Orange Hall Attacked

5 views

From the BBC News Website-

“17 July 2012 Last updated at 10:26

Clifton St Orange Hall in overnight paint attack

An Orange hall in Belfast has been attacked with paint overnight. Damage was caused to the front of the building on Clifton Street.

Belfast County Grand Master, Tom Haire, condemned the actions of the perpetrators and blamed republicans for attempting to raise tensions in the area.

“We deplore the paint bombing of Clifton Street Orange hall,” he said.

Police said it happened between 01:00 BST and 01:20 BST on Tuesday.”

Clifton Street Orange Hall is just across the Westlink Junction from St Patrick’s Church where the incident with the band took place, I have stated previously my fustration and dismay at the behaviour of that band outside the church, and even if mitigating circumstance exist it was still unacceptable.  However this one short incident has generated  extreme volumes of comment and condemnation on slugger and elsewhere, far exceed the comments on the extensive republican terrorism and rioting in Ardoyne on the 12th night.

But as they say that is old news now and todays news is the  attack on the local Orange Hall,  this is just the latest in a long running campaign of attacks on Orange Halls, with hundreds being damaged in recent years (including my own hall), and several destroyed.  I trust that those most vocal in condeming flags and “party songs” will be even more vocal in condeming actual criminal damage on community property.  Its over to you, perhaps our most vocal posters on flags, tunes, etc. would like to lead off…

 

  • http://bangordub.wordpress.com/ Bangordub

    I am weary with this. It is simple.
    Is any unionist politician or person in a position of authority or influence willing to say when something is wrong? without equivocation, whataboutery, buts, if’s or maybe’s?
    Just one?

  • Fergie Pie

    Like sectarian employment discrimination, you mean?

  • ArdoyneUnionist

    Shinner politicos don’t know the meaning of the word wrong.

    They think that kidnapping,torture, murder, dumping of a body, making 10 children orphans and then carrying out 40 year campaign to smear, stain and stigmatize the victim and her family is not a crime.

    Only in the sick minds of republicans and shinners is all of the above not wrong.

  • Rory Carr

    If we are to be treated to Ms O’Hanon’s concerns about the social problem of the lumpen proletariat we might first consider what other than the specifics of a ruck in Phoenix Park might have motivated her to share her thoughts with us at this time.

    Might it be this, I wonder ?:

    http://bit.ly/LyXf3D

    It will be mighty handy for the class with which Ms O’Hanlon’s newspaper has most concern to use a swell of populist anger at “Swaggering brutes with raw fists and short fuses” to impement a cut in unemployment benefits and to help facilitate knock-on cuts in wages down the line.

  • Mister_Joe

    Or, Rory, cut their goolies off (HT to TWTWTW, decades ago).

  • Politico68

    I am a ‘Shinner’ and i absolutely condemn those who attack any Orange hall or who do anything of offense to any person or place. Leaders of Nationalism and Unionism should unite against all forms of sectarian violence and vandalism. What were once tit for tat killings have now turned into tit for tat tantrums. The NI people deserve better and the only way to stop this carry-on is for people to report their suspicions to the police without delay.

  • Reader

    Mister_Joe: Or, Rory, cut their goolies off (HT to TWTWTW, decades ago).
    I didn’t think goolies had been invented back then, so I think it was probably NTNOCN, not quite so many decates ago.

  • the future’s bright, the future’s orange

    ‘ Politico68 (profile) 19 July 2012 at 1:58 am
    I am a ‘Shinner’ and i absolutely condemn those who attack any Orange hall or who do anything of offense to any person or place. Leaders of Nationalism and Unionism should unite against all forms of sectarian violence and vandalism. What were once tit for tat killings have now turned into tit for tat tantrums. The NI people deserve better and the only way to stop this carry-on is for people to report their suspicions to the police without delay.’

    good man – this is the kind of the response we need to see on these forums. 1st Shinner I’ve agreed with yet!

  • Reader

    tacapall: Reader maybe just because: [followed by list of loyalist attacks on Catholic Churches]
    I’m not sure how you get from that list to the point where redneck loyalists get the brains to attack an Orange lodge in the hope that republicans would be blamed – perfectly timed to coincide with a flood of incandescent rage over a band acting the lig for 15 minutes. I believe in evolution, but that’s a lot of intellectual change to accomplish in just 7 years.
    You do realise that using random bits of information and innuendo to prop up a theory based entirely on wishful thinking is an early step on the road to becoming a full fledged conspiracy theorist? I would be more reassured to believe you were just putting up a smokescreen instead.

