Thursday, May 24, 2007
Me Fein Campbell harks back to the Sackcloth
Gregory Campbell has made little effort to conceal his opposition/scepticism about the ‘New Deal’ which has joined McGuinness and Paisley as one up at Stormont, but his poor, embittered performance on tonight’s Hearts and Minds programme revealed the extent of the difficulties being faced up to by the East Derry MP and- likely- others from within the DUP (as if to prove this, the ‘If you ask me’ slot was occupied by Mr. Angry of the Outer Reaches of Unionism himself, David Vance.)
In a 5 minute slot, Campbell managed to invoke Godwin’s Law, belittle discrimination against nationalists, demand an apology from republicans as a prerequisite to discussions about the future and bring even presenter Noel Thompson to the edge of despair. Worth a viewing.
Chris Donnelly @ 08:44 PM
>>In a 5 minute slot, Campbell managed to invoke Godwin’s Law, belittle discrimination against nationalists, demand an apology from republicans as a prerequisite to discussions about the future<<
Is he a regular poster on slugger? I swear I’ve came across him many times lately under several different names. It is getting boring! These bigots need to get over it, the place has moved on and there is no going back.
Posted by on May 24, 2007 @ 09:12 PMWorth a viewing? Hardly—truely terrible performance from Gregory Campbell and utterly depressing-- mind you Martina Anderson’s performance was hardly inspiring either, but you could at least forgive her for not engaging in a verbal battle with Mr Campbell. Problem with him is that he seems to want it both ways to be in government and in a partnership and not to work with the same partners at the same time. I think he can easily be exposed as a hypocrite , if he is so opposed to engaging with a former IRA prisoner in the shape of Ms Anderson why is his leader in a joint office with Martin Mc Guiness and if Gregory has such a problem why the hell is he remaining in the DUP and not resigning a la Jim Allister
Posted by on May 24, 2007 @ 09:19 PMDepressing stuff, but oh well.
Posted by on May 24, 2007 @ 09:35 PM“You have to move on in the spirit of forgiveness”.
!!!
Posted by on May 24, 2007 @ 09:44 PM“The IRA were the source of the problem. They weren’t the source of every problem. But they were the source of the problem.”
Classic stuff.
Anderson should have said what both sides did was wrong though rather than split hairs.
Posted by on May 24, 2007 @ 09:48 PMI thought the IRA etc was more of a result of the problem, though a result that only served to cause more problems. Ah Northern Ireland, what a cycle of crap it has been, though things can only improve, and they have been.
Posted by on May 24, 2007 @ 10:09 PMThe DUP strategy with dealing with Republican spin-doctors is all wrong.
I would have liked to hear what Martina’s proposals are for going about work in the community and the Assembly in a reconciliatory fashion; however, I didn’t get the chance to because Gregory stole the show raising veritable concerns over Republican hypocrisy.
It made for good TV, the TV we are used to seeing; but Unionists seem to always come out the worst, they probably should have put up the Strangford MLA Michelle McIlveen and told her to run with the idea of listening to new ideas which the dyed, dried and spun ‘blonde-bombshell’ had to offer.
A fine Republican publicity stunt and pleasure to watch.
Take note everyone North and South this was how not to deal with Republican PR.
Posted by on May 24, 2007 @ 10:18 PM“Chris Donnelly - Gregory Campbell ... poor, embittered performance on tonight’s Hearts and Minds programme ... bring even presenter Noel Thompson to the edge of despair.”
Thanks for the link to this programme - but you must have been watching a different one to me. Gregory Campbell was saying what the majority of Unionists are thinking. We need a sincere apology from the Sinn Fein-IRA death squads. Instead all we got from Martina Anderson was warm fuzzy nonsense. She seems to think Unionist Outreach means to keep repeating the Christian name of Unionist politicians!
