“The IRA is not unwilling to talk, in fact there needs to be talks…”

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The Guardian carries an exclusive front page interview with the Real IRA - “a series of written answers to the Guardian’s questions”, “the product of several months of contacts through intermediaries who contacted Real IRA members with a view to establishing a link.”

Henry McDonald responds to the ‘oxygen of publicity’ argument.

The Guardian article contains the Real IRA’s familiar defence of “‘punishment’ shootings and beatings of those they deem ‘antisocial elements’ in nationalist working class areas” – “a last resort to protect the community.”

And Garibaldy has some thoughts on the anti-capitalist rhetoric.

On more traditional ground the Guardian article relays

On the political front they dismissed Sinn Féin’s claims that its electoral strategy would ultimately yield a united Ireland despite the majority of nationalists in Northern Ireland still voting for Sinn Féin and an overwhelming majority backing the peace process.

The Real IRA insisted, however, that support for them was building and they had turned away hundreds of young disaffected nationalists because they didn’t have the capacity to absorb so many members.

“From the point of view of republican communities, there is still a heavily armed British police force that casually uses plastic baton rounds, CS gas and Tasers, carry out house raids, stop and search operations and general harassment.

“There’s still a 5,000-strong British army garrison, a new MI5 HQ in Belfast, and a British secretary of state. Republican communities are still subjected to sectarian parades and the right to protest is being met with intimidation and violence.”

And there’s a response to, Northern Ireland deputy First Minister, Sinn Féin’s Martin McGuinness’ recent claims – made prior to popping off on “his August holidays”.

On the subject of recent reports of talks between dissident republicans and the Dublin and London governments the Real IRA said: “There are no talks with either the British government or the Free State Administration.

“The IRA is not unwilling to talk, in fact there needs to be talks … however, talks need to deal with the root cause of the conflict, namely the illegal British occupation of Ireland. We are mindful, though, that the history of such approaches from the British has been characterised by a lack of integrity, a lack of willingness to address the causes of conflict, and has been motivated by a self-serving agenda.” Northern Ireland’s deputy first minister and Sinn Féin MP, Martin McGuinness, also came in for strong criticism. The former chief-of-staff of the IRA and key Sinn Féin negotiator recently claimed that he had knowledge that dissidents were holding secret discussions with the two governments.

“Martin McGuinness is a British Crown minister who has a vested interest in causing mischief among republicans. His job is to administer the Queen of England’s writ in Ireland … However, if he has any evidence to back up his claims, he should make it public,” the Real IRA said.

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  • Nunoftheabove

    Tedious, elitist, clueless nihilist death cultists. Seriously, it’s just a small armed lumpen whine.

  • http://pippakin-meiow.blogspot.comblogspot.com Pippakin

    Been there done that, didn’t buy the Tshirt first time round.

  • Patrick

    What concerns me more is that this story has been on the front page of the big four UK papers sites for at least 24 hours, and there’s no mention whatsoever of it on the BBC or local news services. What gives them the right to play with the agenda? Or don’t we have the right to know what’s happening?

    I can only assume it’s the ‘oxygen of publicity’ argument, but, I repeat, it is not for the media to set the agenda of what we do and do not need to know..

  • White Horse

    Clearly McGuinness gets up their noses. I wonder why he let us know that talks were going on with the British and Irish governments. Could it be that he is right and the dissidents are denying talks to protect, well, McGuinness because he shouldn’t have known before the 32 CSM? Why? Because it demonstrates that Sinn Fein are closer to the RIRA than the 32CSM? Now that would be worth denying.

  • Seymour Major

    Just on the censorship argument, I am not a Henry McDonald fan and I dont like the idea of terrorists having a platform which would give them the opportunity to recruit.

    One of the reasons given for the apparent failure of Mrs. Thatcher’s measures is that the media, in allowing actors to speak the words of Adams etc, were not acting within the spirit of those broadcasting bans so the theory over whether the cutting off of the supply of the “oxygen” works is unproven.

