Sunday, July 01, 2007
US Orange Order Documentary
A Documentary shot in Northern Ireland by a U.S. film crew following Maghera Sons Of William LOL 209, Northern Ireland & Sons Of William LOL 1003, Birmingham, Alabama, USA.
I believe this was aired on PBS in the USA. The Alabama based Orange lodge comprises Anglican / Episcopal Bishop, Rev Paul Zahl and other ministers. They have been regular visitors to the South Londonderry Twelfth in recent years. The 32 minute documentary is viewable in 5 parts here
Aughavey @ 03:47 PM
I’m guessing LOL doesn’t stand for Lots of Laughs. Just a guess mind!
Posted by on Jul 01, 2007 @ 04:23 PMNorthern Ireland & Sons Of William LOL 1003, Birmingham, Alabama, USA.
Hmm, let’s hope those chaps do their city proud:
“Between 1948 and 1965, over two hundred Black churches and homes in the Deep South were the target of bombings, and there was no more volatile city than Birmingham, Alabama (dubbed “Bombingham.")
It’s the affinity thing I suppose....
Posted by on Jul 01, 2007 @ 04:29 PMWell you might check out the Ghana, togo and Mohawk clips while your over at the site then.
Posted by on Jul 01, 2007 @ 04:31 PMWhat site is that, Alan?
Posted by on Jul 01, 2007 @ 04:43 PMThe one linked to above for the documentary.
Posted by on Jul 01, 2007 @ 05:04 PMI watched the video’s, illuminating!
Many times it was mentioned about the SF/IRA propaganda machine whilst waxing lyrical about everyone having civil and religious liberty from the time of the Boyne. Just why the fuck those dumb Taigs had to meet in secrecy in fields and caves is beyond me when they were free to practice their religion openly. Another cracker was about George Washington’s crack troop of Orangemen at the battle of valley forge. This is extraordinary because this battle occurred a good twenty years before the order was founded. I would have loved it to be true though, imagine orangemen fighting against the forces of the crown. Perhaps they weren’t allowed to parade down the main street by the British authorities.
Of course there was the obligatory story of Catholics coming out to watch the marches in good cheer, before SF/IRA programmed them into being troublemakers. The biggest downfall of the programme was the lack of views from those supposed troublemakers. Perhaps they might have disagreed with the contention that the parades were all 4th of July and apple pie.
Posted by on Jul 01, 2007 @ 05:10 PMAlan,
I checked out the Mohawk one. Grown Merkin men with glasses in big chief outfits on a cart with dour OO chaps fore and aft. How weird is that?! And the rain made it weirder still.
What was your point though?
Posted by on Jul 01, 2007 @ 05:14 PMEoghan - I think he meant Scotch-Irish / Ulster-Scots when he referred to Orangemen in Washington`s army....and perhaps the answer to the former lies totally in the Reformation era and the backlash against the Roman church`s previous actions and attitudes - but still it doesn`t excuse that treatment and it was necessary for things like the glorious Revolution to progress the supremacy of Parliament over despotic / tyrannical powers such as absolute Monarchs and indeed Popes.
Posted by on Jul 01, 2007 @ 05:53 PMAlan,
“...things like the glorious Revolution to progress the supremacy of Parliament over despotic / tyrannical powers such as absolute Monarchs and indeed Popes.”
Didn’t help that much though, did it? We still have monarchs and indeed popes.
Posted by on Jul 01, 2007 @ 06:03 PMSlugger really has degenerated in an anti protestant messageboard.
Here we have a video promoting the positive aspects of the OO and what do the members of slugger do, they show their sectarianism in its rawest form, so much for an Ireland of equals.
Posted by on Jul 01, 2007 @ 06:19 PM‘We still have monarchs and indeed popes’
...now joined (according to the OO!) by ‘diktats’ like the Anglo-Irish Agreement from a tyrannical Parliament.
Posted by on Jul 01, 2007 @ 06:19 PMIsn’t it time you went for your tea lib ? ;)
Posted by on Jul 01, 2007 @ 06:35 PM“Here we have a video promoting the positive aspects of the OO and what do the members of slugger do, they show their sectarianism in its rawest form, so much for an Ireland of equals. “
some of it is in jest - I hope, same way as we take the P out of the shinners - and for the rest?
They’ll always need the Orange Bogeymen to scare
the decent nationalist population into supporting SF.Posted by on Jul 01, 2007 @ 06:38 PMIs this the anti-gay rev. Paul Zahl who likened the election of a gay bishop in California to “a terrorist bomb, which is timed to destroy a peace process.”
Weird guy !
Posted by on Jul 01, 2007 @ 06:39 PManyone hear banjo’s when they look at that pic?
‘boy sure got a nice mouth.....’
Posted by on Jul 01, 2007 @ 06:59 PMHill Billy Hearty LOL!
Roger.
>>Slugger really has degenerated in an anti protestant messageboard.<<
I gave a basic critique of the video’s, pointing out the obvious uncontentious flaws. However if I chose to launch an attack on the OO for whatever reason, are you suggesting that this would be an attack on Protestantism?
This could only be because you believed the OO represented Protestantism, and I would totally disagree with you on that one.