And of course on Slugger we get the usual Sinn Fein-IRA spin doctors making comments - trying to spin the truth out of existence. What Sinn Fein-IRA did was wrong. Shooting people dead in front of their families is wrong full stop. Torturing people and dumping their bodies is wrong full stop. Blowing up people causing death and serious injury is wrong full stop. It’s horrible dirty terrorism. Let’s hear that from the contributers to this site - that would be a good start for real Unionist outreach.
Posted by on May 24, 2007 @ 10:56 PM“Chris Donnelly - Gregory Campbell ... poor, embittered performance on tonight’s Hearts and Minds programme ... bring even presenter Noel Thompson to the edge of despair.”
Yes but it is important to remember PeaceandJustice that, while DUP concerns are quite true, the interview between Gregory and Martina followed on from the debate over peacewalls and persisting tension between those who live eitherside.
So that is why the DUP lost tonight because they ought to have listened to any case for improving relations and Martina may have had some ideas but for Gregory by-passing the opportunity.
Posted by on May 24, 2007 @ 11:06 PMI don’t find either of them the least bit engaging, especially with their respective facades of denial.
Posted by on May 24, 2007 @ 11:09 PMAgree with above, maybe the early showing of Hearts and Minds was different because what I just watched was nothing like what Chris is claiming.
I usually cannot bear Gregory Campbell but found myself agreeing with him tonight, I even questioned some of the points Noel Thompson made to him, perhaps he was blinded by the glamour of Ms Anderson?
After watching Catriona Ruane wow on Let’s Talk, Martina was woeful, she sounded like a robot repeating the same lines about wanting a shared future so many times. Gregory on the other hand was honest and rational and really spoke for all who are against terrorism.
Posted by on May 24, 2007 @ 11:09 PMPandJ
“Gregory Campbell was saying what the majority of Unionists are thinking.”Oh God. How depressing.
“We need a sincere apology from the Sinn Fein-IRA death squads.”
Too late for more hurdles I’m afraid. The race is over.
“What Sinn Fein-IRA did was wrong.”
Sinn Fein-IRA is so 90s. Its just Sinn Fein these days. You know, in the 21st century.
“Shooting people dead in front of their families is wrong full stop. Torturing people and dumping their bodies is wrong full stop. Blowing up people causing death and serious injury is wrong full stop. It’s horrible dirty terrorism.”
Nobody has clean hands around here, not the IRA or the British or their loyalist henchmen. By the way, did I miss Harry Potter calling for loyalist decommisioning? Must have.
Political viewer
“Gregory on the other hand was honest and rational and really spoke for all who are against terrorism.”Again, its a bit rich listening to DUP types talking about the evils of terrorism given some of their previous dealing with the LVF etc. Time for loyalism to disarm.
The SF attempt to reach out to the other side is admirable, particularly in the face of such provocation from the likes of Campbell.
Posted by on May 24, 2007 @ 11:20 PMI think with Sunday Sequnece featuring Mr Vance and tonights Hearts and Minds that representation of extreme views has reached its peak and nothing should be heard further from this sector until autumn 2008, if one takes into account the support for power sharing as repressnted in the March elections
Mr Vance has demonstrated his attitude to my opposition to him on Global warming by slandering me across the ineternet and banning me from his website.
Someone who less respects democracy is hard to imagine, short of his late opponent, Mr Hussein.
As I have presented myself as a woman who works for the Northern Ireland public sector, Mr Vance has threatened to use my IP address to advise my employers of my identity. I appeal to fellow bloggers and commentators, wther you agree with me or not, for support against this utterly fascistic and anti-blogging enterprise.
My last endeavour which he took exception to was condemning how the family of a SF councillor (gored to death by a bull) was treated with contempt on his website, at the time his own father died...at a atime when basic humanity should have been a focus, Mr Vancfe could not rise above contempt and rejoicing in the death of anyone opposed to him. Reject this fascist.
Posted by on May 24, 2007 @ 11:22 PMI think the really telling part of this rather nasty face-off was Anderson’s expression right at the end. No-one can jump from the mindset of a bomber prepared to murder political enemies to an ‘outreach’ councillor to those same enemies, and Ms Anderson is no exception.
