UUP will become the ‘eccentric maiden aunt who lives in the Dave’s house’…
Below the fold we have a letter from four prominant party dissidents to the New Force deal between the UUP and the Tories… Their case, in part, is that the local party is putting the whole of its not inconsiderable political capital up for grabs to a new set of political opportunists (ie, the Cameroons)… Jim Nicholson’s loss of the role of Quaestor is just the first of a number of political prices the party will have to pay if it continues down the route it is going… But perhaps the key point, from their point of view, lies in the following rhetorical question:
Will those working class constituencies which have always returned Ulster Unionists still do so once it becomes clear that the Ulster Unionists have become little more than the eccentric old maiden aunt who lives in David Cameron’s house but to whom no one pays a blind bit of notice.
Hmmm… A maiden aunt to join the the mad old uncle drinking himself to death in the attic?
Dear Sir RegIf there is one thing that the Ulster Unionist Party did not need it was a short term fix. Throughout its history the UUP has been a party which had the foresight and the commitment to fend off Irish independence, to form the Government of Northern Ireland, and to keep Northern Ireland running over half a century, including the challenging period of the Second World War. Today it appears that the UUP does not have the vision to see across to the far side of the Albertbridge Road.
There is no doubt that our Party had been floundering to redefine its role within Northern Ireland after the DUP stole its clothes and brought in a large number of UUP members to steer the DUP along the route laid out by David Trimble and the Ulster Unionists. But, rather than despairing and embarking on a journey which, as history tells us, will lead to betrayal and disappointment at the hands of the British Tories, the UUP should have forged a Unionist strategy for Northern Ireland.
The new arrangement is a great deal for the Conservatives.
They tried and failed to gain support here over a decade ago. In the 1992 General Election they received 5.7% of the popular vote. Their last outing was in the 1993 Local Government Elections when 9437 brave souls gave the Conservatives their First Preference Votes.Under this new dispensation the UUP leadership are offering the Tories a Northern Ireland wide organisation, tens of thousands of loyal voters, around 150 councillors, over 20 MLAs and two seats at the Executive table at Stormont.
What does our Party receive in return? At one Executive Committee meeting we were assured that we would have two seats at the Cabinet table in any new Tory administration. Furthermore there are winks and nudges about strong financial support from Tory Central Office. Spin doctors, psephologists and various other types of tactical support will be forthcoming we are assured. Well, we will wait and see.
In return for this the UUP leadership has clearly handed over control of the new movement to the English Conservatives. The very name Ulster Conservatives and Unionists New Force indicates our subordination. But one need look no further that the European Election . The UUP had been members of the European Peoples’ Party for all of Jim Nicholson’s European career.
It was a grouping he was happy with and it had treated him and the UUP well – making him one of its three Quaestors. However, David Cameron did not favour the EPP and because Jim had to take the Tory whip he had to leave and join another more right wing group replete with some fairly dodgy eastern European MEPs.
In addition,we are now approaching a General Election wherein our candidates have to be jointly selected by the handful of Northern Ireland Tories. Some constituencies have been told that they must select Tories irrespective of the wishes of the local activists. Others have been told to delay selection meetings until secret discussions have been undertaken with London. Never in the history of the UUP have we submitted to another party having the final say as to who we should run for election.
Historically the Ulster Unionist Party was a uniting force within the pro-British community. Irrespective of your national politics you could be an Ulster Unionist. Left and Right could sit together in the same branch. Even when our MPs took the Tory whip the party remained a uniting force within Ulster. No longer.
Having shackled ourselves to the Tories what happens to UUP influence when they are not in office? What do we do if Cameron does not win a clearcut majority at the next election? Our Westminster strategy will lie in tatters.
Perhaps more to the point, how will this effect our opportunities of maximising UUP representation at Assembly and Council level. Will those working class constituencies which have always returned Ulster Unionists still do so once it becomes clear that the Ulster Unionists have become little more than the eccentric old maiden aunt who lives in David Cameron’s house but to whom no one pays a blind bit of notice.
The Ulster Unionist Party had had a pact with the pro-British community in Ireland and subsequently Northern Ireland since 1905. We were always an amalgam of Left, Right and Centre. That has been jettisoned by the leadership. At Council level we may well suffer a reaction from working class districts, especially in urban areas.
Perhaps you, Sir Reg, and the rest of the leadership should remember the advice given to Edward Carson when he followed a similar road. “Be careful Edward, the Tories have never adopted a cause yet but they have betrayed it in the end.”
