Wednesday, April 05, 2006
Donaldson: a simple execution
The London Independent’s Ireland correspondent is in no doubt, that this was a quinntessential killing of an informer in the time honoured, if ghastly, way.
There is no mystery about why he was killed, since the IRA makes no secret of its hatred and contempt for informers and agents in its ranks. Republican organisations have killed many over the centuries, including scores in recent decades. But the question is exactly who killed him and whether his assassination was sanctioned by the IRA leadership. The answer will determine the immediate political future of Northern Ireland.
The killing sent major tremors coursing through the Irish peace process, since if the IRA is judged to have been responsible this phase of the process will come to a halt. The IRA declared last night that it had “no involvement whatsoever” in the killing, an assertion which will now be thoroughly tested by police on both sides of the border.
He spoke to the Sunday World journalist who interviewed Donaldson a few weeks back:
The journalist Hugh Jordan, who found Donaldson in Donegal, said last night that he did not think the informer believed his life was in danger. He said: “He looked like a hunted animal. He was extremely depressed. The nerves in his eyes were trembling. He seemed like a man who didn’t think he would come to any harm. He did not see his life to be in any danger, but felt the only future he had was where he was, living in that dreadfully squalid situation.
Mick Fealty @ 12:39 AM
“Individual provisional repuiblicans, or even leaders could simply decide to bump Donaldson off then deny, deny, deny.”
There is of course the possibility that some individual connected to whomever - including an individual within PIRA - might have had an axe to grind with Donaldson. After all, it’s fair to assume that over the years DD was directly involved in the deaths and imprisonments of many of his former comrades. There must be a lot of guys out there who suspected DD of being responsible for the death of their friends / fifteen years in Long Kesh etc.
So that’s certainly a possibility, in terms of motive. Finding Donaldson’s location would certainly be possible to anyone looking for him with any kind of tenacity, especially after the Sunday World disclosed his general locale.
But if it WERE a mainstream, peace process republican, it would have to be one who considered the political devastation worth it. Twelve years after the first IRA ceasefire, it’s possible that some enraged volunteer was willing to jeopardise it all over Donaldson, but it seems less likely than the dissident/security agent scenarios.
But if it WAS a freelance operation from within PIRA, what do you think the political ramifications ought to be?
“It’s worked well for them in the past. All SF has to do essentially is say “nothing to do with us squire” then sit tight and eventually it all blows over.”
I’d have to disagree with this very strongly. Throughout the peace process, events have taken place at remarkably inconvenient times for the republican peace strategy (Northern Bank and McCartney after the failed Dec 04 deal, Stormontgate in the same week that Trimble was threatening to walk out anyway - people always forget that). On each occasion the event has set back the restoration of the institutions by years. There is, unfortunately, every reason to suspect that this will happen again. I don’t think this is what SF want. Ministerial portfolios in the north helps them in the south. I think this is where their thinking lies.
Posted by on Apr 05, 2006 @ 05:43 PMKeithm,
I would say it isn’t joint authority that is attractive, rather the fact that no Assembly is further “proof” that Northern Ireland is a failed entity incapable of ever delivering for its people.Mike,
“They have a massive ‘all-Ireland agenda’ which they hope will pave the way to a united Ireland (and handily get round the consent principle)”Don’t know how you make that leap. You won’t have a united Ireland without majority consent north and south. No way around that one. It’s British policy. I also recommend you read Article 3 of the Irish Constitution and note the word “only” in the article.
Posted by on Apr 05, 2006 @ 05:49 PMBilly,
“Ministerial portfolios in the north helps them in the south. I think this is where their thinking lies.”If that is the thinking, then Sinn Fein misread the southern attitude towards the northern assembly, in my view.
The southern electorate will decide on its own when Sinn Fein are ready for government and whether they are in or out of Stormont will have nothing to do with it.
Stormont has as much relevance to southern politics and attitudes as North Korea’s Supreme People’s Assembly.
What will effect SF is whether there is a disturbing reason why SF isn’t in the Stormont assembly. The sad demise of Denis Donaldson isn’t it.
His death reminds me of Yeats’ epitaph:
“Cast a cold eye On life, on death, Horseman, pass by!”
The Irish electorate will cast a cold eye on Donaldson’s life and death and pass by.
Posted by on Apr 05, 2006 @ 06:01 PMGeorge:
“The Irish electorate will cast a cold eye on Donaldson’s life and death and pass by.”
Well observed, George. Sadly I believe you’re right.
