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Round up of Tuesday’s Political Studies Association conference
If you want to get a flavour of the proceedings at the Political Studies Association conference on its opening day, then the Storify collation below will bring you some of the images, tweets and sounds of the day. Particular highlights included: the Opening Plenary with David Blunkett, Peter Riddell and Matthew Flinders; and the late [...] read our review »
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“Unionism Decayed 1997-2007″ by David Vance: book review
I initially wrote this when the book was first published three years ago; whilst certain elements of it now sound dated, its basic premise that the period of 1997-2007 was a period of irreversible decay for Northern Irish Unionism can still be argued as a valid opinion. My own feeling is that it did indeed [...] read our review » -
Eamon Nancarrow’s misadventures in Rock…
It’s the quiet ones you have to watch, they say. When I last saw Eamonn Namcarrow, back in the mid 1980s he was a congenial, good-natured and highly sociable young lad. The next time was 26 years later, in Lavery’s Gin Palace in Bradbury Place. He’d just brought out his first book, Holywood Star about [...] read our review »
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Comment on Willie Flags Up An Interesting Question
on 20 May 2012 at 11:00 pm
Ryan
But defining what is controversial can be the actual problem. Poppies in Dundonald or Lillies in Derry may not present problems for specific school communities but others on the outside may object.
Bangordub
True to a point, but exposing such hypocritical attitudes is surely a part of inching society forward to a place where we reach better understandings of one another.
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Comment on Two more convicted of menacing comments on Facebook…
on 13 April 2012 at 6:00 pm
Some context is important when examining this case, which I reported on at the time on the following thread:
http://sluggerotoole.com/2011/08/20/rasharkin-parade-will-facebook-threats-lead-to-psni-action/
McKenna was in Ballymaconnelly Sons of Conquerors band at the time of the offence and one of the comments he made that the judge read out was
“never a prouder moment than 2nite parading past the daithi mckay bastard in rasharkin. put a bullet in each o the cunts and they’ll not be back agin – wankers.”
I think we should all be glad that the PSNI stepped up to the mark on this occasion, but the backdrop of the story perfectly illustrates another issue which formed the subject of a more recent thread:
http://sluggerotoole.com/2012/04/11/parading-the-lessons-for-conciliatory-strategies/
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Comment on The Siege of New Forge: Unionism’s latest pyrrhic triumph.
on 22 March 2012 at 11:13 pm
Mick
That’d be missing the wood for the trees, wouldn’t it. Though, naturally, I can understand why you’d prefer that ‘angle’ to the story.
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Comment on You say RUC AA, I say Police Athletic Association Northern Ireland (or else!)
on 20 March 2012 at 10:05 pm
The fact that loyalist murder gangs get no electoral support speaks volumes.
Blue Hammer
Given that this is the centenary year of the Ulster Covenant, perhaps you could do with engaging in a bit of reading when not supporting the ‘Blue Hammers…’
Then you might realise that, were it not for unionism’s ability to ensure the anti-democratic tradition of Britain’s rule in Ireland was maintained courtesy of the Covenant, Curragh Mutiny and ultimately partition, then political unionism would have been where Irish republicans ended up in the ‘terrorist/ freedom fighter’ rotation.
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Comment on A victory…. for tolerance and respect
on 20 March 2012 at 6:44 pm
Mick
‘Less well understood’ is rather mischievous.
It is pretty well understood, and that is part of the problem.
After all, there is no rational reason to seek to march where one is not welcome as part of the celebration of a cultural identity.
In Ardoyne, that has meant loyalist paramilitary bands marching beneath a banner named for a loyalist killed minutes after killing a local catholic.
I’d say people have little problem understanding that.
In Springfield Rd, that means actually opening up the peace wall to allow loyalists to infringe on ‘the other’ s side for no other godly reason than to antagonise.
In Coleraine, that means still trying to bring a band with numerous members implicated in a sectarian murder of a local catholic into contentious areas (incidentally, on that shared inclusive culture, perhaps you’d do well to remember that loyalists in Coleraine used the presence of a solitary tricolour in the town as an excuse for the murder.)
