Wednesday, August 09, 2006
judgement has to be made..
I was disappointed [but not that surprised? - Ed] to see Eamonn McCann, regular Belfast Telegraph columnist and occasional election candidate, in the middle of this particular story. After a long running campaign repeatedly failed to achieve its aim of forcing prominent American company Raytheon to leave his beloved Maiden City - and take their software engineering jobs with them - today he and 8 others resorted to violence, stormed the offices, threw computer equipment and documents from a first storey window and were subsequently arrested. There’s a video report there too. The Belfast Telegraph has some quotes from earlier in the day. Update The 9 have been charged with aggravated burglary with intent to cause unlawful damage and unlawful assembly - BBC report - and remanded in custody until 7 September. More 8 of the 9 men are released on bail
From the Belfast Telegraph.. it’s not clear whether the flag was already in the office, or if the self-appointed judges brought it with them.
An American flag was also set alight and a glass door smashed as debris rained down from a second floor window and littered the area outside.
A banner was unfurled from inside the building, reading: “Raytheon has been decommissioned”.
A dozen more people protesting over the deaths of Lebanese civilians remained outside, with placards bearing anti-war and anti-Raytheon slogans.
Speaking from inside, as dozens of uniformed police gathered, Mr McCann said: “The people of Derry cannot go on feeling shock and horror as they watch TV screens and do nothing,
“I certainly would not welcome an arrest and prosecution, who would? But judgment has to be made. People felt they had no option but to take this form of direct action.”
Eamonn may not welcome arrest, but that’s what he got… the prosecution, for trespass and criminal damage I’d guess, should now follow. It’s worth noting the attempt to frame this within the context of what’s happening in Lebanon now… despite fact that the same group was lobbying Derry City Council to force Raytheon out of the city three years ago
Pete Baker @ 05:45 PM
I don’t share your disappointment on this issue, Pete -surely the direct action taken by the protesters can be justified within the context of the immeasurable violence that american military might has inflicted on so many nations.
Rathteon is part of the american killing machine which provides immense military support to Israel. Direct action may not always be the right course of action but against the backdrop of the carnage inflicted on innocent lebanese civilians, I say fair play to McCann and Co.Posted by on Aug 09, 2006 @ 07:25 PMtra g
The issue of Lebanon has simply been tacked on to provide convenient, and emotionally-driven, cover for the thuggery on display today. As I pointed out in the original post, there has been a long running campaign against this company - a company which is not breaking any laws - and a campaign which failed to achieve its aims.
What we’re left with is self-appointed arbiters of what companies are ‘good’ and what companies are ‘bad’.. a self-appointed group who have resorted to violence when they didn’t get their own way.
You did read about the fire-bombing of stores in Newry this morning?
Posted by on Aug 09, 2006 @ 07:33 PMTra g,
I’m vehemently opposed to my government’s actions in the Middle East, becoming more sickened every night as i watch the ‘world’ news.
That said, the minute McCann stormed Raytheon’s office, he lost credibility. He used violence—though admittedly nothing compared to the US’s aggressions—to argue his case against violence.
Had the demonstration remained outside, with the right ‘stunts’, his case would have been much stronger.
Posted by on Aug 09, 2006 @ 07:36 PMMcCann is a vandal, and a gobshite . He should have left his demonstration outside .
OBviously this is part of McCann’s strategy to encourage American investment in Derry ? :(
How many jobs have McCann and his ilk created in Derry ?
Nothing that McCann and his bunch of outdated loonies of the left do in Derry will have any impact on the tragedy of the Lebanon . McCann should take a plane to Tel Aviv and demonstrate against the war somewhere close to the Wailing Wall . Now that would require courage !
Posted by on Aug 09, 2006 @ 07:50 PMPete, your clumsy linking of the Derry protest to the Newry fire bombs is tenuous in the extreme and smacks of nothing more than sanctimonious claptrap.
To borrow your own words, you have tacked on the issue of the Newry incendiary devices to provide convenient and emotionally driven cover for your mock outrage at McCann’s temerity in taking the action that he did
Better that than spending half your life on this forum talking pointless guff as you do.
Posted by on Aug 09, 2006 @ 07:50 PMOf course it’s tenuous, tra g, that was partly the point - to mirror the tenuousness of McCann’s, and your, claims.
