Loyalists are involved in dialogue.

  • James

    That ain’t workin’, that’s the way you do it
    Money for nothin’ and your chicks for free

    Many, many thanks to Dire Straits

    The biggest problem all the paramilitaries will face (an hence the one you must solve for them) is surviving without arms in a community which they have terrorized for 30 years. No amount of moral condemnation or approbation is going to budge them one angstrom. What can you do to them that the governments and their ideological opponents haven’t done for the last 30 years?

    Many a maggot is going to gag before this is over. You are going to have to empower the paramilitaries to disband and disarm.

    Pay them off in Northern Bank notes. I understand that someone is eager to unload some.

  • Fraggle

    I’d be very concerned at drug dealing gansters being given large amounts of tax payers’ money.

    The UDA are well on their way to destroying more lives with heroin etc. than the IRA ever did with guns and bombs.

  • JD

    Many a maggot is going to gag before this is over. You are going to have to empower the paramilitaries to disband and disarm.

    James could you expand on what you mean here?

  • Davros

    Fraggle- let’s not try and give the IRA some moral superiority over the UDA in this respect. The IRA are also involved in drugs although not so openly.

  • toronto

    “Maybe they are looking at it as payment for services rendered.”

    Exactly. They should call up the MOD Veterans Agency.

  • Pat Mc Larnon

    Davros,

    do you have any particular evidence for this round of whataboutery, or did you just find the irge to get the IRA on to the thread as soon as possible.
    To be honest I have never heard of the IRA involved in drug dealing. I think it would come as a shock to the 340k voters who support SF.

  • Fraggle

    not what I was doing davros. just pointing out that these people are doing more damage to their communities than the threat they say they exist to oppose.

    I didn’t say anything about IRA morality. Interestingly though, Suzanne Breen, who claims to know all about the business interests of the IRA, said that the IRA didn’t deal drugs in her article in the village few weeksn back.

    I don’t doubt that some IRA members deal drugs but were it not for the IRA, places like Derry would have been ravaged by heroin alongside places like Glasgow, Edinburgh and Dublin over the past few decades.

    The evidence regarding the involvement of the paramilitaries lies in the pattern of drug abuse. Heroin is rare in Derry and mainly found in the loyalist enclaves. Ballymena, on the other hand, has a huge heroin problem.

  • maca

    I don’t know if the IRA deal drugs at all but I have heard a few stories which indicate that in some areas at least they are anti-drugs. I have a friend who works with heroin addicts in Dublin and those folks are mightly scared of the IRA, they have to cross the city to get methadone in case the IRA find out they are users.

  • Davros

    do you have any particular evidence

    Pat – I heard it from the same dogs on the street that Pat Doherty has told us are reliable.

    Fraggle – as well as some volunteers being directly involved,they tithe. DAAD sort out the ones that don’t cough up. IRA and UDA members have met to sort out turf differences.

  • Pat Mc Larnon

    Davros,

    it is a serious point. A lot of the propaganda around the Northern job is being used as a means to attempt to damage republicans and by default SF.
    As someone who lives, works and socialises in a nationalist area I a telling you that if a case could be proven linking republicans to drugs then support for SF would vanish like snow off a ditch.

    I suspect that is what most of their political opponents know as well. The fact that no evidence has been produced would suggest to me none exists.

  • Davros

    Pat – it is a serious point. It’s telling that you find it hard to believe that people who would abduct a 15 year old boy with learning difficulties and his brother from school, “question” him and kill him (because he was heard to yell “I’m telling” when he saw IRA men stealing) would do something reprehensible like profit from drugs dealing.

  • Pat Mc Larnon

    Davros,

    this is meant to be a serious politcal site, if you want to spout Sunday World fantasys thats ok, just don’t pass it off as facts.
    The fact remains involvement in drugs would destroy the SF base. Prove it and you’ll go down in history.

  • Davros

    The usual double standards from you pat. You’ll accept without questioning anything that suits you – dogs in the street are fine when they are quoted by Pat Doherty and scream blue murder when the same dogs say something that doesn’t suit your agendum.

