Saturday, November 10, 2007
“Then the boys with masks appeared..”
There’s very little detail online about the stabbing of two men on Thursday night in the Markets area of South Belfast, 4 men were hospitalised and the available reports say that up to 30 people were involved in the fighting by the time the police arrived - two men are now being questioned. Just an average violent night out in the city? Perhaps. But there is one report, and it’s the only one with any detail I’ve seen, which suggests something else might be going on. Also worth noting that the Sinn Féin MLA, Alex Maskey, has been visiting some of those involved who were hospitalised. From the Daily Mirror [NI edition] which names the two men stabbed as Billy Clinton, “a veteran republican” in his 50s, and his brother Terry, and also reports that “another man involved was left with dozens of stitches in his head after being beaten with a baseball bat.”
One source told the Mirror: “It all started with a bit of a row over at the Hilton but later on there were windows smashed and it all started getting messy. After the windows got put in a crowd went looking for the boy that did it. They didn’t find him but there was a row on the street. Then the boys with masks appeared looking for your man saying they were Provies and they were going to kill him.”
Also from the Mirror report
It’s understood the man blamed for smashing the windows later agreed to meet with the other family in a bid to “smooth things over”. But a fight broke out in which the man suffered head injuries and then Mr Clinton was stabbed.
And that additional note
Sinn Féin councillor Alex Maskey described the stabbing as “dusgraceful” [sic] and said that anyone ready to pull a knife should be “behind bars”.
He added: “I was in the hospital today visiting one of the people hurt. There is one man in a very serious condition and another serious.
“This is a terrible attack. The police are in the middle of an investigation and I would urge anyone with information to come forward.
“This could so easily have ended with a fatality.”
Pete Baker @ 01:28 PM
I am beginning to find the potential embarrassment of being mistaken for Rory(South Derry) increasingly irritating.
Since he clearly is not the real, the original, indeed it might be said, the one and only Rory (c’est moi), might it not be better in future if he were to be referred to as Dissident Rory, in much the same way as dissident republicans are distinguished from the Republican Movement.
I know it’s all a bit difficult what with the Real IRA being very unreal indeed, if not in fact surreal and the Continuity IRA not having much in the way of continuity and the Official IRA being, really, officialy not the IRA and I’m not too sure about the Truly, Madly, Deeply IRA....
But I suppose I’m asking for too much and no doubt Rory(South Derry)will now go off to the Knockmealdown mountains and seek out some 500 year old Rory living in a cave on a diet of Carrigeen Moss and potato skins who will give him a parchment of goat skin attesting to the fact that he is in fact the real Rory and that I am a false British copy and I will then simply have to appeal to the people in a referendum. But then winning that wouldn’t do much good either as dissident Rorys don’t pay much attention to the people’s will as clearly expressed in referenda, do they?
Posted by on Nov 11, 2007 @ 09:31 AMhere, Rory.
did psf pay much attention to the people’s will when they were bombing, shooting and general mayhem in the 70s, 80s, 90s etc
was that all that it took to get them to stop- a referendum??
dont you think it ironic that psf will fawning, getting misty eyed, at edentubber commmemoration today.
what electoral support, plan for a united ireland had the IRA in 50’s?? i would say none. but they carried on.
so will psf speakers at edentubber be condemning the martyrs as misguided, wrong for attaking crown forces etc.
i think not.
further alex maskey’s speak about knifes,behind bars etc.
did he he get as upset about the murderers of R McCartney? are those IRA murderers behind bars?
Posted by on Nov 11, 2007 @ 10:51 AMThe point I am making regarding the dissidents continuing use of violence, Harry, is that whatever mandate armed-force republicanism might have felt legitimately derived from the 1919 Dail, was superceded by the all-Ireland referenda on the Good Friday Agreement that established the first genuine all-Ireland mandate for a new dispensation of legitimacy since then and thus took away any spurious legitimacy for afterwards carrying on armed struggle. In fact by the result it declared that the pursuit of armed struggle to obtain unity was in direct opposition to the will of the people and illegitimate in the terms that republicans had previously used to justify such struggle.
Having said that, I do realise of course that as clearly you are not a republican yourself, it is a bit like trying to explain the off-side rule to someone who absolutely detests football and would have nothing whatsoever to do with the game.