    I might have been in the camp which suggested that the Guardian was breaching media ethics until it was decided to allow Nick Griffin of the BNP to attend the BBC’s question time. I was certainly impressed by the way the audience pulled his credibility to pieces.

    If we are going to allow terrorists to talk through the media, this must not be unconditional. They can not and should not be allowed to control their media output. I would like to see the political leader of these people answer questions in a panel featuring Martin McGuiness and Gerry Adams and be put properly on the spot.

    Indeed, I suspect that Adams and McGuinness would be rather uncomfortable but it would also be extremely interesting.

  • Michael

    Your post might have meant something before the ‘web’.
    Your peers or your family will introduce you to certain ideas/beliefs/whatever and they will be reinforced by like minded souls on the web, the fact that BBC1 or the Guardian or whatever refuse or cannot air those views means nothing.

  • Seymour Major

    Excellent point Michael. This is something I had not thought of when writing my previous comment.

    I would only add that the Web is a very differnt kind of media outlet where the consumer has to be pro-active to get the information instead of being “fed”

  • Nunoftheabove

    Michael

    I know where you’re coming from however there is to my mind a legitimacy conferred by direct access to the mainstream media which, as yet, doesn’t flow from, say, youtube or most other web channels. Yes, people might knowwhat you think if they really want to but it’s much less impactful than, say, C4 news or Question Time. That’s one of the bases of my objection to censorship and why it needs carefully monitored (as does self-censorship). These guys don’t as yet have a policitcal infrastructure and as such noone willing or perhaps able to give them any form of plausible articulate front. In the absence of that, I don’t think they’re likely to get much access or much benefit from any access they do get. Particularly if they’re talking the sort of shite reflected in the coverage above.

  • Michael

    Legitimacy or a lack thereof is not a factor when dealing with potential recruits. I dare say a lack of legitimacy probably helps when it comes to appealing to impressionable young men.

  • http://pippakin-meiow.blogspot.comblogspot.com Pippakin

    I have never known young men need a reason to get into trouble.

  • aquifer

    These people repeat themselves and have nothing interesting to say. Smearing their corny lying messages from the dead in blood just means more clearing up for the living.

  • Gerry Lvs Castro

    “There’s still a 5,000-strong British army garrison, a new MI5 HQ in Belfast, and a British secretary of state. Republican communities are still subjected to sectarian parades and the right to protest is being met with intimidation and violence.”

    So the obvious reaction to this, notwithstanding the fact that virtually no-one is drectly affected by any of the above, and that the overwhelming majority of the Irish electorate endorsed the GFA, is to kill people.

    Faced with this head in arse mindset, the only logical solution is to treat such people as the criminals they are. They have no mandate, no respect for the electorate and no wit.

  • White Horse

    “Nothing interesting to say”

    These people are saying what Gerry Adams and Martin McGuinness used to say and if anything they are repeating the SF line prior to the peace process. It may not interest some republicans but it may interest others that republicans are back for more, meaning that the SF line has not held and is therefore unsustainable.

    No-one can now negotiate with any republican brand because they simply cannot deliver on an end to violence.

  • Jimmy

    I thought McDonald’s use of the phrase “Oxygen of Publicity” was disingenuous. It is not to advocate censorship to point out that an electorally insignificant fascist microgroup has had its half baked views on the global economy published uncritically on the front page of a (normally) serious newspaper for no apparent reason other than the fact that its members have murdered and propose to continue doing so. You don’t have to be Thatcher to question the editorial judgment involved there.

  • http://pippakin-meiow.blogspot.comblogspot.com Pippakin

    Does anyone expect editorial judgement any more, especially from papers like the Guardian.

    I don’t know why they bothered tracking down RIRA all they needed to do was have quick flick through their own archives.