  • ayeYerMa

    Bangordub, I’m assuming from your username that you are a Dubliner living in Bangor? If this is the case then, as with many other free-staters poking their noses where they aren’t wanted, then I think you have a bit of a brass neck on you in trying to dictate to the mainstream what is “wrong” based on this assumption that you are somehow still in your place of birth.

    Perhaps anything mildly resembling the “famine song” riles you up so much because it strikes too close to home to you and your own personal complex regarding what you are guilty of yourself? A refusal to integrate, while enjoying a Irish Republican self-determination and an Irish Republican state in Dublin, but at the same time wanting to have your cake and eat it too by contradicting all models for Irish peace by demanding that Ulster Loyalists are not permitted the same enactment of a right to self-determination as your own countrymen.

  • tacapall

    Not really reader as I recall how the troubles first started wasn’t it Loyalists who planted bombs in electricity and water installations which was then blamed on the IRA, I dont also have to remind you how the RUC aided them with the misinformation on the bombing of Mc Gurks bar. Its a tactic loyalists and Unionists have been using for years.

  • Reader

    anne warren: Will the words be updated?
    Will the music change?

    The music is older than the usual lyrics, and there are many variants and parodies of the lyrics. wikipedia gives a few pointers, but if you want the recent Celtic version you’ll probably have to check on the various Old Firm websites.
    But there is probably a processing queue for obsessive updaters of old lyrics. ‘Greensleeves’ is definitely due for an update for the modern era – I typed and discarded several changes to the title on the grounds of dubious taste.

  • Reader

    tacapall: Not really reader as I recall how the troubles first started wasn’t it Loyalists who planted bombs in electricity and water installations which was then blamed on the IRA, I dont also have to remind you how the RUC aided them with the misinformation on the bombing of Mc Gurks bar. Its a tactic loyalists and Unionists have been using for years.
    The 7 year old examples weren’t fit for purpose so you went back over 40 years? I doubt those guys are still active – or even mobile. You never know – their names may be up in a memorial garden somewhere.

  • Republic of Connaught

    Ayeyermam,

    This isn’t a national front website. Though I’m sure you’re a regular visitor to those odious sites, you should wind your neck in on here and learn some manners.

  • tacapall

    Reader are you suggesting the mindset of loyalism has evolved in the last 40 years into something more open and honest, that they would ” Never ” revert back to tactics they used before ? Have you got proof they they never carried out the “Throwing of paint” over Clifton st Orange, hall after all they’re very fond of throwing paint or daubing sectarian slogans on Catholic churches.

  • Reader

    tacapall: Have you got proof they they never carried out the “Throwing of paint” over Clifton st Orange, hall
    Good grief!
    And have they been doing it for years on end in preparation for 10 minutes of fame? Take a trip along Clifton Street on google maps. Streetview image date 2008. I think the building was cleaned up recently. Probably costly, probably a waste of time.
    And before then I was working on the old folks home at the roundabout. Clifton St orange hall was multicoloured at the time. Still think it was all down to loyalists?
    Why are you finding it difficult to believe this was the work of tribal tossers not quite stupid and angry enough to join the dissidents?

  • tacapall

    Reader I dont deny the Orange hall has been attacked in the past by misguided or drunken teenagers I’ve lived around that area most of my life I remember it looked more like a fortified police station but that was all taken down and the stonework cleaned up, probably why it was costly but it wasn’t because it was multicoloured, unless of course the paint bombs were sprayed on with a hose.

    I dont find it difficult to believe this was the work of tribal tossers, Im just dubious as to what sectarian tribe they came from.

  • Mike the First

    Dixie Elliott

    “Is Mike the First serious?

    Did he just go to the bother of explaining that the Sash, which some boyo’s Father wore, wasn’t actually over 300 years old at all but a bit of the old poetic licence”

    Yes, because one poster was making an alarmingly idiotic argument that the fictional “sash” in question was unlikely to be 300 years old.

    What was his name again…oh yes, Dixie Elliott, I believe.