Posted by on Nov 11, 2007 @ 11:30 AMok rory,
if armed insurrection had a legitmacy derived from the 1918 election, does that mean every government elected in the 26 counties lacked legitmacy as it was not speaking for the people of the island as a whole??
so the only governments in the 26 legally established, have been the ones since 1998??
is that not a rather republican sinn fein postion? (until 1998)
why however to you apply special relevance to the 1998 referendum? surely a referendum held in a NI state is not a legitmate expression of the people, given that British interfernce on island still existed at that time.
i except that 1998 referendum “approached” an all ireland ref, but it was still not proper all ireland ref by the qualities of the 1918 election.
further, provisional republicans have quite clearly shown that their following of an armed campaign did hot hinge on the outcome of the 1998 gfa ref.
as i remmeber they retained large quantities of weapon well after the declared will of the irish people in 1998.
they have engaged in activties that are very close to armed struggle tactic from 1998 to the present day.
i.e
the smuggling of new weapons from the USA
the aiding of foreign revolutionaries in columbia.
the northern bank robbery (allegedly)
the death of robert mc cartney
the death of paul quinn.surely the provos rejected the purity derived from the 1919 dail, when they split from republican sf in 1985.
further was the IRA not aware of the feeling of the entire iriah people in load of election held throughout the whole troubles.
they never really got over 4% of the vote on the island as awhole. what need was there for a ref to tell them that violnce had no popular support of the irish people.
lastly why do you presume i am not a republican??
Posted by on Nov 11, 2007 @ 12:06 PMThe Markets ia a vile stain on central Belfast, full of benefit dependent spide scum breeding armies of feral criminals to prey on the decent tax paying residents of the city centre. It also seems to have the fattest women in the north, which is saying something.
That real estate could be used to build homes for people who actually contribute to society rather than constantly taking and demanding more.
There is no attack on the working class in this thread - just the underclass who are incapable of work and are addicted to crime and our taxes. People who, while the rest of us are working in the middle of the day, are roaming their streets smashing windows and stabbing each other.Posted by on Nov 11, 2007 @ 12:45 PMFrank Sinistra is Robin Livingstone and I claim my £5.
Posted by on Nov 11, 2007 @ 12:58 PMCareful ‘remove the stain’ - you’ll soon be branded (a) a self-loather, (b) a bigot, (c) a member of the B.N.P., (d) single/ugly and (e) some sort of Newton Emerson clone.....welcome aboard my friend. Here’s hoping that the days of sub-human filth living in our slowly improving city centre are numbered.
P.S. My father was brought up in a two bedroomed house with twelve brothers and sisters. Not one of them ever got involved in crime or took any benefit from the State - they got up, looked for work, worked hard and got on with life - something the filth of the Markets, Donegall Pass, and other shitholes in Belfast seem incapable or unwilling to do (no doubt balmed in their slothful ignorance by the indulgent witterings of their apologists on Slugger).
To the poster who claims that the fact that these vermin have lived in this area for generations has some sort of bearing on their remaining there at our expense - what a load of utter fucking nonsense. My wife grew up on the Malone Road - does that entitle her to demand to live there at everyone else’s expense? You must be fucking joking.
Keep on deluding yourselves kids - here’s hoping your cars are nicked/wrecked and your houses burgled/destroyed by the scum you so patently wish to provide deluded socio-political cover for.
Shame on you all.
Posted by on Nov 11, 2007 @ 01:06 PMyes bemused,
thats all very well what ur saying about ur family workin for a living an stuff like,
but these people have given the world of fashion so much..
pjamas as streetwear- what self respecting millie would be seen dead in the street without primark’s finest “silky” look pjs?
further
think of the boost such people give to the gold trade and the economy as a whole. think of the profits of H Samuels, gold hoop earings, clear but understated celtic/rangers rings. personally i cannot wait for the H Samual autumn and winter range of hoop earrings comes in.
also, spare a thought for the monks of the Buckfast abbey, do you want those men to go hungry this winter?
ah, the people of belfast, what tourist could fail but be impressed. it must be well worth their money to go to belfast.
Posted by on Nov 11, 2007 @ 01:32 PM“… twelve brothers and sisters. Not one of them ever..... took any benefit from the State ” claims Bemused.
What? Never availed themselves of medical assistance, went to school, turned on a water tap, travelled on a public road? Faith ‘tis angels and saints they were, floating above the earth itself. ‘Tis no wonder you’re so precious.
Posted by on Nov 11, 2007 @ 02:37 PMRory - typo - should have read ‘benefits’ (as if you didn’t know that already)....