And, of course, in Portadown, it means still whining 5,000 days later because they can’t annoy the Garvaghy Road catholics (apparently the lesson of the Quinn children has not been long forgotten.)
And we could go on, and on, and on….
It is, I’m afraid, a case of being far too well understood.
The challenge stands. If, and indeed, when, unionism reveals itself to be prepared to play host to reciprocal republican commemorations- complete with republican bands etc- then a much, much stronger case can be made for moving towards a culture which is defined by mutual respect and tolerance.
The asymmetrical nature of the current situation means that is not likely. Therefore it is for those- like Quincey et al- to show just why nationalists are apparently ‘misunderstanding’ this band culture.
And I’d contend that seeking to aggravate ‘the other’ by erecting loyalist flags in Limavady and organising controversial marches in Armagh on the day traditionally associated with a celebration of an Irish identity is not really the best way.
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Comment on You say RUC AA, I say Police Athletic Association Northern Ireland (or else!)
on 20 March 2012 at 6:30 pm
RUC AA as Ireland’s version of The United Daughters of the Confederacy….
Coming so soon after Robinson’s tantrum over the prison service symbols, I’m assuming that appeal for catholic votes has been put to the side…..again.
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Comment on A victory…. for tolerance and respect
on 20 March 2012 at 4:21 pm
Plausible arguments abound as ever on Slugger. Always an audience for those willing to argue black is but a darker shade of white etc.
Yet it still boils down to this, in spite of Mick et al’s best efforts to suggest otherwise.
A republican parade near the venue of loyalist parades on July 12th would be regarded as an incendiary act, calculated to aggravate unionists on the day when they celebrate their British identity.
The evidence has been presented to expose the motivations of the band organisers as being cynically premised on a tissue of lies.
The net result of the loyalist action was, as Billy points out, that many people feared a violent confrontation in Armagh and simply made alternative plans.
As has been said before, were the loyalists actually interested in simply commemorating the occasion, or indeed staking a claim to the British and protestant identity of Patrick, then they could have simply continued with the established tradition of marching where they had done for many years (safe in the knowledge that, for many other days throughout the year, Orange and loyalist feet would parade through Armagh.)
They didn’t because respecting the legitimacy of the Irish nationalist tradition remains a problem for too many within unionism.
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Comment on A victory…. for tolerance and respect
on 19 March 2012 at 11:11 pm
Billy P
On a point of order, ‘Slugger’ hasn’t been pushing any narrative as Slugger doesn’t speak with one voice.
Indeed, as you can tell from my own contributions on Slugger, I think the line being spun by Quincey and Mick is so absurd that even most unionists are buying it.
What happened in Armagh was simply loyalists at their lark again. Several weeks ago, they were at it in Antrim, trying to strong arm their way into the commemorations for the dead British soldiers at Massereene.
It’s simply the manifestation of a cultural identity which struggles to define itself other than through its opposition to ‘the other.’
Thankfully, in Armagh people did not take the bait.
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Comment on A victory…. for tolerance and respect
on 19 March 2012 at 2:52 pm
I am sickened by your continuous accusations that our culture sets out to “antagonise and aggravate” 99% of parades do not do so in anyway, do you think a whole culture exists to cause offence in that 1%?
DR
You have skipped over my observation that most unionists are more than capable of celebrating their identity in a positive manner.
But regarding the others, the quick answer, Drumlin, is to prove it.
There are scores of republican parades throughout the year, and having attended a number of them, and witnessed (albeit more reluctantly) many loyalist ones, there appears to be little difference in the quality of music on offer from most.
But maybe that’s because I’m a pianist in my leisure time and more accustomed to hearing a better quality of music…..
But I digress….
The simple challenge to the loyalist band/ marching culture is to show itself less interested in ‘the other’ and more interested in celebrating their own collective identity.