  • Alias

    It’s a smart move by RIRA’s handlers to get them announce that they intend to target the financial system. That will ensure that a lot of new private sector funding will find its way into propaganda aimed at undermining the legitimacy of any claims to self-determination made by those in NI wh do not acept the legitimacy of British rule – not that the state-sponsored group is directed to make to make the claim is that violence is being used to assert national rights but rather the laughable claim that it is being used to reform the free market system. The state uses these groups to present them as the alternative to not accepting the legitimacy of its sovereignty and to reinforce the impression that asserting national rights (that are other than the legitimised British national rights) fosters these groups.

  • Marcus

    Cause it sells papers unfortunately!

  • Wilde Rover

    Alias,

    “It’s a smart move by RIRA’s handlers to get them announce that they intend to target the financial system.”

    It’s good to see someone has dragged this thread back from the brink of never never land.

    Anyone who thinks these guys are anything more than pawns has not really been paying attention.

  • http://amanfrommars.blogspot.com/ amanfromMars

    “Clearly McGuinness gets up their noses. I wonder why he let us know that talks were going on with the British and Irish governments. Could it be that he is right and the dissidents are denying talks ” … White Horse
    15 September 2010 at 7:43 pm

    And if he is wrong and there are no talks, who would he be working for, spinning dodgy lies?

    “Alias,

    “It’s a smart move by RIRA’s handlers to get them announce that they intend to target the financial system.”

    It’s good to see someone has dragged this thread back from the brink of never never land.

    Anyone who thinks these guys are anything more than pawns has not really been paying attention.” …. Wilde Rover 16 September 2010 at 5:13 am

    That would then raise the question of pawns for whom or what, for targeting the financial system which enslaves all with debt whenever there are mountains of cash invented at will from thin air, and channeled to bankers and government minions to screw the masses into the ground, will have very few rallying to create an effective opposition. In fact, it could prove to be extremely popular because the man in the street will not suffer as has been the case of dissent and dissident action in the past.

    And what is to say that forces of the state are not priming that action to rid the system of its abusive city players and political puppets creating strife and wars/poverty and destruction whilst they snort a line and sip champagne afetr a hard day’s work doing nothing productive except moving figures around the System?

    Yes, indeed, it’s a mad, mad, mad, mad, crazy world, and would you believe it, Controlled by Media and IT and Powered by ProVision Professionals?

  • Greenflag

    “Let’s not forget that the bankers are the next-door neighbours of the politicians. Most people can see the picture: the bankers grease the politicians’ palms, the politicians bail out the bankers with public funds, the bankers pay themselves fat bonuses and loan the money back to the public with interest. It’s essentially a crime spree that benefits a social elite at the expense of many millions of victims.”

    Very well said except they are not quite correct with the next door neighbour bit . The word is embedded as in the same bed . Western politicians be they British/American/Irish are ‘slaves’ to the international bankers .

    We no longer have a democracies -what we have are plutocracies . Historically plutocracies have always ended in bloody revolutions and or war/civil war/ and replacement by totalitarian regimes of the left or right .

    I wonder which kind of totalitarianism the bankers will prefer ?.

  • A.N.Other

    We are all slaves to debt ushered in by global capitalism and a slavish homage to materialism.

    Don’t these boyos know that the bankers wrecked the country; they are fellow travellers…

  • Greenflag

    “There are no talks with either the British government or the Free State Administration.

    Free State Administration then and not the Republic of Ireland’ Government . These f*****s have some cheek . Who do they represent ? Are they another self chosen minority who think that they have some ‘divine ‘ right to rule ? Gobshites plain and simple .

    “The IRA is not unwilling to talk, in fact there needs to be talks …’

    Talks about what ? If they are serious about a United Ireland they need to go home and breed not bleed . One extra moron one extra vote should be their party mottto:(

    ‘ talks need to deal with the root cause of the conflict, namely the illegal British occupation of Ireland’

    Fair enough except in the ‘real world ‘ the majority of people in Northern Ireland prefer the political connection to the UK so how do these people deal with that fact of life ?

