Sunday, November 12, 2006
The nation remembers
Across the United Kingdom memorial services to the dead of the World War and subsequent conflicts are taking place.
There are similar nationwide ceremonies in a number of countries across the world. In Dublin, Mary McAleese attended a Remembrance Day Service at St Patrick’s Cathedral.
“They shall grow not old, as we that are left grow old.
Age shall not weary them, nor the years condemn.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning
We will remember them”.
Fair Deal @ 12:27 PM
Lest we forget!
Posted by on Nov 12, 2006 @ 01:13 PMWar is such an appalling waste of life and resources, makes you wonder why we have them. They are generally caused because someone wants to control another or threatens another. They are born out of greed, a desire to dominate, mistrust and insecurity and are an appalling indictment on humanity. Generally it is not the strong that cause war but the weak and insecure, the pathetic wretches that have to prove something and we like sheep follow them.
Posted by on Nov 12, 2006 @ 01:34 PM“In Dublin, Mary McAleese attended a Remembrance Day Service at St Patrick’s Cathedral. “
Is this new news? Or significant even?
In 1997, Mary McAleese attended to show that she was brushing up on her statewomanship duties. She has done so on every occasion since.
If you want a new development, look to the all-Ireland Greens whose leader (John Barry) now supports the white poppy initiative.
Posted by on Nov 12, 2006 @ 01:57 PMIn the interests of balance I hope that slugger posts a similar poem on easter sunday when republicans remember their dead.
Posted by on Nov 12, 2006 @ 03:14 PMIn the interests of balance I hope that slugger posts a similar poem on easter sunday when republicans remember their dead - shoulnt that read “when republicans remember their terrorist dead”?
Posted by on Nov 12, 2006 @ 03:24 PMTo exuup
Why should Slugger or anyone post a poem or anything else for Republican Killers.
Thats what these so called freedom fighters were out and out killers who killed innocent people who were going about theit Legal & Lawful way of life. The republicans you hold in such esteem robbed thousands of their lives and left others maimed and disabled.
Up yours exuup,Posted by on Nov 12, 2006 @ 03:39 PMNathan
I thought the leader of the Irish Green Party was a Trevor Sargent? Could you possibly clarify?
White poppies; red poppies personally I don’t really care and am more than willing to let anyone remember their friends family and colleagues in whatever form they wish. It is, like religion their affair and to support one way by attacking another is I think inappropriate. Mr Barry I assume supports the white because he sees the red variety as symbolic of British militarism. This view tells us much about Mr Barry and his perception of the world and really is not of any real overall significance. It’s a day to burry the hatchet and let people remember as they themselves feel appropriate.
Heck
It’s a good poem and let it be for all who died needlessly because of war and strife.
Posted by on Nov 12, 2006 @ 03:47 PM#
“In the interests of balance I hope that slugger posts a similar poem on easter sunday when republicans remember their dead - shoulnt that read “when republicans remember their terrorist dead”?
Posted by exuup on Nov 12, 2006 @ 02:24 PM”Speaking of terrorists http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=viewArticle&code=AKL20050930&articleId=1024
There are none so blind as those that can’t see. [Play the ball! - edited moderator]
Posted by on Nov 12, 2006 @ 03:47 PMThe brave boys of the RAF, whom you would wish us to honour, Nationalist, killed more civilains in one bombing run than did republicans in the course of the whole campaign. And let us not forget Group Captain Leonard Cheshire who was awarded a Victoria Cross for his valorous slaughter in Hiroshima.
Posted by on Nov 12, 2006 @ 03:48 PMI totally agree with “Nationalist” Terrorists on either side never-mind only Republicans should not be remembered offically or otherwise along with those who paid the ultimate price for their country and its people. Terrorists should be remembered only for the murderers and attempted murderers they are who carried out genocide on the people of Northern Ireland for decades and are still continuing to do even to this day. Shame on those who would even suggest this happening. As for Mary McAleese attending a Remembrance Day Service at St Patrick’s Cathedral in Dublin,it is simply kudos for her it is easy for her to do it in the Irish Republic nowadays, were was she for the many years she lived in Northern Ireland I bet as a civilian she never attended a Remembrance Day Service in Northern Ireland doesn’t that speak volumes of the woman.
Posted by on Nov 12, 2006 @ 04:07 PMRory= Maybe without the brave boys in the RAF as you term them hadn’t done what they done you may not be enjoying the sort of life you have now.
Posted by on Nov 12, 2006 @ 04:07 PMDidn’t take long for this thread to follow a predictable route.
Posted by on Nov 12, 2006 @ 04:28 PMRory & Nationalist
It is a day for reflection and ponder what causes war and why we go to war. We should ask is there anything that we personally can do to address the causes. Blaming is perhaps pointless and the horror is as great if you are a victim who is one of many or an individual.
In all wars the victims are often the innocent and in all wars humanity loses. Wars are fought by those who have least to gain for those with most interest stay well away. Often those responsible suffer no personal loss and avoid the consequence and that is very wrong.
We should be very careful before we support any war or support those with big sticks for can you trust such people and who next will they oppose or find inconvenient. And when they talk of acceptable loss or collateral damage, it is someone’s life someone’s family, someone just like you or I or our children that they have chosen to terminate.
War is one pestilence that is self inflicted and avoidable.
Posted by on Nov 12, 2006 @ 04:28 PMStrong lauguage Jumbo, but I entirely agree with both you and Nationalist.