Throughout the interview she reminded me of a shop assistant forced to endure a tirade of abuse from an irate customer, allowed to respond only with platitudes and patronisation.
Campbell was not the man to do it, but the likes of Anderson have a tilt switch (if you’ll pardon the pun) which when pushed far enough will trigger an explosion.
We’ve seen comrade Gerry with ruffled feathers in the past, most recently when demanding that the media desist from asking ‘stupid questions.’
Sometimes the mask slips and it will happen again.Posted by on May 24, 2007 @ 11:24 PM“Throughout the interview she reminded me of a shop assistant forced to endure a tirade of abuse from an irate customer, allowed to respond only with platitudes and patronisation.
Campbell was not the man to do it, but the likes of Anderson have a tilt switch (if you’ll pardon the pun) which when pushed far enough will trigger an explosion”So, to sum up what you’ve said:
1. Martina Anderson remained calm and reasonable in the face of fairly heavy ranting by Gregory Campbell, despite her body language giving away she was a bit annoyed by it.
2. If you push people enough, eventually they will lose their temper.
Fantastic analysis, there.
Posted by on May 24, 2007 @ 11:34 PMThe accusation betrays an assumption that the customer is always right, a strange assumption from Gerry or indeed, castro. :)
Posted by on May 24, 2007 @ 11:38 PMI’m still not getting the “outreach” brief. Martina mentioned a couple of times that while Campbell might not be ready to “move on” there were many (did she say hundreds?) in the unionist community who were.
What is her role? Is it negotiation or reconciliation? If she’s going around the Campbell mindset who is she reaching out to?
Maybe it all becomes clear on Tuesday at the big Stormont launch.
I fear that all that’s happened is that Gerry got a bit carried away with the Unity Green Paper proposal in SF’s southern manifesto and he’s decided to fill some pretend Irish cabinet positions in the meantime.
Ms Anderson seems to have neither the skill, the empathy, the imagination nor even the disposition to play ambassador to unionists. Surely SF have someone better somewhere. Is there not one McCracken, Casement or even Hewitt anywhere in SF who understands at the gut level both unionism and militant republicanism and is capable of representing the one to the other with some elegance, let alone proposing some sort of equilibrium or even synthesis.
Posted by on May 25, 2007 @ 12:02 AM‘Fantastic analysis, there.’
Thanks Kensei glad you enjoyed it.
Let’s cut to the chase. Ms Anderson and her party were more than happy to blow up shoppers and shoot people in the back for decades. Eventually it dawned on them that actually they weren’t getting anywhere. Being a moral-free psychopath just wasn’t getting results.
So they plumped for the political option. And why not? If you can go on live TV and justify blowing up ten workmen in a minibus, you can damn well justify anything.
I watched both Catriona Rouane and Martina Anderson fronting it out for the party tonight and the smarm factor was up to 10. Ruane patiently explained why she couldn’t bring herself to utter the dreaded words Northern Ireland and why academic selection couldn’t be allowed to continue just because two thirds of parents wanted it. Anderson went for the world record use of the word Gregory in a conversation and patronised her opponent so much she almost got away with it—until that final moment.
My point is that SF hate Unionists enough to kill them—they did it for decades with no justification whatsoever. Now we’re supposed to accept that they’re our best friends despite their rabidly anti-Unionist actions and on-message slippage.
The fact is they’ve signed up to the principle of consent. That’s democracy for slow learners.
So apparently one of the great SF ideas for persauding Unionists to go for a UI is to appoint an IRA bomber as a ‘Unionist Outreach’ representative. Campbell’s reaction was depressing but predictable. This is going to run and run.Posted by on May 25, 2007 @ 12:10 AMIs there a reason SF choose those who have committed the most brutal of acts as their public representatives? Surely 21st century SF have enough “clean” Shinners to put in front of he TV cameras without resorting to those with a conviction for violent acts. Or have they a reason for puting up the likes of Anderson to engage with their unionist neighbours?