Yours sincerely
Roy Garland, Dr Christopher McGimpsey, George Fleming, Councillor Ronnie Ferguson.
frustrated democrat @ 05:54 PM: ‘As I understand it she was fully consulted at all stages and chose not to agree, that after she had said she would abide with the will of the party.’
frustrated democrat, what you understand is probably gossip and supposition.
Lady Hermon had no reason to sully her good name by telling untruths to the newspapers. What had she to gain by telling a lie that she was not consulted before Sir Reg, and David Cameron released their article in The Telegraph in 2008?
The discussions she was refering to were those that happened for three months before the newspaper article was released.
Cynic
Professionally, I put my business’ name forward to do a project with a Conservative-aligned thinktank and my idea was accepted – slightly to my own surprise, I can’t deny!
Clearly, had I been elected an MEP, I would have been elected as the Alliance Party representative and would have remained within that party, content that its brand and values meant something to people right across NI (and I would never have put forward such a proposal).
However, adding the professional side to my own strongly held political preference for a change of government at the coming election (and my desire to participate in a party with national rather than sub-regional influence), I came to the conclusion that both my professional and political future were best served in the modern Conservative Party.
Frustrated Democrat
I’ll intervene just once here, in fairness to you as you!
It is evident to me that consultations were not as wide-ranging as they could have been.
Nevertheless, we are where we are, and this cannot be allowed to detract from the big issue here. In NI we are heading into choppy waters, to say the least – there is pressure on our public finances which requires a strong voice at Westminster, there is pressure on our security forces which requires a strong voice at Westminster, there is pressure on NI households facing debt and job insecurity which requires a strong voice at Westminster.
I trust we will have the best possible team of candidates going forward to present the case for giving us that strong voice. We are in far too serious a situation to allow ourselves to be deflected by peripheral, parochial concerns.
IJP,
All your logic concerning the link-up goes right out the window when one considers that it is most likely that Labour gets back into power in the next 8/12 years.Indeed,it means that no matter there political left/right leaning UUP supporters will have no say in UK politics.
The link-up shows up clearly the fallacy of the union,that Irish MPs will never have equal voice to English MPs.and that to have any voice they need to pre-negoitate arangements.Isn’t clear when one examines the union and its arrangements as they are,that UK law in fact English law,and english law Uk law.Carson weeps…..
Guest – in 8 to 12 years Labour will be contesting elections in NI alongside the Conservatives
Elvisparker,
They may be.They may do.
Then people will have the right to vote Labour without being unionist.UUP are offering only conservative uk wide politics ie.not labour politics.The same people have had right to vote conservative till now that voting conservative means voting unionist.Placing unionist at the centre of Uk wide politics has taken away the right of people to vote right or left without voting on the border.and when Labour is an alternative vote in Northern Ireland,will voting for them mean voting anti-unionist.Don’t think you lads have this through at all.Not that i’m complaining…….
elvisparker: ‘Guest – in 8 to 12 years Labour will be contesting elections in NI alongside the Conservatives’
elvisparker, why are labour waiting 8 to 12 years? What about the Labour’s pact, or linkup with the SDLP when Gerry Fitt started the party? Surely Labour’s refusal to put forward candidates for the coming Westminster election is evidence they are tactical voting and do not want to take votes away from this middle class Catholic Irish Nationalist ‘Solicitors, Doctors & Lawyers Party’ who are no more supporters of socialism than the man in the moon.
elvisparker, could it be possibe that in 8 -12 years time the UUP will be merged with the Conservatives, SDLP merged with Fianna Fail, and FF, CP & LP will all have MLA’s in the Stormont Assembly?
http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/opinion/let-battle-commence-14545043.html
Guest
“Then people will have the right to vote Labour without being unionist.UUP are offering only conservative uk wide politics ie.not labour politics.The same people have had right to vote conservative till now that voting conservative means voting unionist.Placing unionist at the centre of Uk wide politics has taken away the right of people to vote right or left without voting on the border.and when Labour is an alternative vote in Northern Ireland,will voting for them mean voting anti-unionist.Don’t think you lads have this through at all.Not that i’m complaining……. ”
I would consider that you have not thought things through.
Submit word – READY – the question is are we?
The primary objective of the partnership is to strengthen Northern Irelands’ place within the union by democratic means.
This is not an attack on Nationalism, is is a move towards a true democratic process much closer to the current Scottish model.