That means following the republican lead and organising marches when and where such processions are welcomed and do not seek to harm community relations.
I’ve used the example before of republicans voluntarily rerouting commemorations away from the Stewartstown Rd interface with the Blacks Road protestant community.
If it’s simply about enjoying onself, why thrive on such conflicts, not least since it is obvious even to all but the most naive of loyalists that they would not countenance forceably ‘hosting’ republican commemorations in the same manner that they seek republican/ nationalist communities to host loyalist parades.
Furthermore, address the practice of ‘claiming’ territory through flags and other symbols, usually associated with marching. Again, there have been numerous examples to illustrate that loyalists would not dream of tolerating reciprocal territorial marking in either mixed or majority unionist communities, so why incorporate it as a part of your parading culture?
In other words, do unto others……
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Comment on A victory…. for tolerance and respect
on 19 March 2012 at 10:56 am
Drumlin
There are Irish republican bands which march in a similar manner. Hardly unique.
More interesting is Quincey’s reference to “specific partial demand” which appears to be a MOPEish claim stemming from the fact that his bands weren’t to be allowed to play whatever they wanted nor fly whatever colours they wanted as part of the main St Patrick’s Day parade.
Well done to all those in Armagh who refused to take the bait laid out by Quincey and his cohorts. It is indeed a tribute to their maturity.
I do, however, agree with the gist of Quincey’s final sentence, where he notes the differing “approaches to cultural expression” in the 6 Counties.
Irish nationalists are very comfortable celebrating their cultural identity in a manner which does not seek to antagonise nor aggravate unionists. So are many unionists.
Alas, it remains a problem for too many within the Loyal Orders and the ‘unique’ band tradition- something confirmed yet again by the marking of the 5,000th day since the brethren were refused the ‘right’ to annoy the Garvaghy Road catholics in Portadown.
Alas, it remains a problem for too many within the Loyal Orders and the ‘unique’ band tradition- something confirmed yet again by the marking of the 5,000 day since the brethren were refused the ‘right’ to annoy the Garvaghy Road catholics in Portadown.
Differing attitudes to cultural expression indeed, Quincey.
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Comment on The first Armagh St Patrick’s Day’s Ulster band parade…
on 14 March 2012 at 12:45 pm
Mick
If it’s a test, then the results are already known and they rather ominous.
I don’t know of anyone who believes the Parades Commission would permit a republican parade through Shaftesbury Square a couple of hours after the main 12th July parade has passed, for obvious reasons concerning security.
Furthermore, the fact that the PSNI have stated that they do not foresee any problems betrays a residual political bias within the police.
Loyalists are, of course, free to commemorate their identity in a manner they see fit, and indeed do so on innumerable occasions throughout the year.
Yet the fact that they decided to effectively hijack the St Patrick’s Day celebrations in Armagh through relocating their march there betrays a continuing failure on behalf of the unionist/ loyalist community to provide reciprocal respect for the Irish nationalist identity and celebrations of that identity.
It’s not really an issue of ‘getting along’ at all, rather one of mutual respect.
It is quite appropriate that the Canuteists that make up the loyalist marching orders and their bands have been in the news in recent days whingeing about the passing of the 5,000th day since they’ve been permitted to annoy the catholics of the Garvaghy Road.
It would now appear that Armagh’s loyal orders are keen on opening up a new front.
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Comment on Peace Monitoring Report: Should there be a strategy to tackle long-term catholic unemployment and deprivation?
on 7 March 2012 at 4:28 pm
Scath Sheamais
I didn’t open the conversation with that, merely suggested that as the logical outworkings of Alan’s observation on why nationalist reps have failed to make an issue of this in the past or present (the distinction being important as, today, both SF and the SDLP are in a position to effect change.)
That is a fair point. But there is little of substance in the charge that, because Gerry Adams was West Belfast MP for a long period of time, then SF are to blame for higher levels of catholic poverty. That would ignore the fact that policy formulation and implementation at the level of delivery lay well beyond SF’s reach during those years.
