Friday, March 07, 2008
Mairead Farrell a Trojan Horse?
Given how ridiculous the idea of celebrating Mairead Farrell at Stormont was, which even the most devoted Sinn Fein supporter had trouble getting their heads around as a great idea, was the whole thing a trojan horse to arrive at this destination instead, which has already had a test-run in Limavady?
SF may seek to ban unionist symbols at Stormont and SF anger over IRA commemoration ban
Or is that just a face-saving exercise after a spectacularly daft suggestion?
What do you think of the tactic of pursuing “neutral space” - is it worth the bother, does it have any true meaning, is it a whitewash, rather than a co-writing of, of a shared history, is it a petulant idea, or a responsible one? Is there a difference between a shared space and a neutral one? Does this have any relevance to ordinary people’s lives? Is it a chimera for real progress, much like the arguments over symbols on the PSNI’s caps or flags in City Hall closets were? Or is it the sort of groundwork that reflects progress?
Rusty Nail @ 09:57 AM
Neutral space is worth the bother. Nationalists and Republicans pay rates and taxes and deserve to have their culture and history represented as much as Unionist. Obviously a road to far for most Unionists so neutral space it has to be.
Of course the usual descension into whataboutery, wailing and gnashing of teeth will begin but there is a word perfectly made for such a situation, “TOUGH”
Posted by on Mar 07, 2008 @ 10:11 AMI would have thought the entire notion of Stormont as a neutral space is a bit of an oxymoron.
Posted by on Mar 07, 2008 @ 10:17 AMWhat symbols would be for the Provo chop I wonder? The inscription in the Senate commemorating the role the building played in the Second World War directing operations against their chums in the Third Reich? Or the memorials to the former Speaker and members they murdered?
Let battle commence. I trust we will see more unionist cajonies than were on display at either Limavady or Banbridge.
Posted by on Mar 07, 2008 @ 10:32 AMCouldn’t agree more with Bonar Law.Let battle commence. SF are giving Peter Robinson a real boost by pursuing this agenda.
Posted by on Mar 07, 2008 @ 10:40 AMNice to hear Jennifer McCann say last night that she would have no problem with, and no objection to, an event to celebrate the role of the SAS in NI. wonder what their victims think of that?
Posted by on Mar 07, 2008 @ 10:42 AMNothing like a good row between unionists and Sinn Féin over symbols to help Northern Ireland prepare itself for the challenges of a global economic slowdown and possible UK recession.
You couldn’t make this stuff up. If you think this is where the battle is, they still haven’t got it.
Posted by on Mar 07, 2008 @ 10:45 AMBonarLaw, it isn’t much of a battle, once an equality impact assessment is made it’s curtains for your cherished symbols.
Posted by on Mar 07, 2008 @ 10:46 AMWill Republicans demand Stormont itself is removed as many still see it as the main symbol of unionism in this country. The Carson statue would also have to come down. Heck even the location of Stormont is in a Unionist heartland. Obviously certain people won’t be happy till the MLA’s are sitting in the Dail.
I’m not a Republican nor am I Unionist, I’m a realist, however it would be fair to say that Farrell and the other IRA dead didn’t give their lives just so Beardy Adams and the crew could have a nice tea party in the Long Gallery just to retain the hardcore Republican vote. Stunts like this once again emphasise the lessons that the UUP and SDLP have already learned, you can’t please everyone in your perticular section of the electorate.
Posted by on Mar 07, 2008 @ 10:46 AMThe inscription in the Senate commemorating the role the building played in the Second World War directing operations against their chums in the Third Reich?
Odd grasp of history there considering the end of the Third Reich predated the birth of the ‘provos’ by a good 25 years. (Yes, I know Sean Russell died on a German submarine but as far as I am aware the IRA never actually signed a peace treaty with them , unlike the British government). Still I realise you’ve never let facts/dates etc get in the way of a good MOPE.
Maybe as compromise we could remove all references to our best known local Nazi sympathizer, Lord Londonderry, from Stormont.
Posted by on Mar 07, 2008 @ 10:58 AMPaul
“it’s curtains for your cherished symbols”
Interesting language, suggesting this is not about bogus “neutrality” but rather an anti-unionist purge.
As for your faith in Equality Impact Assessments, again we see the mask slipping. Unionism has long suspected the “equality” industry was being (I’ll be generous) unwittingly used to advance a Republican agenda. Now we know.
Posted by on Mar 07, 2008 @ 11:06 AMI wonder if SF refer this to the Equality Commission will they abide by the decision when the Equality Commission come back and tell them there are insufficient grounds to remove, for example, the statue of Carson.
Rusty, my immediate reaction was that the “Hero worship for mass murderer” at Stormont was a smokescreen for this all along. Now I think it may also have been a tactic to increase the profile of a certain west Belfast MLA.
Posted by on Mar 07, 2008 @ 11:07 AMDec
could you be more disingenuous?
Posted by on Mar 07, 2008 @ 11:09 AMNice to hear Jennifer McCann say last night that she would have no problem with, and no objection to, an event to celebrate the role of the SAS in NI. wonder what their victims think of that?
Posted by spiritof07 on Mar 07, 2008 @ 09:42 AM
By victims do you mean “IRA volunteers” who where fighting a “War against the British”? In a war soldiers kill each other you can’t cry that the other side isn’t playing fair.
Posted by on Mar 07, 2008 @ 11:14 AMInteresting language, suggesting this is not about bogus “neutrality” but rather an anti-unionist purge.