But it does represent the extreme end of how violence is used by similarly self-appointed groups who can’t get their own way through any other means.
Posted by on Aug 09, 2006 @ 07:56 PMSpare a thought for the moral courage of a group of people who are prepared to risk prosecution and possible imprisonment because of their political and ethical beliefs.
Posted by on Aug 09, 2006 @ 08:04 PMMcCann’s action on this occasion is deplored by some here as an act of “violence” and “thuggery”.
Possibly. Rather less an act of violence or thuggery I would have thought than the continuous acts of violence and thuggery that is visited upon unsuspecting innocents through the deployment of the weapons delivery systems for which Raytheon depends in order to maintain its rate of profit.I appreciate that some here are convinced of the moral primacy of profit (they really mean rate of profit) before people. I happen to think that they are misguided.
For that reason, and for admiration of his willingness to openly confront the giants of violence and the legal system that permits them to thrive and for his willingness to suffer the penalty, I support him.
Well done, Eamonn. Spike Lee said it in his movie title - “Do the Right Thing”. You gone and done it, dawg!
Posted by on Aug 09, 2006 @ 08:10 PMAmy Lee: Spare a thought for the moral courage of a group of people who are prepared to risk prosecution and possible imprisonment because of their political and ethical beliefs.
Well, that’s the essence of Civil Disobedience, though the significant amount of criminal damage in this instance is OTT. However - Civil Disobedience is just a means of highlighting issues - it doesn’t trump Parliament, and its practitioners presumably accept the price of bucking democracy.
Posted by on Aug 09, 2006 @ 08:11 PMWell said Rory, and I reckon if you look at the case of the protestors in Shannon who damaged the plane and the action taken at Prestwick yestarday , that put McCann and co in front of a jury of their peers here and they will acquit. Some peace dividend for Northern Ireland that as our violenc stops we are prepared to nurture both the homegrown weapons manufacturers as well as the international variety. Who cares about death and destruction being rained down overseas as long as we have a few previous jobs here. I often wondered givn the support given to the weapons industry here why noone suggested as a solution to the decommissioning of paramilitary weapons that we sell them off to the highest overseas bidder, perferably those with the worst record of human rights abuses. Perhaps that’s what did happen and I can’t see how it would be any worse than what Raytheon, Thales, Shorts etc are engaging in.
Posted by on Aug 09, 2006 @ 08:18 PMWhy don’t this pathetic little group of left wing Castro worshippers get a plane ticket to Tehran and protest at the offices of the missisle makers whose weapons are raining down on northern Israel just for a bit of balance. As a matter of fact I would totally back Derry DHSS if they decided to pay for it.
Posted by on Aug 09, 2006 @ 08:20 PMHow do you know they are Castro worshippers? And why don’t you go to Tehran? Just because it is impossible for people to take direct action in all circumstances doens’t mean that they should’not take it on those occasions they can
Posted by on Aug 09, 2006 @ 08:28 PMCongratulations to all involved. The anti-war movement needs more actions like this and those at Prestwick and Shannon to confront those who profit from and perpetuate the slaughter in the Middle East.
Posted by on Aug 09, 2006 @ 08:30 PMMicheal*Congratulations to all involved. The anti-war movement needs more actions like this and those at Prestwick and Shannon to confront those who profit from and perpetuate the slaughter in the Middle East. *
I couldn’t agree more. Well done to those involved.
Posted by on Aug 09, 2006 @ 08:33 PMMr John Hume MP said ``I am very encouraged by this initiative from Raytheon. The company has recognised that the dividend from peace is still flourishing. Raytheon has confidence in Northern Ireland as do many other companies.’‘
Posted by on Aug 09, 2006 @ 08:41 PMNevin
I remember this. Just goes to prove how parochial John Hume is and was in his political outlook. Opposed to “retail ” terrorism but less so with the ” wholesale ” variety
Posted by on Aug 09, 2006 @ 08:43 PMAbsolutely disgraceful behaviour from the anti-everything mob. How do McCann and his fellow thugs propose to put food on the tables of the employees of this company wjhen they move to an more welcoming environment?