    The fact remains involvement in drugs would destroy the SF base.

    I never claimed that SF deal drugs or tithe 🙂
    Are you saying SF is the IRA pat ?

    Prove it and you’ll go down in history.

    Anybody trying to prove it would likely end up on a beach or in a bog.

  • Pat Mc Larnon

    Davros

    ‘The usual double standards from you pat. You’ll accept without questioning anything that suits you – dogs in the street are fine when they are quoted by Pat Doherty and scream blue murder when the same dogs say something that doesn’t suit your agendum.’

    Replying as usual when cornered, i’ve never accepted any such ‘evidence’ by Pat Doherty or anyone else. Perhaps you could prove that along with your drugs allegations.

    ‘I never claimed that SF deal drugs or tithe 🙂
    Are you saying SF is the IRA pat ?’

    Quite obviously IRA activity reflects on SF. Whether it is justified or not depends on where you are coming from. But it naive to suggest otherwise.

    ‘Anybody trying to prove it would likely end up on a beach or in a bog.’

    So you leave it to someone else, how gentlemanly of you.

    I contend that your talk of drug dealing, tithes and meetings with the UDA are a great big giant spoof and you are all embarrassed because i’ve caught you out. Lighten up and just have a good laugh at yourself.

  • Davros

    Quite obviously IRA activity reflects on SF.

    So Various SF spokesmen over the years were wrong to protest when SF took any flak for IRA non-crimes ?

  • James

    JD

    “James could you expand on what you mean here?

    The Ra has been kicking the piss out of segments their communities to keep them in line for thirty years. The Loyalists have been doing much the same.

    Take their guns away and maybe Davy Adams is going to be on the porch of the local brigadier with an attitude and a score to settle once the playing field is level. Multiply that a thousand fold.

    I would not disarm EVER under those conditions, I value my own skin too much, don’t you? Moreover, these hard guys may not have any of the scruples we could bring to the table. The full weight of the Crown hasn’t done it in thirty years so a few harsh words and all the righteous indignation Ulster can muster isn’t going to do diddlysquat right now.

    So the problem resolves itself into one of giving them an out, a bolt-hole, some sort of an escape route whereby they can escape with a intact skin. That is where the maggot gagging comes in.

  • Pat Mc Larnon

    ‘So Various SF spokesmen over the years were wrong to protest when SF took any flak for IRA non-crimes ?’

    Whether they were wrong to protest is irrelevant, the fact is they were and are held accountable for the actions of the IRA. Either that or the massive media blitz or recents weeks is a terrible waste of time and energy.

  • Davros

    Whether they were wrong to protest is irrelevant

    Translation -“whoops”.

  • JD

    I would not disarm EVER under those conditions, I value my own skin too much, don’t you? Moreover, these hard guys may not have any of the scruples we could bring to the table. The full weight of the Crown hasn’t done it in thirty years so a few harsh words and all the righteous indignation Ulster can muster isn’t going to do diddlysquat right now.

    Finally. A realist. I agree.

    So the problem resolves itself into one of giving them an out, a bolt-hole, some sort of an escape route whereby they can escape with a intact skin. That is where the maggot gagging comes in.

    What form do you see that bolt-hole taking?

  • James

    “What form do you see that bolt-hole taking?”

    I don’t want that job. You simply must have someone north of the drumlins who can screw this up better than I.

    Look to Latin America. Perhaps Mario could chip in with how this was handled in Argentina. El Salvador and Nicaragua are the easy examples to point to but neither satisfies the unique set of conditions in Ulster. For one thing, the UN was involved in El Salvador, lending an integrity to the oversight greater than that of the ROI and the UK who have many, many political irons in the fire.

    Usually the payoff goes into giving those involved something else they’d rather do like the 35,000 that got land under the several agreements that led up to peace in El Salvador. You guys are unique since there isn’t that much land or jobs except possibly on the mainland. Test Blair’s resolve by relocating some of the massively tattooed loyalists in Sedgefield. I’ll offer several hundred thousand acres surrounding Crawford, Texas as the US relocation area. Texas is a right to carry concealed state, too.

