“Pages of half truths, opinions, bias, lies.”
According to Gerry Adams’ latest post at “This Blog”, “[He] stopped buying the Sunday papers about ten years ago.” And a message to the faithful, “‘[He'll] tell you about the ones with their own wee agenda some other time’ [he] smiled. They usually write for the Sunday World, the Sunday Times, papers of that ilk.” So don’t worry your little heads about questions over his brother Liam’s time in Sinn Féin in Dundalk. Or about questions over his brother Liam’s time in west Belfast between 1998-2006. Or the question of whom, exactly, Gerry claims to have informed at Clonard about those [1987] allegations? Or why, if because of Gerry Adams’ intervention, when Clonard Youth Centre stopped employing Liam Adams in 2003 no-one passed that information any further? Or why the Clonard Youth Centre has no record of anyone raising any concerns? Or why Liam Adams’ employment as a youth worker in west Belfast apparently ended just before Aine Tyrell decided to reactivate the case against her father in 2007 – after 5 years of Gerry Adams promising, but failing, to arrange a meeting between the two? Or any other “stupid” questions. Sure, “It goes with the territory”. Doesn’t it? Adds Two of the people in the Dundalk photographs contradict the official Sinn Féin line.
According to former SF election agent Fra Browne, Liam Adams was an active and well-known member of SF Dundalk in the 1990s. “Arthur Morgan has been quoted as saying Liam didn’t register on the richter scale. That’s not true. Liam was a contender for nomination as a candidate in the 1997 election,” said Mr Browne. “There were two contenders, Liam Adams and Owen Hanratty. However, a number of people in the party were concerned because Liam was from Belfast. “We wanted to put forward a local candidate. When Liam saw the anger that was there he withdrew his name. He was certainly an active Sinn Féin person in Dundalk.”
[i]“In the end the complaint was withdrawn because they were unable to accept that the police have an obligation to investigate all criminal offences committed by the Adams clan, not just the ones committed against immediate family.”[/i]
See, what’s he’s saying here is that if the sexually abused child wasn’t prepared to become a spy for the police then how dare she complain that her father had raped her.
The girl had no choice in the matter. Her mother took her away from the police when they asked her were her father was living. That in her republican mind was “touting”.
“They started asking where Liam lived at the time, and who went in and out of his flat.”
Please can some contributors here stop insulting our intelligence. Thank you.
[i]“although he will no doubt be praying to whatever foul demon he worships that no other victims come forward from his later youth work”[/i]
And no doubt you and others will be praying that they do.
The fact that Gerry has stated he believed his niece closed some loopholes he might have legitimately used to wiggle out of his lives. If he wasn’t sure, if really didn’t know the truth, it would not have been as bad for him to act as he did.
But to say he believed his brother was a child rapist and then campaign with him (and lie about it now), etc. is the issue.
USA
I agree with some of what you appear to be thinking in that the focus of many contributions is on G Adams and how he can be damaged. To me the only focus at present, until court is over, ought to be on the welfare of the victim, Aine, and on minimising the risk to her case in any trial. The behaviour most in question is Liam Adams’. While I have a prejudice in favour of her as the victim, nothing should be said or done either to damage Liam Adams’ right to be tried fairly.
If you are annoyed by others attacking G Adams as a distraction (it is all a distraction from the issue of child abuse in the North – post 1 above) you appear just as keen to distract. The issue is not ‘child abuse in the north’ – it is about child abuse in one home, Liam Adams’. Why do you want to broaden this to the whole country?
However when the courts have settled one way or another what happened in Liam Adams’ home I certainly believe the role of the police, social services, G Adams, Fr Troy, youth contact by Liam Adams’ etc etc all need to be examined.
What is the relevance of the Lammy fire – that has been in the news here recently, I think it was the Inquest? What did the police do wrong, or do badly? I don’t remember any criticism of them. You are right in suggesting G Adams was not responsible for Lammy but suggest that the police and social services were. Did the Inquest suggest that? I don’t remember that it did. Why did you not suggest the fire service were to blame too?
What have the police done badly in the Hamilton case – seems to me they caught him once and got him convicted, then caught him again and got him convicted in a short space of time? What did the social services do wrong in this case either? The sentence seemed lenient for the first case but what had that to do with police or social services?
Are you suggesting we should have police in every school here? There are teachers with responsibilities for pastoral care and NSPCC I think have counsellors in some schools. They should be able to help where children have problems. I am not sure I would have wanted a daily police presence in my children’s school.
USA
The “system” for vetting individuals who are working with children – involving police, social services, and employers – has already been reviewed.