Greenflag “McCann should take a plane to Tel Aviv and demonstrate against the war somewhere close to the Wailing Wall . Now that would require courage !”
Not to mention the gift of bi-location, the Wailing Wall is over 40 miles from Tel Aviv. Flying into Jerusalem might make more sense!
Posted by on Aug 09, 2006 @ 08:54 PMPete,
I despair of you some times, there Mccann is in his 60s and he makes you look like an old git of 90 who does nothing but moan, with your nasty attempt to link this protest to the bombs in Newry and your daft talk about thuggery.[Red card for old Pete Mick, for playing the man not the ball, only joking]
If people are prepared to take the consequences of their actions, then in a democracy peaceful direct action is not only perfectly acceptable but has a noble tradition. Have you ever protested against anything the powers that be have not first sanctioned Pete. If we had all waited for the likes of you, there would be no civil rights etc in the UK or RoI.
As to this being a long running campaign, well if this company is providing systems that are being used in Lebanon, then it proves to me it was a campaign worth supporting. Thanks for bringing it to our attention Pete.
We seem to increasingly live in a world were the protection of property is held above the protection of human beings. It is not rocket science to work out why this has become so, I would suggest the increasing gap between the haves and have nots might be something to do with it.
By the way Pete, that was a real snide trick linking McCanns protest with his employer, why not go the whole hog and send an email to the BT and tell them what a naughty boy Eamon has been. Despite our differences I never had you down as an apprentice tout.
Posted by on Aug 09, 2006 @ 08:56 PMI’ve no problem with taking over the office for a while. But destroying the computers and throwing the files out the window is childish, and makes the protestors look that way.
As for companies like Shorts which are involved in the arms trade, my personal position is that these companies may as well be providing jobs for NI workers as workers in foreign countries, and so wouldn’t want to see them leave.
Posted by on Aug 09, 2006 @ 09:04 PMMick H
“Despite our differences I never had you down as an apprentice tout.”
If you’d bothered to read the original post, Mick - and the linked reports - before typing your response, you’d have realised that the Belfast Telegraph report on today’s thuggish display is also linked - No apology necessary.
In case the point has been missed, or ignored - protest is fine, even by self-appointed groups sitting in judgement on others.. But today’s events went beyond protest.. by a long way.
Posted by on Aug 09, 2006 @ 09:05 PMOh, Garibaldy, how could you say what you just did above?
I shall now forever think of you as the kinda guy who irons a crease in his jeans before he goes out in public.
Nothing wrong with that of course, but…..
Posted by on Aug 09, 2006 @ 09:15 PMRory,
I don’t know how an iron works. I’ve no objection to damaging US air force planes etc, nor if there were missiles being made here as is often claimed (erroneously) to them being damaged, but come on. Throwing computers and documents out windows? Looks ridiculous. This is a matter of what is best for getting the message of the protest across, and convincing people of your argument. In other words, of tactics not principles. And these tactics were wrong.
Posted by on Aug 09, 2006 @ 09:29 PM‘But destroying the computers and throwing the files out the window is childish, and makes the protestors look that way. ‘
Just like the Shannon ‘gobshites’. You can protest against the Iraq or Israeli /Hezbollah Lebanese war without having to act the hooligan .
Posted by on Aug 09, 2006 @ 09:49 PMI hope the Belfast Telegraph are tonight reviewing McCann’s position and will be sacking him in the morning.
A truly disgraceful episode today.Posted by on Aug 09, 2006 @ 09:54 PMYou can protest against the Iraq or Israeli /Hezbollah Lebanese war without having to act the hooligan .
I suppose the USA and UK could have used the UN process to peacefully protest their objections to the Iraq government. Using guided missiles against civilians just seemed so much more glamourously principled i.e. a greater rate of interest would be available on whatever principle investors in such as Raytheon were hoping for.
Oh, and for all you poor souls salivating at the idea of McCann being sacked (sacking a man - second best thing to a lynchin’ - ain’t that right boys?) I don’t think you really understand, do you? The concept of undertaking a principled action where the consequences would most likely result in your own discomfort and to your own econmomic detriment simply has never crossed your mind, has it?
You really are missing out on the best things in life, guys.
Posted by on Aug 09, 2006 @ 10:18 PM