    The patchwork of hostile housing estates doesn’t help much either. Perhaps you could legalize the status of a few in the larger estates by making some of the hard guys local cops if they can stay away from the rackets and the movement. This is where the major maggot gagging comes into play and also presupposes civilian oversight of the police, of course. I’d wish you better luck on this than we had with the Rodney King thing.

    The lynch pin is still the republican movement. It’s pointless to continue unless they are convinced that they have nothing else to gain in playing the long game.

  • Fraggle

    “there isn’t that much land or jobs except possibly on the mainland.”

    unemployment is quite high over there these days, excpet in luxembourg where the land is quite scarce. maybe they could be set up with a bar/restaurant on the costa brava.

  • aquifer

    £70m? Welcome to mobocracy.
    A coup d’etat on a street corner near you.
    Can someone with a backbone put an end to this idiocy before we all end up loading our sofas onto carts.

  • aquifer

    £70m? Welcome to mobocracy.
    A coup d’etat on a street corner near you.
    Can someone with a backbone put an end to this idiocy before we all end up loading our sofas onto carts.

  • Henry94

    £70 million for the UDA? With Burnsides approval?

    If we worked out a pro-rata payment for the IRA based on the number of Burnside’s attacks and condemnations of each organisation how much would it come to?

  • willowfield

    George

    It’s actually Pope Urban II, the crusader Pope Willowfield.

    It wasn’t. It was Kenny Everett.

  • mucky

    Does this mean the IRA will be asking for 43.5 mill? You know, just to make up the shortfall.

  • DessertSpoon

    £70 million!!! You could get 1 and a bit Assembly’s for that. Why should we pay the criminals to go away? Sounds like blackmail to me.

  • George

    Willowfield,
    you did indeed quote Kenny Everett. I was replying to Belfast Gonzo replying to you so should have put his name in not yours.

  • Alan2

    “Why should we pay the criminals to go away? Sounds like blackmail to me.”

    Thats the Good Friday Appeasement for ya bud.
    “War On Terror”. Don`t make me laugh.

    However the followup Newsletter article is at pain to stress that it is more about regeneration in Loyalist areas and retraining rather than a direct payoff to the UDA…..

  • Davros

    Speaking about Burnside , Newton Emerson in Today’s Irish News :

    David Burnside was quick to comment on the UDA pay-off proposal, suggesting that any money should go to bereaved security force families instead. Victims of the UDA itself would also surely be worthy candidates for extra compensation, but the Ulster Unionist MP forgot to mention them. He also forgot to mention his 1977 interview with Andy Tyrie for the post of UDA public relations officer. In the end Mr Burnside turned Tyrie’s offer down because the job didn’t pay well enough – too bad Jonathan Powell wasn’t around with his chequebook back then, eh?

  • Alan2

    Was the UDA “active” at that point in time?

  • Davros

    The UDA were involved with the United Unionist Action Council (UUAC) Strike in 1977, they fought with the Police, Two UDA men were killed when a bomb they were working on exploded.

  • PS

    In league of course with the current leader of unionism in an attempt to exclude Nationalism by whatever means possible

  • Davros

    That was the year Paisley said he would quit politics if the strike failed … however, it was only after the strike failed – sorry, ended that we found out that Paisley was the one who would judge whether it was a success or a failure and he announced it was a success.

  • Vavid Dance

    Let not a single one of us be in any doubt about what is occurring here. The verminous spongers of the knuckle-dragging communities want the gratitude of decent tax-paying citizens in order that they purchase more rugs, paint more disgusting murals and buy new flutes with which to annoy civilised people. I say place the slovenly ill-educated runts under martial law and make them, if needs be forcibly, undertake a comprehensive programme of hard labour cleaning up the cesspits in which they and their cowardly armchair terrorist supporters dwell and have indeed created.

    No surrender to thieving workshy thugs, whether orange or green.

    May the cat eat their stinking dole money bebloodygorrah !