Posted by on May 25, 2007 @ 12:15 AMThe SF machine at work again,droppin the blonde bombshell (all puns intended).Thank God I’m out of Derry,I forgot about how pathetic a local politician Greg was.Anderson was hardly shining either but she came up like an academic against that raving eejit.Most of the DUP and the shinners know that neither side is going to get to sing “we won the war”,Big Ian knows it and Big Gerry knows it,so the thought of such a patheticly entrenched unionist like Campbell squeezing it out of Anderson (who is essentially a PR muscle of Sinn Fein) is daft beyond belief.The talks are all just a negotiation table for “saving face” on both sides.Greg can’t accept that his party’s stance has massively changed right under his nose and now big Ian’s probably just loving the fact that he can get on with the big boy business and use Greg as his little rottweiler to make sure no-one takes the OAP as an easy target.
Posted by on May 25, 2007 @ 12:17 AMGood spot Castro.
She was perfect up till then.
Martina Anderson, serious player. Intelligent.
Glad she’s not messing about under my car, you get a feeling she’d get the wiring right.Posted by on May 25, 2007 @ 12:20 AMI’m no fan of Campbell or his odious party but I found little to disagree with in what he said. Those praising Anderson confuse substance with form. The evidence that SF is engaged in outreach is the creation of an outreach sinecure, filled with one of the people least likely to be acceptable to unionists, whose job appears to be to go on television, speak to unionist politicians as if they were small retarded children and pretend to be deaf when any really difficult questions are asked, simply insisting repeatedly that everyone else is just as guilty of sectarian violence as she is.
Is that it or did I miss something?
Posted by on May 25, 2007 @ 02:34 AMChris,
I am not taking a swipe at you personally, but please do not come on slugger and express surprise that Mr Campbell is a rather nasty reactionary bigot. Remember your party proposed the likes of Campbell as first Minister and no matter what Gregory is like his master is the real McCoy.
Now as to sitting silent whilst a bigot like Campbell [or any other] spews his poison, shame on any shinner who does so. Your party are acting like middle class politicos who believe their own excreta does not stink and they have a god given right to rule over the working classes.
How are you going to win a single Protestant worker over to the republic is you do not challenge those who currently represent them in such a shameful manner. [do not forget there are thousands of Protestant who are ashamed of Campbell and his kind. Offer them an alternative and expose those who do not.]
It seems the SF leadership are afraid of up setting the political apple cart in the north and are only to keen to play the sectarian game as dictated by the UK government. The bigots in the DUP like Mr Campbell can represent without opposition or criticism the protestant community, whilst SF does the same in the nationalist community. It is as if the top NY mafia godfathers have divided the cake up, and the smaller out of state families must take their share or shut up.
Finally I would just say this, far from praising a republican for refusing to challenge a bigot whilst/after he spewed poison they should be sent back to the locality from whence they came to relearn their trade.
Posted by on May 25, 2007 @ 06:33 AMLike a lot of people on this site, i thought gregory was poor, but again agreed with most of what he said. although he did dodge the question about inflicting hurt on the nationalist community, which is extremely disapointing. I preferred Sir Reg’s stance were he openly admitted that wrongs were done on both side.
Anderson is one of the most condecending, pre-programmed spin doctors I’ve ever seen. I’m not sure if SF could have found anymone more inapppropriate to engage unionists - but no doubt that was the idea. The PUP should employ Micheal Stone as nationalist outreach officer, and we’ll how they all get on.
Posted by on May 25, 2007 @ 07:15 AMSF in Derry managed to buck the trend at the last election. They’ll keep pushing Anderson and McCartney but they’re both pretty poor. They’re just lucky Gregory is even worse. Durkan will be enjoying his breakfast.
Posted by on May 25, 2007 @ 07:37 AM