    A little bit of advice for you. If you don’t make such idiotic arguments, people won’t have to talk to you like you’re a simpleton.

  • PeterBrown

    Reader

    Note that if Clifton Street was attacked in the past by nationalists it was clearly only drunken or misguided teenagers…

    I expect tacapall will be watching on BBC1 tonight at 9pm to attempt to rubbish the new conspiracy theory that republicans were responsible for Bloody Friday when it was clearly the work of securocrats in collusion with loyalist paramilitaries, or perhaps misguided or drunken teenagers, but preferably themmuns!

  • tacapall

    No not really Peter, Bloody Friday was carried out by the IRA everybody knows that, a horrific act on innocent people that can never be justified. All violence is wrong and always has been I would never support anyone who uses violence or engages in activity that would cause another injury.

    If you dont believe the Orange Hall in Clifton Street was attacked by teenagers, drunk or sober in the past, who was it then ? If you believe it was Republican paramilitaries then why just paint bombs, why didn’t they just demolish it, I mean they had the methods and its more or less in a nationalist area.

  • PeterBrown

    tacapall

    Both sides have attacked community property belonging to the other community, sometimes it was drunken teenagers sometimes it was paramilitaries (I have been involved in cases inlcuding recently where the police have certified paramilitary involvement in the destruction of Orange Halls in arson attacks and I believe they have also done so for chapels and GAA clubhouses) and both sides have both also attacked their own property in acts of black propaganda. Sometimes a property was attacked and not destroyed because compensation will allow it to be rebuilt better and sometimes property was attacked to allow it to be rebuilt better …

  • HeinzGuderian

    ….’you should wind your neck in on here and learn some manners’

    Charming,yet deliciously ironic :-)

  • Drumlins Rock

    Once again the hall has been attack, still waiting for statements condeming it from any nationalists or republicans.

  • Dont Drink Bleach

    Would be nice to hear condemnation of this sectarian attack from the parish priest at St Patricks also. Given the location, there is every possibility some of his ‘parishioners’ were involved in it.

  • andnowwhat

    Do we know who attacked the lodge yet?

  • Jack2

    An attack on anyone’s property is wrong.

    Just remember that its knuckle draggers doing this, not the majority of one community or the other. Said knuckle draggers may have seen this building used as a forward operating base for UVF command and deemed it “fair game”, wrongly of course.

  • Dont Drink Bleach

    Jack2: Just remember that its knuckle draggers doing this, not the majority of one community or the other. Said knuckle draggers may have seen this building used as a forward operating base for UVF command and deemed it “fair game”, wrongly of course.

    I presume if you know who these senior UVF people are you can tell us all their names?

    All I could see in the photo was two members of the PSNI’s North Belfast Police & Community Safety Partnership and the rest were members of the North & West Belfast Parades Forum.

    If I am wrong please feel free to correct…

  • lamhdearg2

    I suppose when some “knuckle draggers” now return the favor, the press will go apeshit, unlike the two lines/20seconds they have given this attack.

  • lamhdearg2

    We have had multiple references that refer to members of the North and west Belfast parades Forum, as the UVF.

    this is in responce,

    The Carrick hill res group,(otherwise know as the carrickhillmob), is mainly made up of PIRA members, who when not picking fights with non irish nats, are either drug dealing or molesting children.

  • Dont Drink Bleach

    Let’s see Mick turn a blind eye to that as he has done with the smear campaign against Winston Irvine on this site.

  • andnowwhat

    Winkie is referred to constantly in that context in the Sunday World. He is perfectly free to sue them for saying such, should he choose to.

  • lamhdearg2

    Its not only Mr Irvine, that folk on here are accusing of being uvf, for instance everyone on the balcony was called UVF, and by more than one commenter.

  • andnowwhat

    We are but humble consumers of news and two people on the balcony were identified as such by the media. If you have an issue with this, take it up with the media.

  • UserAinm

    DR,

    The attack on Clifton St Orange hall is a disgrace and should never have happened.

    If I may bend you ear a bit further you might be interested to know that despite 5 posts on the ‘Respect?’ thread, at the time of posting I don’t see any of the condemnation you wanted here coming from you.

  • Dont Drink Bleach

    People can confirm UVF membership yet don’t even know these people’s names???