Thursday, January 25, 2007
It’s Londonderry - Official
The Derry City Council legal challenge to the use of Londonderry as the city’s official name has been rejected. The High Court has ruled the renaming of the Council 23 years ago did not change the city’s official name, granted in 1613.
Fair Deal @ 02:54 PM
Was Doire to begin with....... This is were the debate should have centered.
Posted by on Jan 25, 2007 @ 04:25 PMI wouldn’t be getting to excited about this. Its only the first step in the process. This case was always about establishing the official name of the city, not getting it changed.
So now that we’ve found out the name, it can now be changed.
Posted by on Jan 25, 2007 @ 04:27 PM‘ wouldn’t be getting to excited about this. Its only the first step in the process. This case was always about establishing the official name of the city, not getting it changed.
So now that we’ve found out the name, it can now be changed’
Sorry i’m still drying my pants from the above LOL.
I have a picture of all these folk wondering around not knowing where they are (offcially)!!!Get a life and start Disrepecting others not trying to annililate.
I mean now that we all support the police accept partition, Stormont, etc This debate is SO last century
Posted by on Jan 25, 2007 @ 04:30 PMsorry stop disrepecting - too many tears
Posted by on Jan 25, 2007 @ 04:31 PMin the interest of respect for traditions and history, i wonder will nationalists/republicans and the southern government now honour the name Londonderry? i doubt it. they are unable to accept anything that could link ireland with its british history. pathetic really that people are so biter that they cant bring themselves to say the word London....
how ridiculous would it be if councilors in belfast wanted to change the name of the dublin road to something else because it had the word Dublin in it? thats how stupid the Londonderry thing is.
its unbelievable how a group of adults can behave in such a childish petty way.
Posted by on Jan 25, 2007 @ 04:33 PMIn the spirit of fairness and equality, why not a compromise name like “London-Doire” ? This would recognise both traditions and languages and would not alter the pronunciation.
This should not be a zero-sum-game, i.e. always a winner and a loser. Still, I can see people complaining about the London bit being first…
Posted by on Jan 25, 2007 @ 04:33 PMCan someone correct me if I’m wrong here. As I remember this case wasn’t actually brought forward to change the name but the Council were advised by the DOE to get a ruling as the first step in the process of changing the name.
Posted by on Jan 25, 2007 @ 04:39 PMIt seems to escape Republican’s notice that the name they are so intent on is English anyway.
Had James got the better of William they would now be left with no Gaelic culture.
The Glorious Deliverance.....for all......pity some are too blind and ignorant to see.
VVV.
Posted by on Jan 25, 2007 @ 04:40 PMAnd wait till they learn that Gordon’s promised Peter that Walker’s column will be put back up. And made out of marble. And crowned with sour grapes, made of gold, taken from the benefit cheques of Derry. But just to ask one more time, much in the spirit of the Supergran theme tune: the DUP, is there nothin’ they cannae do?
Posted by on Jan 25, 2007 @ 04:40 PMI recall from my National school days in the west of Ireland back in the 1970s that the governmant-approved school atlas (published by Folens I believe) marked the town as “Londonderry”, though of course everybody spoke of Derry.
It is only this very year that the same Folens decided to drop the term “British Isles” from their atlas due to some people finding the term “confusing and objectionable”
Posted by on Jan 25, 2007 @ 04:46 PM‘...i wonder will nationalists/republicans and the southern government now honour the name Londonderry?’
Ah, no. Next question?
Posted by on Jan 25, 2007 @ 04:52 PMThe best rule of thumb is, when talking to unionists call it Derry, when talking to nationalists call it Londonderry. Then you can do a check to see how good everyone is at tolerance!
Posted by on Jan 25, 2007 @ 04:55 PMThe old name game poses an interesting dilemma.
My Dad is a born and bred Derry Catholic, my wife a Londonderry protestant of planter stock. I can’t see why either tradition needs to be airbrushed from the city’s long history.
I accept that the treatment of Derry during most of the history of NI is not one which covers Unionism in any glory, but likewise the city’s polarisation and the casual sectarianism of too many of my catholic Derry born friends who regard their protestant neighbours as a dis-functional subspecies (all of whom are apparently related to Gregory Campbell) is surely equally worthy of challenge.
It seems that this a sleeping dog best left alone. If you want to call it Derry in day to day terms fine (I do) if you choose to call it Londonderry ok.
Finally as so often in this blog a little less triumphalism and a little more conversation might do us all good.
Posted by on Jan 25, 2007 @ 04:56 PMHow about some sort of hedging mechanism - call it Londonderry in a united Ireland and Derry while NI is still in the UK?
Posted by on Jan 25, 2007 @ 05:01 PMall related to gregory campbell????? are there some legendary nocturnal activities that we should all know about ??? do tell ! :D
Posted by on Jan 25, 2007 @ 05:03 PMThey breed like rabbits, you know, it’s in their religion.
But if you treat them properly they’ll start to behave like catholics.
Posted by on Jan 25, 2007 @ 05:08 PMGoodness i was of the opinion that ‘their religion’ explained to them what a pack of Durex looks like!
“How about some sort of hedging mechanism - call it Londonderry in a united Ireland and Derry while NI is still in the UK?”