Posted by on Nov 12, 2006 @ 04:30 PMIt is a bit sad, on today of all days that some people see war in such black and white terms. For there is nothing glorious about war, for all those who participate in it will carry a responsibility for the death of innocents, for that is the nature of warfare. Just look at today’s Iraq.
At times it may be necessary, but we should not forget by going to war, humankind has been defeated by being forced to take the worst of all options. When we pay respect to the dead of war on 11/11, we should not over look the fact that WW1 was a totally unnecessary war which would not have occurred but for inadequate politicians. For when a democracy resorts to war it cannot but be because its politicians have failed those they represent and it then falls to ordinary folk to try and correct their mistakes bayonet in hand.
To those who are so ready to condemn Republicans, with respect, perhaps they should consider two points. Firstly many republicans have apologized for the hurt and suffering they caused during the recent conflict, not much if you have lost loved ones I agree, but surly it is a start. My second point is if Unionists had not made NI such a cold place for Nationalists, many people who did not deserve to have had their lives stolen might have still been with us.
One of the reasons wars happen is far to many people refuse to put themselves in to other peoples shoes, for if they were to, they may gain a little knowledge of how those shoes pinch.
Posted by on Nov 12, 2006 @ 04:53 PM“Terrorists on either side never-mind only Republicans should not be remembered offically or otherwise along with those who paid the ultimate price for their country and its people.”
sorry, am I missing something? didn’t the men and women of easter week pay the ultimate price?
i take exception to the claim that those who fought and died in dublin 1916 were terrorists. we should remember them ... and as of very recently, we do.
that the british wish to remember their fallen is normal, and should be respected.
Posted by on Nov 12, 2006 @ 05:27 PMUNIMPRESSED
sorry, am I missing something? didn’t the men and women of easter week pay the ultimate price?
Some of them did. But the actions - which they took consciously and voluntarily - were morally unjustifiable.
Hardly the same as the soldiers in a war.
i take exception to the claim that those who fought and died in dublin 1916 were terrorists. we should remember them ... and as of very recently, we do.
I can’t see how they were terrorists, since they didn’t engage in terrorism, but their actions were unjustifiable.
Posted by on Nov 12, 2006 @ 06:01 PMmarty
So true. I seem to remember us going through the same crap last year.
By remembering those who died we are not glorifying war (I hope) but simply remembering the sacrifice those young people made, even if being led there by misguided or evil politicians.
On remembrance day, I give a thought to those young people from other countries who also suffered or died.Posted by on Nov 12, 2006 @ 06:10 PMMickhall
Excellent post. I’d agree with every word.
To quote the Fureys
“And did they believe when they answered the Call
Did they really believe that this war would end wars
Well the sorrow the suffering, the glory, the pain
The killing and dying were all done in vain
For young Willie McBride it all happened again
And again and again and again and again.”Posted by on Nov 12, 2006 @ 06:18 PMGotta laugh at the republican spite on this thread: I suppose you have to rationalise your collaboration with the Nazis somehow, eh? The same sort of people who murdered Protestant pensioners remembering their fallen in Enniskillen. Remembering real heroes, not the craven cowards and scum you venerate.
Shame on you. As if you even knew what shame is.
Lest We Forget.Posted by on Nov 12, 2006 @ 06:21 PMAh, quoting The Furies.
The Irish would have been enslaved with the rest of Europe were it not for the courage of the United Kingdom when it stood alone against fascism. The forefathers of the Provos actively collaborated with the Nazi. You’d be better off keeping your mouths shut on this day of all days, lads. The Enniskillen dead should haunt you to your graves. Your cowardice and treachery when those with any decency fought the fascists, and your cowardice and sectarian hatred when you slaughtered Protestants in Fermanagh will also never be forgotten.Posted by on Nov 12, 2006 @ 06:27 PMWhen those three evil empire builders Hitler, Stalin and Churchill competed with each other to send young men out to die so that further millions could perish or be enslaved they were only continuing the hideous waste of the First World War.
De Valera was right to keep Ireland out of it as far as he could. Britain ‘stood alone’ against tyranny for 18 months - big deal. The Irish have resisted it for a helluvalot longer.
Within six years of the end of hostilities France and Germany were building a new Europe with the establishment of the Iron and Steel Community. Britain was too slow then as it is too slow now.
Implement the GFA, wind up the Assembly, and let’s join the real world in Europe. Leave the Brits to their dreams of past glories and maybe, just maybe they might be fit to mingle with the rest of us in another hundred years.
Posted by on Nov 12, 2006 @ 07:14 PMTerrorists regardless of what side they were have no right to be regarded ‘as fallen’ The Terrorist has brought or given society nothing but they have given nothing but pain and suffering to thousands. Let us today honour those who have died trying to bring about a better society for everyone regardless of cast colour or creed.
Posted by on Nov 12, 2006 @ 07:17 PMAll of my family members who fought for the British Army in WWI & WWII were fortunate enough to come home alive - not all in one piece, but at least alive. Unfortunately, a relative who fought for the US Army in the Pacific was killed the day the armistice with Japan came into effect.
I think it is very important that we remember the sacrifice that over 30 million Russians made during WWII. Without their sacrifice the war would have gone on far longer, the Jews would have been entirely eradicated from Europe and who knows if the rest of the allies would ever have been able to successfully invade Western Europe.
Posted by on Nov 12, 2006 @ 07:40 PM“maybe, just maybe they might be fit to mingle with the rest of us in another hundred years.”
Please, don’t let us stop you. There is a regular bus, train and air service to your country. I hope you enjoyed your time in the United Kingdom.
Posted by on Nov 12, 2006 @ 07:40 PM