Posted by on Jul 01, 2007 @ 07:20 PMThe pure hatred of those who oppose the Orange Order’s stand for civil and religious liberty for all is reminiscent of the Nazi fascist hatred for the Jews. It also shows a remarkable ignorance of Irish history on the part of many Republican commentators.
The Loyal Orders will triumph in the end as their quiet dignity, humility and preparedness to honour God is their greatest strength. There is a new understanding in America of the importance of Scots Irish and Ulster Scots in the development of the USA and its democratic institutions.
What is it about Orangeism that troubles Republicans? Why do they hate the Orange Order so much?. Is it because Gerry told them to use interface protest as a means of causing instability to provide an opportunity to indocrinate republican youth into the IRA? Is it deeper than that. There is no church that is more exclusive in its attitude to other Christians than the Roman Catholic Church and one wonders how much tolerance of Protestantism is encouraged in the Catholic school system.
Watching this programme series made me feel great and proud to be an Orangemen as did today,s commemoration services in memory of all ,Protestant and Catholic who fought and died at the Somme.
.Bring on the Twelfth.
T.Ruth
Posted by on Jul 01, 2007 @ 07:28 PMt.ruth
The pure hatred of those who oppose the Orange Order’s stand for civil and religious liberty for all is reminiscent of the Nazi fascist hatred for the Jews. It also shows a remarkable ignorance of Irish history on the part of many Republican commentators.I think you have gone off yout medication
Posted by on Jul 01, 2007 @ 07:35 PM“...the Orange Order’s stand for civil and religious liberty for all...”
Is this a tatty little stand at the Smithsonian Folklife Festival?
Posted by on Jul 01, 2007 @ 08:30 PMT.Ruth your quoate “The Loyal Orders will triumph in the end as their quiet dignity, humility and preparedness to honour God is their greatest strength”, would that be the same Orange Order whos members shot at and bombed the PSNI/British Army in September 2005 because the law said they could not walk through a Nationalist Area?
The Alabhama Orange Order AKA the Klu Klux Klan! The TRUTH always comes out in the end no matter how you try to spin your lies. Just as many of the OO members here in the North also have dual membership of Loyalist Terrorist groups.
Posted by on Jul 01, 2007 @ 08:53 PMT.Ruth,
The Orange Order does not exist in any other part of the civilized world. I guess you could say that everyone hates the OO except a minority of people in Northern Ireland who turn out to see them parade.
Posted by on Jul 01, 2007 @ 09:02 PMComrade Stalin
An appropriate name I must say and your post is very inaccurate/distorted. The order has a strong presence in the USA, Canada, England, Wales, Scotland, several parts of Afria, there is even a small lodge in Spain that was recently formed.
Posted by on Jul 01, 2007 @ 09:38 PMI am unable to play the video due to my useless old computer. I try to avoid discussions of OO etc as I can only speark about South Londonderry.
I have, however, attended South Londonderry 12ths pratically every year as well as Rossknowelagh. I am not an orangeman but play in a rather boring (and not very good) hymn tune band.
I have very briefly met one or two of the American Orangemen and they seemed very nice.
The main point of my post is on the specifics of the South Londonderry 12ths. This is an area of Northern Ireland which has seen a fair amount of trouble over the years and where there are fairly entrenched views. I cannot ever recall any major problem at a 12th demonstration.
I do not think there is a single band with any terrorist connection, even our so called Kick the Pope bands are more politely disagree with the pope and there are few of those, mainly they are accordian, melody flute and pipe bands with one silver band. There is not a single banner gloryfing terrorists. The hangers on tend to be children, wives of orangemen and old people. Elenwe gets bored and will not come.
We parade through a number of towns but have never had any problem. In Maghera the parade mainly goes through the Prod part of the town. On one Black Saturday in Maghera as I posted previously we passed an RC wedding. I suggested a hymn tune. The admittedly quite drunk wedding guests demanded the sash and then sang along to it.
As I said I try to avoid OO typed discussions as I can only speak of South Londonderry but there is little problem there. I have no desire to antagonise my catholic neighbours and I really do not think any of our band or lodge do either. OK this may be naive but for what it is worth there it is. Now please continue to denounce me as a narrow minded bigot.
Posted by on Jul 01, 2007 @ 09:49 PMT Ruth
Comedy post of the century!
Turgon
“As I said I try to avoid OO typed discussions as I can only speak of South Londonderry but there is little problem there. I have no desire to antagonise my catholic neighbours and I really do not think any of our band or lodge do either. OK this may be naive but for what it is worth there it is. Now please continue to denounce me as a narrow minded bigot.”
Intent and outcome are often only passingly related. The organisation you are part of is fundamentally anti-Catholic. If you really don’t want to offend, are you prepared to support some changes as the Grand Master of the Scottish OO suggests: http://news.scotsman.com/scotland.cfm?id=929152007?
Posted by on Jul 01, 2007 @ 10:12 PMKensei,
As I said I avoid OO posts for reasons ably demostrated by yourself Paragraph 2 sentence 2 of my post “I am not an orangeman”.
As such I do not know much about the changes proposed but from what I understand of them they are pretty reasonable.
Posted by on Jul 01, 2007 @ 10:23 PM