Those who are nationalist facing will vote for parties who support a UI, those who are pro-union should have the chance to vote for Conservative, Labour or Liberal Democrat.
If we are serious about working towards a shared future then surely that future should be led by democratic principles.
The move by the Conservative party to more fully engage in NI politics, coupled with the genuine desire by most in the UUP to move away from sectarian, non democratic, politics is a step in the right direction, and should be supported, in principle at least, by everyone who sees themself as a democrat.
New Blue,
I don’t take it to be an attack on nationalism at all.I made concerning the UUP wedding itself to the right wing when so many here claim that this deal gives them the right/left choice that the six counties have to their mind never had.You have not addressed that point.
Those who are nationalist will indeed vote for a party that supports the nationalist line.They will look after themselves.Nothing new in that.Nothing new in the link-up,except unionists fighting for the unionist vote.Fine,but don’t pretend that this gives nationalists a right/left choice when it doesn’t even give unionistsz that choice.
Guest
I am not sure that there is a real left/right opportunity in British or Irish politics at present. The main parties seem to be divided by shades of gray as opposed to clear idealogical differences.
My point is that the step by the Conservatives is the first step in ‘mainstreaming’ NI politics into the union. Why should NI be the only part of the union that cannot vote for the main parties of the union.
I want to see Labour, Lib Dems and Conservatives competing for our votes in the same way as they do in London, Manchester, Glasgow or Cardiff, but I think it is essential that we also have a strong and democratic nationalist movement to allow for those who wish to campaign for a majority vote come a UI referendom.
What I really want to work towards, and this is the ‘holy grail’ for me, is people voting on the issues and not from religious or sectarian principles.
Nationalist and Unionist alike have the same needs when it comes to education, employment, social justice, health, housing etc. etc. We need our politicians to start addressing these issues and stop beating the sectarian drums.
We’ve come a long way in the last 10 years, but politically we are only starting to consider what could be. The mainstreaming of our politics is the next, and possibly most challenging, hurdle we must deal with.
New Blue,
Very honest post;thanks.
I’ll respond in kind by putting aside the left/right argument in spite of the conservative alignment with the Euro right and the hard hard right…..;;
where I disagree is in your assertion that the national question(the irish one) is a sectarian or religious issue.It is only through fault of the fact that most other issues are under the gravity of the constitutional question.What you consider mainstreaming I consider streamlining.That is how it has been and i’m realistic enough to recognize that it will probably still be so when we have this world departed.
Where we fundamentally differ can be summarized by Cameron’s statement that the constitutional question has been settled.It is not because there is not a united ireland that I believe it has not been settled.It is not because UK parties do not organize here as they do in Britain.It is not because Northern Irish MPs are not part of the cabinet.It is because devolution is not complete.It is because north-south bodies have not been worked to their potential.It is because Irish(or irish/british,or northern irish) MPs do not have the same voice in westminster as English Mps.Your solution is a once in a life-time alignment that may put some of those Mps into cabinet in ignorance of them ruling themselves out of the next Labour cabinet.Is the union so unfair that Irish Mps must pay with their future to have any present?
I await an argument on popualtion.I’ll letter that argument to Mr.Cameron when Europe out votes the Uk on “population”.
The Gang of four letter and the earlier S Belfast Association letter has no doubt not been ignored by Tom Elliot MLA from F&ST; UUP association. Looks like he changed his mind.
What will happen to Tom now, will he be threatened to be disciplined by party headquarters like the naughty gang of four for challenging UCUNF party policy decisions.
UUP MLA is ‘open’ to electoral pact talks
http://www.newsletter.co.uk/politics/UUP-MLA-is-39open39-to.5780401.jp
DUP push unity unionist candidate
THE DUP in Fermanagh have unveiled a new campaign designed to bring Unionists together around an agreed candidate in Fermanagh and South Tyrone and South Belfast.
A leaflet will be delivered to every home in the Fermanagh and South Tyrone constituency, highlighting the DUP’s commitment to ensuring that both seats are returned to Unionism in the next Westminster election.
However, Ulster Unionist Tom Elliott has said that a debate in public is not the way to reach agreement.
Mr Elliott said that he is more than willing to talk to the DUP about an agreed candidate but said that discussions need to be held behind the scenes not in a public arena.
Launching the DUP document, Arlene Foster MLA said: “The DUP is the leading party in both South Belfast and Fermanagh and South Tyrone. We want to see both those seats returned to Unionist hands in the next Westminster election. In 2005, we offered the UUP a choice of seats – they would pick one and we would contest the other. Unfortunately, Trimble and Empey rejected that offer and the result was that South Belfast and Fermanagh and South Tyrone were lost to anti-Unionist candidates.