Indeed, those making such points usually ignore the fact that the SDLP have ‘owned’ Derry for several decades, yet Derry continues to predominate the poverty and deprivation stats. Ditto North Belfast wards(catholic and protestant) remaining amongst the most impoverished throughout unionism’s uninterrupted period of Westminster dominance in the constituency.
Where constituency level politicians can be at fault is in failing to utilise their influence to make a difference indirectly (during Direct Rule) and, now, directly through Stormont.
One means of redressing the historical and current imbalance is to take on Invest NI, who continuously fail to promote investment in areas most in need. Another issue is the relocation of public sector jobs away from concentrated centres like East Belfast and North Down and towards other areas of Belfast and beyond.
But a more imaginative strategy would be to compel businesses tendering for contracts to devise and deliver on strategies to ensure that long-term unemployed are in a position to apply and get jobs that will help break the cycle of poverty/ unemployment/ low aspiration.
That is something common to many working-class communities, catholic and protestant, and is in the interest of all in society as this cycle is directly associated with many of the other ills plaguing modern society- alcoholism, criminality etc.
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Comment on Peace Monitoring Report: Should there be a strategy to tackle long-term catholic unemployment and deprivation?
on 6 March 2012 at 10:26 pm
It’s a tricky point to sustain, though. There are plenty of people perfectly willing to disparage education, aspiration and attainment in unionist areas right up to the point at which failure becomes a communal earner. Then it’s time to swivel the dial back to impoverishment and unemployment in some nationalist areas to bring the funding home.
So I’m not seeing a consistent message. More discipline required.
Reader
You’re right that many people have been singing off that particular hymn sheet- and not least from within unionist political circles and the controlled sector.
But, if you’ve followed Slugger for long, you will have noted that I have consistently cautioned against that quite simply because it was not something sustainable by facts which continue to show that more catholic boys leave school without the minimum qualifications expected than protestant boys.
That’s a pretty stark and inconvenient fact running against that particular narrative.
Re the Education Village, that was hardly something bought or sold explicitly on the premise that it deliver for exclusively Catholic/ nationalist/ republican people, unlike the funding stream obtained by the DUP as a sweetener ahead of devolution.
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Comment on Peace Monitoring Report: Should there be a strategy to tackle long-term catholic unemployment and deprivation?
on 6 March 2012 at 9:25 pm
Mick
Data is available by the wheelbarrow load.
Just take a glimpse at NISRA’s Multiple Deprivation Measure 2010 or earlier versions for a consistent picture of a society in which catholics continues to predominate the ranks of those more socio-economically deprived.
The responses to date to the post have been fairly predictable, as one commenter has noted.
We’ve the usual ‘blame Sinn Fein’ brigade, teaming up with those alleging a superior protestant work ethic lay behind the facts.
Lest we forget, the DUP effectively sectarianised poverty when they cynically used the Orange Order/ UVF riots in Whiterock to demand a funding programme be exclusively funnelled into PUL areas (link below)
(http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/northern_ireland/4875204.stm)
Personally, I’m a great believer in objective criteria being the only determining factor guiding public funding, and therefore would not be supportive of a programme aimed at addressing exclusively the long-term unemployed or poor that were of a catholic background or persuasion.
There is no good reason why a catholic in Dunclug should be prioritised over a protestant in Ballysally in terms of the promotion of employment or anti-poverty strategies.
But, given the disproportionate composition of the long-term unemployed and impoverished, it is evident that more catholics would gain from such a targeted strategy
But the question of whether such a programme should be considered is relevant, not least since the evidence exists of politicians and public bodies applying a similarly discriminatory policy in relation to addressing educational underachievement in relation to protestants, using tenuous supporting evidence.
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Comment on Republicans thinking about being courageous in reconciliation (unionists say tell us when you’ve made your mind up)…
on 3 March 2012 at 12:25 pm
Tacapall
Of course you’re spot on regarding politicsl unionism’s unparalleled capacity for self-denial in this regard.