    ‘We are mindful, though, that the history of such approaches from the British has been characterised by a lack of integrity, a lack of willingness to address the causes of conflict, and has been motivated by a self-serving agenda.”’

    Absolutely brilliant analysis -Who’d have thought it ? I’m sure the Brits love doshing out 7 billion pounds sterling in subvention so that the ‘real IRA’ can continue to attend schooling and are provided with the National Health Service/British Welfare State provisions etc ?

    Killing a PSNI policeman or bombing the financial heart of the city of London will achieve exactly what ?

    Nothing .

  • Alias

    Amanfrommars, no doubt expressions of dislike against bankers are popular among the general public but the general public draw the line at decapitating them by states-sponsored murder gangs…

    Is the use violence advocated here, in the absence of alternative means, to assert a right to self-determination by a non-sovereign nation or is it being used to reform the free market system? Clearly it is being advocated for the latter purpose. This ‘ideological’ shift serves to further demean self-determination, just as the Shinner’s sectarian murder campaign served to demean it.

    The prior shift of emphasis away from self-determination occurred when Ireland was partitioned. After partition, the emphasis shifted to reunification. Unity of sovereign jurisdictions, of course, had nothing to do with republicanism prior to that time since there was only one sovereign jurisdiction. The emphasis of republicanism then was in asserting the right to national self-determination. Changing the focus from self-determination to unity allowed the British state to strip republicanism of its original purpose and meaning.

  • old school

    According to the Guardian, the RIRA Ambassador was “articulate, thoughtful and politically tuned in”.
    Which is more than can be said for some of the responses above.

  • Nunoftheabove

    Politically tuned in ? So this politically empty morally vaccuous project of theirs is really a whole bunch more clever than those of us who are not self-loathing elitist reactionary violent catholic nationalists can possibly undertand, is it ?

  • West Sider

    Henry would say that, wouldn’t he? Keep the sources sweet.

    Along with other journalists it suits him to talk up these clowns as he can’t let go of the dream that some day the Troubles will return and he’ll have a career again.

    It is a deeply sad and silly article – and the piece about the memory stick in the surgical glove echoing The Godfather was straight out of Private Eye.

    Craig Brown would have had a field day with it.

  • http://amanfrommars.blogspot.com/ amanfromMars

    “Amanfrommars, no doubt expressions of dislike against bankers are popular among the general public but the general public draw the line at decapitating them by states-sponsored murder gangs… ” …. Alias
    16 September 2010 at 5:40 pm

    The general public play no viable part in anything that transpires, Alias, other than to witness it, and whine in the wind like a whipped dog.

    And surely, and most certainly, the catastrophic adventures into Afghanistan and Iraq, which have seen probably thousands and possibly hundreds of thousands killed and decapitated by states-sponsored murder gangs and armed military forces, led into battle by the lovers of money with its artificial, printing press, power base, from their feather nests as far away from the action as they can manage, is proof positive of the above indisputable fact.

    And they who finance such ventures, and call for such ventures with provision of known false intelligence to perversely justify it in the blackened public eye, know full well the error of their ways and the general impotence of the general public in being able to do anything about it. However …… that is not to say that certain groups and/or individuals and special forces would be so hindered and would resolve to address the issues with their attentions focussed and fine tuned to financial and politically incorrect leadership individuals, so as to make every effort to avoid the mistake of perceived wanton collateral damage against innocent civilians, with any indiscriminate bombing campaign. It is surely unreasonable to imagine that nothng has been learned in four decades of troubles, and to not imagine that there are other ways.

    Indeed, MI5 themselves realise that the game has changed, and become increasingly difficult, ……. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-11335412 …. but would fail to acknowledge that that is simply because the corrupt Capitalist System hasn’t changed a jot and is actually drivering all that they fear and struggle against.