“Now we renew our offer to the UUP. We will give them a clear run in one constituency of their choosing. People should be in no doubt whatsoever of our commitment to seeing Unionism advance and maximising Unionist representation in the sovereign parliament at Westminster. The people living in these two constituencies will not take kindly to any party that describes itself as pro-Union but who by their wilful actions hand over two seats in Westminster to parties that want to dislodge Northern Ireland from the Union.
“Our offer is a generous one. The DUP was the largest party in both constituencies, indeed at the last Westminster election, the DUP came ahead of the UUP. However, our approach is not about advancing parties, it is about advancing Unionism.”
In the last Westminster election in 2005 in which Michelle Gildernew, Sinn Féin won the seat, the breakdown of nationalist/unionist voting was as follows: Michelle Gildernew (Sinn Féin) 18,638; Arlene Foster (DUP) 14,056; Tom Elliott (UUP) 8,869 and Tommy Gallagher (SDLP) 7,230. This means a potential unity unionist candidate could poll in the region of 23,000 votes.
Guest. The constitutional argument has been settled as it is up to the people of the NI and ROI to decide. No political party can attain an UI only the people, therefore politcal parties can now focus on other issues rather than focus on the one (which we have had for decades).
Saying that the constitutional question won’t be settled unitl a UI reeks of your own bias, I’m afraid.
It is amazing how people here complain about our tribal politics, then when one party attempts to move away from tribal politics they are attacked for it.
“Saying that the constitutional question won’t be settled unitl a UI reeks of your own bias”
I think I made it very clear that I was saying nothing of the like.
Read again.
Guest, my apologies. I’ve yet to have my morning coffee yet
.
Garza,
Accepted as always.
Ye lazy fenian!
“elvisparker, could it be possibe that in 8 -12 years time the UUP will be merged with the Conservatives, SDLP merged with Fianna Fail, and Fianna Fail, Conservative Party & Labour Party will all have MLA’s in the Stormont Assembly?”
What also should be borne in mind in any such dispensation is that Fianna Fail don’t want to contest Westminister elections – which means the anti-SF nationalist might well support one of the UK governmental parties (Tory or Labour) at a Westminster contest. Then the question might be why are the remaining DUP/TUV splitting the Unionist vote?
Guest
“Your solution is a once in a life-time alignment that may put some of those Mps into cabinet in ignorance of them ruling themselves out of the next Labour cabinet.Is the union so unfair that Irish Mps must pay with their future to have any present?”
This is not my solution. My solution is that individuals who support the Conservative values stand and campaign on those values. Those who believe in the Labour values (so tempted to be negative here, but will refrain)stand and campaign on those values, those who support a UI stand and campaign on those values.
What I would like to see is a Northern Ireland where there are a guaranteed 18 Conservative candidates, 18 Labour Candidates, 18 Lib Dem candidates and 18 Nationalist candidates (plus, of course any number of smaller ‘special interest group’ candidates) standing for the Westminster election.
Regardless of who’s in Government and who’s in opposition, we should have 18 elected representatives doing thier best for the people of Northern Ireland.
The fact that my personal leaning is towards the Conservative party in no way reduces my desire to see democracy being the primary tool we use for our continued forward movement.
first they came for the MP and i did not speak because i was not an MP
Then theyl come for the MLAs and i will not speak out because im not an MLA
Then theyl come for the councilors and i wont speak out because im not a councilor .
The Ulster Unionist party is going to be taken apart piece by piece and the membership dont even seem to realise. Either the Ulster Unionist party is just that The Ulster Unionist Party or its not… you Cant be 2 political parties at the same time . Who is going to be represented a future conservative government? …. an Ulster Unionist or one of the Conservative party cronies ….even if UCUNF win 3 seats at the next election whos to say it will be the seats with UUP candidates rather than tory
This blog has been the only REAL debate members of the uup have been given –
one last point if i can be so bold – sylvia Hermon is the only UUP member or politician who has been asked to change her political identidy – the leadership can still be uup , the MLAs and councilors can still be UUP but Lady Hermon has to be UCUNF , Perhaps thats upsetting for her some people feel pride in what the ULster Unionist Party stands for and what it has achieved for Northern Ireland in the Past , if i was an Ulster Unionist MP i would Run under no other Banner than the UUP.