Posted by on Nov 11, 2007 @ 03:10 PMHarry,
In response to your questions:
Yes, the acceptance of the sole legitimacy of the First Dáil was the principal plank of the Provisional Republican Movement since its inception and the very point of principle on which they broke from their former comrades in what was to become known as the Official Republican Movement after a decision by the Army Council to contest 26 county elections and, if elected, to take up seats in the Dáil, was endorsed by the Sinn Féin Ard Fheis.
It is my personal argument alone however that the referenda held on the basis of the GFA in both jurisdictions overrides that historical legitimacy and now allows Provisional Sinn Féin legitimately (in terms of Republican legitimacy that is) to contest seats in both jurisdictions in Ireland and to take their seats within both assemblies. Dissident republicans do not accept this argument and ignore completely both the legitimacy of the expressed will of the Irish people in those referenda and the practicality of what that expression means in terms of their ability to sustain an armed campaign. Which to my mind makes them not only wilfully wrong but wilfully stupid into the bargain.
The only thing (apart from another island wide referendum) that could now negate the new dispensation would be if one of the signatories to the GFA failed to meet its agreements. The British government and Unionist parties have come closest to doing that by failing to live up to the agreement for a parallel decommissioning of military materiél and institutions but the IRA have made enormous and painful unilateral concessions in that regard in order that the peace process be kept on track and all sides should recognise that.
Posted by on Nov 11, 2007 @ 03:29 PM“ the IRA have made enormous and painful unilateral concessions in that regard in order that the peace process be kept on track and all sides should recognise that.”
I recognise that the IRA has been repeatedly outwitted and out-manouvered by the Brits, to the extent that it surrendered its weaponry with not one of its core goals secured or even remotely close.
That MI5 superfortress in North Down, the pounds in our pockets and the taxes we all pay to the British Exchequer and are going to continue to do so for the rest of our lives tells you all you need to know about the IRA’s contribution to ‘peace’. The peace that follows abject surrender. A border which is there until the unionists decide to remove it, as enshrined in SF’s beloved GFA. ie, Never.Posted by on Nov 11, 2007 @ 03:46 PMAll of the things I listed, Bemused, are state benefits, not only unemployment and social security payments and all must be paid for from taxation to which all citizens are liable and indeed to which all (yes, even the chronically unemployed) contribute. Income Tax is levied on all on the basis of a citizen’s income (unless of course he’s rich and hides it with help from tax advisors) - even unemployment benefit and old age pensions are potentially liable for income tax. But, by any chance,have you heard of value added TAX. Now that is pretty unavoidable and as a percentage of income the poor, the old, the disabled, the sick, the unemployed pay a far greater share than the rich and the richer one becomes the greater the disparity becomes.
I believe it was Jesus of Nazareth who once said, “The poor are always with us”. Unfortunately so are the rapacious, greedy, uncharitable, whingeing rich. Which is why, I suppose, old Jesus didn’t reckon they should be allowed into Heaven where they would likely disrupt the harmony there with all their miserable moaning.
Posted by on Nov 11, 2007 @ 03:51 PMAh right - thanks for that Rory - now I understand. It’s MY fault for working hard and making money (legally I hasten to add in light of your typically whining insinuation that earning money somehow implies that I’m a criminal) and I should in some way be ashamed that filth who sit on their fat holes all day eating shite and contributing fuck-all-squared to society have the misfortune to pay VAT on their sports wear and gold tat which they purchase with my money. As I say - here’s hoping your car’s nicked by one of their feral little off-spring.
Posted by on Nov 11, 2007 @ 04:03 PMBelfast Earthquake
At 09:45 yesterday morning a major earthquake measuring 4.5 on the Richter Scale epicentered on greater Belfast. The earthquake decimated the area causing an estimated £30 million of damage, with the exception of Sandy Row and Ardoyne where approximately £375,000 of improvements were made.
Untold damage and distress was caused, with many woken before their Giros arrived. Several priceless collections of momentos from Millisle and the Spanish Costa’s were damaged and three areas of historic and scientifically significant litter were disturbed.
A mural of King Billy was destroyed on the Shankill as was one of some oul-doll gurning, on the Falls. Thousands are confused that something other than political madness has shaken Belfast. Victims can be seen wandering aimlessly amidst the wreckage muttering “Wha? What the f%*k was that?”
One survivor Tracey-Anne Kirsty-Lee Johnston, a 17-year-old mother of three told us “I near crapped maself. Our Shania-Fairybell came gurning into the room this morning. The chyle was in an awful state. My youngest ones, Britney-Jo and Justin-Keanu slept through it all, so they did.