Posted by on Apr 05, 2006 @ 06:15 PMAs a simple observer,I am suprised that DD stayed in an area where he could be found and without doubt, someone was going to go for him? I am sad and feel it is true that all the cold eyes who have observed such slaughter will still pass by and see some another squalid waste around the next corner!
Posted by on Apr 05, 2006 @ 11:56 PM......."shotguns", “severed arm”??? Sounds like a mess.....I’m thinking this was personal....bet you knew them Denis.....
Posted by on Apr 06, 2006 @ 01:43 AM...Many might say dd, was slaine brutally,but lets be fair ,he was a top ranking official [in an organisation that is bringing peace to a nation that has lived under occupied forces for centuries]...alot of people have immigrated over the centuries to escape occupied rule and oppression]… and dd was one of the fortunate few that had the brains to take on the irish goverement and the british,how he comprised himself to mi5 is a mystery in itself...lets take things in perspective here ireland is nearley free[ bar the paisley crew of media commentators ] commpared to iraq and its civilians we are all free...nearly from...occupied forces...im not heartless if i told my father i was touting on my friends on any level of matters he would dis own me probably like you reading this… so dd was not touting on his family… but a nation and its ideals… and culture...now you savvy arm chair critics are thinking why did the boys kill him know?...well it aint rocket science.... spooks came in and cleared him...Manipulated the sunday world to publish ...[the story]...giving clear blame to dissidents or pira...this man was relinqueshed of his position and told to go like scappati...he choose to live in his brother in laws house in donegal...[and had clear passage to vanish from mi5 or the pira] but who did he trust in the end?...his pay masters or his commarades in creating an all ireland that lives in peace...[well he choose to die in Eire...as he was warned by garda, his life was endanger]...such trust bestowed in a man...such betrayal to a nation...the real irony is he would be still there in a position of power of our people if it wasnt for davidtrimble and the face saving scenario… there will not be a creadible search for killers to dd… because who really cares?...a soldier is a soldier what ever side but a grass is neither here nor there… how lucky we are to express our views in a democracy[ so hard fought for in eire and still not propably gained] just bear a thought for the people of iraq...[and their tolerance to occuped forces and there abuse...like suffered in Eire] god blees the people of Iraq...for what have they done?...as we know when u want something ,so badly you set up new rules to get them ie guantanimo bay..[off the coast off cuba]...well we lived through interment as catholics...the muslims are now reasling[theres more to interment than the 70s and 80s ... they ship u abroad now] how the irish was downcast and stereo typed is now happening to the muslims....how the imperiasits never change even with there 20th century democracy ideals… nobody delights in a death… but how many has dd comprimised in his duty to his pay masters? only he and mi5 and his maker knows…
Posted by on Apr 06, 2006 @ 03:37 AMSo the theory is that the British/Securocrats did it to cover up some mysterious information that DD had. A few problems with this:
1. DD would have told other people the “mysterious information” by now - not least his IRA debriefers and maybe others ("if I am killed, send this package to the papers...”. Killing him is hardly going to cover up any information he had at this late stage.
2. Spies give out information, they do not receive it. So what he would know is limited.
3. Why would the British or Securocrats risk an operation on Irish soil - if there was the slightest chance of it being compromised it would be a major calamity.
4. The main aim of the British and the Securocrats has been to get everyone to stop using violence. This has lagely been completed - killing DD does not further this aim.
5. Deniability. Even if DD did spout off his “mysterious information” it is all deniable by the British. After all, he had pretty much gone along with the Sinn Fein line after being outed, so he would be easy to deny.
On another note, as an insider of Sinn Fein for 20 years, he would definiately have a lot of knowledge of Sinn Fein (e.g. who really robbed the Northern Bank) and maybe the threat that he would eventually leak information gives Sinn Fein a more powerful motive to bump him off that the British/Securocrats. However, this also falls foul of point 1. above.
Most likely scenario - personal revenge by someone who feels they were personally impacted by DD’s actions.
Any comments?
Posted by on Apr 06, 2006 @ 07:46 AMDK
I’m with you all the way. No point going back point for point, but I see this as outside the circle of official or sanctioned acts, either by the RM or the Brits.You make a very important point about DD’s knowledge. He probably had nothing more to say so the motive to shut him up didnt exist.
There really was something of a classic tragedy about it, the sad, isolated man, spurned by colleagues, friends and family. Took himself off like some ancient celt to the woods to live in a primitive fashion until the messengers found him(SW). Then the long wait until the knock on the door and peaceful oblivion.
