Wednesday, March 28, 2007
Northern Ireland go top: Stan to get reprieve?
Yep, heard the cheering from down below, now it’s all quiet because it’s all over... (till the pubs get out)… They just expect Healy to score and he does... Meanwhile, with a 1-0 against Slovakia, maybe some of the blatantly pernicious salami slicing of Stan will stop…
Mick Fealty @ 08:51 PM
“NI doesn’t represent me any more than, say, France.”
Even though you live and were born there? (I know I’m making an assumption that may not be correct here but for sake of argument let’s roll with it)
Posted by on Apr 01, 2007 @ 12:01 PM“Even though you live and were born there? (I know I’m making an assumption that may not be correct here but for sake of argument let’s roll with it)”
The state doesn’t represent me either, and it against all of my politics. In fact, as I live here and have grown up here, I’m more likely to say “Northern Ireland” doesn’t represent me.
As a Nationalist, I want to see the end of the current arrangement. As has been pointed out by others, I’m Irish and if others want to stick other things onto it, that’s up to them. But once you start tacking on those additions, you have ceased to represent me.
Posted by on Apr 01, 2007 @ 12:09 PMRealist,
It’s not that I was doing my homework, its just that I was amazed at the lack of knowledge shown by some BBC presenters on Wednesday night. Even the usually well-researched Stephen Watson made the following comment.
“ We play Liechtenstein next which means we will stretch our lead even further...”
He clearly had no knowledge that there were 2 complete rounds of matches in June, of which Northern Ireland were not involved in any. Amazingly poor-quality journalism when you think about it…
Posted by on Apr 01, 2007 @ 12:11 PMkensei,
I respect your honesty.
PS. Great to see Sir David grab a last minute (flukey) winner for you on Friday night - a much needed three points bagged.
Posted by on Apr 01, 2007 @ 12:11 PMmacswiney,
I know what you mean - some people are losing the run of themselves!
If we finish third in this group, I think it will be a fantastic achievement.
Even fourth would represent progress.
Good times tho - “feelgood factor” abounds.
Posted by on Apr 01, 2007 @ 12:14 PMAs a Northern Ireland fan, call me biased but I think in terms of being the most likely to qualify for the Finals, I would rank these countries as follows
Most Likely 1-Northern Ireland
2- Scotland
3-England
4-Wales (2 games in hand on Republic)
5- Republic of Ireland.What do you think?
Posted by on Apr 01, 2007 @ 12:24 PMWe’ll finish third.
Best chance out of the other 4?
Scotland, England, ROI, Wales.Posted by on Apr 01, 2007 @ 12:44 PMI can’t believe your negativity, BP. I strongly fancy us to qualify on the back of us winning our next 3 games, which we should do.
Let’s sit back and laugh at the beggars from the south when we are confirmed qualifiers in the autumn.
Then watch turncoats like Gibson and Kane wallow in their own shit when this happens.Posted by on Apr 01, 2007 @ 12:53 PMYou seem to be suffering a bit from split loyalties there Inver…
Posted by on Apr 01, 2007 @ 01:24 PM“Let’s sit back and laugh at the beggars from the south when we are confirmed qualifiers in the autumn.
Then watch turncoats like Gibson and Kane wallow in their own shit when this happens.”Football for all ???
inver
It would be more honest if you just said ‘Taig’ or ‘Fenian’.
Posted by on Apr 01, 2007 @ 02:21 PM“It would be more honest if you just said ‘Taig’ or ‘Fenian’. ”
Sigh. I’m tired of explaining things like this to ignorant bitter stirrers who jump to the wrong conclusions based on their own prejudice.
The term beggars came from the Republic of Ireland’s football team developing a habit during the late eighties early nineties of running all over the world ‘begging’ foreign nationals whose grandad once drank a pint of guinness in Dublin airport to come and play for them. It has nothing to do with taigs and fenians. But don’t let the truth get in the way of a MOPE, would you?
Posted by on Apr 01, 2007 @ 03:17 PM“The term beggars came from the Republic of Ireland’s football team developing a habit during the late eighties early nineties of running all over the world ‘begging’ foreign nationals whose grandad once drank a pint of guinness in Dublin airport to come and play for them. It has nothing to do with taigs and fenians. But don’t let the truth get in the way of a MOPE, would you?”
So sneering and nasty whatever spin you put on it, and the fact the NI team has done the same apparently has no impact. I see.
And apparently I am guilty of “idiotic and prejudical bullshit and rank hypocrisy”.
Get some shame there beano.
Posted by on Apr 01, 2007 @ 04:42 PMMost Likely 1-Northern Ireland
2- Scotland
3-England
4-Wales (2 games in hand on Republic)
5- Republic of Ireland.What do you think?
I like your optimism but England have to be the favourites and then the ROI. Wales are gon and Scotland won’t qualify.
We will qualify if we can muster up two more away victories, this is something I don’t think we can do.
Posted by on Apr 01, 2007 @ 05:45 PMAccording to a poster on owc a while back the term beggar was a simple code for taigs.
Posted by on Apr 01, 2007 @ 06:12 PMKensei
To be fair, you’re honest.
I’d much rather your stated position than someone who does make excuses but wouldn’t support NI anyway!
I’d be interested to hear how you define “add-ons”. Do you accept that Britishness is an integral part of Irishness, for example?