I was still shakin’ watchin ‘Trisha’ - you know what I mean like. It’s awful so it is. All ma windies are broke and I can’t get the houl of the Housin’ Executive for til fix them. They’ve only been fixed for a week after me and his last row. I’ve lost me fegs and everything - its terrible so it is. Look at the state of my hair. Have ya any fegs mister?”
Apparently in the west of the city widespread joyriding and looting carried on as normal. The British Red Cross has so managed to ship 400 crates of beer into the area to help with the stricken masses but were stoned, bricked and petrol bombed as they left the area. Rescue workers still searching through the rubble have found large quantities of personal belongings, including benefit books and jewellery from Elizabeth Duke and Ratners. They claim that the death toll would have been significantly higher had the Bru been open at the time.
HOW YOU CAN HELP:
Clothing is most sought after - Items required include: Sovereign rings,
Burberry baseball caps, white socks, Tesco two-stripe trainers, white track suits, chunky gold chains.
FOOD PARCELS ARE ALSO URGENTLY REQUIRED.
Required foodstuffs include: beer, frozen burgers, beer, lard, deep fried Mars bars. Tayto cheese n’ onion, beer, Chinese takeaways.
REMEMBER - EVERY LITTLE HELPS.....
25p will buy a biro pen to fill in a spurious claim form.
£1.95 will buy an All-Day Ulsterbus ticket to enable victims to travel from the Bru to the Post Office to McDonalds to the Wine Store.
£10 will take a family to Antrim for the day where the children can sniff glue and skin-up.
£15 will buy fish suppers and an E for a family of 4.Posted by on Nov 11, 2007 @ 04:41 PMHow cheesily excruciating was that, agh? Like a nightmare hybrid of Jimmy Cricket and Julian Simmons-only less funny.
If you have one, don’t give up your day job.
Posted by on Nov 11, 2007 @ 05:13 PMit’s not funny because it’s probably a fair prediction of what would happen…
Posted by on Nov 11, 2007 @ 06:16 PMjust to let you all know there is more than 50 per cent of the houses in the market area bought by the hard working owners that live in them.
Posted by on Nov 11, 2007 @ 07:02 PMGlad to hear it homeowner. Well done to those folks - it’s the other fifty per cent that I want sorted out.
Posted by on Nov 11, 2007 @ 07:28 PMI’m sure there are plenty of ways of obtaining cash to purchase houses, other than by hard work… Just ask the Slab.
Posted by on Nov 11, 2007 @ 07:30 PMBelfast would be much improved if the feckless, workshy, criminal underclass that infects city centre areas like the Markets were forced to work in camps for food.
Then hard working immigrants who actually want to make something of themselves could be given their houses.Posted by on Nov 11, 2007 @ 09:02 PMGlad to hear it homeowner. Well done to those folks - it’s the other fifty per cent that I want sorted out.
Fascinating. So it’s only those who can’t afford to buy their homes you want exterminated/moved to forced labour camps?
As for your story about your father, big deal, most people have a similar story, unless you think there’s something special or unique about yours. Most people also seem to be able to balance their new found wealth and social status as homeowners with their origins, without recourse to ignorant slabbering on an internet message board.
You’re nothing but a jumped up little spide yourself. Money never made a lady, nor a gentleman.
Posted by on Nov 11, 2007 @ 09:35 PM“So it’s only those who can’t afford to buy their homes you want exterminated/moved to forced labour camps?”
I don’t want a single member of the WORKING class being anything other than treated decently by the state. I want them protected from the workshy spongers who torment them and the rest of us and contribute NOTHING to society. Decent hard working people are sick of these parasites being given an easy ride. If they fail to join their work detail,they should be dispatched to whatever countries decent hard working people are trying to get out of due to actual poverty or oppression (neither of which exist in any appreciable form in this country) in an exchange programme.
Posted by on Nov 11, 2007 @ 09:44 PMChrist, no sooner did I put that post up and there’s a reply from one of the ubermensch. Do you (and your socks) sit by your computer just waiting for a reply, or do you amuse yourself wanking to porn while you wait?
Anyway, no more from me, it’s obvious now you’re either an attention seeking troll or an uber right wing delinquent, sad either way.
Posted by on Nov 11, 2007 @ 09:54 PMI’m sure there are plenty of ways of obtaining cash to purchase houses, other than by hard work… Just ask the Slab. ”
I’m sure, Agh, that asking Peter Mandelson or Ian Paisley junior or indeed, any one of the Windsors might prove to be even more enlightening in this regard - that is if you could ever get a straight answer from a one of them.
Posted by on Nov 12, 2007 @ 12:56 AM