Who better to have done it than someone with a burning sense of personal wrong and a need to exact revenge. Anything more professional would have looked more professional
Posted by on Apr 06, 2006 @ 08:07 AMGeorge
“The southern electorate will decide on its own when Sinn Fein are ready for government and whether they are in or out of Stormont will have nothing to do with it. Stormont has as much relevance to southern politics and attitudes as North Korea’s Supreme People’s Assembly.”
You misunderstand me George. I don’t think that people in the south would take much interest in the minutae of a Stormont executive, even if it were up and running. However it clearly would be beneficial to SF to have a few of their big hitters coming down across the border in their ministerial limosuines to help with canvassing.
Also, as a party seeking office in Dublin, they can use Stormont to establish some ministerial credentials, so when their political opponents mutter morbidly about an investment flight or North Korean economics, they can simply point to their form in Belfast as a means of rejecting it. It’s not that people in Cork particularly give a damn about the budget in Belfast, it’s about establishing SF’s image as a party that can be trusted with governance. One way to do that is to spend the next few years in office in Belfast cuatiously pursuing modest, slightly centre-left policies and trying not to fuck anything up too badly.
Posted by on Apr 06, 2006 @ 10:47 AMTHE BEST FORM OF ATTACK IS SUPRISE DK,AND WITH TWO DAYS BEFORE BERTIE AHEARN AND TONY BLAIR MEETING, IT FITS INTO THE MENU OF CORRUPTION BY MI5 TO TOP DD,HE HAD NO MORE SECRETS TO TELL,[HE TOLD THEM 20 FOR THE LAST 20 YEARS]
GOD KNOWS HOW MANY HE COMPRIMISED...HE SHOULD OF BEEN AIMING FOR A FREE STATE...THERES AN OLD SAYING DK, DONT BITE THE HAND THAT FEEDS YOU,HE DONE THAT FROM BOTH SIDES,HE RENOUNCED HIS BAD DEEDS TO THE IRA COUNCIL AND WAS GRANTED CLEMENCY...[AND CHOSE TO LIVE IN HIS NATIVE LAND]...YOU MUST REMEMBER THE IRISH PEOPLE HAVE BEEN AT THE BEHEST OF ENFORCED ENGLISH LANDOWNERS...[AND PAYMASTERS FOR CENTURIES]… SO I ASK YOU DK… WHY WOULD THE IRA KILL A MAN GIVEN CLEMENCY...2 WEEKS AFTER HIS COVER WAS BLOWN IN THE SUNDAY WORLD...DO YOU REALLY THINK THE IRA DIDNT KNOW HE LIVED IN HIS BROTHER IN LAWS HOUSE IN DONEGAL...[THAT THEY WORK ON THE SUNDAY WORLDS AGENDA]...I THINK NOT...WE LIVE IN A WORLD OF NEW AGE IMPERIALISM...HENCE THE EXACT REGIME THAT WAS SUFFERED BY THE IRISH CENTURIES AGO BY ARE FOREFATHERS[GOD BLESS THEM]...WELL I SUPPOSE WE WILL AGREE ON ONE THIN DK MAY DD REST IN PEACE...[BECAUSE HE WAS IN NO PEACE WHEN HE WAS TOUTING ON HIS FELLOW COUNTRY MEN AND COMMRADES] 1 QUESTION DK WHY DID DD GRASS?…Posted by on Apr 07, 2006 @ 12:07 AM“WE LIVE IN A WORLD OF NEW AGE IMPERIALISM”
I wonder what the fundamentalist Christians will make of this.
(BTW, Shay, you’ll find the Caps Lock toggle on the extreme left of your keyboard, about halfway up.)
Posted by on Apr 07, 2006 @ 12:26 AMwhen you say we,does this constitute the iraqis suffering in iraq? [and sorry about the caps was angry with dk]
Posted by on Apr 07, 2006 @ 12:58 AMit suprises me after reading my views you pick up on the new age imperialism line [ie i was stating the obvious]…
Posted by on Apr 07, 2006 @ 01:09 AMSHAY
“ [and sorry about the caps was angry with dk]”
I forgive you ;)
You made some excellent points, just a pity that the caps almost turned me off reading them.
Posted by on Apr 07, 2006 @ 01:10 AMSHAY
Again mea culpa. I was emailing with a friend in the States and discussing New Age shite. Then I saw your post and “new age” caught my eye. Flippant of me. Blame the lateness of the hour.