It would be difficult to remove Republican symbols from Stormont now wouldn’t it? Neutrality in Stormont could only mean removing Unionist symbols, in the same way that if you were making the Dail neutral you wouldn’t need to remove a whole lot of Unionist symbols.
As for your faith in Equality Impact Assessments, again we see the mask slipping. Unionism has long suspected the “equality” industry was being (I’ll be generous) unwittingly used to advance a Republican agenda. Now we know.
Because Paul said so? Again it’s simple - the Unionist dominated state surrounded itself with Unionist symbols - understandable really. Now for neutrality to be introduced the only symbols to remove are Unionist ones, this because of the simple fact that Republican symbols weren’t allowed. We all remember what happened when a tricolour was placed in the window of a building in the lower Falls in the mid 60s.
Posted by on Mar 07, 2008 @ 11:20 AMBonar, perhaps it’s time the Equality Commission, including its staff, was restructured. I understand that it doesn’t adequately reflect a cross-section of society here.
Posted by on Mar 07, 2008 @ 11:25 AMBTW I find it odd that on one hand republicans and their fellow travellers are demanding increased use of that most cherished nationalist symbol the Irish language whilst launching an ill-advised assault on unionism symbolism.
Posted by on Mar 07, 2008 @ 11:29 AMIf “shared spaces” and “equality” at Stormont mean parties for Provo “Activists” and Nationalists are happy for this type of representation then I would sooner have the whole f*cking assembly pulled down to be brutally honest because the whole peace process is obviously built on incompatability and lies.......
Posted by on Mar 07, 2008 @ 11:30 AMnmc, it should be possible to work towards a shared workspace rather than a bare or bland neutral one.
Also, the Athboy strategy was supposed to have been buried not reincarnated.
Posted by on Mar 07, 2008 @ 11:32 AM“nmc, it should be possible to work towards a shared workspace rather than a bare or bland neutral one.”
Of course it should, but it is Unionists we are dealing with here so don’t hold your breath, the above is the carrot, neutrality is the stick. Decisions decisions.
From a personal point of view I do quite enjoy watching Unionists in convulsions over these two choices.
Posted by on Mar 07, 2008 @ 11:49 AMTry to look at this and think outside the box for a moment.
Imagine what way the birds flying about and living around stormont would think of this if their brains had the capability of constructive thought.
We the pigeons, crows and all other avian residents of the Stormont estate, the symbol of Unionist domination or the symbol of Provo inspired power sharing, depending on which way you look at it.
Demand that statues of a Unionist identity are kept within in the grounds of this beautiful and historical establishment which is an important part of our heritage. We further demand that due to a change, known as equality in the political climate and a shortage of living space and social or socially affordable perching spots that extra statues incorporating a Nationalist/Republican identity are installed through out the grounds.
If an agreement can’t be reached then we suggest that all statues are removed and the vacated sights planted with trees. Which could be enjoyed by all.
After all we have no political axe to grind, we fully believe in equality as we reserve the rights bestowed on us by Mother Nature, to shite on all statues and symbols regardless of their perceived political affiliation.
Lastly we demand that those residents who live around here keep their bastard cats under control or we may be left with no other option but to take some retaliatory action.
Signed
Seamus SparrowBilly Black Bird
Posted by on Mar 07, 2008 @ 11:49 AMconsidering the huge success SF have had in removing symbols of unionist domination in council chambers across the north.. i wouldnt hold my breath at the party being able to remove any of the symbols, statues etc in the stormont building.
the failure of sf to secure the use of the long gallery (regardless if it was an appropiate place to commemorate vol. farrell) indicates quite clearly who is in charge in stormont.
gerry mc hugh was correct. the Unionists still pull the strings there. and SF can do nothing about it.
that is despite the guff preached by the MLAs to the head scratching cumann members that SF are equal partners in government.
they cannot use a certain room in stormont because the DUP wont let them, yet we are expected to believe that somehow, by some miracle, that SF can engineer an United Ireland using the vehicle of stormont.
i dont think so.
Posted by on Mar 07, 2008 @ 11:50 AMNevin - good points you make. Maybe the Equality Commission should take a good look at itself before it allows itself to be used as a sock puppet of SF’s anti-unionist agenda. The problem SF have is that the Union still exists - they failed to break it down and are now administering it instead, so they’ll go for second best and try to remove any reminders of it. Heck, we know they’d be happier if nobody even said the words ‘Northern Ireland’ up there. You have to ask why they were so keen to go into the government of the place in the first place. An SF FM, should that ever happen, will be a fascinating thing to behold.
Posted by on Mar 07, 2008 @ 11:51 AMI couldn’t agree more Nevin. I would like to see people respect each other’s culture as opposed to demanding all culture removed. I feel that this commemeration business has been concocted in an attempt to bring the symbolism argument to a head, I feel it is highly unlikely that SF thought that they would get to hold this commemeration in the long gallery.
I feel that in todays nanny state of politically correct, equality based, qualified speech that those Unionists above saying let battle commence may end up having their eyes opened.
Posted by on Mar 07, 2008 @ 11:57 AMPaul
“neutrality is the stick”
Is it now?
This unionist in not in a convulsion just looking forward to the debate about how state symbols are somehow incompatible with a set of political accomadations grounded on acceptance of that state.
BTW the Union Flags will be flying over Stormont on 10th March and 17th March pursuant to the Flags Regulations 2000. How will your cherished “Equality” Impact Assessmnent deal with those regulations and the Order under which they were made?
Posted by on Mar 07, 2008 @ 12:00 PMcould you be more disingenuous?
Could you go one day without invoking Godwin’s Law?
Posted by on Mar 07, 2008 @ 12:01 PM
