You prove my point – most non-Nationalists have nothing to do with the marching tradition these days.
Nordie
That’s absolutely the case (I was involved peripherally in the foundation of politics.ie many moons ago and am delighted at how well Dave and the team have done).
In there is an interesting challenge for all political parties: do you want people from other parties to join yours, or not?
At basic level, you must do – in that you want people who vote for other parties to switch their vote to yours.
It probably follows, therefore, that you want people who were members of other parties to switch their membership to yours. Of course, that will increase competition for positions – on the other hand, it will be evidence of increasing support (thus more positions to compete for, at least electorally).
At that stage, when you accept the new member, you have a decision: you can say “Nice to have you but you’ll just have to wait your turn” (in which case not too many more will follow); or you can say “You’re an equal member with every one else and feel free to go ahead and stand for party positions, selection etc”.
Sensible parties do the latter, of course, which is why in fact two of the names mentioned were elected to the Party Executive by the Party Council in a competitive election, and one ran for the Assembly last year. New party members do not have any special rights, but nor are they to be especially hindered.
It’s all part of the problem of managing a growing party – a problem quite a few others would like to have, no doubt.
Here’s the thing: the cumulative effect is a decline of 6%, but once you take account of economic growth over the period 1997-2007 and economic projections based upon that, we are 14% worse off that we expected to be. That’s a decline of roughly double comparable Western economies – toss in currency devaluation of 20-25% and it’s a total mess.
The phrasing is certainly somewhat harsh, but given what we continue to hear about Mr Nesbitt’s actions in the recent past, I suspect such “doubts” will continue to surface.
With the decline of “mainstream” parties even in England, in fact it will become more common for MPs to have a marked influence on government policy without taking the whip.
Mark Langhammer is a thoughtful contributor to any debate.
I do wonder if people are talking across each other a little. For all the talk of “regional pay”, there is a distinct lack of clarity about what that means in practice and against what it will be measured. The only thing which is clear is that pay will not be reduced in absolute terms, but rather frozen (again, even “frozen” requires definition) until it is “corrected” (whatever that means).
You can’t help but think this is yet another example of the Coalition Government coming up with a principle which is sound, but then refusing to listen to anyone when it comes to actual delivery of it. Ask Andrew Lansley how that works out…
To be fair – notwithstanding my own genuine anger at yet another middle-class do-gooder not having any properly researched ideas about what to do about poverty – you make a completely fair point. You cannot judge a manager after one game, even if it’s a 5-0 thrashing.
Today, to be fair, he probably came back with a 1-1 draw; he had the nous, at least, to avoid Nolan and take Talkback instead.
All the evidence is that he will keep being vague and keep making mistakes – but the evidence is not complete yet.
And remember, the central issue is not so much whether Mike Nesbitt is a good Leader or not, but rather can his party be led at all? I suspect it can’t, so even if he turns out to be a genius it’ll be to little avail.
No, Naomi specifically said she would not enter a governing coalition before she was elected.
The people who elected her knew that.
To have entered the coalition would have been “running away” from what she said she would do beforehand.
The LibDems, on the other hand, did not (and could not) expressly say they would not enter a coalition. On the contrary, the clear inference from their argument was that they wanted as big a mandate as possible to hold the balance of power (i.e. enter government).
I happened to share your view – and not Comrade’s – that we would be better participating as close to in line with the UK as we can. But the electorate didn’t take that view. Your party and I, separately, both accepted that and moved on – essentially back to where we came from!
East Belfast is pretty good of course. In fact, it’s so good, your esteemed party leader lives there even though he represents Strangford!
Ed Moloney’s Voices from the Grave: Two Men’s War in Ireland has received considerable attention in the press and in the public realm since its publication earlier this year. Although the book relates the experiences of the Provisional IRA’s Brendan Hughes and the PUP/UVF’s David Ervine, much of the discussion has focused on Hughes’ stories [...] read our review »
Having somehow managed to avoid watching a single episode of the widely praised West Wing TV series I was delighted to discover the entire Box set in my Christmas stocking – and with enough spare time over the holidays to give it a good lash. But with 10 episodes of the first series under my [...] read our review »
I’m currently trawling through Norman Davies’s fabulous new tome – “Vanished Kingdoms” – Five stars in the (London) Telegraph’s review from Ben Wilson: All the nations that have ever lived have left their footsteps in the sand,” writes Norman Davies. “The traces fade with every tide, the echoes grow faint, the images are fractured, the human [...] read our review »
Comment on Why are there not more Nationalist blogs?
on 24 April 2012 at 5:38 pm
Tyrone
You prove my point – most non-Nationalists have nothing to do with the marching tradition these days.
Nordie
That’s absolutely the case (I was involved peripherally in the foundation of politics.ie many moons ago and am delighted at how well Dave and the team have done).
I just wonder why that is?
Or is it, indeed?!