    The question for Jonatahan Evans is … What you gonna do about it, [with IT] …… for more of their same old stuff with a failed intelligence supply, as he admits …”And, he said, the security service had not expected dissident republicanism to grow as it had in Northern Ireland.” …. is not an option which will deliver necessary change to the System, for that is what they are battling against, too.

    Chaos rules and War pays handsomely, but only handsomely to warmongers. Remove warmongers and their financial backers and very quickly will it be a memory of the past with no one willing to follow its leaders with their dodgy faiths on cracked foundations.

    This is a short read from a military man and hero of the people, which is far too oft a perverse oxymoron today, and that is regrettable ….. http://www.lexrex.com/enlightened/articles/warisaracket.htm ….. and it very simply explain the attraction of war for the racketeering cowards who call for it and supply its cannon fodder.

    And Alias, the picture today is much bigger than just orange and green, for the troubles in one area of the world are mirrored in all areas of the world, so weeding out the cause of the problems in one to deliver that which is needed, will be mirrored in all, so that all will have what is needed ……. which is surely the Change that is needed with the Hope that was created whenever Barack Obama in the US, ascended the POTUS throne. But he also is poorly advised to server the Status Quo Establishment Model rather than Remodelling it Lock Stock and Barrel, as it needs, with IT controls to the Fore rather than allowing the Federal Reserve and the Wall Street Ponzi merchants to yank his chain. But I digress.

    Such digression though is to be fully expected, for it is a fact, that one cannot have meaningful Change in one area without it meaning there has to be change in all areas, for there is always a ripple effect, ergo the Master Plan must always be to change and replace the whole System, with a Better Beta System, and that is always most easily done from the Top down rather thyan from the bottom up, as the assumption/presumption is, that those who are at the top have the power and the money and the control to do it easily, and with IT and Media and Cloud Controls in Intelligence Services can it be done very easily.

    Which sort of suggests that MI5, along with every other Intelligence Agency are missing those Vital Viral NEUKlearer HyperRadioProActive IT Controls. How very remiss of them. What on earth are they playing at when IT has such Powers and such IT Powers are so readily available in Advanced Sublime ProgramMING from Novel Sources? Come on, boys and girls, get your act together. You’re letting the side down with your dithering and headless chicken routines.

    Do something, get with the ProgramMING…… and be bold and imaginative to make a positive difference, which will be a pleasant change on which everyone can Future Build.

    FFS, Jonathan …. does one have to spell IT out in BIG CAPITAL LETTERS and in words of just a few syllables? EITHER YOU LEAD FROM THE FRONT OR YOU FOLLOW IN THE REAR.

  • Greenflag

    Alias,

    ‘After partition, the emphasis shifted to reunification.’

    Nonsense . After partition the emphasis shifted dramatically to political and economic survival for the Irish Free State . From 1922 to 1932 the State endured Civil war , economic war and the high expectations of ‘independence’ had to face realities of realpolitik. The State then turned it’s back toand on NI by adopting a Constitution which was written as almost catholic doctrine . The State survived by maintaining ‘neutrality’ of a sort in WW2 but because of this and it’s ‘ourselves’ alone policy the country did not benefit from the post war economic boom unlike Northern Ireland .

    For several years in the 1950′s the State was losing 1,000 young people a week with 50,000 a year emigrating elsewhere for a better life and economic opportunity for their children .

    The only concerted effort in the period 1922 to the late 1960′s to highlight or end partition was Sean McBride’s worldwide anti partition campaign which achieved zero and in retrospect seems to have been more of an embarassment for the Irish government than anything else.

    In short it was’nt the British State which stripped ‘republicanism’ of it’s original purpose and meaning but the economic and political realities which faced the Irish Free State post 1922.

    Had there been no partition in 1920 it’s probable that the early Free State would have faced civil war over much of Ulster and that would have probably resulted in it’s ‘bankruptcy ‘ and the reimposition of British rule over the entire country -possibly even welcomed by a majority on both sides