But that should not halt republicans in taking forward such an agenda quite simply because the knee-jerk public response of the loudest (political leaders & commentariat) are not always representative of the breadth and range of opinions within the community which has traditionally been hostile to republicanism.
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Comment on Republicans thinking about being courageous in reconciliation (unionists say tell us when you’ve made your mind up)…
on 2 March 2012 at 9:35 pm
Sounds quite positive and indeed another example of republican willingness to avoid the prisoner’s dilemma which is clearly still preoccupying the minds of political unionism if Jeffrey’s remarks are anything to go by.
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Comment on #AssetTransfer: Investing in schools in order to help meet community demands…
on 2 March 2012 at 4:00 pm
Mick
I suspect the Girls Model example is an exception to the rule (owing to demographic realities in the area), though I don’t believe it really is fair to expect otherwise.
There are many more examples beyond those operated by Amey, though I’m not sure if there is any clear orchestration beyond the management of the actual school.
There are practical difficulties relating to ensuring school facilities are not put at risk, but these would appear to be quite manageable with proper care taken regarding security procedures and the architecture of the new schools in particular.
I’ve always thought it strange that schools, with all their facilities, were effectively closed off to local communities after the working day ended in the past.
We’ve moved beyond that.
I can think of a number of shared campus projects across the north where it is envisaged that a number of schools will share sites. I would imagine that these present new opportunities to be more ambitious with leisure provision in the hope and expectation that they will be used regularly by the schools and local communities feeding into each school.
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Comment on GAA promises to attend all coming ‘milestones’ (even Unionist ones)…
on 25 February 2012 at 12:19 pm
Mick
I think this is a very good move by Danny Murphy and the Ulster Council, though believe you might be a tad optimistic in inferring that observing Slugger spats may have helped precipitate the move. Listening to Talkback, Nolan or indeed reading any of the local papers would have given the same picture of our society.
And, of course, it is perfectly valid to suggest that forward progress would best be served by reciprocity from within unionism to this magnanimous gesture.
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Comment on CSI: Are the people running ahead of the policy makers and politicians?
on 25 February 2012 at 12:13 pm
Mick
‘Are the people running ahead of the policy makers and the politicians’ was the headline you placed on this thread.
Consequently, the points I raised were clearly relevant.
Take it somebody’s got out of the bed on the wrong side this morn…..
The PUL term has been widely used and promoted by DUP spokespersons in recent years.
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Comment on CSI: Are the people running ahead of the policy makers and politicians?
on 25 February 2012 at 9:41 am
Mick
Nationalists and republicnas have accommodated themselves quite well to the reality of having (firstly) the man widely attributed with stoking the flames that ignited in the 1960s into conflict as First Minister, followed by his firebrand deputy.
But then, respect for the right of unionism to determine who represented its own community was never really a problem for nationalism.
On the broader question, it’s a bit of a ‘yes’ and ‘no’ answer.
Yes, there is a haziness around the monolithic certainties of old, and comments attributed to Rev David Latimer and Fr Eugene O’Neill give expression to that reality.
But the political reaction to such expressions can have a stifling or liberating effect.
Regarding Latimer, he was publicly slammed by unionist politicians, labelled a ‘Lundy’ by others and the subject of threatening graffiti in his home city.
The message from the unionist gatekeepers was clear.
Thankfully, Fr O’Neill’s words have not been meant with similar outbursts as it is perfectly healthy to have such debates and discussions as we move forward as a society.
But sometimes the discussion loses sight of the reality that the electorate still give their firm support to what was once regarded as the more ‘extreme’ (hate the term but will do for now) of political parties, and the reasons for that have to do with a deeper belief within both communities that these parties’ firm commitment and vision with regard to the constitutional question and political/ cultural identities accurately reflects the position of most in our society.
That is something that too many lose sight of when suggesting that periodic surveys- other than actual votes cast in a ballot box- have more significance than they really do.
And, regarding the fault lines within the CSI discussion, these issues strike at the very heart of the matter.
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