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Comment on Alliance Party conference preview #apni12
on 19 April 2012 at 9:48 pm
Comrade
Indeed the last two Secretaries of State under Labour had previously been members of other main UK parties (one Conservative, one Liberal).
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Comment on Alliance Party conference preview #apni12
on 19 April 2012 at 9:47 pm
In there is an interesting challenge for all political parties: do you want people from other parties to join yours, or not?
At basic level, you must do – in that you want people who vote for other parties to switch their vote to yours.
It probably follows, therefore, that you want people who were members of other parties to switch their membership to yours. Of course, that will increase competition for positions – on the other hand, it will be evidence of increasing support (thus more positions to compete for, at least electorally).
At that stage, when you accept the new member, you have a decision: you can say “Nice to have you but you’ll just have to wait your turn” (in which case not too many more will follow); or you can say “You’re an equal member with every one else and feel free to go ahead and stand for party positions, selection etc”.
Sensible parties do the latter, of course, which is why in fact two of the names mentioned were elected to the Party Executive by the Party Council in a competitive election, and one ran for the Assembly last year. New party members do not have any special rights, but nor are they to be especially hindered.
It’s all part of the problem of managing a growing party – a problem quite a few others would like to have, no doubt.
Go to comment
Comment on The Problems of Centralised Government: The Ill-considered Constraints on Economic Recovery in Northern Ireland
on 13 April 2012 at 10:33 am
cynic may not be so far off there.
Here’s the thing: the cumulative effect is a decline of 6%, but once you take account of economic growth over the period 1997-2007 and economic projections based upon that, we are 14% worse off that we expected to be. That’s a decline of roughly double comparable Western economies – toss in currency devaluation of 20-25% and it’s a total mess.
Go to comment
Comment on Sinn Fein’s seven goals towards unification?
on 8 April 2012 at 11:16 pm
All “what” and no “how”.
You can’t deliver constitutional change by waiting for others to do it for you, far less when they don’t actually want it!
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Comment on Nesbitt Landslide: a missed opportunity?
on 7 April 2012 at 1:13 pm
Comrade isn’t a member of the Alliance Party.
The phrasing is certainly somewhat harsh, but given what we continue to hear about Mr Nesbitt’s actions in the recent past, I suspect such “doubts” will continue to surface.
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Comment on Nesbitt’s task is to discover a real purpose for the UUP. But will they let him?
on 5 April 2012 at 1:38 pm
With the decline of “mainstream” parties even in England, in fact it will become more common for MPs to have a marked influence on government policy without taking the whip.
This may well be a healthy thing for politics.
Go to comment
Comment on Why the UK Chancellor’s regional pay initiative not a solution to depressed regional growth…
on 4 April 2012 at 8:49 am
Great piece, Mick.
Mark Langhammer is a thoughtful contributor to any debate.
I do wonder if people are talking across each other a little. For all the talk of “regional pay”, there is a distinct lack of clarity about what that means in practice and against what it will be measured. The only thing which is clear is that pay will not be reduced in absolute terms, but rather frozen (again, even “frozen” requires definition) until it is “corrected” (whatever that means).
You can’t help but think this is yet another example of the Coalition Government coming up with a principle which is sound, but then refusing to listen to anyone when it comes to actual delivery of it. Ask Andrew Lansley how that works out…
Go to comment
Comment on NI Tories: “You have to wonder on which planet the new UUP leader is living”
on 3 April 2012 at 12:31 am
alan56
To be fair – notwithstanding my own genuine anger at yet another middle-class do-gooder not having any properly researched ideas about what to do about poverty – you make a completely fair point. You cannot judge a manager after one game, even if it’s a 5-0 thrashing.
Today, to be fair, he probably came back with a 1-1 draw; he had the nous, at least, to avoid Nolan and take Talkback instead.
All the evidence is that he will keep being vague and keep making mistakes – but the evidence is not complete yet.
And remember, the central issue is not so much whether Mike Nesbitt is a good Leader or not, but rather can his party be led at all? I suspect it can’t, so even if he turns out to be a genius it’ll be to little avail.
Go to comment
Comment on Nesbitt’s task is to discover a real purpose for the UUP. But will they let him?
on 2 April 2012 at 8:21 pm
Framer
No, Naomi specifically said she would not enter a governing coalition before she was elected.
The people who elected her knew that.
To have entered the coalition would have been “running away” from what she said she would do beforehand.
The LibDems, on the other hand, did not (and could not) expressly say they would not enter a coalition. On the contrary, the clear inference from their argument was that they wanted as big a mandate as possible to hold the balance of power (i.e. enter government).
I happened to share your view – and not Comrade’s – that we would be better participating as close to in line with the UK as we can. But the electorate didn’t take that view. Your party and I, separately, both accepted that and moved on – essentially back to where we came from!
East Belfast is pretty good of course. In fact, it’s so good, your esteemed party leader lives there even though he represents Strangford!
Go to comment