Best point iv heard all day haha buy that man a pint
Posted by on Jan 25, 2007 @ 05:19 PMThis is a compromise that others have suggested many times and it always struck me as a good one: why not retain the name Londonderry for the part of the city within the walls (ie the “Londonderry” established by the London guilds) but change the name of the city overall to Derry, in accordance with the wishes of most people who live there, and in accordance with the practice of virtually everyone?
Or, given that the only way to effect change is by petitioning Her Majesty or her government, how about just long-fingering it for ten or fifteen years, at which point the government of the newly reunified Ireland can discuss the issue?
Posted by on Jan 25, 2007 @ 05:24 PMi agree with billy. everyone call it Londonderry until there is a united ireland :)
Posted by on Jan 25, 2007 @ 05:30 PMWhatever the resolution is, the majority from both traitions who live there, or come from there must be happy with it, and sign something to that effect so that the issue can be laid to rest. It should happen regardless of partition or reunification or independence or whatever the bigger political situation is.
Posted by on Jan 25, 2007 @ 05:40 PMCuriosity gets the better of me on one question: why are the Apprentice Boys called “The Apprentice Boys of DERRY” and not “The Apprentice Boys of Londonderry” ? The siege of Derry (1688-1689) happened well after the James’ charter was granted (1613)
Posted by on Jan 25, 2007 @ 05:41 PMA phyrric victory for the Orangeman. Its time for plan B. Lets get rid of the Orange death machine once and for all, for the people of derry and the rest of the 6 counties.
Just think of all the paint the signwriters will save, all the ink in correspondence and all the time people will save not saying or writing that London nonsense.
Londonderry is inefficient. THEY WOULD NEVER TOLERATE THIS NONSENSE IN DEUTSCHLAND!! Has the Queen forgotten her German roots? Are the real huns the Catholics of Derry?? Very confusing all of this I am sure many will agree.
The sick mind of the Orangeman may be in overdrive at the moment, thinking that Ulster has been spared her darkest hour of final and irrevokable damnation yet again. But his dastardly plans will not succeed. This was only a fact finding mission. Reconnaisance before the great battle for righteousness. We shall walk in the path of the light once again.
Posted by on Jan 25, 2007 @ 05:59 PMeranu,
‘I wonder will nationalists/republicans and the southern government now honour the name Londonderry? i doubt it.they are unable to accept anything that could link ireland with its british history.’
Really ? Then why do we Dubliners have an Aston Quay, Annesley Bridge , Aberdeen St, Adelaide Road , Alexandra Basin , Bedord Row ,Buckingham St,Bolton St, Bow St, Britain Quay, Capel St, Chancery Lane, Place and Street Charlotte Quay/Street/Way , Chatham St (named after William Pitt son of first Earl of Chatham ) , Chesterfield Avenue , Dorset St , Wilton Terrace , Gloucester St etc etc etc etc and hundreds of other street names with ‘british’ connections ???
Seems to me that if people are not bothered by a particular name then it makes sense to leave well enough alone . If the vast majority of the people of the city want it to be called Derry then that’s what it should be called.
Posted by on Jan 25, 2007 @ 06:16 PMJust face it lads, you lost this one.....
Posted by on Jan 25, 2007 @ 06:36 PMThe following is a quote from “ Inishowen: Its History, Traditions, And Antiquities” by Maghtochair; published in 1867.
According to an “inquisition taken in Derry in the seventh year of the reign of James I.,” parts of Derry belong to Inishowen, Co Donegal and everything else belongs to Co. Londonderry.“Inishowen’s “ northern shore is the Atlantic Ocean; Lough Foyle forms its eastern boundary, and Lough Swilly its western. It is connected with the mainland on the south, and is, therefore, not an inis, or island, as its name implies, but a peninsula. …
Regarding its southern boundary we learn, by the Ordnance Survey that, ‘ about half the parish of Templemore, or what is generally called the northern liberties of Londonderry, was compromised in Inishowen, before the formation of the County of Londonderry, as is evident from an inquisition taken in Derry in the seventh year of the reign of James I., from which it appears that a jury composed of resident English and ancient Irish natives, of the principal septs of the district, ‘did upon their oaths find and present that the auncient and knowne meares of the country of Inishowen, alias O’Dogherties countrey, to the south and south-east, are and have been, tyme out of mynde, as followeth, viz., from the part or branch of Lough Swilly, on the weste and south-west parte of Birt, thorough the midst of a bog which extendeth to Lough Lappan from a well or spring upon Mullaghknockemona, and from the topp of that mountayne the meare extended through a small bog, which runneth alonge the top of the hill of Ardenemahill, and soe to the top of the hill Knockenagh, upon the easte part of which hill ariseth the streame of Altbally M’Rowertie, which runneth a meare betweene Bally Mac Rowertie in Inishowen, and parte of the landes of the Derry and Garrowgarle to the cawsy under Ellogh, and so down thorough the bog to Lough Swilly, and from the foresaid cawsy the meare of Inishowen aforesaid is thorough the midst of the Bog to Lough Foile.”
Posted by on Jan 25, 2007 @ 06:49 PM