Posted by on Apr 01, 2007 @ 08:38 PM“I’d be interested to hear how you define “add-ons”. Do you accept that Britishness is an integral part of Irishness, for example?”
I don’t understand how it could be, but then I don’t have particular insight into the Unionist mentality.
I don’t believe “Britishness” can be accommodated within an All-Ireland state. But British people and many of the things that make up “Irish Britishness” can be.
Exactly how you would define “add-ons” would take some thought, because there are regional identities that I do have - Belfast, Antrim, Ulster. But Northern Ireland and British-Irish are entirely alien to me.
Posted by on Apr 01, 2007 @ 08:46 PMIsnt it about time people including certain journalists within the ‘Irish News’ grew up and started refering to this province as Northern Ireland instead of the ‘North’. The North is an incorrect reference anyway as it would include Donegal which is part of the ROI.
Kensei you said
I don’t believe “Britishness” can be accommodated within an All-Ireland state. But British people and many of the things that make up “Irish Britishness” can be.
You wont need to worry about this as an all Ireland state does not exist and is unlikely to do so any time soon.
Besides why can Britishness not be accomdated within an all Ireland state?
Posted by on Apr 01, 2007 @ 10:03 PM“You wont need to worry about this as an all Ireland state does not exist and is unlikely to do so any time soon.”
Depends how you define soon, doesn’t it.
“Besides why can Britishness not be accomdated within an all Ireland state?”
Because you always hit walls. There is no tricolour flying over Belfast City Hall due to present Constitutional arrangements, just as there could be no Union Jack in an All-Ireland scenario.
That doesn’t speak to how people see themselves or express themselves - they could be as British as they liked - and a lot of the underlying “Britishness” here is really indigneous Ulster culture anyway and that can be catered for.Posted by on Apr 01, 2007 @ 10:31 PMBut couldnt British traditions such as Remembrance Sunday be accomodated in a UI.
As for a UI Gerry predicts 2020, that is quite soon.
Posted by on Apr 01, 2007 @ 10:44 PM“But couldnt British traditions such as Remembrance Sunday be accomodated in a UI.”
Sure, but as I said, there are always going to be limits, and if Nationalism is going to sell a UI, it has to recognise that. I think there would be gains in other places though.
“As for a UI Gerry predicts 2020, that is quite soon.”
There are chains of events where 2020 is possible, but I would say very unlikely. But it’s been 80 years so far. If it’s another 80, we are over half way :)
Posted by on Apr 01, 2007 @ 10:58 PMBeano
“The term beggars came from the Republic of Ireland’s football team developing a habit during the late eighties early nineties of running all over the world ‘begging’ foreign nationals...”Kensei’s right, it’s nasty.
What ROI does is no different that what other teams do. Anything we do is within the rules set by FIFA.Inver Red
“Most Likely 1-Northern Ireland
2- Scotland
3-England
4-Wales (2 games in hand on Republic)
5- Republic of Ireland.”That’s a joke right? Wales are 7 points the top 3 (same no of games as Germany, 1 less than CzRep) but you think they’ll qualify?? Have you been following the competition at all?
NI & Scotland ahead of England?Posted by on Apr 01, 2007 @ 11:08 PMMaca
Good to see you back.
One can only assume the order is a joke, as it just “happens” to have NI on top and RoI at the bottom.
And we wonder why the NI team’s not popular with many RoI fans!
I suspect he’ll regret printing that list come October.
Dave
Isnt it about time people including certain journalists within the ‘Irish News’ grew up and started refering to this province as Northern Ireland instead of the ‘North’.
Only if the Belfast Telegraph grows up and starts referring to “Northern Ireland” by its proper name too, instead of this constant “Ulster” rubbish.
The North is an incorrect reference anyway as it would include Donegal which is part of the ROI.
And “Ulster” includes two more. So the Tele is even further out.
Funny how people are so one-sided in the things they notice…
Posted by on Apr 02, 2007 @ 07:26 AMKensei
I don’t believe “Britishness” can be accommodated within an All-Ireland state.
Again, at least you’re honest so we know what we’re dealing with.
In fact, I’ve no doubt Britishness would have to be integral to an All-Ireland state. Just as NI doesn’t work because it’s divided into sectarian camps, an all-Ireland State would fail if it too were so divided.
But that’s hypothetical. Dave is right at least when he says it won’t be happening soon. We each have a responsibility to make the best of a bad deal in the mean time.
Posted by on Apr 02, 2007 @ 07:30 AM“Again, at least you’re honest so we know what we’re dealing with.”
Selectively quoting, then being a condescending git works wonders, doesn’t it?
“In fact, I’ve no doubt Britishness would have to be integral to an All-Ireland state. Just as NI doesn’t work because it’s divided into sectarian camps, an all-Ireland State would fail if it too were so divided.”
The nature of Irishness would have to change, and many of the things that make up “Irish Britishness” would need to be integral. But the state would have to be indivisibly Irish, or else it is not independent.
Posted by on Apr 02, 2007 @ 08:50 AMIJP the GFA included recognition of the legitimacy of Northern Ireland and its place in the UK. It included no such recognition of the present-day boundaries of Ulster, which is not a legally defined entity.
Posted by on Apr 02, 2007 @ 10:54 AM
