Saturday, March 29, 2008
Flag wars in Kilrea
I was brought up quite near Kilrea which contrary to some people’s views is not actually noted for particularly good community relations. The latest problem has been the “tit for tat” flying of flags. Apparently this episode began when the Irish tricolour was raised over the St Patrick’s Church of Ireland church on Easter Sunday. As some form of “retaliation” the Union flag was then raised over the Marion Hall in the town.
This unpleasant silliness has been condemned by both Olive Church the local UUP councillor who is a member of St. Patrick’s CoI and John Dallat the SDLP MLA. I am slightly disappointed to see, however, that Dallat described the misuse of the Union flag as a sectarian desecration (which I entirely agree with) but seemed not to use the term sectarian when describing flying the tricolour over St. Patrick’s. Overall I thought his condemnation of the attack on the CoI was less fulsome than that on the Marion Hall. Maybe I am being too sensitive.
Turgon @ 12:37 AM
Im not entirely sure of your view on the flying of flags Turgon, but the use of them as proxy weapons is childish. I do believe in equality as regards areas designated as ‘shared space’, but tit for tat, or posting them on any available street lamp is akin to a dog takin a piss. There is little which annoys me more than the sight of a tattered and torn tricolour left to rot in the wind, whilst the sight of any union jack hurts my eyes....joking (or am i?)
If a flag goes up in the morning, it should come down before sunset, it seems laziness grabs these paitriots in the last half of this endeavour.Posted by on Mar 29, 2008 @ 12:57 AMRS,
That is an interesting point. A long time ago I heard that it was considered disrespectful to fly a flag after the sun had set. Clearly Northern Ireland seems not to accept this. If so do other countries have this convention?Posted by on Mar 29, 2008 @ 01:01 AMPure sectarianism. Which of course doesn’t actually exist, except in so far as it is the other side. Or a group of kids. And all the other excuses.
These people should be charged with incitement to hatred if they are caught.Posted by on Mar 29, 2008 @ 01:02 AMGotta agree with Gari, pure sectarianism.
But the fact churches have flag poles to fly them from and can have a flag that doesn’t suit their religion is also an indictment of their own contribution to sectarianism.
Posted by on Mar 29, 2008 @ 01:07 AMI think flagging from Orangies is more fun when there is snow and ice, nothing quite like a chum sliding off a Jaffa Hall to provoke giggles amongst his loyal crew.
If the tricolor was about the steeple top, I suggest it was a brave enough effort.
I think it is digusting that some black hearted eejit would stick a union flag of all things on a Marion hall, it just shows what pratistants are capable of.
Posted by on Mar 29, 2008 @ 01:11 AM“I thought his condemnation of the attack on the CoI was less fulsome than that on the Marion Hall.”
Fulsome means insincere/weak. So you are saying that Dallat was sincere when criticising the attack on CoI and weak when condemning the Marion Hall? Or are you misusing the word?
Posted by on Mar 29, 2008 @ 01:14 AMTurgon in the military (you know those boys who actually get paid for soldiering) the flag is raised in the morning and lowered before sunset. Because if it is not lowered before sunset, its akin to playin a tape of your national anthem and then walking out of the room so you can’t hear it, in other words, disrespectful.
Mark???
‘and can have a flag that doesn’t suit their religion’im not sure we in the west have national flags to suit a religion....you wanna be headin east a good bit to find those.
Posted by on Mar 29, 2008 @ 01:16 AMWhy is it anyone’s business what flags a church or a “Marion Hall” (whatever that is) fly? Unless the flags depict tentacle porn or something, who cares and why does everyone feel they have to stick their oar in?
Ireland and the UK are friendly, neighbouring nations and members in good standing of the international community. It takes a unique brand of hysterical provincial paranoia to get lathered up about “unpleasant silliness” about some displaying the flag of one such on their own private property.
Posted by on Mar 29, 2008 @ 01:25 AMI agree that the churches have their own guilt on promoting sectarianism. I hadn’t thought that the churches might have flagpoles, and had assumed they were stuck on the buildings themselves. As I’ve seen before.
Posted by on Mar 29, 2008 @ 01:27 AMslug,
where did you get this definition of fulsome from????
Posted by on Mar 29, 2008 @ 01:29 AMben,
I think with respect you misunderstand. In this case the Union flag was flown over a building owned by the RC church (clearly offensive and sectarian to the RC community) in supposed retaliation for a tricolour being flown over a CoI church (again offensive and sectarian to the Protestant community). It is the use of flags not to mark one’s own territory (problematic as that sometimes is) but to antagonise the other community by flying them over their property which is the issue here.Posted by on Mar 29, 2008 @ 01:31 AM“I hadn’t thought that the churches might have flagpoles, and had assumed they were stuck on the buildings themselves. As I’ve seen before.”