Posted by on Apr 07, 2006 @ 01:23 AMOne of the points I picked up from Shay was “why did DD turn in the first place”
This probably puts me in the position of armchair detective, but perhaps some of the clues lie there? What was the original motivation for becoming a tout, what were the compromising factors at the time?
Are there any feelings left over from that time? Did the shinners find out something unpalatable during his interrogation that leaked back to a family and provoked this repsonse?
Posted by on Apr 07, 2006 @ 07:25 AMI forgive you michael lol...my point about new age imperialism is its history repeating itself…
Posted by on Apr 07, 2006 @ 03:12 PMTo mizz fit… your assumption that it was the Ira is in my mind to obvious...[remember the spooks work in strange and mysterious ways]...lets face the facts DD was outed by unionists in stormont...for david trimbles face saving act...[hed probably be there now if it wasnt for the outing he got] and in retrospect it suited whitehall...to get back to direct rule...the whole affair from DD’s outing stinks of a stalling act from the unionists [again] and downing street...in life the obvious answer is not always the correct answer, in my opionion there will be no arrets over DD’s demise, [time will tell]…
Posted by on Apr 07, 2006 @ 03:26 PMIf you think i was wrong in my assumption and arm chair theory, read the Donaldson family statement that reads, the pira was not involved in the murder of DD...and blames the sole blame @ the british ss...so miss fit and david micheal, we all have theories in life [but like i have to convey to you , the obvious is not always the feasible answer]...we have to look beyond the realms of the obvious and comprehend whats the worst scenario… like DD did for the last 20 odd years...and the brethen he portrayed we pray for…
Posted by on Apr 08, 2006 @ 01:44 AM“… since the IRA makes no secret of its hatred and contempt for informers and agents in its ranks ...”
The IRA is nothing exceptional in this respect. No one loves a fink, a traitor, someone who betrays comrades, a country, a cause. Even if that person was probably blackmailed or tricked into doing it.
What did Britain do to Lord Haw-Haw? What did the USA do to the Rosenbergs? Does anyone remember who Quisling was, and that Norway reintroduced the long-abolished death penalty just for him?
Would anyone in Britain like to chance passing information to Al Quaeda, and what do they think would happen to them if they were found out?
Posted by on Apr 08, 2006 @ 09:00 AMWHY DID HE GRASS?
For the money Shay, why else.
It seems from reports in todays papers that he was blasted thru the front door.
That MO belongs to.......
Posted by on Apr 08, 2006 @ 09:30 AMJust substitute “informer” for “scab”:
The Scab
“After God had finished the rattlesnake, the toad, and the vampire, he had some awful substance left with which he made a scab.”
“A scab is a two-legged animal with a corkscrew soul, a water brain, a combination backbone of jelly and glue. Where others have hearts, he carries a tumor of rotten principles.”
“When a scab comes down the street, men turn their backs and angels weep in heaven, and the devil shuts the gates of hell to keep him out.”
“No man (or woman) has a right to scab so long as there is a pool of water to drown his carcass in, or a rope long enough to hang his body with. Judas was a gentleman compared with a scab. For betraying his master, he had character enough to hang himself.” A scab has not.
“Esau sold his birthright for a mess of pottage. Judas sold his Savior for thirty pieces of silver. Benedict Arnold sold his country for a promise of a commision in the british army.” The scab sells his birthright, country, his wife, his children and his fellowmen for an unfulfilled promise from his employer.
Esau was a traitor to himself; Judas was a traitor to his God; Benedict Arnold was a traitor to his country; a scab is a traitor to his God, his country, his family and his class.”
Author --- Jack London (1876-1916)
Posted by on Apr 08, 2006 @ 10:00 AMM. Gibbs
“The scab sells his birthright, country, his wife, his children and his fellowmen for an unfulfilled promise from his employer.”
Believe me, I’m not being cynical but isn’t this how the business world works these days, in the island of Ireland, in America and just about everywhere else?
Its opposite is called “integrity”. Hard (though not impossible) to find.
Posted by on Apr 08, 2006 @ 10:27 AMDavid Michael
“Believe me, I’m not being cynical but isn’t this how the business world works these days, in the island of Ireland, in America and just about everywhere else?”
Sadly, David, you are absolutely right. The name of the game is greed, and nearly everyone is playing it.
Posted by on Apr 08, 2006 @ 12:26 PM