And the recommendations of that review have been implemented.
I’ve already noted that review and the changes implemented here.
It’s also linked in the original post.
Some contributors to this board would do well to watch the UTV programme. The girls’ mother took her out of the police station. When later in adulthood she considered going back to the police she was pressured out of it by Sinners, and was later given the dubious pleasure of a pastoral visit from Aidan Troy.
[i]“Some contributors to this board would do well to watch the UTV programme. The girls’ mother took her out of the police station. When later in adulthood she considered going back to the police she was pressured out of it by Sinners, and was later given the dubious pleasure of a pastoral visit from Aidan Troy.”[/i]
How all of that somehow proves the false claim that cops didn’t try to use the girl’s plight for their own ends is beyond any sane person’s reckoning.
Neither Lammy or Hamilton are relevant.
I take the point that querulus and USA make in so far as the Gerry Adams part of this is getting more coverage than the crime. However i think Liam Adams is getting the same coverage as any on the run rapist and Aine Tyrell as much as any victim. Wait until the court case for all that.
The point with Gerry is more pressing insofar as he is a leading representative treating the population as fools
“Some contributors to this board would do well to watch the UTV programme.”
How would that help them blame it all on the peelers?
The only evidence we have that the police did anything other than carry out a normal investigative interview is the fact that her mother decided that they were trying to make touts of them. Given that they were reporting a senior Provo for a serious crime that was exactly what, in the eyes of the Provos, they were doing.
If you were reporting someone as a paedophile do you not think it would be fairly routine for the police to ask where he lived and who he associated with?
[i]“How would that help them blame it all on the peelers?[/i]
Worse even than blaming it all on the peelers is someone blaming it all on the child for not being a spy.
Blair,
You know what they were doing as well as any of us know what they were doing. Why pretend otherwise? It’s not as if anyone is going to believe otherwise, not even you.
Why would they bother to recruit the wife and child when the Provo himself was ripe for the picking?
Why not recruit all? They get the wife to start giving up information like that and then they’ve got her.
Boring conspiracy theories
Because that would leave too many trails and too many chances for things to go wrong. Consider this. If a fourteen year old abused girl had been recruited as a tout would there not be good chance of her breaking under the pressure? Would that breakdown not bring the whole sorry story out and lead directly to her father’s door?
I’m not the one who is saying that they were trying to recruit the child. That was another’s wet dream. I’m just telling him how sick in the head he is for wanting things like it to become true.
I’m just saying that they obviously tried to manipulate the mother into becoming a tout. They obviously couldn’t help themselves, considering who she was.
Jimmy merely pointed out that the police had a right to question them on all aspects of the suspect’s criminal career. In fact though they didn’t. As soon as the asked her mother where the suspect was living she took her daughter out of the police station.
It was only her perception that they were trying to recruit her as an informer. It makes an interesting diversion from Uncle Gerry though.
I love a good conspiracy theory. Maybe Liam was working for the peelers all along and they told him to rape his daughter so they could recruit her into MI6. I mean you can’t prove it didn’t happen so it must be true. Let’s face it, they have to come up with something to distract attention from grisly, and whataboutkincora didn’t really get much traction. This is what chuckies are reduced to nowadays,
Jimmy,
The tactics are fascinating.
1. Blame the police for not doing anything. (Scuppered because the complaint was withdrawn)
2. Tell lies. (Scuppered by the photographs etc)
3. Use whataboutery ie Kincora (Scuppered because people can see right through it.)
4. Claim that Uncle Gerry’s enemies are using a child abuse to get at him and that this is almost as bad as carrying out the actual abuse. (Scuppered by No 3 above and the fact it is not.)
It’s hard to see where they go from here.
Would you consider it anti-Republican to point out the holes in Gerry Adams’ attempts to explain why he did nothing to protect the children his brother had access to up until 2006? Or to point out the many lies that he has told?
Of course he would
I’m not trying to deflect anything away from Gerry Adams. I think he’s a cunt. The only ‘person’ on here trying to deflect away from child abuse is the one who clearly stated that if an abused child isn’t willing to become a political spy for the police then she has no business complaining about her abuse. What we can take from that is that she got what she deserved.
That’s the type of demented self-righteous prick who is actually taking delight in the fact that a 4 year old was raped by her father, because it harms the Provos.
“I am not blaming the cops entirely”
That’s very generous of you.
Whatever the police did or did not do does not mean that Gerry acted correctly or was truthful in his recollections of what happened.
I think that has largely happened inside your head.
Have you been employed as his official spokesman?