They don’t all have flag poles. They once needed them for Empire Day & etc. Irishman Lord Meath was the founder of the Empire Movement.
Posted by on Mar 29, 2008 @ 01:36 AM“think with respect you misunderstand. In this case the Union flag was flown over a building owned by the RC church (clearly offensive and sectarian to the RC community”
The ‘RC” moniker can also be slightly off-putting. We are not Roman in the sense of a city, we were the state religion of Rome.
We are therefore just ‘Catholics’.
The last surviving office of the (eastern) imperium is by the way the office of the (Roman) Patriarch at Constantinople.
G.
Posted by on Mar 29, 2008 @ 01:42 AMDo Canadians still do Victoria day on the original (Empire Day) date?
Posted by on Mar 29, 2008 @ 01:46 AM“However, no independent evidence has emerged to support O’Rawe’s suggestion that the IRA leadership deliberately prolonged the hunger strike for political advantage for the movement outside. O’Rawe’s cell-mate does not believe that hunger strikers were allowed to die in order to maximise electoral support.”
Posted by on Mar 29, 2008 @ 02:15 AMGari
We mostly call it May long weekend/ 24 weekend and lastly victoria dayits considered the first weekend of the summer and a large percentage of the population goes camping / cottaging and we drink ourselves stupid
its the third Monday in May
Posted by on Mar 29, 2008 @ 02:21 AM“its the third Monday in May”
That’s the last Monday before the 24th of May.
relic of Empire Day in your case. The date in the UK was changed to HM birdday (official) and then to March sometime. Commonwealth day etc.
24th of May was Empire Day as per the Empire Movement. It wasn’t that bad a deal, it was just little kids and parades.
It was an easy target for PC types. In ULster the OO stuff would have been to the fore.
Empire Day Parade - AOL VideoThe whole Empire Day parade from 2004 or 2005. To mark British Empire Day, the Orange Order in Lisburn and Dunmurry districts combine for a parade, ma…
Maybe they still do it.
They have so darn many parades it is impossible to keep track. One doesn’t stop to ask “what’s this one for me auld Jaffa”
G.
Posted by on Mar 29, 2008 @ 02:42 AMIn Canada its really just an excuse to take a long week end
Our population is not largely from the western european archipeligo ant more so we are hardly going to celebrate “empire”
I personally could trace 3/4’s of my ancestory to the archipeligo but my last name doesnt fit
I truly am CANADIAN a mutt, a halfbreed and free of vestigial loyalty
Posted by on Mar 29, 2008 @ 03:31 AMI got the blame for Pettigrew’s chauffeur thing.
‘Pettigrew’s staff says that driver Bruno Labonté has “some responsibilities that are not on his official job description.” ‘
I just happened to be targeting him at the moment with the same journalists. I was doing organized crime and exotic dancer visas.
So most Canadians are not European. Are you sure?
G.
Posted by on Mar 29, 2008 @ 04:22 AMI also queered up the girls in the Dominican Republic relating to Judy Sgro.
The House of Lancaster’s attempts to source from outside Romania, a cartel had that.
Posted by on Mar 29, 2008 @ 04:29 AMSteve,
I really hope that cottaging has a different meaning in Canada than it does in the United Kingdom!Posted by on Mar 29, 2008 @ 09:27 AMThe raising of the tricolour over the church of Ireland seems to have been done following the AOH Parade in Draperstown which commemorated the Feast of St. Patrick.
Posted by on Mar 29, 2008 @ 12:28 PMTurgon: The link you gave is only to the Anglican church, not to any story of a tricolour flying on it. The Anglican Church is the British military at prayer. Although you support these invaders, you should not try to warp the facts. Sectarian baiting is the Protestant “culture”. No point denying it.
Posted by on Mar 29, 2008 @ 03:20 PMThere was no easily accessible picture link for the Marion Hall so I could not include it. I think the CoI in Kilrea is a very attractive building. It looks even better seen from the centre of the town. I decided to include a link of the picture because I like the building.
Posted by on Mar 29, 2008 @ 04:08 PMI’m against national, flags on or in churches,
IMO it’s about your affiliation with God, not your political or national affiliations.
“Sectarian baiting is the Protestant “culture”.”
What are you on about? are you saying that the culture of the reformed churches across the whole world is based on ‘baiting’?
Posted by on Mar 29, 2008 @ 04:13 PM