Well he is understandably avoiding the flame war which you appear to be trying to start with him.
I’m not, I’m just challenging his depraved grunting about the child not deserving an investigation of her father’s sexual abuse against her if she didn’t agree to spy on her uncle. Lest it be thought though that I’m using the child’s abuse at the hands of her father for another agenda this is the last I’ll say on that demented little man and leave it to others to use the sexual abuse for their owns ends.
The question is, how and why Laim Adams was approved to work with children in republican areas after these allegations that his brother Gerry knew about. The RUC and the social services were notified, although Aine withdrew her complaint for whatever reason – it dosen’t really matter, He was still able to work with children. The RUC, special branch, british intelligence and therefore Unionist leaders and I suppose other members of the republican movement all knew about it but no-one said anything or used this WHY.
“I think that has largely happened inside your head.”
Largely?
I am a Republican and I consider Gerry Adams’ actions in regard to his brother and indeed in many other matters to be anti-Republican. Harbouring a known paedophile (GA believes the allegations and did nothing to prevent LA working with children; indeed LA would no doubt have traded on his name in gaining access) is anti-Republican and anti-human.
All those questions regarding a suspected systematic failure are better left until after a conviction. The Ombudsman wouldn’t even look at it until then, which is appropriate. There are questions but jumping on silly bandwagons on a blog is no way of dealing with it.
Gerry Adams role though is as a public representative is ripe for scrutiny now. He put his story in the public domain and it is important for the press to use some investigative journalistic endeavour to probe this.
So now you think we should let the investigation take its course and wait for all the facts to come out and only then blame the police?
Well, I can’t speak for USA but I’m saying as far as the role police goes, that is usually more appropriate.
As far as Gerry Adams goes, I think you should probe away to your hearts content. I share USAs frustration insofar as it annoys me that many contributors are getting sidetracked and bringing in all manner of stories from the conflict to simply bash Gerry Adams. For my money, these people do themselves a disservice as the sinn féin supporters will simply bury their heads in the sand. Stick to this issue. The public, and in particular the people of west Belfast deserve to be fully informed.
Not at all, he’s very good at learning lessons. Well, for a while anyway. Then he seems to forget them again.
The public, and in particular the people of west Belfast deserve to be fully informed.
There could be an election anytime and Gerry Adams said he believed Aine, why should he or Laim Adams get any respite, were the photo’s in Dundalk or west belfast fake – No, has there been censorship of opinion in the west belfast paper ie A/townnews, yes, then why should people wait possibly years on a court case. As for U.S.A well your far away from this but my kids went to one of those youth clubs when he worked there and Im a republican I want all the truth now.
Tacapall,
that’s what I’m arguing. The people of west Belfast shouldnt have to wait to have questions about Gerry answered but there are other factors being brought in that are unhelpful. If u are a truly astute critic, you will restrict yourself to this one story
USA,
You’d be happy enough for Liam to get a job working in a nursery until such time as he faces a court then?
Dumb Yank,
Well if you are not happy with him working with children then why should we give Uncle Gerry a by ball for letting him do so for over twenty years?
Dumb Yank,
I think you’ll find that under current rules there is. There wasn’t in 1987, so the Cops blew nothing.
Dumb Yank,
By walking into the police station and reporting a senior republican for a crime she was already informing, as far as republicans are concerned.
Dumb Yank,
You think that fact would stop the IRA from murdering them and dumping their booby trapped bodies on the border?
I’m new to this thread and will sidestep the bickering that seems to be plaguing it.
Gerry Adams is the leader of the biggest nationalist party in Northern Ireland, and yet he tells the readers of the ATN, who elect him, that he doesn’t read the Sunday papers.
What sort of elected representative is that?
There’s lots to be said about this story, but the bottom line, for me, a west Belfast Catholic, is:
The republican movement only ever care about their own – and by that I mean their operatives, those who killed for them, or robbed for them, or tortured, threatened and abused everyday Joes and Josephines.
That’s who they cared about, and in this case, it is no different.
They weren’t out to get justice for the child who was abused, they were out to minimise the damage to the party, the movement, and to the abuser himself.
That much is clear from what I’ve read.
I don’t like Suzanne Breen – she is a contrarian with too many axes to grind for my taste – but she is going straight to heaven for this latest article.
Adams is finished – and despite what Squinter – who really hates him as evidenced by his srticle earlier this year – says, or the censored texts in the ATN – the people in WB that I meet are sickened by this. And are getting angrier and angrier.
Adams is scum, is one of the phrases I hear most. And thos who utter it are justified in that.